Ministry official hints you'll need to be vaxxed to do things in public in Thailand

[atpeace]

2 hours ago, James105 said:

If only it was as simple as getting a jab and you get your life back.    Can you describe a country where those that complied, have had their 2 jabs are now living without any kind of restrictions, are no longer required to wear masks anywhere and the governments have willingly handed back their emergency powers without any further threats of restrictions?   

True, but   living in the USA is much easier with very few restrictions.  The vaccines made this possible.  Still not perfect but you can walk in public without a mask and do most things carefree.  I know there are exceptions but just want this to end and maybe it is  a pipe dream.   As for handing back emergency powers, I am extremely confident governments will do this within the next 6 months to a year.  I may be wrong and can respect your right to make a stance.  My choice was based on calculations of what is better for me and society which is subjective.

 

It is amazing how people are scared to the point 95% wear mask while on a scooter and see me jogging and cover their mouth.  They really do not have a clue how it spreads nor care to learn.  Thais in rural areas just don't have the access to data or know how to calculate risk.  Not criticizing their intellect but stating a reality.

 

If getting to 80-90% vaccinated allows me to get some more freedoms that I cherish, I want people to get vaccinated regardless of how much it helps.

[Danderman123]

6 hours ago, James105 said:

If only it was as simple as getting a jab and you get your life back.    Can you describe a country where those that complied, have had their 2 jabs are now living without any kind of restrictions, are no longer required to wear masks anywhere and the governments have willingly handed back their emergency powers without any further threats of restrictions?   

You not have noticed, but there is an epidemic raging. Your thoughts about power grabbing governments should be set aside until enough people are vaccinated to effectively end the epidemic by reducing to pockets.

[Oxx]

1 hour ago, Danderman123 said:

end the epidemic by reducing to pockets.

I thought it was about increasing the pockets - the pockets of the pharmaceutical companies.

[onthedarkside]

A COVID misinformation post, and an off-topic diversion post regarding medicines, have been removed, along with a series of replies to each.

 

[Oxx]

 I'm perfectly aware that many pharmaceutical companies are making obscene profits on the back of this tragedy.

 

It's expected that Pfizer, BioNTech and Moderna will, between themselves, make pre-tax profits of $34 billion this year*.

Personally, I'd prefer that all pharmaceutical companies were taken into public ownership and operated on a non-profit basis.  However, of course, that's never going to happen.  The companies' claws are far too deep into the politicians' pockets.

 

* Just to expand upon that:

 

"Based on company financial statements, the Alliance estimates that Pfizer, BioNTech and Moderna will make pre-tax profits of $34 billion this year between them, which works out as over a thousand dollars a second, $65,000 a minute or $93.5 million a day. The monopolies these companies hold have produced five new billionaires during the pandemic, with a combined net wealth of $35.1 billion."

https://reliefweb.int/report/world/pfizer-biontech-and-moderna-making-1000-profit-every-second-while-world-s-poorest

 

 

Edited November 21, 2021 by onthedarkside
quote of and response to hidden post removed

[zzaa09]

1 hour ago, Oxx said:

I thought it was about increasing the pockets - the pockets of the pharmaceutical companies.

You know how that is - profiteering under the guise of goodness. 

Covid and war. 

[placeholder]

12 hours ago, atpeace said:

Are you serious?  The vax better than thou crowd loves a case spike and excitement doesn't come close to describing the hysteria of a "rise in cases" causes.

 

How about vaccines are much more limiting than anticipated but seem to be the best alternative.  Shoving your logic down the anti vaxers throat is only going to make them laugh at your petulance IMO.  My advice to the anti vax proponents is to please get vaccinated to decrease the spread-  even if it helps only a little.  I'm sick of wearing masks and prefer being able to interact with people without the cloud of fear that I have never been able to grasp but respect it nonetheless.  If the fear is too much, I can understand but if it is political or whatever, please just get a jab...

"even if it helps only a little."

what about keeping the hospital occupancy rate down?

anyway, the people who refuse to get vaxxed are clearly not thinking realistically. Whether that's because of their political alignment as is overwhelmingly the case in some countries and is quite apparent on thaivisa.com, or just fear because of rumormongering, I don't think reasoning gently with them is going to have much effect. 

[ukrules]

The vaccines have been disappointing at best.

