Former U.S. defense chiefs say no role for military in Trump's efforts to contest defeat

[webfact]

Former U.S. defense chiefs say no role for military in Trump's efforts to contest defeat

 

U.S. Defense Secretary Mark Esper speaks during a joint news conference with Britain's Secretary of State of Defence Ben Wallace after their meeting at Pentagon in Arlington, Virginia, U.S., March 5, 2020. REUTERS/Yuri Gripas/Files

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Ten living former U.S. secretaries of defense on Sunday said in an opinion piece published in the Washington Post that the military should play no role in President Donald Trump's efforts to block the transfer of power to President-elect Joe Biden.

 

The group, including Mark Esper who was fired by Trump in November as well as another Trump defense chief James Mattis, said the time had come to accept that the Republican president had lost the Nov. 3 election and that Biden would succeed him on Jan. 20.

 

"Our elections have occurred. Recounts and audits have been conducted. Appropriate challenges have been addressed by the courts. Governors have certified the results. And the electoral college has voted," they said in the opinion piece. "The time for questioning the results has passed."

 

The group of officials included Dick Cheney -- who went on to serve as vice president under George W. Bush, and Donald Rumsfeld who served as secretary of defense first under Gerald Ford and again under George W. Bush.

 

The group called on the current acting Pentagon chief, Christopher Miller, to refrain from playing a role in Trump's efforts to remain president and to aid the incoming Democratic administration with the transition.

 

"Efforts to involve the U.S. armed forces in resolving election disputes would take us into dangerous, unlawful and unconstitutional territory," they wrote. "Civilian and military officials who direct or carry out such measures would be accountable, including potentially facing criminal penalties."

 

Other officials who signed the letter from both Republican and Democratic administrations included Ashton Carter, William Cohen, Robert Gates, Chuck Hagel, Leon Panetta and William Perry.

 

Biden said in mid-December that some Pentagon officials had balked at providing information needed to ensure a smooth transition. Acting secretary Miller denied that there was a problem.

 

The ten noted the importance of a smooth transition given that U.S. forces were involved in active operations overseas.

 

(Reporting by Diane Bartz, additional reporting by Idrees Ali; Editing by Scott Malone and Diane Craft)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2021-01-04

 

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[tonray]

Let me guess....Trump and his base will call all of them RINOs within 24 hours...member of the Deep State

[heybruce]

Before Trump the headline would have been a statement of the obvious.  Under Trump you worry that his acting SecDef will think otherwise.

[Tug]

Well that should let the military guys know in no uncertain terms how illegal trump orders will be viewed take heed would be my advice 

[Berkshire]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

"Efforts to involve the U.S. armed forces in resolving election disputes would take us into dangerous, unlawful and unconstitutional territory," they wrote. "Civilian and military officials who direct or carry out such measures would be accountable, including potentially facing criminal penalties."

Miller may not grasp the severity of the violation, but the career military leadership certainly will.  Interesting that both Esper and Mattis put their names on the piece.  Probably a good idea for the former SecDef's to put this in writing so that everyone in the military is clear where the red line is.    

[Trentham]

Trump's behaviour, in all its variances, indicates he is a very ill and mentally deranged man. Normally I would feel sympathy for such a person but somehow, in Trump's case , I just want him to pay dearly for his symptoms.

[Paul Henry]

Please do not worry. Trumps MAGA militia will keep the unloyal military in their  camps. And will control all the malcontents who wish to question or challenge [Trump]. Remember the US military has been underfunded until the saviour was elected.

Edited January 6, 2021 by onthedarkside
name calling reference removed

[heybruce]

33 minutes ago, Paul Henry said:

Please do not worry. Trumps MAGA militia will keep the unloyal military in their  camps. And will control all the malcontents who wish to question or challenge the liar in chief. Remember the US military has been underfunded until the saviour was elected.

A lot of Trump fans will think you're serious.

Edited January 4, 2021 by heybruce

[Lacessit]

22 minutes ago, heybruce said:

A lot of Trump fans will think you're serious.

I hope they do, because if they try it on with real soldiers it will be a salutary lesson for them.

Trump ducked his military service, why should the military support a draft dodger?

[Eric Loh]

1 hour ago, Paul Henry said:

Please do not worry. Trumps MAGA militia will keep the unloyal military in their  camps. And will control all the malcontents who wish to question or challenge the liar in chief. Remember the US military has been underfunded until the saviour was elected.

You mean those Proud Boys and Boogaloo  Boys and other boy groups. ????

