Britain nears abandoning Brexit trade deal hope - The Telegraph

[RayC]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

I don't think Leavers believed it any more than it was intended to be believed. Only the Remainers are still taking it literally.

More fool you, if you believe what's plastered on the side of a bus. 

 

So quiet day at 'Leave HQ' and someone says: "You know what would be a laugh. We hire a bloody big coach, plaster some nonsense about promising to spend the money we 'save' leaving the EU on the NHS, on the side of the bus and drive around the country"

 

Office junior pipes up: "Won't people take that seriously?". Reply comes in: "Nah, at least not our supporters. They're all as sharp as tacks that lot."

 

Now I know that you shouldn't laugh at your own jokes but, sorry I can't help it. I'm cracking up at what I've just written.

[CorpusChristie]

1 minute ago, 7by7 said:

Everyone, including Thatcher, called it a rebate, that's good enough for me.

 

But whatever you want to call it, it was deducted before we paid, so we did not pay £350 million per week; that was a lie.

 

I wont mention the money we did get back in research grants, farm subsidies etc.

No, The UK paid the full amount in one year and the following year the UK got the reduction and so paid less that year , due to overpaying the previous year

[7by7]

4 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

Errm  ,wasnt those from the Left who voted against everything  proposed , trying to get Brexit delayed and postponed the reason why Mays deal didnt get passed in Parliament ?

 The opposition did oppose May's deal and try to make amendments to it.

 

But if Johnson, Rees-Mogg and the ERG had voted with May then her deal would have passed.

 

We will never know if Labour had won last December whether or not they would have presented May's deal with a few tweaks to the EU.

 

We do know that Johnson did exactly that!

[7by7]

3 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

No, The UK paid the full amount in one year and the following year the UK got the reduction and so paid less that year , due to overpaying the previous year

Wrong.

 

Although Thatcher called it a rebate and it has always been referred to as such, it is, in fact, more of a discount.

 

Fully explained in the HoC briefing paper The UK’s contribution to the EU budget.

 

That's a long read, so you may prefer The UK's EU membership fee

[melvinmelvin]

 

history history history history --- soon we go back to Stonehenge and BC (ie before cider)

nee wish to look ahead --- no wonder stumbling follows

 

49

you should at least be glad that you are not Norwegian

why? Norway is the land of saying no thank you to EU and European happiness TWICE, and still breathes

 

on the other hand there are many 49ers in Norway, difficult to master as they are they are still quite popular

[RayC]

2 hours ago, 3NUMBAS said:

the EU mafia are so angry they would shoot themselves rather than do a deal ..its like leaving a mexican drug cartel ,,they just cant bear losing all the free fish from uk waters which amounts to a tidy sum of cash .. so they would comit hari kari

 

Often called “hara-kiri” in the West, “seppuku” is a form of ritual suicide that originated with Japan's ancient samurai warrior class. The grisly act typically involved stabbing oneself in the belly with a short sword, slicing open the stomach and then turning the blade upwards to ensure a fatal wound

So the economic future of the EU is dependent upon member states being able to fish in UK waters? Must be an enormous quantity of fish in UK waters if that's the case.

 

This is all good news. The UK will avoid mass unemployment as a result of the Covid crisis, as all UK residents can retrain as trawler men. It's going to be difficult to fill the vacancies.

[3NUMBAS]

Keir Starmer crisis: Damaging poll will worry Labour as Boris Johnson EXTENDS his lead

SIR Keir Starmer is struggling to make headway almost six months after being elected leader of the Labour Party, a new poll has indicated.

By Ciaran McGrath

 

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1324923/keir-starmer-news-labour-party-poll-conservative-party-boris-johnson-education

[melvinmelvin]

11 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 The opposition did oppose May's deal and try to make amendments to it.

 

But if Johnson, Rees-Mogg and the ERG had voted with May then her deal would have passed.

 

We will never know if Labour had won last December whether or not they would have presented May's deal with a few tweaks to the EU.

 

We do know that Johnson did exactly that!

if you are talking about the package that PM TM presented in the Mach / April time frame I might agree with you,

that package very clearly had the potential for reasonably quickly being negotiated into smth signable

best chance UK ever had

 

no deal is better than bad deal --- triple sheyte

Come Xmas and UK with no deal ---UK will make herself silly (again) to the whole world

 

about time to start using the pencil sharpeners . . . .

 

[RayC]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

I can answer but you were twisting as usual.

 

That the UK could leave the EU and remain in the single market and customs union was never likely. That would have required a major change on the EU side. A lesser change would have been relaxation of single market rules, or a sensible trade zero or ultra low tariff agreement to keep EU/UK trade moving easily. 