 

In the years to come as this drags on and on I hope there are more effective antivirals and vaccines which work better.

 

Until then it will rage on regardless of what anyone does, that's just the way it is.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

15 minutes ago, ukrules said:

The vaccines have been disappointing at best.

The medical and scientific communities would disagree with your opinion, and the facts don't support your judgment.

 

Considering we're now just two years into what quickly became a worldwide pandemic with a new virus, vaccines have been developed and deployed that substantially reduce the risk of infection, and even more substantially reduce the risks of hospitalization and death from COVID, even for the current and most troublesome Delta variant.

 

"Unvaccinated people are 11 times more likely to die from COVID-19 than those who are fully vaccinated, new research has found, bolstering evidence that the inoculations continue to provide powerful protection, even against the delta variant.

 

The latest studies from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention released on Friday also found that vaccinated people were nearly five times less likely to get infected and 10 times less likely to get so sick they ended up in the hospital."

 

https://www.npr.org/2021/09/10/1036023973/covid-19-unvaccinated-deaths-11-times-more-likely

 

 

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7037e1.htm

 

No, the current crop of vaccines don't provide 100% protection against contracting and spreading COVID, especially with the Delta variant. But the initial protection rates are still very high, especially with the mRNA vaccines like Pfizer and Moderna. In large part, they're keeping fully vaccinated people from getting seriously ill and from dying from COVID. It's hard to call that disappointing.

 

What I'd call disappointing is the substantial minority of anti-vax folks in some societies who are refusing vaccines that would significantly protect their own health and the health of those around them, often based on either political judgments or gross medical/scientific misinformation.  Thus prolonging the pandemic for everyone.

 

 

[ukrules]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

The medical and scientific communities would disagree with your opinion

I am disappointed, I expected much more, that's all you need to know

 

Given enough time I'm sure things will improve a lot as will our ability to fight this and other pandemics.

 

Edited November 21, 2021 by ukrules

[Virt]

14 hours ago, James105 said:

If only it was as simple as getting a jab and you get your life back.    Can you describe a country where those that complied, have had their 2 jabs are now living without any kind of restrictions, are no longer required to wear masks anywhere and the governments have willingly handed back their emergency powers without any further threats of restrictions?   

If you asked me last month i could have answered yes.

Denmark cancelled their emergency law and lifted all restrictions and we lived liked normal for some time.

No masks, everything open, no distance, no nothing and we didn't see any spikes for quite some time.

 

https://sum.dk/nyheder/2021/august/the-danish-government-will-not-extend-the-categorisation-of-covid-19-as-a-disease-presenting-a-“critical-threat-to-society”-in-denmark

 

Sadly the colder season arrived and it turned out that 85% vaccine coverage of the target group age 12+ was not enough and we started seeing spikes once again.

I think you can guess which group mostly were hospitalized...

 

But the government think it went to fast so they once again voted to make covid 19 a critical threat to society, so they  could reintroduce the covid 19 passports for the vaccinated ones/and the ones who had covid plus the unvaccinated has to show a negative test to enter restaurants and bars.

Other than that everything is still open like normal, and masks are not mandatory.

Very very few people use masks.

I attended a soccer match last friday with 35,000 spectators and personally didn't see a single spectator wearing a mask.

 

If we manage to make it though winter with such minor restrictions i think that's acceptable.

Sure they unvaccinated ones will complain about they have to get tested constantly to get into restaurants and bars, but that's better than forcing them to get their shots.

 

They should just be happy that they don't live in Austria.....

 

[Virt]

3 hours ago, ukrules said:

The vaccines have been disappointing at best.

 

In the years to come as this drags on and on I hope there are more effective antivirals and vaccines which work better.

 

Until then it will rage on regardless of what anyone does, that's just the way it is.

Huh?

The vaccines has saved millions of lives and still continue to save lives.

Sure they are not perfect and there is room for improvement, but calling them a disappointment is not fair.

I hope the combo with vaccines and the news pills under development will do the trick,

but until then we have to keep using the vaccines.

 

New vaccines are in developments worldwide, and hopefully someone develop one that offers lifelong protection against the corona family, so new strains will not cause a problem.

[micmichd]

12 hours ago, Oxx said:

I thought it was about increasing the pockets - the pockets of the pharmaceutical companies.

