Have any of you teachers received the ultimatum yet?

[robblok]

19 minutes ago, matchar said:

On the other hand would a business take responsibility if an employee suffers serious side effects or death linked to a vaccine they were forced to take?

 

I'm not anti-vax and I'm quite happy to take Pfizer if I'm eventually offered it but I'm not willing to take AstraZeneca since that one has a higher risk of very dangerous side effects, which in younger healthy people is similar to the risk from covid.

 

If I was old I would be more willing to take AstraZeneca because the risk from covid would be higher than the risk from the vaccine.

Good point, but the chances of what I am saying are far higher then deaths. Vaccine death and serious side effects are far lower. So from a purely business point of view it still makes sense. 

[brewsterbudgen]

I thought that the MOE rule was that 85% of school staff needed to be vaccinated in order for the school to reopen. So, as 15% do not need to be vaccinated it shouldn't be an issue if some teachers either cannot or do not want it - as long as it's less than 15% of the total workforce.

[ThailandPermanent]

1 hour ago, brewsterbudgen said:

I thought that the MOE rule was that 85% of school staff needed to be vaccinated in order for the school to reopen. So, as 15% do not need to be vaccinated it shouldn't be an issue if some teachers either cannot or do not want it - as long as it's less than 15% of the total workforce.

Do you reckon it'll stay that way come next year though, what with the vaccine push etc?

 

[sleepwalker999]

In my school, two teachers opted out of taking the vaccine and all staff were informed of this decision. Both members of staff were told when onsite learning resumes only vaccinated teachers will be allowed to teach onsite. 

 

I think it's fair enough and I would imagine it will be pushed twice as hard when it comes to foreign teachers. I mean you still have a choice it's up to you and I think it's fair considering all choices in life come with a consequence attached to them. 

 

Maybe you can look into online teaching instead?

[thaichina]

5 hours ago, matchar said:

On the other hand would a business take responsibility if an employee suffers serious side effects or death linked to a vaccine they were forced to take?

 

I'm not anti-vax and I'm quite happy to take Pfizer if I'm eventually offered it but I'm not willing to take AstraZeneca since that one has a higher risk of very dangerous side effects, which in younger healthy people is similar to the risk from covid.

 

If I was old I would be more willing to take AstraZeneca because the risk from covid would be higher than the risk from the vaccine.

No, the business does not force you to take the vaccine, you have the choice to take the vaccine or find yourself another job where it is not required. 

I would hope that if an employee agrees to take only a vaccine that is not currently available but maybe soon, he can find an agreement with his employer, but that s up to the employer, when the school opens, teachers need to be there.

 

I m not sure where you find informations that tell you the Astrazeneca has similar risks than covid for young people, I suggest you check more on that beacuse that may not be true...

[matchar]

10 minutes ago, thaichina said:

No, the business does not force you to take the vaccine, you have the choice to take the vaccine or find yourself another job where it is not required. 

I would hope that if an employee agrees to take only a vaccine that is not currently available but maybe soon, he can find an agreement with his employer, but that s up to the employer, when the school opens, teachers need to be there.

 

I m not sure where you find informations that tell you the Astrazeneca has similar risks than covid for young people, I suggest you check more on that beacuse that may not be true...

The Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine has been linked to distinctive, but rare, blood clots that also appear with low levels of platelets (which help clots form) in the blood.

 

The risk of a clot is roughly one in 100,000 for people in their 40s, but rises to one in 60,000 for people in their 30s. Two in a million people in their 40s died rising to four per million people in their 30s.

 

At the same time, the risks of developing severe Covid, if you catch the virus, fall in younger age groups.

 

Dr June Raine, the chief executive of the Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency (MHRA), said the benefits continued to outweigh the risks for the "vast majority of people".

 

She added: "The balance of benefits and risks is very favourable for older people, but is more finely balanced for younger people."

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57021738

[thaichina]

1 hour ago, matchar said:

The Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine has been linked to distinctive, but rare, blood clots that also appear with low levels of platelets (which help clots form) in the blood.

 

The risk of a clot is roughly one in 100,000 for people in their 40s, but rises to one in 60,000 for people in their 30s. Two in a million people in their 40s died rising to four per million people in their 30s.

 

At the same time, the risks of developing severe Covid, if you catch the virus, fall in younger age groups.

 

Dr June Raine, the chief executive of the Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency (MHRA), said the benefits continued to outweigh the risks for the "vast majority of people".

 

She added: "The balance of benefits and risks is very favourable for older people, but is more finely balanced for younger people."

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-57021738

I appreciate your reply, I just notice that there is probably less risk to die from the astrazeneca vaccine even in your 20s than the 10 mns tuktuk ride I take coming home from Makro every week. Maybe you should take that in consideration instead of putting your job at risk.

