advise about overtsay visa

[lexlam]

hey guys, a friend of mine called me this morning asking for some advises about his GF situation,

she's currently in southern area, her passport was expired on the 14th Nov. as well her visa expired on the same date.

she applied for new passport since Oct. but was so delayed, this week her embassy suggested to deliver to her with a travel document as a faster solution to return back home to avoid overstay more than 90 days and get her passport from there,

as I knew that the max overstay penalty is 20k thb she must pay, but another issue which i'm not sure if overstay more the 90 days will be ban to retrun back?

or the immigration will give an extension about this delayed new passport same to other visa extensions? 

please advise if anyone experienced with this issue? does she need to get a letter from her embassy showing that the caused delay is not her fault? 

or any suggestion to prove she reached this overstay because of waiting her new passport? maybe can ask her embassy to help with this letter?

or must advise her to leave before the 14th of Feb to avoid the ban?

plz  your quick reponse will be highly appreciated, thanks a lot. 

 

[ubonjoe]

A overstay of more than 90 days will result in ban from entering the country for one year. If she get caught with an overstay if will be longer ban.

From the immigration website.

[DrJack54]

She needs to leave Thailand as soon as she receives new pp.

If under 90 overstay 20k fine.

The delay in obtaining pp due to process time will mean nothing with expiry mid November.

Seriously thats almost 3 month overstay.

[Tagged]

Why not just ask the immigration  directly what to do in this situation? 

[VinnieK]

As I had a similar problem, here is my take

For a start...has she gotten her new pp already?

If yes, dash to the immi office and get an extension or whatever is reqd

Obviously ,she will have to pay the 20k.

If she goes over the 3 month limit, I have no idea how to proceed.

 

I would visit them TODAY and explain the situation.

..ie what happens if she stays over the 90 day limit

 

Good luck

 

(Which province in the south?...drop me a DM)

[jackdd]

It's quite easy, more than 90 days overstay means she will be banned for a year from Thailand, Immigration won't care what the reason for the overstay was.

If my math is right she has until tomorrow to get an emergency travel document from her embassy and fly out of Thailand (she has to pay a 20k THB fine at the airport), as advised by her embassy. If she fails to do this she will be banned for a year.

Then she can get a new passport back home and come back to Thailand.

[lexlam]

16 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

She needs to leave Thailand as soon as she receives new pp.

If under 90 overstay 20k fine.

The delay in obtaining pp due to process time will mean nothing with expiry mid November.

Seriously thats almost 3 month overstay.

I asked back and learned that she applied: submitted the documents to her embassy in Sept. 2020, they caused this delay,, as for now the embassy informed her to get a travel document to leave sooner, but there is another trouble, she needs to ge the certificate free from covid, and make a flight booking,

sunday will be the 14th = deadline, in this case, how can be possible to avoid this passing 90 days?

also, she needs to go to the immigration office to pay the fine on monday the 15th? then set for flight?

 

 

[lexlam]

3 hours ago, jackdd said:

It's quite easy, more than 90 days overstay means she will be banned for a year from Thailand, Immigration won't care what the reason for the overstay was.

If my math is right she has until tomorrow to get an emergency travel document from her embassy and fly out of Thailand (she has to pay a 20k THB fine at the airport), as advised by her embassy. If she fails to do this she will be banned for a year.

Then she can get a new passport back home and come back to Thailand.

unfortunately, time is very tight, she needs to get the covid certificate also, book a flight, this maybe not enought time, 

or can go to immigration office to pay the 20k fineon monday and fly monday evening? will be 1 day late,

if she managed to make booking on monday, and get the cert in this weekend, 

any advise or recommendation about this?

[ubonjoe]

12 minutes ago, lexlam said:

I asked back and learned that she applied: submitted the documents to her embassy in Sept. 2020, they caused this delay,, as for now the embassy informed her to get a travel document to leave sooner, but there is another trouble, she needs to ge the certificate free from covid, and make a flight booking,

sunday will be the 14th = deadline, in this case, how can be possible to avoid this passing 90 days?

also, she needs to go to the immigration office to pay the fine on monday the 15th? then set for flight?

The fine can only be paid at the airport on departure from the country. 

If she could apply for a extension of some kind would it be possible to pay at a immigration office.

If her embassy would issue a travel document and assist her with immigration by at least writing a letter to immigration explaining the problem. They might let her pay the fine and grant a 30 day extension based upon the letter from the embassy.

Edit: Immigration will be closed tomorrow for a holiday so the earliest she can go to immigration would be Monday.

Edited February 11, 2021 by ubonjoe

[lexlam]

4 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

The fine can only be paid at the airport on departure from the country. 