What do you care? 

I'm vaxxed, and it was for free. 

[Macrohistory]

8 hours ago, ukrules said:

The vaccines have been disappointing at best.

 

In the years to come as this drags on and on I hope there are more effective antivirals and vaccines which work better.

 

Until then it will rage on regardless of what anyone does, that's just the way it is.

 

No, the vaccines -- especially the mRNA vaccines -- have been magnificent.

 

 

[placeholder]

On 11/20/2021 at 4:08 PM, sungod said:

What about those who dont wear seat belts in cars, crash helmets on bikes. People who dont follow healthy diets and dont exercise,ignore doctors, those who smoke and drink?

 

Actually those who don't wear seal belts in cars and crash helmets on bikes in many countries, including all of the developed ones, are committing a crime and get fined. So I guess you won't have a problem with fines being imposed on those who refuse to get vaccinated?

[placeholder]

On 11/19/2021 at 5:18 PM, Harveyg said:

Are you able to say which vaccine it was, how many total injections were given at that same time, and how old was your child at the time? And also, do you know the total number of injections your child was given in the first five years of life?

It's really pointless to interrogate an anonymous person about the alleged details of their life, particularly when they are using it as evidence to support their position. It's rare that you get to objectively evaluate their evidence.  Very occasionally you do. In one instance, not long ago, an American claimed that they couldn't get any compensation for a serious adverse reaction that one of their children experienced after being vaccinated. The reason being, they claimed, was the US law forbids suing vaccine companies.

[sungod]

25 minutes ago, placeholder said:

On 11/20/2021 at 4:08 PM, sungod said:

What about those who dont wear seat belts in cars, crash helmets on bikes. People who dont follow healthy diets and dont exercise,ignore doctors, those who smoke and drink?

 

Actually those who don't wear seal belts in cars and crash helmets on bikes in many countries, including all of the developed ones, are committing a crime and get fined. So I guess you won't have a problem with fines being imposed on those who refuse to get vaccinated?

In the same vein do you advocate fines on smokers, drinkers, people who dont exercise /follow doctors advice etc.

 

BTW, last time I checked it was not against the law to not be vaccinated.

Edited November 22, 2021 by sungod

[placeholder]

22 minutes ago, sungod said:

In the same vein do you advocate fines on smokers, drinkers, people who dont exercise /follow doctors advice etc.

 

BTW, last time I checked it was not against the law to not be vaccinated.

Well, to take last things first, you are the one who cited seat belts and helmets, not me. Maybe you should have thought that through before posting. I think people who don't wear seat belts or helmets should be fined. And so should those who refuse to get vaccinated for no medically valid reason.

As for smokers and drinkers, these are addictions and notoriously difficult to break. Since when is not getting vaccinated an addiction? As for exercise, it requires a frequent investment of time. . How much of a demand on one's time does a vaccination take? As of now, let's say once every 6 months.

[sungod]

Choosing when to vaccinate, not to vaccinate is not a crime, its a choice.

 

Edited November 22, 2021 by onthedarkside
trolling comment removed

[EricTh]

The funny thing is that hospitals and immigration still need you to get an expensive Covid test even though you are fully vaccinated.

 

It's better to verify the authencity of the vaccination cert rather than subject people to Covid tests.

 

So what's the point anyway?

 

We don't mind having a Covid test if it is inexpensive and the results are out quickly but this is not the case.

Edited November 22, 2021 by EricTh

[EricTh]

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

It's really pointless to interrogate an anonymous person about the alleged details of their life, particularly when they are using it as evidence to support their position. It's rare that you get to objectively evaluate their evidence.  Very occasionally you do. In one instance, not long ago, an American claimed that they couldn't get any compensation for a serious adverse reaction that one of their children experienced after being vaccinated. The reason being, they claimed, was the US law forbids suing vaccine companies. The moderators quickly scotched that one.

 

In Thailand, the government did compensate those who died from the vaccines. 

 

The USA should follow Thailand and be more responsible.

Edited November 22, 2021 by EricTh

[James105]

1 hour ago, Macrohistory said:

 

No, the vaccines -- especially the mRNA vaccines -- have been magnificent.

