'We don't know if we'll survive': Thailand sex workers left struggling as COVID-19 lockdown drags on

[OneMoreFarang]

10 hours ago, bang saen guy said:

Using your logic, hotel prices should rise in low season and decrease in high season. Clearly not the case

It's not my logic. It is what some Thai businesses do.

 

And I gave up looking for logic in Thailand. Often it just does not exist. And searching for something that does not exist doesn't make sense.

[Smithson]

On 8/19/2021 at 10:03 AM, impulse said:

I've just never met a little girl that claimed her goal in life was to blow old foreigners for money.  Nurse, teacher, singer, model, actress, even corrupt gub'ment official, sure.  Sperm receptacle for money?  Never.

 

And anyone who looks at an underage girl and hopes she grows up to be a real good hooker is sick.

 

Is this a question you go around asking young girls?  Anyone who wonders about the future sex lives of young girls is sick, as is seeing humans as 'sperm receptacles'.

 

I have never believed the anti-sex worker lobby cared like they claim to. It's just about making money while looking down on people and controlling the sex lives of others. This was confirmed when they ignored the plight of workers following covid. In fact it was sex workers and bar owners who got together feeding families in Pattaya. So much for the dumb submissive sex slave stereotype.

 

Following closures, many workers went online to make a living. Now the neo colonialist anti sex lobby is closing this avenue to further hurt those who don't follow their twisted ideas. OnlyFans is one of the sites many workers went to, today it announced it would no longer allow adult material due to pressure from (rich) people in western countries.

 

OnlyFAns is paid content. If free online pornography is easily accessible on the internet, why the need to ban this site?

Edited August 20, 2021 by Smithson

[Leaver]

19 hours ago, Tanomazu said:

No, I didn't miss your point, your point is just incorrect. It's not that different. The Tsunami cost Thailand 2-3 points in GDP, and so does Covid. The Tsunami impaired tourism for about 3 years, and so will Covid.

 

Now, of course there are differences, Covid affects the whole world, but just like the Tusnami issue, this pandemic will also come to an end. Even if it circulates from year to year, the vaccination will prevent the pandemic responses of lockdowns, which are  the real issue. We've seen the UK, wisely, climb down from that panic horse, and others will follow.

 

No, just because you are missing the point, yet again, it doesn't mean my point is incorrect.

 

Once again, when the tsunami hit, clean up and rebuilding started IMMEDIATELY.  Do you understand this?  Also, the tsunami effected only certain parts of Thailand.  Covid is effecting the whole of Thailand, not to mention, the rest of the world, including Thailand's major tourism markets.  Do you understand that?    

 

You say the tsunami "impaired tourism for about 3 years, and so will covid."  Do you realise, covid has "impaired" tourism, across the whole of Thailand,  for 18 months already, with no end in sight?  Rebuilding hasn't even started yet, and we are already half way through the 3 years you claim covid will "impair" tourism here.  When do you think rebuilding the tourism industry here will start?  It started the day after the tsunami hit. 

 

Yes, there are differences, and the pandemic will come to an end, but not within your time frame, and cost to Thailand's GDP.  Covid is,  and will be, a lot worse, and take a lot longer.   It hasn't even finished yet, and you claim "3 years."  Why don't you include the actual time covid is "impairing" tourism?  That would be something like, 2 years of closed borders, possibly longer, plus the 3 years you say to rebuild, totalling 5 years.  This would be more accurate, but I still think it will take longer.  

 

 

Edited August 20, 2021 by Leaver

[Tanomazu]

Just now, Leaver said:

 

No, just because you are missing the point, yet again, it doesn't mean my point is incorrect.

 

Once again, when the tsunami hit, clean up and rebuilding started IMMEDIATELY.  Do you understand this?

 

Yes, I do, but what you're not understanding is that despite that fact, and Thailand advertising world wide, the tourist industry took 3 years to get back to normal. Even though clean up began immediately, the tourists did not return in full numbers immediately.

 

You could equally argue that Thailand immediately shut down borders. That does not mean recovery began then, does it?

 

You have to look at the full picture, and after the Tsunami tourism took 3 years to recover.

 

With Covid there is nothing to actually rebuild, nothing was destroyed physically, excepting business that have to be rebuilt, or reopened. Though many in fact took  the Covid break to refurbish. So I suspect the influx of tourists can happen much quicker, and won't drag out over 3 years, like after the tsunami.

 

We have evidence of previous pandemics. The four waves of the Spanish flu pandemic took 2 years. So giving it 3 years for Covid, when we have vaccinations they did not have in 1918, is actually very conservative.

