My Issan 10kw on grid solar project fully installed by contractors 337,500bht

[Crossy]

2 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Agreed, it's almost as if the solar meter readings are double everything.

 

He does have two inverters, software configuration issue?

 

I'm also not clear if he has the "Smart Power Sensor" (item H on page 6 of the manual) it's not on the single-line that I can see (our equivalent is a simple clamp-on current transformer on the incoming supply). If not where is the "self consumption" number coming from?

 

SUN2000-(2KTL-5KTL)-L0 User Manual.pdf

 

@Thaifish Any actual documentation from PEA yet?

 

 

[BritManToo]

Just now, Crossy said:

He does have two inverters, software configuration issue?

 

I'm also not clear if he has the "Smart Power Sensor" (item H on page 6 of the manual) it's not on the single-line that I can see. If not where is the "self consumption" number coming from?

 

@Thaifish any photos of what you have and the general installation, it's certainly looking good from an export point of view.

 

Yes, I could absolutely believe he was generating 25kwhr and using 20kwh a day.

[BTB1977]

That's alot just for some electric.  20 some years to pay for itself?  

[Crossy]

Here are our graphs for yesterday, note that the right hand side is grid consumption not self consumption.

Real time version (with some additional graphs) here https://thingspeak.com/channels/991448

 

You can see the irrigation pumps in the morning, Madam washing and ironing around mid day and the bedroom A/C and shower in the evening. This is the sort of thing I'd be expecting to see.

 

 

[Srikcir]

Do you have storage, ie., Telsa Power Wall?

[worgeordie]

On 2/25/2021 at 8:21 AM, Thaifish said:

I run an 8000w hot water machine for my shower and fill jacuzzi,

Maybe you should spend a few bob on a Solar water heater too,

regards Worgeordie

[Crossy]

1 minute ago, Srikcir said:

Do you have storage, ie., Telsa Power Wall?

 

The systems under discussion here are all on-grid systems which export excess production to the grid, no batteries.

[RocketDog]

On 2/23/2021 at 10:21 PM, Thaifish said:

I'm day 4 into commission of unit... The questions you ask are hard but I will answer with what I see.. There has been heaps of interruptions on the unit. We had a black out for 4 something hours (solar shut down) + a major warning display come up which through the system out and it shut down and spiked and shut down for a few hours. The warning was prompted by an over voltage from the power supplier. I have noticed since solar switched on we are getting around 230V...before it was around 210V..  so early on in the stage with sun all day bar drop outs.

 

Financials looking better than what I was expecting.. I was expecting 40kw production but it is looking like 60kw per day!!! early times. I have issues big time with the computer and phone readouts but the production figure looks close.

 

Best guess at this stage with break even is 5 years 11months. Average consumption is 1196Kw p/m or 5,0000bht. Cost per Kw 4.18 Bht. The meter has averaged 13.3 Kw gain after a nights consumption.. :-)

 

Do I make money from selling to the grid?....Yes as confirmed by my Terak at Nang Rong PEA today. The buying price is 1.96Bht Kw.. I am still waiting for the smart meter to be installed...could take up to 6 months?? This is Thailand... Meter paid for in installation 4K Bht.. so going on figures above roughly 731Bht per month.

 

Amortization and expected lifetime?  No idea... Comes with 5 year warranty...cough cough...money paid day is when warranty stops in Thailand. Inverters have 5 years...Might last 10 if lucky...really lucky... Solar panels maybe 20 years... 1 lightning strike may change all of that.. The system is earthed for such an event..

 

Expected maintenance...Clean the PV panels every six months which is included in the installation cost for the next 5 years.... That was a surprise in contract...

 

Repair cost?? no idea... 5 years warranty to worry about that...

You quote in kw, which is actually 'power '. I will assume you actually mean kwh, energy. For example, a cordless drill battery can typically supply upwards of 12V@>10A=>120W. But it certainly can't do that for an hour. KWH is unit of energy. 

 

Minor point but eliminates confusion and irritating replies like mine. Sorry, as an EE these things matter to me. Remember the hubble mirror was wrong because of confusion in units of inches vs millimeters during fabrication ? 

 

Installation looks top notch. You obviously did your homework. Best of luck and thanks for the info. 

 

 

[JBChiangRai]

You can save a lot of money by shopping around and paying a local sparky to install it.

 

I have 2 installations, first one is 8.6Kw in panels on a Must 6Kw Grid-Tied inverter, total insulation cost 140,000 baht, ROI in about 3 years.