[billd766]

9 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

You mean those Proud Boys and Boogaloo  Boys and other boy groups. ????

There is a vast difference between the wannabe military and the real military.

[Dumbastheycome]

I find it strange and  alarming that there would be any question !

[DaveK68]

6 minutes ago, Dumbastheycome said:

I find it strange and  alarming that there would be any question !

 Why?

The media has been spreading this fear mongering old wive's tale for three years now.

It's no surprise that this question is being asked.

I'd be more surprised if they didn't ask the question. It's utter nonsense. 

The lies and fabrications continue. That is all this is.

I'll be glad when Trump is gone so we can get back to the other set of lies where they tell us for four years how perfect Harris and Biden are and give them Nobel Peace Prizes for destroying the peace momentum building in the Middle East and when Biden reinvests American military into Afghanistan and Syria.

Back to good ol' progressivista hypocrisy. The Left has to keep the Military Industrial Complex on full auto.

.

 

Edited January 4, 2021 by DaveK68

[Dumbastheycome]

6 minutes ago, DaveK68 said:

 Why?

The media has been spreading this fear mongering wives tale for three years now.

It's no surprise that this question is being asked.

I'd be more surprised if they didn't ask the question. It's utter nonsense. 

The lies and fabrications continue. That is all this is.

I'll be glad when Trump is gone so we can get back to the other set of lies where they tell us for four years how perfect Harris and Biden are and give them Nobel Peace Prizes for destroying the peace momentum building in the Middle East and when Biden reinvests American military into Afghanistan and Syria.

Back to good ol' progressivista hypocrisy. The Left has to keep the Military Industrial Complex on full auto.

 

A somewhat intriguing response.

You are happy to see Trump  gone  but not happy about who replaces  him on the basis of more than equivalent "lies" that have not been revealed as substantive or  important on a national security basis or any yet to eminate from  the future.

It is not the "left" who has  boasted about  revamping the US Military. Full auto has been established already  and now here are  enuff  bullets  for dem  guns ! Never mind that  "other" nations  have stepped on the toes  of the Military Industrial Complex by upsetting the  International  market !

Relegation is  on the  move ! (over) !

So what  would bring satisfaction?  Bernie Sanders  or  Mike Pompeo ? ????

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, DaveK68 said:

 Why?

The media has been spreading this fear mongering old wive's tale for three years now.

It's no surprise that this question is being asked.

I'd be more surprised if they didn't ask the question. It's utter nonsense. 

The lies and fabrications continue. That is all this is.

It's nuts, all right. It's as crazy as saying that Trump would ever appoint as his National Security Adviser the kind of person who would recommend deploying the military to unconstitutionally rerun the election in the 6 states where the results are being disputed by Trump:

Michael Flynn: Trump could deploy military to 'rerun' election

Former Trump national security adviser Michael Flynn on Thursday said that President Trump could deploy the military to “rerun” the 2020 election.

During an appearance on Newsmax’s “Greg Kelly Reports,” Flynn was asked about the actions the president could take to undo the results of the election.

After Flynn suggested that the president could seize every voting machine across the country, he then suggested deploying the military in swing states that the president lost to President-elect Joe Biden.

https://thehill.com/homenews/news/530795-michael-flynn-trump-should-deploy-military-to-rerun-election

 

It's a good thing that Trump hasn't met with Flynn in the White House lately:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/19/us/politics/trump-sidney-powell-voter-fraud.html

[DB58]

3 hours ago, Paul Henry said:

Please do not worry. Trumps MAGA militia will keep the unloyal military in their  camps. And will control all the malcontents who wish to question or challenge the liar in chief. Remember the US military has been underfunded until the saviour was elected.

After living through so many I can’t believe he did/said that moments the last 4-years; it’s unnerving to even ponder the thought... one thing I will give him, he’s gonna standout in history books ????

[Scott Tracy]

As an outsider, I find this whole issue about the Presidential elections both comical and worrying. 

 

I look at the incumbent, desperate to cling to power and those who follow him will do almost anything to keep him in power. Those people are so virulently against the President elect and his team. Even to the point where the President elect is not the President elect, according to them.

The election seems to take forever. It always seems to be part of the news, years before it happens and months after. Such a circus I have rarely seen.The

As for the possibility that the United States military machine has some role to play in the outcome of an election,this is unthinkable to me.

 

[Patong2021]

On 1/4/2021 at 7:06 PM, Eric Loh said:

You mean those Proud Boys and Boogaloo  Boys and other boy groups. ????

Most just look like common thugs, - dirty, and uneducated. They walk around with guns and in gangs bullying.