 

Obviously we can't know it for sure, there may be a new SARS variant and we may all die within months, but all things being equal and if the past can be used as an indicator, by the end of 2022 the end of the Covid pandemic (not the end of Covid, but the pandemic) and all the associated knee-jerk lock down measures, can come to pass.

[Leaver]

7 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

Yes, I do, but what you're not understanding is that despite that fact, and Thailand advertising world wide, the tourist industry took 3 years to get back to normal. Even though clean up began immediately, the tourists did not return in full numbers immediately.

 

We are 18 months into the 3 years you claim it will take to rebuild, and covid here hasn't even finished yet.  

 

Are you seriously suggesting Thailand's tourism industry will be rebuilt, within the next 18 months, to meet your 3 year deadline?

 

8 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

You could equally argue that Thailand immediately shut down borders. That does not mean recovery began then, does it?

The "covid tsunami" hasn't even finished you say tourism will be rebuilt in 3 years.  

 

10 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

You have to look at the full picture, and after the Tsunami tourism took 3 years to recover.

 

I think it's you that has to look at the full picture.

 

10 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

With Covid there is nothing to actually rebuild, nothing was destroyed physically, excepting business that have to be rebuilt, or reopened.

 

Whilst covid has not destroyed buildings,  it has destroyed the businesses within them.  In general, these businesses are not going to move back into their previous premises after borders open and resume business.  They are gone for good. 

 

18 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

We have evidence of previous pandemics. The four waves of the Spanish flu pandemic took 2 years. So giving it 3 years for Covid, when we have vaccinations they did not have in 1918, is actually very conservative.

Do you have some data on Thailand's tourism statistics after the Spanish flu?  ????

 

19 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

Obviously we can't know it for sure, there may be a new SARS variant and we may all die within months, but all things being equal and if the past can be used as an indicator, by the end of 2022 the end of the Covid pandemic (not the end of Covid, but the pandemic) and all the associated knee-jerk lock down measures, can come to pass.

 

So, are you now predicting it will be 3 years from the end of 2022, which would be about 6 years in total?      

 

[Tanomazu]

1 hour ago, Leaver said:

 

Are you seriously suggesting Thailand's tourism industry will be rebuilt, within the next 18 months, to meet your 3 year deadline?

It's quite possible tourists will start to return in 18 months. After all nothing was physically destroyed. If you look at Europe, people were desperate to go to Majorca, despite Covid still raging there. Not everyone is terrified of the virus and lets it rule their lives.

 

If Thailand manages to vaccinate and thus get the virus under control, something which happened in the UK and Germany within 6 months, there will clearly be a demand for tourists to go there. The Maldives, Dubai, Greece, Spain, are seeing tourists coming in.

 

People in cold countries are tired of being at home, and want to travel abroad.

 

 

Edited August 20, 2021 by Tanomazu

[Leaver]

23 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

It's quite possible tourists will start to return in 18 months.

I am sure they will. 

 

Will tenants be returning to all the vacant buildings here in 19 months?

 

24 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

Not everyone is terrified of the virus and lets it rule their lives.

 

That doesn't exactly gain you entry to a foreign country, does it?  

 

25 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

If Thailand manages to vaccinate and thus get the virus under control, something which happened in the UK and Germany within 6 months, there will clearly be a demand for tourists to go there.

It's not if, it's when, but unlike yourself, I don't see Pattaya / Thailand returning to pre covid tourism for several years after covid has finished, even with buildings not being destroyed.

 

27 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

People in cold countries are tired of being at home, and want to travel abroad.

 

True, but I can't see them traveling to a country that is still dealing with covid.  

 

The tourists from countries that have dealt with covid will holiday in other countries that have dealt with covid and who are on their way to economic recovery. 

 

Thailand is nowhere near that, at this stage.   

[BritManToo]

12 minutes ago, Leaver said:

True, but I can't see them traveling to a country that is still dealing with covid. 

I can't see them wasting 14 days of their holiday in quarantine.

Or making any effort to complete the Thai paper chase.

 

Spain is warm enough, and no thinking required.

Edited August 20, 2021 by BritManToo

[2009]

Bull...

 

The prices they charge, they ought to have a million in the bank.

 

In fact, one recently sent me a snapshot of her bank balance : it was over a mill.

 

I don't have any sympathy; they have been earning loads. I do feel for low income workers affected.

 

My cousin in law brags of how she earns 50k a month in Phuket and 100k a month on her trips to Japan and Korea.

 

Yet her daughter's entire mouth is rotten, every tooth. She seems autistic or something; doesn't communicate. They haven't checked it out with the doc. Her son is 11 and the size of an 8 year old girl, totally stunted. He will be in secondary school next year and is illiterate and doesn't even know 10÷2=5. He seriously couldn't do it.

 

With what she earns she could send them in the schoolbus to a city school and not neglect their health to a shocking extent.