[chessman]

8 hours ago, rbkk said:

I would go further and say they are unnecessarily endangereing the health of the children they are supposed to be nurturing and protecting. Why is that not criminal?

Yes, I was trying to show the stupidity of the ‘but there are two valid sides’ argument. That there are plenty of things that significant numbers of people seem to believe that should be disqualifying if you want to be a teacher. As you point out, there are potentially grave practical consequences if schools and governments are not firm with this.

[rbkk]

 

2 hours ago, chessman said:

Yes, I was trying to show the stupidity of the ‘but there are two valid sides’ argument. That there are plenty of things that significant numbers of people seem to believe that should be disqualifying if you want to be a teacher. As you point out, there are potentially grave practical consequences if schools and governments are not firm with this.

The protection benefit of having a  vaccine is greater than the protection benefit of wearing a mask. Yet, not wearing a mask is an offence whilst going unvaccinated is a personal choice. It's bonkers. Why risk any childs health?

[The Hammer2021]

On 10/6/2021 at 12:35 PM, MarcelV said:

I teach at a school in one of the worst affected provinces in the south. Some (many?) of our teachers don't want to get the vaccine due to religious reasons. Combined with the huge infection rates in our area, I have reason to believe that, contrary to the rest of the country, schools will stay closed for on-site learning during the entire second semester.

What a huge freakin' loss to the students!

I'm afraid some may never be able to catch up. As teachers we are fortunate to still get paid. I can't see my school cutting teachers who don't get the shot.

There is NO religion that forbids vaccines.

[The Hammer2021]

4 hours ago, chessman said:

Yes, I was trying to show the stupidity of the ‘but there are two valid sides’ argument. That there are plenty of things that significant numbers of people seem to believe that should be disqualifying if you want to be a teacher. As you point out, there are potentially grave practical consequences if schools and governments are not firm with this.

I wouldn't let my kids go to schools that employ anti vaxer nutters

[cdemundo]

On 10/6/2021 at 6:31 PM, chrissables said:

Maybe it will help people question the regulations, and try to understand what is happening around them. That would be educating.

 

America's under 17 year old covid death rate is 0.67 % of the total death rate for the same age group.

 

That is worth understanding too.

Absolutely, and I am sure that is a great comfort to the parents of children who die from COVID.

[cdemundo]

1 hour ago, The Hammer2021 said:

There is NO religion that forbids vaccines.

https://abc7chicago.com/exemption-for-covid-vaccine-religious-exemptions-mandate-form/11098634/

 

"some religious leaders, including Pope Francis and Rabbi Chaim Kanievsky, a leading authority in Israel's ultra-Orthodox Jewish community, have made clear that vaccines are necessary for the common good and take precedence over religious beliefs."

[MarcelV]

6 hours ago, The Hammer2021 said:

There is NO religion that forbids vaccines.

Some religious leaders think otherwise.

[chrissables]

5 hours ago, cdemundo said:

Absolutely, and I am sure that is a great comfort to the parents of children who die from COVID.

I'm sure its not, but as the deaths are such a small proportion of total deaths in that age group i suggest there are bigger issues to deal with.

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7260492/

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[user1047]

Hello, OP here. I didn't receive any emails about replies to this thread. I come back and see that I missed a lot. haha. 

 

Anyway, an update about situation. I guess it was a false alarm. My manager told me that I would be replaced but he's not part of HR. A lot of companies around the world are using scare tactics. I talked with HR and they told me if schools don't actually open, I have nothing to worry about. I'll see what happens. I have a feeling that after this next big holiday is over, the cases will skyrocket and I'll be fine. I'll wait until the last minute before I do anything drastic.

 

A friend of mine just renewed his visa and WP and no questions were asked about vaccination. Maybe I should apply at his school. ????

[Chad3000]

On 10/13/2021 at 5:58 PM, ThailandPermanent said:

Do you reckon it'll stay that way come next year though, what with the vaccine push etc?

 

No. I think a school will expect all teachers to be vaccinated. Doubt you'll receive any sympathy for not wanting to be vaccinated. This is Asia and the Thai are all clamoring for shots.

[Chad3000]

3 hours ago, user1047 said:

, I have nothing to worry about. I'll see what happens. I have a feeling that after this next big holiday is over, the cases will skyrocket and I'll be fine. I'll wait until the last minute before I do anything drastic.

Schools are opening. The country is opening. I'd put far more money on your school going full speed ahead than any blow up in numbers and back to lockdown. PM is fully on board with this.

 

Just get a couple AZ or chinovac shots and stop complaining. It's coming.

[youreavinalaff]

3 hours ago, user1047 said:

 

A friend of mine just renewed his visa and WP and no questions were asked about vaccination. Maybe I should apply at his school. ????

As and when there is a rule that all teachers must be vaccinated, I'm sure there will be one sooner or later, it will come from the top and will cover all teachers and all schools.

 

Changing jobs will have no effect.