20 killed after train collides with bus in Thailand

[berrec]

OMG so sad and senseless loss of life.

 

People on their Temple journey to give thanks and pray.

 

RIP and prayers to all families of those lost.

[jollyhangmon]

9 minutes ago, Derek B said:

Why just at "risky spots"?

Such basic "improvements" are surely a mandatory requirement at all crossings. The design of many of these crossings is allowing drivers to take risks. Engineer the risk out to ALARP.

ALARP, which stands for "as low as reasonably practicable", or ALARA ("as low as reasonably achievable"), is a term often used in the regulation and management of safety-critical and safety-involved systems. The ALARP principle is that the residual risk shall be reduced as far as reasonably practicable.

 

... yes, sounds good but very slow process, been there & done that back home in the 1990s.

It's expensive to upgrade these crossings, so is later maintenance, the only safe way is to go above or below, just like with a real highway a.k.a. Autobahn, now we talking about really effin' expensive ...

 

First of all - again from experience - the sheer number of crossings will need to be cut and the remaining ones sized up and made safer technically ...

 

Btw., I suppose the trains have to slow down at this spot as well as lots of others anyway, by schedule, due to 'low safety standard' at these crossings ... underpasses sound good, yes, but aside of costs might be flooded half the time in these here lands ... 

 

[sandyf]

20 hours ago, petermik said:

The only time I ever took a train journey here was from Si Sa Ket to Bangkok....I heard the train driver sounding the horn several times to warn a farmer not to drive his cattle across the tracks....completely ignored it and it was a bloodbath...fortunately it was cattle and not human lives lost....beggars belief what this bus driver was thinking about.

RIP to the deceased

This track passes fairly close to our house so there are several crossings in the vicinity. We have been sat at the barrier and drivers have overtaken and zig zagged through the barrier, the mind boggles.

Quite often the barriers do not function because they have been bent by traffic trying to pass them so you are dependent on the flashing lights, but to many no barrier no problem.

The freight trains run about 2/3 times an hour and are fairly lengthy so little chance of stopping quickly, had it been the passenger train, that has only 3 carriages and would have stood more of a chance.

I am really surprised there is not a lot more accidents on that line, and as you say sympathies to the families of the deceased.

[tadpole22]

So sad for the loss of life, 

at school were told look left then right and left again

then cross

[worrab]

8 hours ago, CorpusChristie said:

800 meter visibility , train going 100 KM per hour , 1.6 kilometers per minute , would have given the bus driver 30 seconds to see the train 

I think you will find 100 kph a tad optimistic for a freight train on the lines over here.

[Moo 2]

My wife said the bus had Karaoke playing loud....end of comments. 

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, ginjag said:

Freight train ???   passenger carriages,  

I have seen many of the freight trains with one passenger carriage behind the engine.

[Moo 2]

And by the way, trains run on tracks, so the bus hit the train, not the other way out.

[worrab]

1 minute ago, Moo 2 said:

And by the way, trains run on tracks, so the bus hit the train, not the other way out.

Other way round Moo 2. Being an ex train driver it is always a case of the train hitting bus/car/truck or whatever object.

[recom273]

2 hours ago, Grumpy John said:

Only one thing to say...which is generally not specifically...the Thai engineman don't hit the horn enough when approaching level crossings, if at all.

 

This is how it should be done. 

 

Nothing to do with the size or speed of the train.  All about giving motorists plenty of warning.

Apparently, witnesses heard five blasts on the horn. 
 

Give that guy 200 boasts on the horn, he wouldn’t have noticed, he had no intention of stopping.

 

There are enough Thai apologists out there, they don’t need any help from us. Plain and simple, the driver killed 20 people because of his irresponsible action. He didn’t stop, he didn’t look, he didn’t do his job which is taking care of his passengers.
 

I feel for the driver of that train, I bet it will be a few months before he will be able to get a solid nights sleep again. 