 

But money is worth more. I think this is a common story.

 

I would feel bad for the ones who spend their salary on their kids though and don't have much in savings.

 

I think the ones without savings are gambling it away.

 

Like I said, no sympathy for those in that profession. They have had plenty of time to make hay while the sun was shining and earning top dollar.

 

 

Edited August 20, 2021 by 2009

[Leaver]

23 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I can't see them wasting 14 days of their holiday in quarantine.

Or making any effort to complete the Thai paper chase.

 

Spain is warm enough, and no thinking required.

 

I concur.  

 

Also, what tourist would want to be one of the first ones to return?  Nothing awaits them here as it currently is. 

 

It will take a few months for the amount of tourists trickling in here to entice the girls back to Pattaya.    

[3NUMBAS]

it will be like rebuilding germany after WW2

[HashBrownHarry]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

I can't see them wasting 14 days of their holiday in quarantine.

Or making any effort to complete the Thai paper chase.

This won't last for ever, and the double vaxxed will return shortly after it opens.

[HashBrownHarry]

9 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Also, what tourist would want to be one of the first ones to return?  Nothing awaits them here as it currently is. 

If they come for the girls ( or boys ) then are n't you the one that claims it's all online nowadays anyway?

 

What else would they need if heading to Pattaya, is that not the main attraction?

[HashBrownHarry]

1 hour ago, 2009 said:

Bull...

 

The prices they charge, they ought to have a million in the bank.

 

In fact, one recently sent me a snapshot of her bank balance : it was over a mill.

 

I don't have any sympathy; they have been earning loads. I do feel for low income workers affected.

 

My cousin in law brags of how she earns 50k a month in Phuket and 100k a month on her trips to Japan and Korea.

 

Yet her daughter's entire mouth is rotten, every tooth. She seems autistic or something; doesn't communicate. They haven't checked it out with the doc. Her son is 11 and the size of an 8 year old girl, totally stunted. He will be in secondary school next year and is illiterate and doesn't even know 10÷2=5. He seriously couldn't do it.

 

With what she earns she could send them in the schoolbus to a city school and not neglect their health to a shocking extent.

 

But money is worth more. I think this is a common story.

 

I would feel bad for the ones who spend their salary on their kids though and don't have much in savings.

 

I think the ones without savings are gambling it away.

 

Like I said, no sympathy for those in that profession. They have had plenty of time to make hay while the sun was shining and earning top dollar.

 

 

Everything you describe is totally normal for rural Thai life that the working girls 'allegedly' provide for.

[Leaver]

12 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

If they come for the girls ( or boys ) then are n't you the one that claims it's all online nowadays anyway?

 

What else would they need if heading to Pattaya, is that not the main attraction?

 

I have stated a lot of the initial introduction will be online in the future. 

 

Online meeting, pre covid, was gaining in popularity, at the expense of the traditional lady drinks and bar fine business model. 

 

Like AirBnB and Uber, I can only see the use of apps getting bigger here. 

 

As I have said before, Tinder, but with a guaranteed outcome, for payment.

 

 

[brewsterbudgen]

Heaven Above is back!

 

We are Back

 

Hello everyone, 

Have you checked out our live stream on YouTube and Facebook ???? 

The girls are making the best of a bad situation due to the current lockdown restrictions in Pattaya and Thailand.

 

If you want to support our ladies and buy them a drink, please click on the YouTube link below. 

[Leaver]

33 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

This won't last for ever, and the double vaxxed will return shortly after it opens.

 

What will the first tourists back here be returning to?  

[HashBrownHarry]

1 hour ago, Leaver said:

 

I have stated a lot of the initial introduction will be online in the future. 

 

Online meeting, pre covid, was gaining in popularity, at the expense of the traditional lady drinks and bar fine business model. 

 

Like AirBnB and Uber, I can only see the use of apps getting bigger here. 

 

As I have said before, Tinder, but with a guaranteed outcome, for payment.

 

 

Precisely, so what exactly would they need to open to prevent them returning?

[HashBrownHarry]

1 hour ago, Leaver said:

 

What will the first tourists back here be returning to?  

According to you - online girls ( or boys? ).

[JAS21]

I'm sure that an 'Enterprising' man will turn up to help, in fact he is probably there in 'Warp Drive' now. 

[Tanomazu]

4 hours ago, Leaver said:

True, but I can't see them traveling to a country that is still dealing with covid. 

Well, that is what was happening with tourists flying to Spain, Portugal, Greece, and other places that were still dealing with Covid.

 

In fact many tourists were in those countries while they were again declared at risk countries.