The UK are the ones instigating the change by leaving the EU. Why therefore, should the EU relax it's regulations governing the single market and customs union?

[nauseus]

29 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

"People who had small chance of being in power"

 

You must mean Boris Johnson; as he was one of those making these promises/claims/forecasts or whatever term you prefer.

Who knew who would be leading and in government after the referendum? Dodgy Dave said he would be carrying on (dodging) after all. 

[nauseus]

8 minutes ago, RayC said:

The UK are the ones instigating the change by leaving the EU. Why therefore, should the EU relax it's regulations governing the single market and customs union?

Because they need to. You all seem to think that only the UK will suffer economically. The economic power of the EU is declining, globally, anyway. With the loss of the UK cash and easy access to its market, plus the Covid issue, then the time for continued bullying should have passed by now.    

Edited August 21, 2020 by nauseus

[kingdong]

 

5 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

I wont mention the money we did get back in research grants, farm subsidies etc.

which is a fraction of what we pay in,and we,re told how and where to spend it.

[RayC]

5 hours ago, nauseus said:

Because they need to. You all seem to think that only the UK will suffer economically. The economic power of the EU is declining, globally, anyway. With the loss of the UK cash and easy access to its market, plus the Covid issue, then the time for continued bullying should have passed by now.    

We've been here before. I've acknowledged previously that both parties will suffer; to say otherwise is a falsehood.

 

Given that - and that 'leavers' continually insist that they knew what they were voting for - the only logical conclusion is that 'leavers' are economic sado-masochists: 'We will suffer but you will suffer more' (Imo very unlikely).

 

The loss of the UK contribution is now basically irrelevant; the EU have agreed the budget for the next 7 year cycle.

 

The EU was willing to walk away from the TTIP negotiations with the US because it could not accept US demands. Given that, do you really honestly think it wouldn't be willing to do the same during these negotiations?

[Scott]

Off-topic posts and replies removed  

 

[stevenl]

4 hours ago, RayC said:

We've been here before. I've acknowledged previously that both parties will suffer; to say otherwise is a falsehood.

 

Given that - and that 'leavers' continually insist that they knew what they were voting for - the only logical conclusion is that 'leavers' are economic sado-masochists: 'We will suffer but you will suffer more' (Imo very unlikely).

 

The loss of the UK contribution is now basically irrelevant; the EU have agreed the budget for the next 7 year cycle.

 

The EU was willing to walk away from the TTIP negotiations with the US because it could not accept US demands. Given that, do you really honestly think it wouldn't be willing to do the same during these negotiations?

Leavers don't care about the economy, things like the bus were all side stories. It was always only about one thing, immigration.

[transam]

15 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 Can you not be bothered to read the information from Vote.Leave provided; or have you read it and simply cannot admit that you were wrong?

The information was provided by the Government, but YOU keep talking about Cummings, he is an employee of the Government. Now go back and un-twist....????

[transam]

16 hours ago, Surelynot said:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-barnier-trade-talks-uk-eu-boris-johnson-a9681496.

 

Not looking good.....we must have let someone see our cards

Another anti everything "Independent" link.....How tiresome....????

[transam]

15 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 I would like to say that it's amazing that you have dodged a question with a reply you now claim was 'tongue in cheek banter!'

 

But it happens so often it's not amazing; it's expected.

Perhaps you don't realise that other folk don't twist stuff like yourself....????

[transam]

2 hours ago, stevenl said:

Leavers don't care about the economy, things like the bus were all side stories. It was always only about one thing, immigration.

More "Independent" assumptions.......????

[Rimmer]

Off topic inflammatory post removed

[stevenl]

19 minutes ago, transam said:

More "Independent" assumptions.......????

Looking at threads about brexit, looking at the disregard brexiteers have for the economic effects, looking at posts about immigration, my conclusion. So yes, very independent, but not Independent.

[CorpusChristie]

4 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Looking at threads about brexit, looking at the disregard brexiteers have for the economic effects, looking at posts about immigration, my conclusion. So yes, very independent, but not Independent.

An endless supply of cheap Eastern European labour may be good for big businesses , but its not good for British people looking for jobs .

  The UK needs to train its own young workforce , rather than just importing cheap workers

[stevenl]

31 minutes ago, CorpusChristie said:

An endless supply of cheap Eastern European labour may be good for big businesses , but its not good for British people looking for jobs .

  The UK needs to train its own young workforce , rather than just importing cheap workers

Please don't pretend brexit will be good for the UK economy. The reason for brexit is clear, immigration.

Edited August 22, 2020 by stevenl

[CorpusChristie]

2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Please don't pretend brexit will be good for the UK economy. The reason for brexit is clear, immigration.