If she could apply for a extension of some kind would it be possible to pay at a immigration office.

If her embassy would issue a travel document and assist her with immigration by at least writing a letter to immigration explaining the problem. They might let her pay the fine and grant a 30 day extension based upon the letter from the embassy.

Edit: Immigration will be closed tomorrow for a holiday so earliest she can go to immigration would be Monday.

Thanks. this is a good option, 

her embassy can help  to send letter along with her travel document, 

but, will this help her to obtain just a short extension for a week if she goes to the immigration office on monday which means 1 day after the 90 days limit?

her current visia expired on 14th Nov. she has the documents reference when she submitted to renew passport in Sept last year, 

One more point, she's at songka province, she be advised to get a letter from her embassy to reach BKK? she worried if she get arrested on the way to BKK, 

Thanks,

[ubonjoe]

Monday would be 92 days according to my date calculator. 

With the letter from the embassy and etc immigration could grant 7 days to leave the country after the 1900 baht fee is paid. But if the embassy wrote the letter requesting a extension she could get 30 days under clause 2.28 of the immigration order.

[lexlam]

5 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Monday would be 92 days according to my date calculator. 

With the letter from the embassy and etc immigration could grant 7 days to leave the country after the 1900 baht fee is paid. But if the embassy wrote the letter requesting a extension she could get 30 days under clause 2.28 of the immigration order.

perfect advise, thanks bro ubonjeo!

[jackdd]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

Monday would be 92 days according to my date calculator. 

With the letter from the embassy and etc immigration could grant 7 days to leave the country after the 1900 baht fee is paid. But if the embassy wrote the letter requesting a extension she could get 30 days under clause 2.28 of the immigration order.

Are you sure that immigration would grant an extension with just an emergency travel document? Afaik this can only be used to fly out of the country and nothing else, I think having a valid passport is a must have to get any kind of extension.

Also as you said, Monday is day 92 already. I would say it's at quite unlikely that they get any high up officer involved to waive the ban just to do her a favor, the odds that she will be banned from Thailand for a year if she stays after tomorrow are probably way above 50%.

If she attempts to visit immigration on Monday, I would also highly suggest that she has a ticket out of Thailand booked in advance, as proof that she intents to leave as soon as possible, or it could happen that an IO with bad mood sends her to the IDC.

Edited February 11, 2021 by jackdd

[lexlam]

4 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Are you sure that immigration would grant an extension with just an emergency travel document? Afaik this can only be used to fly out of the country and nothing else, I think having a valid passport is a must have to get any kind of extension.

Also as you said, Monday is day 92 already. I would say it's at quite unlikely that they get any high up officer involved to waive the ban just to do her a favor, the odds that she will be banned from Thailand for a year if she stays after tomorrow are probably way above 50%.

If she attempts to visit immigration on Monday, I would also highly suggest that she has a ticket out of Thailand booked in advance, as proof that she intents to leave as soon as possible, or it could happen that an IO with bad mood sends her to the IDC.

informed her BF to advise her to come to BKK, probably will reach BKK tomorrow, also she needs to get the Covid test as well,

 so as you said, to avoid any misunderstanding, will suggest her to arrange a flight booking at hand, then go to immigration office on Monday to pay the 20k, but if the flight will be 2 - 3 days later than monday, she still can be fine to avoid the ban of ecxeeding the 90 days? for sure must have the embassy letter with her too, 

in this case, 3 - 5 days over the 90 days limit, paying her fines and showing airticket at hand with letter from embassy will help the IO to understand not to put her as blacklisted?

 

Also, she planning to come to BKK today or tonight, but she worried if arrested on the way?

shall advise her to get a letter from the embassy to show to police or any else to avoid get troubled with this metter? 

 

 

[ubonjoe]

26 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Are you sure that immigration would grant an extension with just an emergency travel document? Afaik this can only be used to fly out of the country and nothing else, I think having a valid passport is a must have to get any kind of extension.

Some travel documents can be used for extensions. Some embassies also issue emergency passports.

There is not way she can leave the country before the 91st day. The rules state over 90 days. 

If she has a letter from her embassy immigration may be a bit flexible especially with the current covid 19 situation.

[jackdd]

20 minutes ago, lexlam said:

so as you said, to avoid any misunderstanding, will suggest her to arrange a flight booking at hand, then go to immigration office on Monday to pay the 20k, but if the flight will be 2 - 3 days later than monday, she still can be fine to avoid the ban of ecxeeding the 90 days? for sure must have the embassy letter with her too, 

in this case, 3 - 5 days over the 90 days limit, paying her fines and showing airticket at hand with letter from embassy will help the IO to understand not to put her as blacklisted?