 

 

[recom273]

8 minutes ago, Moo 2 said:

My wife said the bus had Karaoke playing loud....end of comments. 

Yeah, they had a DJ on board (probably some idiot shouting on a mic, turning the music up and down) apparently they were dancing in the aisle at the back of the bus.

[Bangkok Barry]

3 hours ago, Grumpy John said:

Only one thing to say...which is generally not specifically...the Thai engineman don't hit the horn enough when approaching level crossings, if at all.

Absolutely right. I've watched quite a few UK cab ride train videos and 2-3 hundred metres before wherever there is a crossing of any kind there is a sign with a big W on it. The W means whistle. And they do. They also have a bell sound in the cab whenever they are approaching a signal to make sure the driver is alert, but that's another story.

[sandyf]

1 hour ago, Huckenfell said:

This particular train must have been travelling slowly as it was parked a couple of hundred meters up the line after the accident. Nothing like  1.5 miles at 55 mph.

I have been sat at the barriers on that line more times than I care to remember. It is a bit difficult to judge but I would say they travel around 40 mph.

Its the momentum due to the length and weight of the train that is the problem.

[hotchilli]

21 hours ago, Shuya said:

Just another unsecured, unprotected level crossing

And an idiotic driver.

[johnarth]

I watched a video which probably will not be shown again the road was clear and the train was clear and only a few yards away from the crossing  both bus and train arrived at crossing at the same time bus did not stop

[Surasak]

Governor Maitree said the crossing has an alarm but does no barrier to block traffic when a train is coming. He said the province will install speed bumps and barriers as well as cut down trees near the crossing to improve visibility.

Always reactive, never proactive.

[Bkktodd]

So thailand accepts 20,000 plus fatalities a year on the roads yet fears 50 dying from COVID and 3000 now immune.  Need to get your priorities straight

[NanLaew]

As reported in the local news, the bus was full of workers on their way to the temple to make merit. Apparently there was even a DJ onboard so maybe the reason why the crossing's loud, audible warning wasn't heard by the bus driver or anyone else onboard. Mrs NL reckons that being a tamboon bus, it probably would have been full-on party central onboard.

 

The crossing there has three tracks, two for non-stop, each-way traffic on the main line and a third one on the north side which extends from Bangkok to Chachoengsao and looks like maybe it was the original single-track line and the one normally used for freight trains? It also looks like this 'goods line' may be being rebuilt about 4 km east of the accident site so maybe why the freight strain was on the mainline? The next set of points where trains can be redirected across all three tracks is about 4 km west of the accident site.

 

The bus had already crossed the single track and was hit by the freight train on the main line. I would have thought that a level crossing that wide, maybe 25 m across and on a quite busy track would have had barriers. Maybe it will in the future.

 

The video clip does appear to show the amber flashing lights may not have been operating but the low resolution and filtering of the video may account for that. However, witnesses have been reported as saying the loud audible warning is working and was ringing at the time.

 

With regard to the train 'not stopping', it did stop but the driver, knowing the length of his consist would have made sure his last car was clear of the accident site.

 

RIP

 

 

Edited October 12, 2020 by NanLaew

[sandyf]

45 minutes ago, jollyhangmon said:

 

... yes, sounds good but very slow process, been there & done that back home in the 1990s.

It's expensive to upgrade these crossings, so is later maintenance, the only safe way is to go above or below, just like with a real highway a.k.a. Autobahn, now we talking about really effin' expensive ...

 

First of all - again from experience - the sheer number of crossings will need to be cut and the remaining ones sized up and made safer technically ...

 

Btw., I suppose the trains have to slow down at this spot as well as lots of others anyway, by schedule, due to 'low safety standard' at these crossings ... underpasses sound good, yes, but aside of costs might be flooded half the time in these here lands ... 

 

The majority of the barriers on this line are small roads, we have a crossing each side of our house, one a barrier and the other a bridge, roads with significant traffic have already been altered.

