People who retire in Thailand - Whats your plan?

[Isaan sailor]

10 minutes ago, 2009 said:

Exactly

 

The problem is the only financial instruments the average person understands is: property and a savings account.

 

Investing in stocks is a mystery to the average person. I don't have and friends or family whom I am aware of that does it. It's like anything outside of property is too risky, difficult to understand, or just plain gambling.

Unfortunately, some truth to that.  Always been a stock investor.  Since retiring, I have rebalanced for more income, less growth.  Can’t quite get my Thai wife to understand investments in a foreign country.

[giddyup]

1 minute ago, EVENKEEL said:

I have 2 rental homes, both were at one time my primary residence. One is rented super cheap but they take care of it better than I did. They take care of all repairs and deduct from rent, the other same tenants for 10 yrs, is the rent on time? seldom Do they take good care of it? no  It's still an earner. 

But with new inheritance laws maybe coming our way in the US selling it all might someday be necessary.

If the properties are a source of income or you intend to move back at some stage I can understand, but I didn't need the income nor did I intend to move back.

[gk10012001]

My plan was to retire in Thailand Dec 2019. but COVID was rearing up and I coincidentally at that time got a crazy huge paying contract job here in the states so I worked all of 2020.  Still always planned to retire there since my first trip in 2004.  I always "planned" on the simple income financial method but then the USA embassy stopped issuing the ltters.  Now the annoying monthly transfers have to be done, which have a few pitfalls if things are not coded correctly, or a date is missed, etc, but I still plan to go that way, once I get into Thailand.  I am not comfortable storing money of any sizable amount in Thailand.  And not having 10,000 USD means not having to file the FINCEN form.  And becauase of my work, I would also have to report such amounts and financial (interests) overseas if I had 800k baht there.  None a deal breaker, just more desirable for me to not put 800k on deposit, and instead keep it invested in the USA earning dividends and interest, which while not particularly a large amount, is measurable.

 

  I planned to make Pattaya my home base.  I planned to travel out of country literally every 89 days to Cambodia, or Myanmar or Laos, etc. to see other places and also, that should eiminate the need to do the 90 day reports.  I mean, if one wants to go travel, and one has an open schedule, why not do it in a way that would eliminate a 90 day report?

 

  I planned to keep paying my medicare which starts next year when I turn 65 as I am sure at some point I will return to the USA. 

I planned on getting some nominal local Thai insurance for convenience. 

 

I planned on getting the Non Imm OA visa and retirement extensions. But with recent changes, I guess I would go with the O vs OA, although I suspect the O visa will also require applicable Thai insurance at some point.

 

I planned on renting a decent Condo and NOT buying.  I prefer the flexibility to change and move.

 

   I planned on getting my motorcyle license here in the USA before I go to Thailand because having that makes insurance and things much better if one rides a motobike in Thailand. 

 

  I planned on renting a room and maintaining my USA presence at my younger sister's house and pay her a nominal amount for mail forwarding, and things like that.  However, family issues are now preventing that unexpectedly so I have to work out my own permanent USA presence going forward.  Looks like I will be buying a small house in Florida, and renting it to an engineer since I will not be home much.   Sad that I can't keep things in the family and pay them, but things happen.

 

So lots of plans.  All up in the air at the moment.  I just got another great contract starting Oct 25th at Electric Boat in CT working with people I used to work with and on which I had a great time, so I think I will just keep busy working and doshing up into next year and wait to see how Thailand and the world shakes out from COVID.

\

I always wanted and planned on the basic retirement extension with a reentry permit and just come and go once or twice a year , but Thai policies make that not as easy as before,

 

   I think I am now planning or hoping in the future to just do two 60 day SETVs, each with a 30 day extension.  So 60+30,  then antother 60 + 30 . Probably won't be back to back as I will fly back to the USA to do things then return.  But who knows.

 

 

 

 

 

  

[Thujone]

Eat, drink and be merry.

[2009]

1 minute ago, Isaan sailor said:

Unfortunately, some truth to that.  Always been a stock investor.  Since retiring, I have rebalanced for more income, less growth.  Can’t quite get my Thai wife to understand investments in a foreign country.

I feel your pain.

 

They think gold is an investment. They dump a day's wage on lottery numbers. They are happy borrowing from loan sharks to get through life.

