Has Prayut’s order as junta chief put Thailand on gold miner’s chopping block?

[webfact]

 

New developments in negotiations between the Thai government and mining company Kingsgate Consolidated have left the public worried that Thailand will either have to pay billions of baht in compensation or leave many of its residents struggling with adverse health and environmental impacts.

 

Australia-based Kingsgate filed a complaint against the Thai government with an arbitral tribunal in Singapore. The company claims that PM Prayut Chan-o-cha violated the Thailand-Australia free-trade agreement when he ordered the January 1, 2017 closure of its Chatree gold mine.

 

Prayut issued the order in his capacity as chief of the National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO) following locals’ long-standing complaints that the mine was damaging their health and environment. The gold mine, which straddles Phitsanulok, Phetchabun and Phichit provinces, was operated by Kingsgate subsidiary Akara Resources.

 

Full story: https://www.thaipbsworld.com/has-prayuts-order-as-junta-chief-put-thailand-on-gold-miners-chopping-block/

 

-- © Copyright Thai PBS 2021-11-29

 

- Whatever you're going through, the Samaritans are here for you

- Follow ASEAN NOW on LINE for breaking COVID-19 updates

[The Hammer2021]

Dirty big business killer polluters

[RichardColeman]

 Given that an order from a junta leader is not accepted under international law, the Thai government is clearly at a disadvantage.

 

Wonder what else he could be sued for ? 

[Gold Star]

An expat mining friend that worked for a long time in the Thai gold mining industry here seems to have another story regarding the root cause.  

 

Years ago, he along with other foreigners in charge were deemed high priced, and forced by the gov't to be let go to be replaced by Thais. The standards, knowledge, procedures, and quality of work went out the door with them.

 

When the replacement Thais took over, they had no idea how to run a mine properly. The resulting equipment failures, accidents, and lack of maintenance due to bad management, bad supervision, lack of skills, lower output, and resulting pollution incidents resulted in an inevitable order for closure.

 

The way I have seen things done around here, I tend to believe his story. 

 

Either way, it is a sad and costly legacy.

 

I just wonder how the Thai space program will manage...

[malathione]

Going by the judgement against Pakistan for a copper/gold mine being developed by an Australian company, similarly for treaty violation, Thailand might be in for a very nasty surprise, indeed. These treaties have  protection of investment clauses that can protect future earnings, as well.

[ThailandRyan]

3 hours ago, Gold Star said:

An expat mining friend that worked for a long time in the Thai gold mining industry here seems to have another story regarding the root cause.  

 

Years ago, he along with other foreigners in charge were deemed high priced, and forced by the gov't to be let go to be replaced by Thais. The standards, knowledge, procedures, and quality of work went out the door with them.

 

When the replacement Thais took over, they had no idea how to run a mine properly. The resulting equipment failures, accidents, and lack of maintenance due to bad management, bad supervision, lack of skills, lower output, and resulting pollution incidents resulted in an inevitable order for closure.

 

The way I have seen things done around here, I tend to believe his story. 

 

Either way, it is a sad and costly legacy.

 

I just wonder how the Thai space program will manage...

I would have to agree with you in the way Thais replace or even take over a company.  They scrimp, fail to complete the necessary maintenance and let things that are known to be routine in an industry lapse and eventually ends in the demise of a company.

 

Had a friend who created a business here in Bangkok, hired Thai workers and after 4 years the company was making good profits which were being put back into the company and for potential growth in size.  A Thai employee quit and opened up a competing similar style of business and took half of the contracts with him.  This led to a lawsuit which my friend lost, and eventually he closed up shop.  Within 2 years the Thai business was also closed as the product being made was inferior to the original.  Amazing Thailand.

 

[redwood1]

3 hours ago, Gold Star said:

An expat mining friend that worked for a long time in the Thai gold mining industry here seems to have another story regarding the root cause.  

 

Years ago, he along with other foreigners in charge were deemed high priced, and forced by the gov't to be let go to be replaced by Thais. The standards, knowledge, procedures, and quality of work went out the door with them.

 

When the replacement Thais took over, they had no idea how to run a mine properly. The resulting equipment failures, accidents, and lack of maintenance due to bad management, bad supervision, lack of skills, lower output, and resulting pollution incidents resulted in an inevitable order for closure.

 

The way I have seen things done around here, I tend to believe his story. 

 

Either way, it is a sad and costly legacy.

 

I just wonder how the Thai space program will manage...

For some reason the words Maintenance , or routine Maintenance don't seem to translate into Thai, especially on public projects.....

Edited November 29, 2021 by redwood1

[jacko45k]

2 minutes ago, redwood1 said:

For some reason the words Maternice, or routine Maternice don't seem to translate into Thai, especially on public projects.....

I presume you mean 'maintenance'....

[mfd101]

2 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

I presume you mean 'maintenance'....

