Had 2 Phizer vacs but tested positive for Covid

[bbko]

13 hours ago, watthong said:

Vaccines can be compared to seat belts, but not to reckless driving. Seat belts can save lives but they stand no chance against a drunken, crazy or just plain irresponsible driver. Analogies are fun to use, as long as they are applied fairly (2+2=4, not 5 or 6). However in order to do that, a token of discerning cells in the brain might be required.

I was thinking the same thing the other day, vaccines are like seatbelts: designed to help lessen the chance of death, not a 100% guarantee. 

[richard_smith237]

8 minutes ago, bbko said:

13 hours ago, watthong said:

Vaccines can be compared to seat belts, but not to reckless driving. Seat belts can save lives but they stand no chance against a drunken, crazy or just plain irresponsible driver. Analogies are fun to use, as long as they are applied fairly (2+2=4, not 5 or 6). However in order to do that, a token of discerning cells in the brain might be required.

I was thinking the same thing the other day, vaccines are like seatbelts: designed to help lessen the chance of death, not a 100% guarantee. 

While the ‘car analogy’ is obviously flawed... it would be like this... 

 

Say a seatbelt has an ‘efficay’ of 95% in accidents.

 

100,000 drivers... all of them wear a seat belt.

1% (1000) of them have a car accident - 950 will have no injuries from the impact

50 of them will have mild to moderate injuries but were ultimately protect by the seatbelt.

The seatbelt prevents death and hospitalisation in all of the accidents. 

 

Meanwhile people are arguing seatbelts are dangerous because:

- a seatbelt causes discomfort the first time they use it 

- Someone died after getting strangled by their seatbelt

- No one knows the long term effect of wearing a seatbelt

 

 

 

Edited July 30, 2021 by richard_smith237

[watthong]

13 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Meanwhile people are arguing seatbelts are dangerous because a seatbelt causes discomfort the first time they use it and somewhere in the world someone died after getting strangled by their seatbelt !!!

A US news clip today shows a reporter sits down with a group of female nurses, none is vaccinated, for an impromptu interview regarding vaccination. When asked why not, one says because "vaccines currently available are not fully tested" and therefore she doesn't trust them. Reporter asks how fully do you want the vaccines to be tested? The nurse replies, quite confidently, that "a fully tested vaccine normally takes anywhere between 12 to 14 years..."

Simply boggles the mind.
 

[driver52]

On 7/27/2021 at 2:19 PM, Rowdyman said:

my doctor says there is no doubt that without the vaccine I would be in the hospital now fighting for my life

speculation and opinion NOT fact......there's growing evidence that folks who have been vaxxed are going around shedding loads of 'spike proteins' cos of the way this bizarre new vaccine is interacting with the body and that is actually making other folks ill

How many decades has mankind been trying to develop a vaccine to cure colds and flu? Ooh then suddenly a miraculous new cure comes along to save us all from this 'new strain'......I've never heard such BS since Ronald Reagan was in power ????

[driver52]

On 7/27/2021 at 2:44 PM, bartender100 said:

The experts are saying the Pandemic will be behind us in the UK by October

18 months ago they said it would take 2 weeks to 'flatten the curve'.......wake up man we're being played! Bet you a tenner the pandemic is not behind us in October ????

[richard_smith237]

8 minutes ago, driver52 said:

On 7/27/2021 at 3:19 PM, Rowdyman said:

my doctor says there is no doubt that without the vaccine I would be in the hospital now fighting for my life

speculation and opinion NOT fact......there's growing evidence that folks who have been vaxxed are going around shedding loads of 'spike proteins' cos of the way this bizarre new vaccine is interacting with the body and that is actually making other folks ill

How many decades has mankind been trying to develop a vaccine to cure colds and flu? Ooh then suddenly a miraculous new cure comes along to save us all from this 'new strain'......I've never heard such BS since Ronald Reagan was in power ????

Speculation not fact....  you were saying.... ???

[billsmart]

7 hours ago, habanero said:

On 7/29/2021 at 7:09 AM, billsmart said:

Masks help protect you from getting the virus and from spreading it.

You wearing a mask only helps you from spreading the disease. It does nothing to help protect you.  Masks may help prevent people who have COVID-19 from spreading the virus to others. The CDC has guidance for wearing masks. Wearing a face mask may limit exposure to respiratory droplets and large particles and may help prevent people who have COVID-19 from spreading the virus.