 

 

On 1/4/2021 at 7:35 PM, DaveK68 said:

 Why?
The media has been spreading this fear mongering old wive's tale for three years now.
It's no surprise that this question is being asked.
I'd be more surprised if they didn't ask the question. It's utter nonsense. 
The lies and fabrications continue. That is all this is.
I'll be glad when Trump is gone so we can get back to the other set of lies where they tell us for four years how perfect Harris and Biden are and give them Nobel Peace Prizes for destroying the peace momentum building in the Middle East and when Biden reinvests American military into Afghanistan and Syria.
Back to good ol' progressivista hypocrisy. The Left has to keep the Military Industrial Complex on full auto.

 

Do you really believe what you write? It is Trump team and Trump who are promoting US military intervention. No one else. it is childish to  make up word like progressivista all because you are frustrated and cannot accept that the Trump group is anti democratic. If progressive to you is people who support democracy, then you will find much of the western world and USA is progressive.

 

Edited January 6, 2021 by onthedarkside
quote and reply to hidden post removed

[Pique Dard]

15 hours ago, webfact said:

that the military should play no role in President Donald Trump's efforts to block the transfer of power to President-elect Joe Biden.

i'm not sure this article is about the usa politics! a former gop was so taken aback he said this is  what could happen in a country like zimbabwe but not in the usa , indeed. i agree with everything he said. so delete donald trump's name and replace it with  robert mungabe's! that makes sense!

[Jeffr2]

9 hours ago, placeholder said:

It's nuts, all right. It's as crazy as saying that Trump would ever appoint as his National Security Adviser the kind of person who would recommend deploying the military to unconstitutionally rerun the election in the 6 states where the results are being disputed by Trump:

Michael Flynn: Trump could deploy military to 'rerun' election

Former Trump national security adviser Michael Flynn on Thursday said that President Trump could deploy the military to “rerun” the 2020 election.

During an appearance on Newsmax’s “Greg Kelly Reports,” Flynn was asked about the actions the president could take to undo the results of the election.

After Flynn suggested that the president could seize every voting machine across the country, he then suggested deploying the military in swing states that the president lost to President-elect Joe Biden.

https://thehill.com/homenews/news/530795-michael-flynn-trump-should-deploy-military-to-rerun-election

 

It's a good thing that Trump hasn't met with Flynn in the White House lately:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/19/us/politics/trump-sidney-powell-voter-fraud.html

Stop!  Trump supporters hate the facts.

 

Good links....crazy times!!!!!!!!!

 

https://www.newsweek.com/pro-trump-lawyer-lin-woods-claims-against-mike-pence-prompt-calls-fbi-secret-service-scrutiny-1558509
 

Quote

 

Wood, a staunch believer that Trump won the election, has switched his focus from Democrats to Republicans, calling for Pence to resign and face "execution by firing squad" in a tweet Friday. Once arrested, Wood suggested that the vice president would "sing like a bird" and confess to being a "main participant" in the "theft of the election."

 

Under Title 18 of the U.S. Code, threatening to kill, kidnap or inflict bodily harm upon the vice president is punishable by a fine, a maximum of five years in prison, or both.

 

 

[placeholder]

On 1/4/2021 at 7:30 PM, DaveK68 said:

Overwrought Trump delusions of the Progressivistas and their media puppets.

Trump could not mount a takeover of the US. It just would not and could not happen.

Stop the wet dreams and delusional Trump derangement already. He's been defeated. He will depart the White House or he'll be thrown out.
 

 

Top national security officials are now worried Trump could try to use the military to stay in power.

 

"The former secretaries were moved to sign the op-ed by three factors: the remark last month by retired Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn, Trump’s former (and recently pardoned) national security adviser, that Trump could declare “martial law” and order the military to supervise a do-over of the election; Trump’s own increasingly erratic and desperate behavior in trying to reverse the election through dubious legal means (and the statement was written before the notorious phone call on Saturday with Georgia’s secretary of state); and the refusal of top Pentagon officials to cooperate with President-elect Biden’s transition team...

 

The cessation of cooperation in mid-December is what “set off the alarm bells” that led to the drafting of the op-ed, according to one former official involved in the process. In one section of the statement, the secretaries note that, during a transition, the Pentagon’s current top officials are “bound by oath, law and precedent to facilitate the entry into office of the incoming administration” and to “refrain from any political actions that undermine the results of the election or hinder the success of the new team.” 