What needs to change is the type of barrier, most are just arms that come down half the width of the road. This allows reckless drivers to try and pass the barrier and often causing damage and putting them out of operation. The only solution is a full width barrier and ideally one that came up out of the road.

Considering the number of trains on that line, a few years back it was upgraded to dual track increasing the number to around 2/3 hour, the accident rate is extremely low. Probably why there has been little done to improve the barriers.

[Stargeezr]

Watching the video, seeing that the crossing is clear, and the bus does not stop or slow

., makes me wonder what the driver was doing at the crossing. With the driver

dying, I hope there were enough witnesses to prove the it was the bus drivers

fault for this crash. My Thai family all tell me this was a typical, party bus,

and the music is always loud. Likely no other person in front to yell at the driver

to stop either. Sad that a person who had 50 lives depending on them got

so careless and complacent.  RIP.

Geezer

[khunPer]

3 hours ago, stouricks said:

This video, and the photo on the OP are of different accidents. The first one shows passenger coaches stopped at the scene. This video shows goods/freight trucks and the train did not stop at the scene.

 

  08.11am After looking again, I suspect the passenger coach was one brought up to bring rescuers or ferry victims.  

There is a station, with multiple tracks, next to the incident place; it could be that other trains are passing...????

[stouricks]

3 minutes ago, khunPer said:

There is a station, with multiple tracks, next to the incident place; it could be that other trains are passing...????

Do you really think that they would allow other scheduled trains to pass while they are recoveing bodies?

I didn't think so until I realised TIT!

[essox essox]

1 hour ago, jollyhangmon said:

 

... yes, sounds good but very slow process, been there & done that back home in the 1990s.

It's expensive to upgrade these crossings, so is later maintenance, the only safe way is to go above or below, just like with a real highway a.k.a. Autobahn, now we talking about really effin' expensive ...

 

First of all - again from experience - the sheer number of crossings will need to be cut and the remaining ones sized up and made safer technically ...

 

Btw., I suppose the trains have to slow down at this spot as well as lots of others anyway, by schedule, due to 'low safety standard' at these crossings ... underpasses sound good, yes, but aside of costs might be flooded half the time in these here lands ... 

 

ARE there any signs at the sides of the tracks to tell train drivers to SLOW DOWN ??

bet that there ARE NONE.......!!

[Peterphuket]

"There has been little improvement despite safety campaigns over the years"

 

Please tell me which one?

Do you mean they showing now a movie at the office, before you'll get your driverlicense where anybody fell in sleep?

Or there are on television?

Or do you mean at the primary schools?

Or you will be fined if you commit a violation in the traffic?, Do you mean 500 thb?

 

As far as I know, there is not only 1 safety campaign in this country.

 

Perhaps the government can start with the recommended present above, and not tomorrow but today!

[essox essox]

51 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

As reported in the local news, the bus was full of workers on their way to the temple to make merit. Apparently there was even a DJ onboard so maybe the reason why the crossing's loud, audible warning wasn't heard by the bus driver or anyone else onboard. Mrs NL reckons that being a tamboon bus, it probably would have been full-on party central onboard.

 

The crossing there has three tracks, two for non-stop, each-way traffic on the main line and a third one on the north side which extends from Bangkok to Chachoengsao and looks like maybe it was the original single-track line and the one normally used for freight trains? It also looks like this 'goods line' may be being rebuilt about 4 km east of the accident site so maybe why the freight strain was on the mainline? The next set of points where trains can be redirected across all three tracks is about 4 km west of the accident site.

 

The bus had already crossed the single track and was hit by the freight train on the main line. I would have thought that a level crossing that wide, maybe 25 m across and on a quite busy track would have had barriers. Maybe it will in the future.

 

The video clip does appear to show the amber flashing lights may not have been operating but the low resolution and filtering of the video may account for that. However, witnesses have been reported as saying the loud audible warning is working and was ringing at the time.