 

It is true that Thailand is a bit behind at the moment, but the UK and Germany have introduced the vaccine about 6 months ago, that is how long it took them to vaccinate most people in the country.  Thailand could do the same, even if they do it a bit slower they could do it within 18 months.

 

Whilst some of the tenants renting space will not return, we  should not pretend none will. Whilst the scale of the economic problems is large, about 10 million are projected to be unemployed because of Covid.

 

That means more than two thirds of the work force still get a paycheck. Undoubtedly the unemployment will fuel some of those, lucky enough to have some savings to start new businesses that will in time replace those that were lost.

 

Yes, things are bad, but we should not make them worse than they are. If you recall Germany was completely destroyed in world war 2 and still was able to rebuild the economy. None of the current problems are insurmountable and people have overcome much worse before.

Edited August 20, 2021 by Tanomazu

[Tanomazu]

4 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I can't see them wasting 14 days of their holiday in quarantine.

Or making any effort to complete the Thai paper chase.

 

Spain is warm enough, and no thinking required.

Quarantine and compulsory tests are a major problem, and it is their own home countries as well that impose the restrictions on potential travellers. You will recall people travelling to Portugal were required to go to quarantine from one day to the next.

 

But again, as the vaccinations now provide protection, and the fourth wave naturally ebbs away, these quarantine rules are quickly abandoned, and Thailand too will abandon them when they are ready.

 

Yes, Spain is warm, but it does not offer other advantages more exotic places offer. People will want to fly to Thailand.

[Leaver]

6 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

Precisely, so what exactly would they need to open to prevent them returning?

 

Who is "they?"  

 

How do you prevent tourists and Thai girls meeting on apps?  How did hotels prevent AirBnb from having people rent out their condo's to tourists?    

 

As I have said, bars may move away from salaried bar girls, except for service staff, and move towards the freelancer business model.  Initially, post covid, many bars may not even be able to afford salaried bar girls.  

 

The freelancers will be sat in a bar, but on their phones, and if they get an online customer, they are gone for an hour, or maybe the rest of the shift. 

 

Lady drinks and bar fines was a fading business model pre covid.  I can't see post covid being any different.  

[Leaver]

44 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

According to you - online girls ( or boys? ).

Online was gaining in popularity even before covid. 

 

In any case, most of the nightlife simply doesn't exist here anymore.  So many vacant buildings.  

[HashBrownHarry]

^ i give up with you ^

[EricTh]

On 8/16/2021 at 2:56 AM, A1Str8 said:

I don't see the problem. Everything is moving online anyway. 

 

They rely on tourists as customers. There are not many Thai customers that have the money nowadays.

 

Most tourists can't come to Thailand ...

[Leaver]

11 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

Well, that is what was happening with tourists flying to Spain, Portugal, Greece, and other places that were still dealing with Covid.

Cheap and short flights, plus a common border.  Not a great comparison.  

 

17 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

It is true that Thailand is a bit behind at the moment, but the UK and Germany have introduced the vaccine about 6 months ago, that is how long it took them to vaccinate most people in the country.  Thailand could do the same, even if they do it a bit slower they could do it within 18 months.

So, is that 18 months from now, totally 3 years, and then your 3 years to rebuild, totalling 6 years.

 

Can you clarify this?  

 

18 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

Whilst some of the tenants renting space will not return, we  should not pretend none will. Whilst the scale of the economic problems is large, about 10 million are projected to be unemployed because of Covid.

I would say more than some, it's probably most will not return. 

 

What has the unemployment rate got to do with new businesses starting up?

 

21 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

That means more than two thirds of the work force still get a paycheck. Undoubtedly the unemployment will fuel some of those, lucky enough to have some savings to start new businesses that will in time replace those that were lost.

 

More than two thirds of the work force in the tourism industry, really?  ???? 

 

Do you really thing the unemployed, will little to no government assistance, for at least 2 years, will start a business to give themselves a job?  Are you trolling?

 

23 minutes ago, Tanomazu said:

Yes, things are bad, but we should not make them worse than they are. If you recall Germany was completely destroyed in world war 2 and still was able to rebuild the economy. None of the current problems are insurmountable and people have overcome much worse before.

 

Who do you think funded the rebuilding of Germany?

 

Who is going to fund the rebuilding of Thailand's tourism industry?    

[Leaver]

18 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

^ i give up with you ^

Strange.

 

You don't put forward any of your own ideas, just question mine, without an opposing opinion. 

[HashBrownHarry]

1 minute ago, Leaver said:

Strange.

 

You don't put forward any of your own ideas, just question mine, without an opposing opinion. 

You're idea's are bonkers.

[Leaver]

6 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

You're idea's are bonkers.

 

Do you have any ideas of your own on Pattaya's immediate future, and medium to long term future?

 

When do you think "bonking" will return here?  ????