Probably 'maintenance' doesn't translate into Thai either.

[zzaa09]

4 hours ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Dirty big business killer polluters

Not much difference between the two. Organized criminals.

They both deserve each other.

[jacko45k]

2 minutes ago, mfd101 said:

Probably 'maintenance' doesn't translate into Thai either.

Along with preventative, proactive.......or consequence. 

[ChrisY1]

4 hours ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Dirty big business killer polluters

 

4 hours ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Dirty big business killer polluters

Some research into Kingsgate and their Thai arm, Akara, may enlighten you somewhat as to the real reason this mine was shut down. It was not about pollution.

[hotchilli]

3 hours ago, Gold Star said:

I just wonder how the Thai space program will manage...

Without international help it won't even get off the ground... [excuse the pun]

[spidermike007]

3 hours ago, Gold Star said:

An expat mining friend that worked for a long time in the Thai gold mining industry here seems to have another story regarding the root cause.  

 

Years ago, he along with other foreigners in charge were deemed high priced, and forced by the gov't to be let go to be replaced by Thais. The standards, knowledge, procedures, and quality of work went out the door with them.

 

When the replacement Thais took over, they had no idea how to run a mine properly. The resulting equipment failures, accidents, and lack of maintenance due to bad management, bad supervision, lack of skills, lower output, and resulting pollution incidents resulted in an inevitable order for closure.

 

The way I have seen things done around here, I tend to believe his story. 

 

Either way, it is a sad and costly legacy.

 

I just wonder how the Thai space program will manage...

Will even the ionosphere ever be reached? Many doubt it. They are not working with alot of prize winning scientists and engineers. 

[kingstonkid]

The real reason is that the government does not want to lose the money that the gold mine brings in.  The people with money in the country see the money they can make if they stop the Aussie country.

 

If you were that country I would not want to settle.  I would keep ownership build big walls around it declare yourself as the owner and stop anyone from digging in the area.

Edited November 29, 2021 by kingstonkid

[Almer]

1 hour ago, jacko45k said:

I presume you mean 'maintenance'....

Thankyou for spending the time and trouble explaining that, nobody would have guessed!!

 

[jacko45k]

1 hour ago, Almer said:

Thankyou for spending the time and trouble explaining that, nobody would have guessed!!

 

Some might have, not all... you are welcome.

[Bluetongue]

The local "black" gold mining entrepreneurs were the polluters. I have seen this with my own eyes. The campaign against the legitimate non cyanide using company was run by those individuals who got some locals on board. Water table testing did reveal some pollution and this is supposedly why the junta shut it down. Kingsgate share price collapsed and there was an attempt by an English based consortium of spivs, backed by Thai's no doubt to buy the company for a song. This failed. Kingsgate's insurance against this sort of action, with a Swiss firm paid out 80 million US. A concurrent action through the WTO was held in Singapore and the outcome will not be revealed as negotiations around reopening the mine continue. It will not be in the Thai Government's favor. As far as I know the 3 most senior positions in the actual mining operation were expats. Most of the thousands of locals who derived a good income from either working there or supporting it would be better off it it reopened.

Edited November 29, 2021 by Bluetongue

[roquefort]

8 minutes ago, Bluetongue said:

The local "black" gold mining entrepreneurs were the polluters. I have seen this with my own eyes. The campaign to have the legitimate non cyanide using company was run by those individuals who got some locals on board. Water table testing did reveal some pollution and this is supposedly why the junta shut it down. Kingsgate share price collapsed and there was an attempt by an English based consortium of spivs, backed by Thai's no doubt to buy the company for a song. This failed. Kingsgate's insurance against this sort of action, with a Swiss firm paid out 80 million US. A concurrent action through the WTO was held in Singapore and the outcome will not be revealed as negotiations around reopening the mine continue. It will not be in the Thai Government's favor. As far as I know the 3 most senior positions in the actual mining operation were expats. Most of the thousands of locals who derived a good income from either working there or supporting it would be better off it it reopened.

Why let the facts get in the way of a good story? Many posters on here will jump to conclusions just from reading the headline, never mind the full post.

[Thingamabob]

8 hours ago, Gold Star said:

An expat mining friend that worked for a long time in the Thai gold mining industry here seems to have another story regarding the root cause.  

 

Years ago, he along with other foreigners in charge were deemed high priced, and forced by the gov't to be let go to be replaced by Thais. The standards, knowledge, procedures, and quality of work went out the door with them.

 

When the replacement Thais took over, they had no idea how to run a mine properly. The resulting equipment failures, accidents, and lack of maintenance due to bad management, bad supervision, lack of skills, lower output, and resulting pollution incidents resulted in an inevitable order for closure.

 

The way I have seen things done around here, I tend to believe his story. 

 

Either way, it is a sad and costly legacy.

 

I just wonder how the Thai space program will manage...