 

 

A "magnificent" vaccine would not require someone to quarantine on arrival into Thailand whilst they await the result of a test to see if they have the virus that the "vaccine" does not actually stop them from catching.   A "magnificent" vaccine would neither require coercion or compulsion for people to get it.   

 

If the vaccines were truly magnificent then we would not be in lockdown nor would we still be wearing masks.   

[placeholder]

3 hours ago, sungod said:

Choosing when to vaccinate, not to vaccinate is not a crime, its a choice.

 

There was a time when the same could be said for seat belts and motorcycle helmets. I guess a lot of bleating took place once that situation changed.

 

And stop making up straw men. I never claimed that refusal to get vaccinated is a crime. 

[James105]

4 hours ago, placeholder said:

not long ago, an American claimed that they couldn't get any compensation for a serious adverse reaction that one of their children experienced after being vaccinated. The reason being, they claimed, was the US law forbids suing vaccine companies.

 I thought that was common knowledge.  Is this article factually incorrect then?:

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/16/covid-vaccine-side-effects-compensation-lawsuit.html

[placeholder]

3 hours ago, James105 said:

 I thought that was common knowledge.  Is this article factually incorrect then?:

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/16/covid-vaccine-side-effects-compensation-lawsuit.html

This comes straight from the agency that pays out:.
"Since 1988, over 24,538 petitions have been filed with the VICP. Over that 30-year time period, 20,400
petitions have been adjudicated, with 8,439 of those determined to be compensable, while 11,961were
dismissed. Total compensation paid over the life of the program is approximately $4.6 billion"

https://www.hrsa.gov/sites/default/files/hrsa/vaccine-compensation/data/vicpmonthlyreporttemplate 11-01-21.pdf

[James105]

3 minutes ago, placeholder said:

This comes straight from the agency that pays out:.
"Since 1988, over 24,538 petitions have been filed with the VICP. Over that 30-year time period, 20,400
petitions have been adjudicated, with 8,439 of those determined to be compensable, while 11,961were
dismissed. Total compensation paid over the life of the program is approximately $4.6 billion"

https://www.hrsa.gov/sites/default/files/hrsa/vaccine-compensation/data/vicpmonthlyreporttemplate 11-01-21.pdf

Right, so you are not talking about covid vaccines on a forum related to covid vaccines?   You are talking about other long ago established vaccines people can be compensated for so something entirely different to the article I linked.    

[Bkk Brian]

28 minutes ago, placeholder said:

There was a time when the same could be said for seat belts and motorcycle helmets. I guess a lot of bleating took place once that situation changed.

And stop making up straw men. I never claimed that refusal to get vaccinated is a crime. 

Its not a crime no but it could well be in some countries in the future:

 

Austria is to become the first European country to make vaccinations against Covid 19 mandatory, and will go into its fourth nationwide lockdown for at least 10 days from Monday, the chancellor, Alexander Schallenberg, has announced. The government said it was preparing the legal groundwork for a general vaccine mandate to come into effect from 1 February

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/nov/19/austria-plans-compulsory-covid-vaccination-for-all

[sungod]

30 minutes ago, placeholder said:

There was a time when the same could be said for seat belts and motorcycle helmets. I guess a lot of bleating took place once that situation changed.

And stop making up straw men. I never claimed that refusal to get vaccinated is a crime. 

No you didnt, just suggested it should be.

[Macrohistory]

3 hours ago, James105 said:

A "magnificent" vaccine would not require someone to quarantine on arrival into Thailand whilst they await the result of a test to see if they have the virus that the "vaccine" does not actually stop them from catching.   A "magnificent" vaccine would neither require coercion or compulsion for people to get it.   

 

If the vaccines were truly magnificent then we would not be in lockdown nor would we still be wearing masks.   

Absolutely off-the-charts illogic.  What is the global vaccination rate? Come back and whine about the restrictions when the global vaccination rate is north of 80 percent.

 

[James105]

17 minutes ago, Macrohistory said:

Absolutely off-the-charts illogic.  What is the global vaccination rate? Come back and whine about the restrictions when the global vaccination rate is north of 80 percent.

 

Meanwhile, sorry for your inconvenience!  
 

The global vaccination rate of 80% is an impossible goal as the "magnificent" vaccines only last about 6 months, which means there is not a snowballs chance in hell that the world will ever reach 80% vaccination rate.    

Edited November 22, 2021 by James105