Is the 2nd night of quarantine on the SQA++ program a real deal breaker?

[HashBrownHarry]

6 minutes ago, Kinnock said:

Family in UK planning to visit Thailand for a 2 week vacation.  I waa explaining the entry system, and when I got to the part about the second test on Day 5, there was silence on the call ..... then they all decided to go elsewhere.

I love reading all the posts like this, means the airport will be quieter when i return, brilliant - hate queues.

 

Selfish i know, but true story.

[NanaSomchai]

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Any thoughts or guesses?

Any cents from me that might somehow make it's way into either Prayuth's or Prawit's or their affiliated Junta's goons pockets is the real deal breaker for me.

 

Besides, as a quick reminder:

 

https://www.traveloffpath.com/the-philippines-officially-reopening-borders-for-tourism-february-10/

 

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/philippines-reopening-tourism-intl-hnk/index.html

 

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/travel/travel-news/philippines-to-reopen-to-fully-vaccinated-tourists-from-february-10/as89214845.cms

 

https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/philippines-reopen-february-vaccinated-foreign-tourists-2022-01-28/

 

https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/philippines-to-reopen-in-february-to-vaccinated-foreign-tourists/47300408

 

Take your hard earned money and your valuable time elsewhere. Period.

[Virt]

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

However, asking for the 2nd test after 5 days is enough of a hurdle, without asking for a 2nd night of quarantine. Sounds like a real deal breaker to me.

A colleague of mine takes the risk and goes to Thailand this month,

but she told me her friends were not that lucky this week.

Negative PCR tests before flight, negative tests on arrival in Thailand and then the 3rd test days later came back positive for one of them, so they could kiss their holiday goodbye.

 

Test on arrival is a show stopper, plus there is a good chance that the positive test

is a result of getting covid in Thailand.

 

If they had caught Omicron in their home country there would be a good chance

that their first test on arrival would return positive, since Omicron grows up to 70 x faster than Delta in the bronchial tissue.

 

So i'm not buying any tickets to Thailand until they drop the demand for tests.

Not even going to accept a pre flight PCR test.

 

So maybe it will take quite some time before i return to Thailand, but it is what it is.

There are other countries that just accept proof of vaccine so i stick to them for now.

[sirineou]

56 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

How do you think it will be adjusted?

 

My thoughts are the day #5 test will be scrapped pretty soon, certainly hope so as it's very inconvienient.

Me to. 

Who would want to jump through all these hoops to come to Thailand, when you can just take a PCR test, jump om a plane and go to the Philippines or many other tourist destinations?  Just as soon as they see that their insane plan has no affect on reducing covid, and that their tourism  industry is dying . it's not like they will come to their senses as much that the pressure from the tourist industry would be too big.   

[NanLaew]

4 hours ago, sirineou said:

Don't worry, it wont last. I give this latest version of the T&G a month at best before it is adjusted again.

So you reckon that the busy tourist who didn't bother doing or getting the day #5 RTK test during the first version of T&G last Nov and Dec are suddenly going to adhere to the rules if they drop the current day #5 PCR and revert to the do-it-yourself/visit the hospital RTK again?

 

This CONTROLLED 5th day PCR test was introduced due to omicron PLUS a dismal failure of visitors to do what they had agreed to do when they applied for and received their Thailand Pass late last year.

[Sheryl]

9 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

This CONTROLLED 5th day PCR test was introduced due to omicron PLUS a dismal failure of visitors to do what they had agreed to do when they applied for and received their Thailand Pass late last year.

 I would disagree that there was widespread failure if visitors to follow up with the second test in the first 2 iterations of test & Go. This forum and various Facebook groups were filled with posts from people who got the required tests but had no idea where/how to report the results (most ended up not reporting). There was a failure on the part of government to establish a clear, feasible system for tracking the Day 5 test results. Hospitals received no instructions, arriving visitors got no instructions, and the Mor Chana app is dysfunctional, most people were unable to upload anything to it.

 

More to the point a test of Day 5 makes zero sense in the era of Omicron which has an average incubation period of onl;y 3 days - and that is until symptoms appear, likely incubation period before a PCR test might be positive could be much less.

 

Positive results on day 5 will be primarily picking [ infections acquired after arrival in Thailand. They don't go around testing asymptomatic Thai residents (nor should they), why test people who arrived 5 days ago and were negative both prior to and immediately after arrival?

 

Even if someone arrived infected with Omicron and somehow tested negative nonethless on arrival, by Daty 5 they will usually no longer be contagious.

 

Makes absolutely zero sense fro ma Public health perspective  to test on Day 5 now that Omicron is  the overwhelmingly predominant strain.