Habernero, You are incorrect. Masks help both cases, from spreading and contracting the disease.

[cdemundo]

20 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I agree, but are the vaccines the reason for the new variants? 

no.

[cdemundo]

6 hours ago, driver52 said:

speculation and opinion NOT fact......there's growing evidence that folks who have been vaxxed are going around shedding loads of 'spike proteins' cos of the way this bizarre new vaccine is interacting with the body and that is actually making other folks ill

How many decades has mankind been trying to develop a vaccine to cure colds and flu? Ooh then suddenly a miraculous new cure comes along to save us all from this 'new strain'......I've never heard such BS since Ronald Reagan was in power ????

 'spike proteins'  alone don't cause illness.

They are the binding protein that allows the Corona virus to bind to human cells.

That is one of the first steps in infection, the rest of the virus is needed to cause illness.

So even if people were shedding spike proteins, they wouldn't make anyone sick.

 

[Liebemein]

On 7/30/2021 at 6:52 AM, BritManToo said:

When you last had a cold or flu, did you wait for a lab test before claiming to have had them?

How about mumps, measles, chickenpox, and lab tests?

 

I was in contact with Wuhan Chinese at Chiang Mai and Saigon airports in Jan 2020.

A few days later I had mild flu like symptoms and a hacking cough.

A few days after returning home all my family had similar symptoms.

It seemed different to flu (although I've only had flu twice) mainly the lingering cough we all had.

 

There were no tests available, as the media fear factory hadn't started up.

And if there were tests I wouldn't have risked the 10,000bht COVID jail would have cost me.

If it was before 2019, I would conclude that you had a flu which is if you had no symptoms you couldn't spread to your family and you are right that no need to proof with the test. Who created the test did accept it has been inaccurated. What is the different now? I don't see the different. 

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, shdmn said:

You are accidentally correct even though you thought you were only being sarcastic.  The spanish flu was quite a killer which is why current flu shots incorporate immunization against it.  It is why flu shots will eventually incorporate immunization against covid.

Flu shots are not the same technology as the new corona vaccines, so how would they be combined?

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, watthong said:

A US news clip today shows a reporter sits down with a group of female nurses, none is vaccinated, for an impromptu interview regarding vaccination. When asked why not, one says because "vaccines currently available are not fully tested" and therefore she doesn't trust them. Reporter asks how fully do you want the vaccines to be tested? The nurse replies, quite confidently, that "a fully tested vaccine normally takes anywhere between 12 to 14 years..."

Simply boggles the mind.
 

Your post doesn't make it clear why you are boggled. I think the nurses probably know more about it than lay people.

One of the advantages of being a nurse is that one knows about medical BS.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, bbko said:

I was thinking the same thing the other day, vaccines are like seatbelts: designed to help lessen the chance of death, not a 100% guarantee. 

Are you sure about that? Most vaccines do stop one becoming infected, period. If you were correct we would still have smallpox in the community.

[driver52]

12 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

Speculation not fact....  you were saying.... ???

Aye, as I go about my daily chores I see lots of fat and scared folk around.......strange world we appear to have created in the West, n'est ce pas? The East appears to be more successful at dealing with 'the fatties' so far ????

Edited July 31, 2021 by driver52

[driver52]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Are you sure about that? Most vaccines do stop one becoming infected, period. If you were correct we would still have smallpox in the community.

Exactly this! Historically a vaccine has given you a small dose of whatever it is you're trying to get rid of! And ahem, this mRNA 'vaccine' doesn't do that lol

The 'experimental monkies' still don't seem to get it ????

[millymoopoo]

15 hours ago, jak2002003 said:

And hopefully countries will not be refusing flights, travel and entry into their country if you don't have the vaccine...same as they don't for people who have not had the flu shot

Could be a forlorn hope.!

Even if airlines don't require proof of vaccination, there will be other way of requiring it.

Eg:
No entry visa without vaccination.

No transit through airport without vaccination.

Mandatory quarantine for unvaccinated passengers.

Proof of vaccination when booking tours/hotels/trains/buses etc.!

Just look at the recent news from UK/USA travel now permitted between both countries without quarantine for fully vaccinated passengers.!

[3NUMBAS]

On 7/29/2021 at 4:11 AM, D M G said:

False positive?  Testing?

the aussie vacinne gave you a false positive for HIV

[cdemundo]

8 hours ago, driver52 said:

Exactly this! Historically a vaccine has given you a small dose of whatever it is you're trying to get rid of! And ahem, this mRNA 'vaccine' doesn't do that lol

The 'experimental monkies' still don't seem to get it ????