 

Yet they are smart enough to squeeze their entire arm up a farang's backside - to the elbow - without him even noticing (until it's too late). There are some financial instruments they know how to play.

 

Well, I think that's just a woman thing, not specific to Thai. 

 

"I am not a financial instrument, teerak!"

[Leveraged]

3 minutes ago, Isaan sailor said:

Unfortunately, some truth to that.  Always been a stock investor.  Since retiring, I have rebalanced for more income, less growth.  Can’t quite get my Thai wife to understand investments in a foreign country.

 

You cant get most western people to understand the stock market. Its why the rich always get rich and the people in the rat-race rage-out all the time. 

 

Its also another aspect of retiring that I need to figure out because most of my retirement fund will be stock market investments and most people dont understand how it works, let alone my wife. Ill probably have to form some kind of managed trust handle paying her and my kids over X amount of time rather than a giant payout. 

[EVENKEEL]

5 minutes ago, giddyup said:

If the properties are a source of income or you intend to move back at some stage I can understand, but I didn't need the income nor did I intend to move back.

I keep them to give to my son someday. I'm not an advocate for not selling up. Everyone has a different agenda. If I do return to the US I'll have a place to hang my hat.

[gk10012001]

On 8/25/2021 at 6:27 AM, bkk6060 said:

In some western countries especially the U.S., your family sticks you in a lousy rest home, never visits you, and let's you rot until you die. You stare at TV all day, the food is terrible and everyone stinks.

Find a caregiver here or like the suggestion, a younger lady to take care is not that difficult.

 

yes.  I am 64 now and have seen all the long lived situations.  As a kid in the 60s I watched my neighborhood friend and they took in their Great Aunt.  She was like the living dead.  Sat at the table.  They put her bed in the dining room just off from the kitchen.  I don't think they could afford at the time to put her in a home and I don't think they really wanted to either.  I have seen my great aunts care for each other and live together until they died with the exception of one great aunt who had severe dementia.

  My Dad passed at 79 at home.  In debt because he reverse mortgaged the townhome, but the payouts and his social security allowed Mom to stay there for another 8 years on her own.  Then the money ran out and Mom moved into my sister's house.   My mom just passed at 91 while luckily my sister and her husband my brother in law  were able to take her in and let her live with them.  Mom had gotten a little senile and could not cook for herself besides making some bagel lox and cream cheese, Toast an english muffing in the morning and run the Keruig coffe machine but that is OK.  So god bless my brother in law and little sis.

 

  Me, well, I can imagine a live in Filipia care give if I lay down in the USA in my final years.  I like Thais, but in the USA in california and even Florida the filipinas do a pretty good job of house sitting.

 

   I like the warm weather and give me a swimming pool and I can be quite happy.  I do like the beach though, so Florida and its warm water is likely to be my resting place.  Melbourne Florida has a fine Thai community and a very nice Wat Thai which I enjoy.  Ending my days in Thailand... I don't know.  Having traveled so much, I think I would get USA homesick in the end. 

[Isaan sailor]

2 minutes ago, Leveraged said:

 

You cant get most western people to understand the stock market. Its why the rich always get rich and the people in the rat-race rage-out all the time. 

 

Its also another aspect of retiring that I need to figure out because most of my retirement fund will be stock market investments and most people dont understand how it works, let alone my wife. Ill probably have to form some kind of managed trust handle paying her and my kids over X amount of time rather than a giant payout. 

If you’re an American, you can set up a TOD (terms of death) for your stocks or other instruments.  Then decide what % goes where.  And your heirs can take advantage of the Step Up Basis, to save big on cap gain taxes.  Even the current administration promised to save the Step Up Basis for the first million.

[Leveraged]

Just now, Isaan sailor said:

If you’re an American, you can set up a TOD (terms of death) for your stocks or other instruments.  Then decide what % goes where.  And your heirs can take advantage of the Step Up Basis, to save big on cap gain taxes.  Even the current administration promised to save the Step Up Basis for the first million.

At the moment Im considering using a financial trustee to basically manage everything so that I can get every benefit possible in death while making the money last as long as possible for my wife, and once she dies, setup an accounts in my kids names to get them started off. 