 

After the learning experience of the first, my new house has 20.7Kw of panels on 3 Hybrid Inverters of 5.5Kw each, total 16.5Kw slaved running single phase (can run 3 phase too). I discovered I could buy the inverters direct from the factory in China, shipped all taxes and duties prepaid (skips customs here entirely) for 49,000 baht for all 3, half the price of Lazada.  I also have 26KwHrs (usable 21) of LiFePo batteries sourced and shipped the same way for 85,000 baht including BMS and Active Balancers. Including installation about 450,000 baht. We will attempt to operate net-metering, keeping the batteries for power cuts, but I might have to use the batteries during peak sunlight hours/evening if we kick out more than 253v in peak production hours.

[maxpower]

2 hours ago, Crossy said:

I'm also not clear if he has the "Smart Power Sensor

 

[JBChiangRai]

1 hour ago, worgeordie said:

Maybe you should spend a few bob on a Solar water heater too,

regards Worgeordie

It may be cheaper to use 6 solar panels of V(max) 40 volts in series powering a stored hot water tank

[maxpower]

2 hours ago, Crossy said:

it's not on the single-line that I can see (our equivalent is a simple clamp-on current transformer on the incoming supply).

 

But what throws a spanner in the works is :-

QUOTE - We had to run a second phase from the grid meter as we burnt the supply cable out. So we have 2 phases coming into the bahn.

Wiring around the Schneider load center is interesting.

I will hold back any comments about solar production until the OP has all ducks in a row.
 

[Crossy]

@maxpower yeah, missed that in his photos.

 

[TyJames]

Thanks very much for the information, from all the contributors, I am interested in going Solar, my normal usage is 750 units approx 3,500Baht at least half of that is for the Pool pumps which are on twice a day.

I rarely if ever use the AC,

The batteries seem to be a very high expense within any system, could I use the solar power to run the house and pumps during the day and revert to PEA for night and dull days?

I shall be following your experience with interest.  thanks

[Crossy]

On 2/24/2021 at 9:16 PM, Thaifish said:

 

 

Oooh, hybrid inverters it seems ???? 

 

Any plans to add batteries at a later date (I'm assuming they have "emergency" power outputs).

 

 

[Pilotman]

On 2/22/2021 at 9:31 PM, Thaifish said:

Folks give me a few days to put this together. My system has been up and running for only 4 days and I would call it a commissioning stage. There was a black out 4 hours from grid day 3 which did not help. There is plenty to tell so far already from my experience. Slowly Slowly catch the monkey!! Yes my outlay was 337,500bht + 3 cases of Chang and 1case of Leo... Physical installation took 2 days to install + 2 days initial start up. The initial start up on day 3  configuring output performance/display was hampered by lousy internet reception and was sorted early on day 4. Not an installer issue. It could have been finished on day 3 bar the internet issue. The 6 guys who physically installed the system come from Bangkok so free accommodation was supplied on site in Yai's bahn on the floor!!. Also my "Issan Luv Machine" acka   "Missus" provided 3 cooked meals a day for workers which is being charged back to the company. (~1500bht) I was more than happy with the arrangement of accommodation set up before it happened knowingly I could build up a relationship with these guys with the installation. So I will progress with this thread and put some photos and links up to web pages etc.. After day 4 I am producing way more than what is being consumed... The meter does not lie! 

i would have to live to be 115 to get a payback, so I won't be doing that. 

[bigdod]

I'm considering going down this route myself - not so much to try to save or make money, more so that I have one less monthly outgoing when I finally get to retire... 

[eisfeld]

8 hours ago, Crossy said:

Our OP is apparently getting a LOT more from his panels than we are, he has roughly 10kWP of panels and is getting 53kWh (5.3kWh per 1kWP installed), we have 6.5kWP installed and are currently getting about 22.5kWh (3.5kWh per 1kWP installed). He's getting better than 50% more than we are.

 

If I pick a really good day recently (not avg) then I get 19.6 kWh / 3.96 kW = 4.95kWh per kWp. He got 7% higher and in my case the panels are not clean. The slope of "my" roof is 15 degrees pointing reasonably south and has a tiny bit shadowing in the very early morning. I can see him getting the quoted yields.

[WebGuy]

Did you cover the aspect of cyber security?