[NanLaew]

35 minutes ago, Virt said:

Test on arrival is a show stopper, plus there is a good chance that the positive test

is a result of getting covid in Thailand.

 

If they had caught Omicron in their home country there would be a good chance

that their first test on arrival would return positive, since Omicron grows up to 70 x faster than Delta in the bronchial tissue.

How can a +ve test on arrival be due to getting infected in Thailand when the only place the traveler has been in Thailand is the airport, the transfer vehicle to get tested either at the hospital enroute or at the hotel before he checks in to his room? For most T&G arrivals, the time from airport gate to AQ is probably less than 2 hours while the maximum travel allowed is capped at 5 hours.

 

I agree that test on arrival is increasingly redundant but with omicrons faster, 5-day 'gestation', the day #5 test may be quite sensible. Maybe the new 5th day pre-paid AQ and PCR test will be all that's needed?

 

After they dropped the need for a pre-flight PCR test, the UK was only asking for folks to book and pay for a 2nd day RTK test, either self-administered (cheapest) or supervised (expensive). Most people arriving in the UK would be adhering to that but based on the performance of some of those arriving in Thailand last November and December, doing or getting the totally free RTK test a week after release was just too difficult.

[NanLaew]

5 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 I would disagree that there was widespread failure if visitors to follow up with the second test in the first 2 iterations of test & Go. This forum and various Facebook groups were filled with posts from people who got the required tests but had no idea where/how to report the results (most ended up not reporting). There was a failure on the part of government to establish a clear, feasible system for tracking the Day 5 test results. Hospitals received no instructions, arriving visitors got no instructions, and the Mor Chana app is dysfunctional, most people were unable to upload anything to it.

 

More to the point a test of Day 5 makes zero sense in the era of Omicron which has an average incubation period of onl;y 3 days - and that is until symptoms appear, likely incubation period before a PCR test might be positive could be much less.

 

Positive results on day 5 will be primarily picking [ infections acquired after arrival in Thailand. They don't go around testing asymptomatic Thai residents (nor should they), why test people who arrived 5 days ago and were negative both prior to and immediately after arrival?

 

Even if someone arrived infected with Omicron and somehow tested negative nonethless on arrival, by Daty 5 they will usually no longer be contagious.

 

Makes absolutely zero sense fro ma Public health perspective  to test on Day 5 now that Omicron is  the overwhelmingly predominant strain.

My opinion is based on my experience and that of five acquaintances who also managed to complete AQ and the subsequent RTK test without any issues or misunderstanding be it DIY or going to a hospital with the RTK test request note.

 

OK, with regard to 3-day peak omicron shedding (I was sure 5 was the magic number) how about a day #3 PCR test?

 

Hopefully, they will skip any interim steps and go "full English" and accept that the few omicron infected visitors that slip through aren't really contributing much to what's already the dominant strain in Thailand.

Edited January 30, 2022 by NanLaew

[daveAustin]

Deal breaker for me. I will not visit under that system since the likelihood of picking it up locally and incurring great expense is too high. And it was put in place as a knee jerk because those few tourists didn’t turn up.  
 

Why do they make it so complicated and awkward?

Why is Thailand so paranoid?

Chiefly because they try to look clever and can show their ‘low’ figures (yeah, I know) as being the result of such policy. 
 

But, as you know yourself Mike, that tourism is gone is not a thing. They ALWAYS wanted that. Covid was the perfect excuse. Having all these silly rules also deflects from the real issue—the junta—and typically keeps protesting Thais off the streets. 
 

Thailand was always going to go way OTT and make entry as awkward and convoluted as possible. Not bashing as I love the place, but they just can’t help but make a mountain out of a molehill. 
 

What will likely happen when they see hardly any genuine tourists showing up over the next few weeks is the (face saving) announcement of the entry regs being a resounding success and that our infection rates are now low enough that we can shelve the second test. 
 

Of course, the real way forwards is for Thailand to drop all this nonsense, or at the very least pick up the tab for ANY and EVERY expense incurred by the tourist, including obligatory incarceration to hospital for useless and unnecessary treatment for their cold. Won’t happen of course because, as you say, run by children. 

[Sheryl]

11 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

My opinion is based on my experience and that of five acquaintances who also managed to complete AQ and the subsequent RTK test without any issues or misunderstanding be it DIY or going to a hospital with the RTK test request note.

 

Completing the test was never the issue, anyone could do that and most people did. But government had no way of tracking  the numbers  tested.

[Jeffr2]

17 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

How can a +ve test on arrival be due to getting infected in Thailand when the only place the traveler has been in Thailand is the airport, the transfer vehicle to get tested either at the hospital enroute or at the hotel before he checks in to his room? For most T&G arrivals, the time from airport gate to AQ is probably less than 2 hours while the maximum travel allowed is capped at 5 hours.