What will happen is just speculation, the rules clearly say more than 90 days means a year ban, this situation is too rare to make any really educated guess on it. To have the ban waived would require a nice senior immigration officer and a lot of luck.

If I were in her situation (besides of that I would have left Thailand long before ending up in this situation though), I would sit in a plane tomorrow, somehow.

 

If she shows up at immigration on Monday with the ticket in hand, I think there are two options on how it will most likely end:

Extension possible: If she is very lucky they involve a senior IO, waive the ban, and issue her some kind of extension, maybe 7 days to leave the country, after she pays the 20k fine.

Extension not possible: They will ask her for the booking confirmation of her flight, and upon showing this they will tell her to take the flight, inform her that she has to pay 20k at the airport and will probably be banned for a year, then they send her away.

Edited February 11, 2021 by jackdd

[lexlam]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

Monday would be 92 days according to my date calculator. 

With the letter from the embassy and etc immigration could grant 7 days to leave the country after the 1900 baht fee is paid. But if the embassy wrote the letter requesting a extension she could get 30 days under clause 2.28 of the immigration order.

 

32 minutes ago, jackdd said:

Are you sure that immigration would grant an extension with just an emergency travel document? Afaik this can only be used to fly out of the country and nothing else, I think having a valid passport is a must have to get any kind of extension.

Also as you said, Monday is day 92 already. I would say it's at quite unlikely that they get any high up officer involved to waive the ban just to do her a favor, the odds that she will be banned from Thailand for a year if she stays after tomorrow are probably way above 50%.

If she attempts to visit immigration on Monday, I would also highly suggest that she has a ticket out of Thailand booked in advance, as proof that she intents to leave as soon as possible, or it could happen that an IO with bad mood sends her to the IDC.

 

2 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Some travel documents can be used for extensions. Some embassies also issue emergency passports.

There is not way she can leave the country before the 91st day. The rules state over 90 days. 

If she has a letter from her embassy immigration may be a bit flexible especially with the current covid 19 situation.

Yes bro, also booking a flight and doing the covid test which is a requirement to fly will together take 3-5 days, so the best advise to her is to arrange a full set of doc at hand: 

1. travel doc from embassy,

2. letter from embassy to immigration requesting for a week extension, 

3. booked air-ticket - confirmed flight,

4. test covid cert.

5. 20k - fines for 90 days,

6. 1900 THB for extra days - 1 week extension

As I understood, these would help her to avoid the blacklisted trouble? 

as I understood

One more point, she will be heading to BKK today or tonight, will she need a letter from her embassy to avoid arrested if she stopped/checked by police on the way to BKK? please confirm if this needed she must opbtain it from her embassy within today by email or fax from the embassy, 

Thanks for you all guys, very kind of you all these quick responses are so helpful indeed, 

[lexlam]

3 minutes ago, jackdd said:

What will happen is just speculation, the rules clearly say more than 90 days means a year ban, this situation is too rare to make any really educated guess on it. To have the ban waived would require a nice senior immigration officer and a lot of luck.

If I were in her situation (besides of that I would have left Thailand long before ending up in this situation though), I would sit in a plane tomorrow, somehow.

 

If she shows up at immigration on Monday with the ticket in hand, I think there are two options on how it will most likely end:

Extension possible: If she is very lucky they involve a senior IO, waive the ban, and issue her some kind of extension, maybe 7 days to leave the country, after she pays the 20k fine.

Extension not possible: They will ask her for the booking confirmation of her flight, and upon showing this they will tell her to take the flight, inform her that she has to pay 20k at the airport and will probably be banned for a year, then they send her away.

Yes, you are right and possible, so as I understood:

will advise her to arrange this full set of doc at hand before heading to IO next monday: 

1. travel doc from embassy,

2. letter from her embassy to immigration requesting for a week extension, 

3. booked air-ticket - confirmed flight,

4. test covid cert.

5. 20k - fines for 90 days,

6. 1900 THB for extra days - 1 week extension,

would this satisfy the IO to let her leave normally and return back as usually?

 

 

[Tanoshi]

4 minutes ago, lexlam said:

One more point, she will be heading to BKK today or tonight, will she need a letter from her embassy to avoid arrested if she stopped/checked by police on the way to BKK? please confirm if this needed she must opbtain it from her embassy within today by email or fax from the embassy, 

Thanks for you all guys, very kind of you all these quick responses are so helpful indeed, 

If she hasn't already contacted her Embassy as an emergency case, she should do so immediately.