[Thaifish]

Day 7and my updates... First up I really did not want to post my power bill but I have had heaps of questions about previous consumption. The bill is not accurate consumption as I returned to Thailand January with lock out fellang since March last year.. Long story.. I do know from memory from my previous 8 years living here that I would expect this time of year for the Bin to be in the high 4,000bht range... Maybe 4,600bht and it will build up over the wet season to maybe 5,400bht.. Each year it builds up.. The consumption shown in the last 6 months is low for reasons yours truly has not been on the ground... I wish to show a full picture here of my installation. The ATM has been broken until I got back... On the bonus side the Durian is fruiting for the first time..4 years... with all the water from irrigation.. 

[Thaifish]

For those crunching numbers attached is my diary readout from the old meter 7 days now in production.. As many posters are saying.... To good to be true with output.... A big shortfall with this system is the poor readout display. Enviouse of other posters display....Maybe with smart meter when it turns up I might get a more accurate info with display??  

[Thaifish]

From my readouts I found by clicking on the inverter Icon and Meter Icon I could gain a bit more info as in the Pics attached... Even though the main screen shows power coming from the grid the box shows a minus which means it is being fed into grid. The meter is spinning backwards all day.. Sheeet software readout.. It is all I have to go by...

[Thaifish]

There is a smart meter wired in as earlier questioned. In the schematics of wiring I think there are 2 but I watched the installers remove 1 during initial start up. There is a scrolling readout with active energy IMP/EXP and Active Power which I do not comprehend??? Not sure which side of power input it is coming from....ie PV or Grid?? The other readouts are basic Amp, Watt, Freq to me which I understand

[Thaifish]

Todays output as best I see it....

[eisfeld]

IMP/EXP should be Import (consumption from grid) and Export (production sent to grid). Active Power should be I guess the current wattage.

[Crossy]

20 hours ago, TyJames said:

Thanks very much for the information, from all the contributors, I am interested in going Solar, my normal usage is 750 units approx 3,500Baht at least half of that is for the Pool pumps which are on twice a day.

I rarely if ever use the AC,

The batteries seem to be a very high expense within any system, could I use the solar power to run the house and pumps during the day and revert to PEA for night and dull days?

I shall be following your experience with interest.  thanks

 @TyJames No need for batteries, run grid-tie like many of us are, your solar just offsets the bill. If you size the system to maintain your pool pumps then the meter will rarely, if ever, go backwards so no attract teh attention of PEA.

 

Why not start a thread of your own or have a read of the other solar threads then ask questions?

 

[BritManToo]

Your past meter readings show 20 units/day, your new power readings display shows production of 30 units and use of 27 units a day.

These are far more believable than your previous claims of 50-70 units production and 40 units use a day.

 

Edited February 27, 2021 by BritManToo

[Crossy]

11 hours ago, Thaifish said:

There is a smart meter wired in as earlier questioned. In the schematics of wiring I think there are 2 but I watched the installers remove 1 during initial start up. There is a scrolling readout with active energy IMP/EXP and Active Power which I do not comprehend??? Not sure which side of power input it is coming from....ie PV or Grid?? The other readouts are basic Amp, Watt, Freq to me which I understand

 

The DDSU666-H is the "Smart Power Sensor" which interfaces the current transformer hanging off your incoming supply in the Schneider box and your inverters. It's this that's generating your usage/export/import data.

 

One assumes that the manuals for all your devices are in a pile of documentation somewhere.

 

DDSU666-H Manual.pdf

 

[Thaifish]

1 hour ago, Crossy said:

1 hour ago, Crossy said:

The DDSU666-H is the "Smart Power Sensor" which interfaces the current transformer hanging off your incoming supply in the Schneider box and your inverters. It's this that's generating your usage/export/import data.

 

One assumes that the manuals for all your devices are in a pile of documentation somewhere.

data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAPABAP///wAAACH5BAEKAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAICRAEAOw==

 

 

Ok got it. The one fitted is a Chinese model not a Huawei brand. Chinglish manual included. If the sensor is generating the data then maybe this is what is causing the unusual production/consumption readouts? It looks like you can change the values if I am reading it correctly?? Is that possible?? If so then I will get onto the installers to fix..

 

[Crossy]

26 minutes ago, Thaifish said:

Ok got it. The one fitted is a Chinese model not a Huawei brand. Chinglish manual included. If the sensor is generating the data then maybe this is what is causing the unusual production/consumption readouts? It looks like you can change the values if I am reading it correctly?? Is that possible?? If so then I will get onto the installers to fix..

 

You shouldn't be able to change anything on the DDSU unit other than the RS-485 address. I wouldn't mess with it.

 

I included the English manual with my earlier post but it probably isn't really going to help.