 

One thing i dont want to do is have my death trigger a sell of all assets and then a large payout to beneficiaries. It'll just get burned through and wasted. It happens like this in like 90% of cases similar to this. 

 

Dedicated people who live within their means can turn 2-3 million into generational wealth if they stay the course. Problem is getting others to understand how it works and the safety net it provides over just blindly thinking "Im a millionaire!" and buying a condo in Miami with a G-wagon to drive around. 

[olfu]

my 2 cents.

Its good idea to have couple credit/debit cards for emergency use like hospital and/or travel.

[Isaan sailor]

5 minutes ago, Leveraged said:

At the moment Im considering using a financial trustee to basically manage everything so that I can get every benefit possible in death while making the money last as long as possible for my wife, and once she dies, setup an accounts in my kids names to get them started off. 

 

One thing i dont want to do is have my death trigger a sell of all assets and then a large payout to beneficiaries. It'll just get burned through and wasted. It happens like this in like 90% of cases similar to this. 

 

Dedicated people who live within their means can turn 2-3 million into generational wealth if they stay the course. Problem is getting others to understand how it works and the safety net it provides over just blindly thinking "Im a millionaire!" and buying a condo in Miami with a G-wagon to drive around. 

Exactly. Once you’re gone, you can’t control the money—unless you set up a trust fund, with a trusted administrator with annual costs and some hefty legal fees to start.  I will have to trust my wife to spend conservatively.

[LongTimeLurker]

5 hours ago, khunPer said:

I’m about to say that if you cannot afford an 800k baht deposit, you shall save up some more money before moving to Thailand for retirement; or simply said little hard, think twice, if you cannot find that level of money then Thailand might not at all be the optimal destination for your retirement.

Agents can take care of the lack of funds for you, and is the method preferred by Immigration!

 

5 hours ago, khunPer said:

I will rather have some outstanding good years in Thailand – which I already have had more than 15 of – and then sign out, instead of having a long run of fairly unhappy years in my home country, especially sitting in my rocking chair and think of all that I missed, because I didn’t dare to take this risk, and now it’s way too late...

Well said.

[LongTimeLurker]

3 hours ago, Stevemercer said:

You could marry a Government official, such as a teacher or nurse.

Or an immigration officer and solve your visa problems at the same time!

[khunPer]

1 hour ago, BananaGuy said:

That’s all very encouraging thank you … I’ll bookmark your post, maybe print it out and have it bound!

Good to hear that insurance can be started 70+ … that takes away the pressure. Personally, I’m not interested in insurance at all … I self-insure whenever I can and that’s worked well so far. I’m only concerned about what’s legally required by Thai government for visa extension.

 

Likely I’ll need to go the marriage route … we have a tiny home already built on her land near Uttaradit so living costs will be low but it will be a stretch coming up with a lazy 800k, so I hope the 400k option is still there next year.

 

Anyhow. Thanks again for the informative post … and especially for sharing the reasoning behind your personal choices.

The risk of a mandatory insurance makes me seriously consider at least the LMG 400k+40k baht insurance with 200k baht deductible for 16,900 baht a year from age 76 (sign up not later than 75), it's only 1,409 baht a month so it should be affordable for everyone, and then you have an approved insurance under the mandatory retirement plan; it might be extremely difficult, or very expensive, to sign up to anything when older than 75 years.

 

If something more serious happens you have the extra 200k baht in insurance for only 8.45 percent in annual fee, and it covers till you are 100 years old; if one is getting older than that, every day might feel like a miracle; however, miracles do sometimes happen...????

[LongTimeLurker]

1 hour ago, giddyup said:

I didn't do that for the simple reason that I didn't want the worry of tenants destroying my property, agents ripping me off, or getting screwed on the rent etc. Sold my house when I moved here 11 years ago, no regrets.

I have a couple of mates who have had these problems and especially in the Covid area when tenants stopped paying rent and they can't get rid of them. But in the long run they've made money, especially on the increase in property value over the years.

[khunPer]

24 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Agents can take care of the lack of funds for you, and is the method preferred by Immigration!

Depending on where you stay, agent are not the legitimate way to extend one's permission to stay; I would not count on agents in the long run.