Wow, you have a very deep understanding of the mRNA vaccines. (Sarcasm, cuz of chance/certainty of misunderstanding).

How the Pfizer-BioNTech Vaccine Works

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/health/pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine.html

Cuz it's always nice to know what flock you are talking about.

[cdemundo]

13 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Your post doesn't make it clear why you are boggled. I think the nurses probably know more about it than lay people.

One of the advantages of being a nurse is that one knows about medical BS.

If you worked in health care you would know that there is a wide range in the quality of training and level of intellect of nurses.

"I think the nurses probably know more about it than lay people.

One of the advantages of being a nurse is that one knows about medical BS."

Nurses certainly should know more yet some of them clearly don't.

Within the next 12 months the US FDA will almost certainly complete full approval of both mRNA vaccines.

What will Nancy Nurse say then?

 

I have not found a study that looks at MDs versus other health care workers. 

 

[drenddy]

Let's be honest and admit, if this whole covid thing wasn't so serious, impacting millions of lives, lockdowns after lockdowns, pain and despair, these vaccines would have never been approved.There are far too many side effects, most of them mild, yes, but still, I think Big Pharma would have been asked, go back, study more and come back with a better vaccine.

 

But we need to get the jabs, otherwise it would get far worse than it is.Honestly, I am not afraid about this bug, but I took the vaccine, mainly for travel purposes and with the hope that it might help me protecting my parents, as we all know, there are indications that vaccinated guinea pigs, sorry, vaccinated human beings are not so infectious as non vaccinated.

Edited July 31, 2021 by drenddy

[richard_smith237]

11 minutes ago, drenddy said:

Let's be honest and admit, if this whole covid thing wasn't so serious, impacting millions of lives, lockdowns after lockdowns, pain and despair, these vaccines would have never been approved.There are far too many side effects, most of them mild, yes, but still, I think Big Pharma would have been asked, go back, study more and come back with a better vaccine.

 

Why would the vaccines not have been approved ??? - had covid-19 been less wide spread, but still serious vaccines would have just taken longer to pass through the bureaucratic process and of course a stage 3 trial.

But, we are in a global emergency where the vaccines have already proven to make difference. 

 

The vast majority of people have ‘cold’ like side temporary effects which are also side effects of many other vaccines. Never had a vaccine before and been told you may feel unwell for a few days ?

 

I do agree, go back study more, come back with a better vaccine which has undergone longer trials....  that would obviously generate the best vaccine. But, we don’t have the luxury of time. 

 

 

11 minutes ago, drenddy said:

But we need to get the jabs, otherwise it would get far worse than it is.Honestly, I am not afraid about this bug, but I took the vaccine, mainly for travel purposes and with the hope that it might help me protecting my parents, as we all know, there are indications that vaccinated guinea pigs, sorry, vaccinated human beings are not so infectious as non vaccinated.

I know a couple younger and healthy people who were in hospital with Covid... sounds awful - a vaccine would most likely have made the difference.

 

Some choice of ‘emotive’ words there, guinea-pigs...  but this isn’t a trial and we are not guinea-pigs we are a population at risk who have been offered vaccine.

 

As is being noted, Covid-19 is now becoming an illness of the unvaccinated.

 

 

 

[cdemundo]

11 hours ago, 3NUMBAS said:

the aussie vacinne gave you a false positive for HIV

And was never approved for use, it was "abandoned" is apparently the terminology.

[cdemundo]

2 hours ago, drenddy said:

Let's be honest and admit, if this whole covid thing wasn't so serious, impacting millions of lives, lockdowns after lockdowns, pain and despair, these vaccines would have never been approved.There are far too many side effects, most of them mild, yes, but still, I think Big Pharma would have been asked, go back, study more and come back with a better vaccine.

 

But we need to get the jabs, otherwise it would get far worse than it is.Honestly, I am not afraid about this bug, but I took the vaccine, mainly for travel purposes and with the hope that it might help me protecting my parents, as we all know, there are indications that vaccinated guinea pigs, sorry, vaccinated human beings are not so infectious as non vaccinated.

You're wrong. The vaccines are among the most effective and safest ever produced.

You are getting your "information" from the wrong sources.

[drenddy]

59 minutes ago, cdemundo said:

You're wrong. The vaccines are among the most effective and safest ever produced.

