Retirement extention - Dipped below the 400k

[EricTh]

On 9/3/2021 at 8:24 AM, crazykopite said:

If your friend has another account with money in he can use that account to make up the 400k it happened to me they turned me down for being 165 baht short as the bank had deducted commission for my debit card thankfully I had another account for every day spending had to get a letter and bank statement for that account but in the end got sorted Koh Samui IO shows no compassion even for such a small amount your IO might be more understanding 

 

I don't think any IO show any compassion because my own experience mirrors yours. They have to follow the law strictly.

 

I am not sure how the agent can circumvent all the evidences during audit time if there is one.

 

 

 

[DrJack54]

8 minutes ago, EricTh said:

 

I don't think any IO show any compassion because my own experience mirrors yours. They have to follow the law strictly.

 

I am not sure how the agent can circumvent all the evidences during audit time if there is one.

 

 

 

You misunderstood the person you quoted. 

If someone has 2 accounts they can use both accounts to show requirements satisfied.

You would need bank letter for both accounts.

 

Also an agent can circumvent financial requirements if required. That option was mentioned several times. Since it's extension only cost ~15k.

Edited September 4, 2021 by DrJack54

[HappyExpat57]

7 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Indeed. Jomtien is one of very few offices that require folk using money in bank retirement to return post 3 months to prove money still in Bank. Rogue office.

But I thought those were the rules. Rogue for following Thai directives? I think the others who don't are the rogues. It's a minor nuisance (I have to go in next Monday for this very reason) but it's offset by the generally sensible treatment they give us.

[EricTh]

7 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

You misunderstood the person you quoted. 

If someone has 2 accounts they can use both accounts to show requirements satisfied.

You would need bank letter for both accounts.

 

Also an agent can circumvent financial requirements if required. That option was mentioned several times. Since it's extension only cost ~15k.

 

I didn't misunderstand. I tried to avoid getting two bank statements, letters with all the hassle just for a small amount but the IO won't allow it.

 

 

 

Edited September 4, 2021 by EricTh

[HappyExpat57]

12 minutes ago, EricTh said:

I am not sure how the agent can circumvent all the evidences during audit time if there is one.

Exactly my concern! Every year at extension renewal time, I think "It sure would be nice to be able to use that 800k" but then I fear an audit could be very costly, possibly getting me removed from Thailand permanently.

Edited September 4, 2021 by HappyExpat57
Brevity

[DrJack54]

1 minute ago, HappyExpat57 said:

But I thought those were the rules. Rogue for following Thai directives? I think the others who don't are the rogues. It's a minor nuisance (I have to go in next Monday for this very reason) but it's offset by the generally sensible treatment they give us.

There are over 70 imm offices and Jomtien is one of perhaps 4 or so that have this return after 3 months rubbish. 

Some posters that have dealt with Jomtien have noted that it's becoming less enforced. People having to ask for return date etc.

No it's not official requirement. Just a Jomtien thing.

[EricTh]

1 minute ago, HappyExpat57 said:

Exactly my concern! Every year at extension renewal time, I think "It sure would be nice to be able to use that 800k" but then I fear an audit could be very costly, possibly getting me removed from Thailand permanently.

Yes, that would be called 'forging documents' by the immigration officer. 

 

I remember reading somewhere that the penalty for forging documents is a ban for X years from entering Thailand.

 

The immigration office do keep the signed bank statements somewhere, right? 

 

 

 

[DrJack54]

3 minutes ago, EricTh said:

 

I didn't misunderstand. I tried to avoid getting two bank statements, letters with all the hassle just for a small amount but the IO won't allow it.

 

 

 

If both accounts are with same bank then most will provide ONE statement. In case of Kasikorn it's only the one charge 100baht. Not difficult.

Fact is he can satisfy financial requirements by providing two bank accounts. Simple. 

[DrJack54]

1 minute ago, EricTh said:

Yes, that would be called 'forging documents' by the immigration officer. 

 

I remember reading somewhere that the penalty for forging documents is a ban for X years from entering Thailand.

 

The immigration office do keep the signed bank statements somewhere, right? 

 

 

 

Your posting incorrect advice.