 

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/01/secdefs-statement-trump-military.html

[Stargeezr]

Just over 2 weeks to go, how much more of a mess can this unstable man get into before that date. Can someone take away Donnys cell phone, and get twitter to cancel his account?

  Geezer

[Hanuman2547]

On 1/4/2021 at 3:38 AM, Lacessit said:

I hope they do, because if they try it on with real soldiers it will be a salutary lesson for them.

Trump ducked his military service, why should the military support a draft dodger?

I guess by that same logic the military should not have supported Bill Clinton either seeing that he had dodged the draft through student deferments.  

[shdmn]

13 hours ago, Stargrazer9889 said:

Just over 2 weeks to go, how much more of a mess can this unstable man get into before that date. Can someone take away Donnys cell phone, and get twitter to cancel his account?

  Geezer

 

This is not going to end Jan20?  The idiots and racists who still support him will not suddenly go away after that and you cannot fix stupid. They and he will keep pretending the election was stolen for the next 4-8 years.  This is just Obama's birth certificate v2.

 

 I am kind of enjoying seeing all the nuts getting all worked up by him being led to believe the election is going to get overturned then constantly being disappointed daily.  Biden has been re-winning the election daily for the past 2 months.

Edited January 5, 2021 by shdmn

[Jingthing]

11 minutes ago, Hanuman2547 said:

I guess by that same logic the military should not have supported Bill Clinton either seeing that he had dodged the draft through student deferments.  

No. They are not equivalents. Student deferments were legal and legitimate although people can question the ethics of mostly the lower classes being drafted to fight.

 

 Faking bone spurs was not. 

 

Others fled to Canada. They faced lifetime consequences for doing that. Mr. trump never paid for his fraud. 

Edited January 5, 2021 by Jingthing

[Jeffr2]

8 hours ago, Hanuman2547 said:

I guess by that same logic the military should not have supported Bill Clinton either seeing that he had dodged the draft through student deferments.  

Sad you don't understand the difference between student deferments and medical fraud.  Bone spurs?  Done by a doctor renting an office from daddy?  Right....

[Hanuman2547]

4 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

Sad you don't understand the difference between student deferments and medical fraud.  Bone spurs?  Done by a doctor renting an office from daddy?  Right....

I actually understand the use of and differences between both quite well thank you very much.  Numerous men used what was available to them to get out of being drafted.  Bone spurs, flat feet, etc were all common medical reasons to be classified as unfit for military duty.  You just needed to find a "sympathetic doctor" that would sign off on it if you were refused by others.  Believe me, there were doctors out there who people were well aware would grant the waiver they needed.  What's odd is that you didn't know this.  If you came from a family with a little bit of money then you could enroll in college/university and use student deferments to delay your military service.  Students would then take the minimum amount of credits (and achieve passable grades) to keep their deferment in place.  Some, upon graduation, would then enroll in grad school to keep their deferment in effect.  

[Jeffr2]

12 minutes ago, Hanuman2547 said:

I actually understand the use of and differences between both quite well thank you very much.  Numerous men used what was available to them to get out of being drafted.  Bone spurs, flat feet, etc were all common medical reasons to be classified as unfit for military duty.  You just needed to find a "sympathetic doctor" that would sign off on it if you were refused by others.  Believe me, there were doctors out there who people were well aware would grant the waiver they needed.  What's odd is that you didn't know this.  If you came from a family with a little bit of money then you could enroll in college/university and use student deferments to delay your military service.  Students would then take the minimum amount of credits (and achieve passable grades) to keep their deferment in place.  Some, upon graduation, would then enroll in grad school to keep their deferment in effect.  

Yeah.  That's what Trump did.  Found a sympathetic doc, one who was beholden to his father, and got a fake diagnosis.  Clinton didn't do that.  So why bash Clinton?  He did what was legal.  Trump committed fraud.

 

Either way, war sucks and should be avoided at all costs.

[Hanuman2547]

2 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

Yeah.  That's what Trump did.  Found a sympathetic doc, one who was beholden to his father, and got a fake diagnosis.  Clinton didn't do that.  So why bash Clinton?  He did what was legal.  Trump committed fraud.

 

Either way, war sucks and should be avoided at all costs.

Technically both Clinton and Trump were just doing what thousands of young men of all political leanings did during a time that the US was involved in a very controversial and unpopular war.  They both did this "legally" but they just used different means to achieve the same outcome.  This left the war to be fought by young, poor, and an overly represented POC draftees with neither the financial means or connections to avoid being sent to this conflict.

[onthedarkside]

Let's try to stay reasonably on topic here, which is not Vietnam War era draft evasion.