You are getting your "information" from the wrong sources.

Many western countries have stopped/limited AZ and Johnson in the middle of a pandemic, when vaccines were badly needed.

These two vaccines would never have been accepted in other conditions.

Same goes for mRNA-vaccines, many strange and unknown side effects.

They work and are safe, yes, but I keep my opinion.Let's say, all these vaccines were being developed for the seasonal influenza, they wouldn't get approval.Hospitals across UK and Europe asked had staff shortage after AZ vaccine, they even asked the staff to get the jab before their day off.You don't hear that after the common influenza jab.

 

 

 

 

Edited July 31, 2021 by drenddy

[cdemundo]

51 minutes ago, drenddy said:

Many western countries have stopped/limited AZ and Johnson in the middle of a pandemic, when vaccines were badly needed.

These two vaccines would never have been accepted in other conditions.

Same goes for mRNA-vaccines, many strange and unknown side effects.

They work and are safe, yes, but I keep my opinion.Let's say, all these vaccines were being developed for the seasonal influenza, they wouldn't get approval.Hospitals across UK and Europe asked had staff shortage after AZ vaccine, they even asked the staff to get the jab before their day off.You don't hear that after the common influenza jab.

 

 

 

 

OK;  fair enough, easy to have an opinion on a hypothetical, have at it.

 

Even still, because a billion doses of COVID vaccines have been administered worldwide there is a lot of publicity.

Doesn't matter if a million people get a shot with no problem, it's gonna be news if one person has a reaction.

I guess that is natural.

 

True about AZ and J&J. Some countries have halted use;  just as true many countries continue to use.

Notably UK uses AZ. 

I believe that the number of negative events per million for AZ and J&J were less than are seen for widely used prescription drugs.

 

But this one is just fantasy: "Same goes for mRNA-vaccines, many strange and unknown side effects."

That is purely and simply not true. "many strange and unknown side effects"?

By February 2021, there had been 63 million doses of mRNA vaccines administered in the US.

I don't know what the strange and unknown side effects you speak of are.

A lot of hysteria about the vaccines.

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 8/1/2021 at 3:31 AM, cdemundo said:

If you worked in health care you would know that there is a wide range in the quality of training and level of intellect of nurses.

"I think the nurses probably know more about it than lay people.

One of the advantages of being a nurse is that one knows about medical BS."

Nurses certainly should know more yet some of them clearly don't.

Within the next 12 months the US FDA will almost certainly complete full approval of both mRNA vaccines.

What will Nancy Nurse say then?

 

I have not found a study that looks at MDs versus other health care workers. 

 

Hmmmm. I consider that most nurses I worked with knew as much or more than I. A really bad nurse was a rarity.

[cdemundo]

8 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Hmmmm. I consider that most nurses I worked with knew as much or more than I. A really bad nurse was a rarity.

Ok, your experience was different than mine.

Possibly you worked in better facilities than I did.

But have you listened to the reasoning (or lack of) by the vax hesitant nurses?

No evidence of knowledge or reasoning above that of lay people.

[placeholder]

On 7/30/2021 at 8:19 PM, Liebemein said:

If it was before 2019, I would conclude that you had a flu which is if you had no symptoms you couldn't spread to your family and you are right that no need to proof with the test. Who created the test did accept it has been inaccurated. What is the different now? I don't see the different. 

The US CDC among other National Health authorities routinely checks samples of patients with respiratory illness to see what kind of influenza virus has caused it 2020 they could find virtually no influenza of any kind but they did find plenty of covid

[Liebemein]

19 hours ago, placeholder said:

The US CDC among other National Health authorities routinely checks samples of patients with respiratory illness to see what kind of influenza virus has caused it 2020 they could find virtually no influenza of any kind but they did find plenty of covid

Ask Kary Mullis!

[DavisH]

On 7/30/2021 at 11:46 PM, watthong said:

A US news clip today shows a reporter sits down with a group of female nurses, none is vaccinated, for an impromptu interview regarding vaccination. When asked why not, one says because "vaccines currently available are not fully tested" and therefore she doesn't trust them. Reporter asks how fully do you want the vaccines to be tested? The nurse replies, quite confidently, that "a fully tested vaccine normally takes anywhere between 12 to 14 years..."

Simply boggles the mind.
 

...but new flu vaccines are developed each year to deal with mutations in influenza viruses. So in essence, they are all "not fully tested".