[EricTh]

6 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

If both accounts are with same bank then most will provide ONE statement. In case of Kasikorn it's only the one charge 100baht. Not difficult.

Fact is he can satisfy financial requirements by providing two bank accounts. Simple. 

Mine was with two different banks. So I tried to avoid getting another letter for such a small amount.

 

 

Edited September 4, 2021 by EricTh

[EricTh]

3 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Your posting incorrect advice.

I am not posting incorrect advice, going through an agent has its risk when immigration decides to do an audit to weed out corrupt immigration officers.

 

Of course, if you know the risk and still do it, it's up to you.

[david555]

21 hours ago, DefaultName said:

I use Jomtien, they've never checked that I've kept the ฿400,000 during the year, only the ฿800,000 2 months before and 3 after.

no need....,  as they can see the whole year history in your bank book  when you are on to your next ret. ext. application , and the 90 day rapport desk don't ask for bank book....

 

And in my 13 years i never got another reason to go to Jomtien Immigr. desk 8....

[DrJack54]

14 minutes ago, EricTh said:

Mine was with two different banks. So I tried to avoid getting another letter for such a small amount.

 

 

Somewhat irrelevant. The OP,s friend withdrawal was 30,000baht.

[BritTim]

1 hour ago, clivebaxter said:

Fraudulent letters from the bank cannot cover that up, and such letters are surely corrupt and illegal.

The actions of the bank and of Immigration would likely not stand up well to a strict examination. The objective is to ensure there is plausible deniability in the event of a cursory audit. It is also important that officials above the one doing the actual sign offs are tolerant of the practices being employed. Recall that senior officials buy their positions, and expect to be allowed some latitude to recover their investments.

[Liverpool Lou]

6 hours ago, hotandsticky said:

On 9/3/2021 at 12:14 PM, Liverpool Lou said:

I did read it, here it is...

"Hi

Not me, but a friend of mine who is not on this forum, has dipped below the 400k in his bank account for his retirement visa.  Anyone here have any experience of this kind of mistake, and if it's corrected quickly is it a major problem?

Thanks".

 

What you say now seems to have been his intention but there is no mention, whatsoever, in his OP of the B400k being that required by some IOs to maintain the validity of his extension.

 

It's you who needs to read the OP properly before telling others to do so.

Expand  

Everyone else understood it  straight off  -  except you!

No, they didn't, they just assumed that they did, whereas I asked him a specific question about his OP, did you miss that?

[hotandsticky]

13 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

No, they didn't, they just assumed that they did, whereas I asked him a specific question about his OP, did you miss that?

 

 

Miss your pointless question?

 

 

No, just ignored it as being irrelevant (which it was)

[Liverpool Lou]

Just now, hotandsticky said:

14 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

No, they didn't, they just assumed that they did, whereas I asked him a specific question about his OP, did you miss that?

Miss your pointless question?

No, just ignored it as being irrelevant (which it was)

Irrelevant to you, not to me.   Thanks for your pointless judgement.

[clivebaxter]

3 hours ago, BritTim said:

The actions of the bank and of Immigration would likely not stand up well to a strict examination. The objective is to ensure there is plausible deniability in the event of a cursory audit. It is also important that officials above the one doing the actual sign offs are tolerant of the practices being employed. Recall that senior officials buy their positions, and expect to be allowed some latitude to recover their investments.

How can there be plausible deniability over forged letters and ignored bank books? The objective is to make money by corrupt means. Yes you can argue the waiving of the needed bank funds is legal, but only doing so when paid large sums and getting extensions from a province an applicant does not live in clearly are not. Just part of the disgusting corruption that exists throughout the country at all levels.

[hotandsticky]

33 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Irrelevant to you, not to me.   Thanks for your pointless judgement.

 

 

You're welcome.

 

You made it easy for me.

[OneeyedJohn]

3 or 4 years ago when I was on retirement I experienced some leniency from one Imm office but not the other, we have two in Chaing Rai. 

[Liverpool Lou]

8 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

42 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Irrelevant to you, not to me.   Thanks for your pointless judgement.

You're welcome.

You made it easy for me.

It'd have to be.