[LongTimeLurker]

1 hour ago, gk10012001 said:

I planned to travel out of country literally every 89 days to Cambodia, or Myanmar or Laos, etc. to see other places and also, that should eiminate the need to do the 90 day reports.  I mean, if one wants to go travel, and one has an open schedule, why not do it in a way that would eliminate a 90 day report?

So you planned on spending a few thousand dollars to avoid doing something that costs nothing and takes 10 minutes of your time?

[LongTimeLurker]

9 minutes ago, khunPer said:

Depending on where you stay, agent are not the legitimate way to extend one's permission to stay; I would not count on agents in the long run.

But isn't it ironic that they brought in the new rule of having the 800k in the bank for 3 months after your extension to STOP the use of agents for visa renewals but now there are MORE using agents because of this.

 

I don't think it's going away anytime soon, however non-legitimate it is.

[EVENKEEL]

4 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

But isn't it ironic that they brought in the new rule of having the 800k in the bank for 3 months after your extension to STOP the use of agents for visa renewals but now there are MORE using agents because of this.

 

I don't think it's going away anytime soon, however non-legitimate it is.

The extension in my passport using an agent is as legitimate as anyone's. The IO herself handed me the passport back to me personally after my mug shot was taken. In and out in less than 5 minutes.

[LongTimeLurker]

10 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

The extension in my passport using an agent is as legitimate as anyone's. The IO herself handed me the passport back to me personally after my mug shot was taken. In and out in less than 5 minutes.

How much of that agent's fee was paid to the IO because you didn't have the legitimate requirement of funds in the bank?

 

That's what makes it non-legitimate.

[3NUMBAS]

my mate ended up on farangs deaths website when they pulled him out of the river after jumping in rip trevor

[EVENKEEL]

14 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

How much of that agent's fee was paid to the IO because you didn't have the legitimate requirement of funds in the bank?

 

That's what makes it non-legitimate.

You're just speculating about my bank funds. I choose the path of least resistance. 

[Espanol]

4 hours ago, 2009 said:

How people get to retirement age without even a one bedroom apartment (bought) in their home country is beyond me.

Perhaps they got divorced?

[khunPer]

1 hour ago, LongTimeLurker said:

But isn't it ironic that they brought in the new rule of having the 800k in the bank for 3 months after your extension to STOP the use of agents for visa renewals but now there are MORE using agents because of this.

 

I don't think it's going away anytime soon, however non-legitimate it is.

How is it known that "more using agents", are there any statistics available..?

[Elkski]

Interesting thoughts.   From YOLO to those who are planning well.   A good topic but perhaps to much of a reality check for some. 

[Damrongsak]

On 8/25/2021 at 6:27 AM, bkk6060 said:

In some western countries especially the U.S., your family sticks you in a lousy rest home, never visits you, and let's you rot until you die. You stare at TV all day, the food is terrible and everyone stinks.

Find a caregiver here or like the suggestion, a younger lady to take care is not that difficult.

 

My mother was in a fairly decent assisted-living home in Virginia for 2 1/2 years.  I think last year's cost for living, supplemental health insurance and sundry items was around 2.4 million Baht ($74,000 U.S.).  Healthcare and health insurance alone was about 470,000 Baht. 

Edited August 26, 2021 by Damrongsak

[LongTimeLurker]

2 hours ago, EVENKEEL said:

You're just speculating about my bank funds. I choose the path of least resistance. 

But I'm not speculating about the bank funds of people that I know that are using agents because they don't have the funds.

 

And if you have the funds, why use an agent.

[LongTimeLurker]

1 hour ago, khunPer said:

How is it known that "more using agents", are there any statistics available..?

Empirical data.

[gk10012001]

3 hours ago, LongTimeLurker said:

So you planned on spending a few thousand dollars to avoid doing something that costs nothing and takes 10 minutes of your time?

Your question is ridiculous.  It does not cost a few thousand dollars to go to Cambodia for a few days which is something I wanted to do anyway.  Scheduling to do that at the time a 90 report is due is just a simple matter.  You assertion and implication is pure nonsense.  And if one was planning to go visit Laos, same thing.  Stop writing inane things and trying to attack people. As I said in my post, if one was planning on traveling around, just line up the travel with when a 90 day is due.  You apparently did not grasp or understand that simple concept.  Go lurk somewhere else with your stupid comments