 

With regard to the train 'not stopping', it did stop but the driver, knowing the length of his consist would have made sure his last car was clear of the accident site.

 

RIP

 

 

WHY are there passengers on the train IF IT WAS a freight train ???

[Neeranam]

1 hour ago, Bkktodd said:

So thailand accepts 20,000 plus fatalities a year on the roads yet fears 50 dying from COVID and 3000 now immune.  Need to get your priorities straight

Who are you to tell a country what they should do?

[jollyhangmon]

2 minutes ago, essox essox said:

ARE there any signs at the sides of the tracks to tell train drivers to SLOW DOWN ??

bet that there ARE NONE.......!!

 

... there could be but probably not if it's already included in (all) the trains 'schedule' - for lack of better expression - meaning the Vmax is already pre-defined for such spots or bends, or 'weaker' spots in the tracks superstructure scheduled for later repair, or stops and stations etc., etc. ... 

 

That's why the engineers need to have 'aquired knowledge of the way/tracks' before they're allowed to drive trains alone/without a 'local' pilot at any given stretch of their journey ...

 

[spidermike007]

Whether there is a train crossing warning signal or not, when you are crossing railroad tracks, especially when you are responsible for so many lives, you slow down, look both ways, and then proceed. This was an enormous cargo train, and was easily visible, had this moron driver bothered to look. Now, he has inflicted untold amounts of pain on dozens of families. How skilled a driver was he? Did he have any previous accidents? Why did he not bother to look, while traveling slowly across railroad tracks? That is the very definition of reckless, and nonchalant. Public transport here can be very dangerous. 

 

The only way to survive here on the road, is to be patient, have eyes in the back of your head, drive with caution, and always, and I mean always watch out of the other guy. Chances are, he does not have much driving skill, nor patience, nor reason, nor common sense. You cannot be too careful on the road here. Especially considering that the toy police offer no traffic safety, nor enforcement of the law.

When I was growing up, we took drivers education courses. They showed us horrendous films, or semi trucks plowing into cars, and literally obliterating everything in their path. They also showed us graphic images of head on collisions. 120mph impacts. Even as a young kid, it made quite an impression. It was horrific, and it was hard to get those images out of your head afterwards. But, it left a lasting impression, and when I started driving, I understood it was serious business, and that it was a very dangerous thing to do. I always try to maintain awareness of "the other guy", while driving.

I see people driving here, with their families in the car, and doing things, and taking the kinds of risks no rational or sane person with common sense would do. What for? To gain one minute? Why take those risks? What is the logic? Often, when I am cruising along at 100kph, someone cuts right in front of me. Or someone comes out from the side road, right in front of me. I have to slam on my brakes, or change lanes to avoid him. I look in my rearview mirror, and there is nobody behind me. So, if he had waited two seconds, he would have had completely safe passage onto the highway. What gives? Where is the intelligence, caution, and prudence? Where is the common sense? What about just the instinct to survive, and protect your loved ones? Where is that? 
 

[Peterw42]

28 minutes ago, essox essox said:

WHY are there passengers on the train IF IT WAS a freight train ???

That is a train that has pulled up later, 

the freight train hit the bus then stopped further up the track, a passenger train came along then had to stop because the track is blocked.

There appears to be a great deal of confusion. A white bus, with a green underside, collided with a freight train, the freight train stopped a little way up the track.

Later, someone took the photo in the OP, it shows the green underside of the white bus, and a separate passenger train parked or passing on the other track.

 

Edited October 12, 2020 by Peterw42

[kuzmabruk]

22 hours ago, colinneil said:

Why does that matter?

UK unsecured crossings, have a sign saying.... Stop.... look... listen, clearly the bus driver did none of that.

Thai news shows actual video of the bus passing over the tracks without stopping.   They also report bus passengers saying the music was very loud and many of them saw the train but the driver was not looking and could not hear the train whistle.