[jazzdog32095]

On 9/2/2021 at 8:33 PM, DrJack54 said:

So much in your post. This may seem harsh but just one person's opinion.

 

1. Doubt he will satisfy immigration with withdrawal of money, even with quickish replacement. He could visit and ask.

 

2. If he needs to get the 30k back from her to top up his account sounds like he doesn't have other money supply. Eg funds in home account.

 

3. If that's the case perhaps why she wants rid of him.

 

4. You use term misses....take it that he is not married as he would be on extension based on marriage and you mention retirement.

 

Bottom line: He should get all his bankbooks, ATM etc and leave.

For next extension retirement he can use agent ~15k to cover money in bank issue.

I note that he withdrew the funds? Strange. 

Agent for 15K is a no brainer. I can make 56K baht interest at Itau on the 800K, an upside of 41K and not have to deal with an IO at all. Crazy to park 24K USD in a Thai bank making nothing.

[jazzdog32095]

On 9/2/2021 at 9:55 PM, Gottfrid said:

It just does not dip below 400k. Your friend has knowingly taken money out, which is the cause of reaching below 400k. It´s not like he didn´t know it, right?

In cases like this, I feel very embarrassed to be among foreigners. Everyone knows how important this actually is, and still do not care about it. After they seem to need help with something they already know from start? In my opinion, that is the pure essence of stupidity.

Chill out dude, I define stupid as somebody that can't do the math in two minutes and understand one can make 4X the 15K you pay an agent by investing the 800K baht in a CDB Plus while at the same time never having to even face an IO.

[DrJack54]

9 minutes ago, jazzdog32095 said:

Agent for 15K is a no brainer. I can make 56K baht interest at Itau on the 800K, an upside of 41K and not have to deal with an IO at all. Crazy to park 24K USD in a Thai bank making nothing.

Might suit you. Up to the individual.

I prefer to not use an agent.

I assist others when they need an agent.

The thread is not about pros and cons of using agents.

[jazzdog32095]

5 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Might suit you. Up to the individual.

I prefer to not use an agent.

I assist others when they need an agent.

The thread is not about pros and cons of using agents.

Of course it's relative, had he used an agent he 1- would not be stressed out 2- would have made at least 40K baht putting his money to work. I think that's assisting the OP. How my I ask you assist people when they need an agent?

[LarrySR]

Once upon a time I went to renew my retirement VISA.

Got the bank letter stating I had 850,000BT then went to the bank cashier, withdrew 10,000BT and updated the bank book 840,000BT.  Balance showing 40,000BT above the required 800,000BT.

Immigration officer.....no, no, no. Bank book balance must be same as bank letter balance......

"But Officer, I'm 40,000Bt above the required balance".....The jerk waved me off and I had to go back to the bank and get another letter. 

He was fishing for a bribe or being a <deleted> or perhaps just thick in the head.

 

Can never predict what they will do. 

 

[jazzdog32095]

On 9/3/2021 at 9:03 AM, DrJack54 said:

Given that it was below 400k for few days and was 30k, I can't see imm allowing that. As pointed out by @crazykopite if he has another account with 30k+ he can use that together with his 400k account.

Worse case is use agent 15k. Not end of the world.

Really, The old guy has been extending for 15 years, brought 50M into the economy, give him a break already

[DrJack54]

6 minutes ago, LarrySR said:

He was fishing for a bribe or being a <deleted> or perhaps just thick in the head

When your obtaining the bank letter you make deposit/withdrawal at the same time to show "activity". That transaction is done first and the letter in turn matches balance.

You were in error.

 

[DrJack54]

2 minutes ago, jazzdog32095 said:

Really, The old guy has been extending for 15 years, brought 50M into the economy, give him a break already

Completely irrelevant.

There are financial requirements for extensions and withdrawals, especially as in this case 30k, the extension will (most likely) not be granted.

[LarrySR]

8 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

When your obtaining the bank letter you make deposit/withdrawal at the same time to show "activity". That transaction is done first and the letter in turn matches balance.

You were in error.

 

Last year I got the updated book and bank letter with matching balances,  went to Immigration and the Officer sent me to the bank to withdraw 100BT and updated book ......showing a different balance than the letter..

VISA approved Mr Smarty Pants.