Your friend is entirely correct. Many years ago the Departmenf of Mineral Resources (the DMR) began to dismiss it's foreign operators and consultants. The industry has never recovered.

[oznomad]

10 hours ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Dirty big business killer polluters

Interesting.

How would you type that, sit in the chair, cook your dinner, and anything else, without mining?

[puck2]

16 minutes ago, oznomad said:

Interesting.

How would you type that, sit in the chair, cook your dinner, and anything else, without mining?

Isn't this an excuse for polluting the environment without any sane and health connected restrictions???

[candide]

Of course, there was more to it than just a pollution issue.....????

 

"Northern Gulf Petroleum Ltd. offered to pay as much as A$4.9 million ($3.7 million) to buy 50.1 percent of Kingsgate Consolidated Ltd., the operator of Thailand’s biggest gold mine that’s facing the threat of closure. Northern Gulf is better placed than Australia’s Kingsgate to resolve disputes with the Thai government, Director Chatchai Yenbamroong said Friday in in a statement. Chatchai has previously been an adviser to Kingsgate and also to a former Thai Prime Minister, according to the statement."
https://www.bloombergquint.com/onweb/northern-gulf-bids-for-control-of-owner-of-thai-gold-operation

 

Edited November 29, 2021 by candide

[Chris.B]

9 hours ago, Gold Star said:

An expat mining friend that worked for a long time in the Thai gold mining industry here seems to have another story regarding the root cause.  

 

Years ago, he along with other foreigners in charge were deemed high priced, and forced by the gov't to be let go to be replaced by Thais. The standards, knowledge, procedures, and quality of work went out the door with them.

 

When the replacement Thais took over, they had no idea how to run a mine properly. The resulting equipment failures, accidents, and lack of maintenance due to bad management, bad supervision, lack of skills, lower output, and resulting pollution incidents resulted in an inevitable order for closure.

 

The way I have seen things done around here, I tend to believe his story. 

 

Either way, it is a sad and costly legacy.

 

I just wonder how the Thai space program will manage...

I see so what you are saying is, the indigenous natives are not capable and need the white man to run the mine for them? ????

[Gold Star]

1 hour ago, Chris.B said:

I see so what you are saying is, the indigenous natives are not capable and need the white man to run the mine for them? ????

No. Experienced men, from all around the world. Nothing to do with race Chris. 

[eastendanto]

7 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

The real reason is that the government does not want to lose the money that the gold mine brings in.  The people with money in the country see the money they can make if they stop the Aussie country.

 

If you were that country I would not want to settle.  I would keep ownership build big walls around it declare yourself as the owner and stop anyone from digging in the area.

err if they stop anyone digging how are those greedy little mockticians gonna get their hands on the gold?

Edited November 29, 2021 by eastendanto

[lapamita]

13 hours ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Dirty big business killer polluters

the story is completly diffrent, follow up read all news 2,3 years ago

poluters ?? or is it not that thais want to control the company  , thats why 2 yrs ago, a bermuda incorp, with shareholders related to the goverment try to take over and failed

their is not any evidence of poluting, even 16  diffr analysis shown simmilar results

[lapamita]

2 hours ago, candide said:

Of course, there was more to it than just a pollution issue.....????

 

"Northern Gulf Petroleum Ltd. offered to pay as much as A$4.9 million ($3.7 million) to buy 50.1 percent of Kingsgate Consolidated Ltd., the operator of Thailand’s biggest gold mine that’s facing the threat of closure. Northern Gulf is better placed than Australia’s Kingsgate to resolve disputes with the Thai government, Director Chatchai Yenbamroong said Friday in in a statement. Chatchai has previously been an adviser to Kingsgate and also to a former Thai Prime Minister, according to the statement."
https://www.bloombergquint.com/onweb/northern-gulf-bids-for-control-of-owner-of-thai-gold-operation

 

and they was thinking to get shareholders to sell their shares 95% bellow market bid prices.

what a big failure

this pro forma companys with all the shareholders related to the goverment

and the best was....... in a statement  NGP  said..if we get 50.1 % we will open mine soon again bcs ceo have relation to the goverment

hahahha

[candide]

2 hours ago, lapamita said:

and they was thinking to get shareholders to sell their shares 95% bellow market bid prices.

what a big failure

this pro forma companys with all the shareholders related to the goverment

and the best was....... in a statement  NGP  said..if we get 50.1 % we will open mine soon again bcs ceo have relation to the goverment

hahahha

Right. I just checked the market value which was A84 million and now A322 million. And the plan was to get half of it (and the control of the company) for 4.9 million thanks to the help from the Junta! ????

[kingstonkid]

20 hours ago, eastendanto said:

err if they stop anyone digging how are those greedy little mockticians gonna get their hands on the gold?

my point exactly if they get are going to lose then they need a court order prohibiting all exploration and mining in the area