That was one of the reasons .

Although I do not make the claim to speak on behalf of 17 million Brexit voters and give their reasons as to why they voted , I have no idea why everyone voted the way they did , I havent asked them all

[nauseus]

9 hours ago, RayC said:

We've been here before. I've acknowledged previously that both parties will suffer; to say otherwise is a falsehood.

 

Given that - and that 'leavers' continually insist that they knew what they were voting for - the only logical conclusion is that 'leavers' are economic sado-masochists: 'We will suffer but you will suffer more' (Imo very unlikely).

 

The loss of the UK contribution is now basically irrelevant; the EU have agreed the budget for the next 7 year cycle.

 

The EU was willing to walk away from the TTIP negotiations with the US because it could not accept US demands. Given that, do you really honestly think it wouldn't be willing to do the same during these negotiations?

Well there you have it - the main reasons for leave votes were not economic - but that's all remainers have to talk about.

 

The loss of the UK contribution is entirely relevant; the recently bartered EU budget/Covid fund created even more angst and disharmony within the sacred onion.

 

The EU may be willing to walk away from another negotiation. However, I expect that pressure from German industry will prevail in the end and that means some kind of deal will be made eventually.  

[Loiner]

15 hours ago, 7by7 said:

Not asking you to do that, simply asking for your opinion. Odd that you are so free with it in other circumstances, but can't offer one now! Actually, no, it's not odd at all.

 

I was thinking of tonight's estimated £99 million Euro lottery. But were you able to purchase a ticket, you probably wouldn't as it has the word 'Euro' in it's title!

 

If you think a FTA doesn't have rules agreed to by both parties, then you really are as naïve as your posts suggest!

 

You may have voted for a no deal Brexit, assuming you did actually vote; but most people voted for what Vote.Leave promised. All the benefits of membership without any of the responsibilities. (See many posts passim for proof.)

I did give you my opinion, which you then referred to. But you were too busy twisting my post away that you ignored that and wandered off to check the EuroMillions value. I guess you didn't win that either.

 

FTAs don't have the same EU rules, especially after negotiation. If Barnier sees sense (and Macron lets him) he could walk away with a deal that is OK for the EU, but more importantly good for UK. If not, we are finally free with No Deal. They can all start negotiations again, against the UK as a fully independent sovereign state. 

 

Leavers voted for many things, but none of them included a BRINO disguised as a deal. There are not that many benefits to the Single Market and Customs Union but far too many EU responsibilities. The UK and its' economy will be better off out of it. Thank god for JRM and the ERG. Dominic Cummings too!

 

Don't you like Chubby Checker? Here's another twister for you

 

 

 

 

[Loiner]

15 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

Boris said in his Telegraph article and on his bus that we paid £350 million a week to the EU. We didn't. We paid £350 million a week minus the rebate negotiated by Thatcher!

 

We didn't pay £350 million a week and then get £75 million a week refunded; the rebate was deducted before we paid.

 

This rebate was irreversible, we never would have lost it had we remained a member.

 

£350 Million minus the rebate does not equal £350 million.

 

£275 million is a big enough figure; one has to wonder why Johnson and his boss at Vote.Leave found it necessary to lie.

 

Never mind the pedantry. Red the top line:

 

 

17.4 Billion is about 350 Million per week.

Rebates come and go. They will never be irreversible with the crooks in Europe, who can simply increase our contribution when they like. 

EU spending in the UK is all our own money trickling back to EU causes, which will be now decided by the UK not Brussels.

 

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

Please don't pretend brexit will be good for the UK economy. The reason for brexit is clear, immigration.

There will be plenty of other political and economic benefits, plus your cream on the top. 

[transam]

2 hours ago, CorpusChristie said:

That was one of the reasons .

Although I do not make the claim to speak on behalf of 17 million Brexit voters and give their reasons as to why they voted , I have no idea why everyone voted the way they did , I havent asked them all

Nor has he........????

[Andrew65]

18 hours ago, 3NUMBAS said:

he will never be in no10 as its all bluff from lefty journos bigging up sir wooden head ,hes under orders of the unions and never can escape them ..bojo will be back in power at the next GE

I used to vote Tory, 30 years ago, but now I wouldn't vote for anyone.

It's true what you say about Labour & the unions, but it's just big business that has the Tories in their pockets/corruption.

I believe that every penny involved in politics a should be accounted for and that it's public money.

What's called bribery & corruption in Thailand is called a 'donation' in the UK.

I remember some years ago a Tory guy trying to convince people that the only reason people bribe the Tories is because they think their awfully nice chaps, they're giving them 10's of thousands and they do not expect anything whatsoever in return.