 

I'm in agreement with @jackdd they can't issue an extension beyond the date of an expired Passport.

If she can get an emergency passport, maybe, but highly unlikely.

She'll probably get an emergency travel document, in which I'd go to the airport directly, pay the fine and receive a 1 year ban.

[Tanoshi]

21 minutes ago, lexlam said:

2. letter from her embassy to immigration requesting for a week extension, 

Unless she can get an emergency passport as opposed to an emergency travel document, I'd stay clear of an Immigration office. Nothing stopped her returning to your home Country with an expired Passport.

 

21 minutes ago, lexlam said:

would this satisfy the IO to let her leave normally and return back as usually?

Very doubtful, she's had since mid November to deal with her situation and I wouldn't expect any sympathy in the case due to Covid. That didn't stop her from acting long before now.

Edited February 11, 2021 by Tanoshi

[Tanoshi]

21 minutes ago, jackdd said:

If she shows up at immigration on Monday with the ticket in hand, I think there are two options on how it will most likely end:

Extension possible: If she is very lucky they involve a senior IO, waive the ban, and issue her some kind of extension, maybe 7 days to leave the country, after she pays the 20k fine.

Extension not possible: They will ask her for the booking confirmation of her flight, and upon showing this they will tell her to take the flight, inform her that she has to pay 20k at the airport and will probably be banned for a year, then they send her away.

Third option, they arrest her for overstay, prosecuted, IDC, 5 year ban.

[natway09]

A "Vitre de Voyage issued by her Embassy should suffice.

As she has let things drift for far too long her only hope is to approach Immigration with preferably an agent or intelligent Thai to explain, along with letter from Embassy outlining all dates of application etc & their reason for delay

But do not expect too many favours. An airline travel confirmation may help

Incidently, which country is over 3 months behind in issuing new passports?

Please tell, as you may help others to avoid  this problem

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, natway09 said:

Incidently, which country is over 3 months behind in issuing new passports?

Pound to a penny it's USA.

 

All applications for Visas to the US have been held up in NVC for 10 months due to Covid and the political situation.

[ubonjoe]

10 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

All applications for Visas to the US have been held up in NVC for 10 months due to Covid and the political situation.

No delays for US passports. A recent report stated theirs was received at the embassy 8 days after he applied. 

[gavlar]

A member of my extended family works in Bangkok Hospital. 

I was enquiring about my own RT PCR test for exit and she tells me if tested before 10am then you get the result same day..in the evening. Cost is 5000 baht.

If she got tested tomorrow morning and could get a flight on Saturday she wouldn't breach the 90 day overstay. Just a thought .....

 

[VinnieK]

A can of worms..

You can't even stay in a hotel with an expired visa/passport ,in case she needs to overnight in BKK

Even a domestic flight could be a problem w/an expired passport as it happened to me a couple of days ago.

I pulled out my thai driver's license and the issue was dropped.

 

Btw...what kind of visa does she hold?

 

 

Edited February 11, 2021 by VinnieK

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, VinnieK said:

Btw...what kind of visa does she hold?

None, it expired.

She had permission to stay but that's expired as well.

She's now here illegally on overstay.

Edited February 11, 2021 by Tanoshi

[2 is 1]

1 hour ago, VinnieK said:

A can of worms..

You can't even stay in a hotel with an expired visa/passport ,in case she needs to overnight in BKK

Even a domestic flight could be a problem w/an expired passport as it happened to me a couple of days ago.

I pulled out my thai driver's license and the issue was dropped.

 

Btw...what kind of visa does she hold?

 

 

If can, travel whit bus when passport or visa have expired! And don't need stay night in Peninsula, there are "few" other than 5 ⭐ place in Bangkok and all not so accurate ask documents!

[VinnieK]

5 hours ago, 2 is 1 said:

If can, travel whit bus when passport or visa have expired! And don't need stay night in Peninsula, there are "few" other than 5 ⭐ place in Bangkok and all not so accurate ask documents!

I stayed in a cheap GH in soi Chanasongkram back in Dec and the lady at the reception diligently went thru my visa page to check for expiration.

She even told me that no visa no stay.

My visa was still valid at the time though.

 

As an aside re: the case in question.

Talkin to immi. officials in the past few weeks, my take is that there are no raids or stopping ppl on the streets, for the time being. ( Covid and all that)

 

 

[rosst]

This is so interesting, this is precisely why I have chosen the Philippines, Thailand immigration lacks common sense and empathy. 

Sorry to read about your dilemma. 

I have a friend in the Philippines who has that situation and no problem, just needed to show the documentation for the replacement passport.