 

I agree that test on arrival is increasingly redundant but with omicrons faster, 5-day 'gestation', the day #5 test may be quite sensible. Maybe the new 5th day pre-paid AQ and PCR test will be all that's needed?

 

After they dropped the need for a pre-flight PCR test, the UK was only asking for folks to book and pay for a 2nd day RTK test, either self-administered (cheapest) or supervised (expensive). Most people arriving in the UK would be adhering to that but based on the performance of some of those arriving in Thailand last November and December, doing or getting the totally free RTK test a week after release was just too difficult.

With Omicron being so contagious, even a brief encounter at an enclosed place like an airport terminal can cause infection.  Or, being on the plane.  Or even in the van with others being transported to the ASQ hotel.  As you know, many don't wear mask properly, or good ones, and not all the time as on the plane, ya gotta eat! LOL

 

But 100% agree a PCR before travel should be good enough.  It's well known this is a money maker for the government, getting some 30% kickbacks....

[GrandPapillon]

5 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

highly paranoid, very controlling

that sums up pretty much all Thailand officials,

[GrandPapillon]

5 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Tourism alone contributed to 20% of the GDP

don't think it does, not sure how and where you got that number, I think it was more like 5% from official stats

[Jeffr2]

9 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

don't think it does, not sure how and where you got that number, I think it was more like 5% from official stats

https://www.bot.or.th/Thai/MonetaryPolicy/EconomicConditions/AAA/250624_WhitepaperVISA.pdf

Quote

In 2019, nearly 40 million foreign tourists visited Thailand which helped generate
revenue of about 2 trillion Baht (11% of GDP) and employed more than 7 million
persons (20% of total employment)

 

[GrandPapillon]

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

The destruction of the tourism industry is now almost complete. Good job Prayuth.

I think it will recover quickly, don't underestimate Thailand for recovering very quickly, this is a country that can be very flexible when it wants to

 

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

The officials are behaving like scared little children.

always been like that, and they will never change

[DFPhuket]

I've completed 3 Sandboxes. Because the pre-flight PCR result must be less than 72 hours before the first flight departs, if you're coming from North America the test could be up to 6 days old. For example, I was swabbed on Sunday, received negative results on Tuesday, flew on Thursday and arrived on Friday. I don't like it, but I can understand a PCR on arrival.

 

But as others have mentioned, Omicron has a 2-3 day incubation period, which means the day 5/6 positives caught it in Thailand. With 100% of the tourists given PCRs and a miniscule percent of locals being tested, of course it's going to appear that the tourists are the dirty ones. 

[GrandPapillon]

5 minutes ago, Jeffr2 said:

https://www.bot.or.th/Thai/MonetaryPolicy/EconomicConditions/AAA/250624_WhitepaperVISA.pdf

 

so it's 10% of GDP, sounds more reasonable than 20%

 

and without the Chinese, you can expect a return to the 5% historical figure ????

 

Edited January 30, 2022 by GrandPapillon

[HashBrownHarry]

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

Who would want to jump through all these hoops to come to Thailand

Who on earth would want to go to Phillipines - lol.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

8 minutes ago, DFPhuket said:

Because the pre-flight PCR result must be less than 72 hours before the first flight departs, if you're coming from North America the test could be up to 6 days old. For example, I was swabbed on Sunday, received negative results on Tuesday, flew on Thursday and arrived on Friday.

 

I'm not a COVID era flyer.... so I may be fuzzy on this...

 

But I thought the actual test itself had to be no more than 72 hours before the first flight -- not the timing of the reporting of the ultimate results.

 

Which is it?

 

[DFPhuket]

3 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

I'm not a COVID era flyer.... so I may be fuzzy on this...

 

But I thought the actual test itself had to be no more than 72 hours before the first flight -- not the timing of the reporting of the ultimate results.

 

Which is it?

The rule is that your PCR test RESULT (not the swab) must be 72 hours before the departure time of the first flight. All three times I've flown, that's what the airline has checked - and in each case the actual swab was more than 72 hours. 

[Jeffr2]

28 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

so it's 10% of GDP, sounds more reasonable than 20%

 

and without the Chinese, you can expect a return to the 5% historical figure ????

 

But 20% of total employment....interesting....

[Jeffr2]

21 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I'm not a COVID era flyer.... so I may be fuzzy on this...

 

But I thought the actual test itself had to be no more than 72 hours before the first flight -- not the timing of the reporting of the ultimate results.

 

Which is it?

 

72 hours before you depart on your first flight.  Now, some countries are doing 48 hours.  Making it harder.

[tlcwaterfall]

49 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

don't think it does, not sure how and where you got that number, I think it was more like 5% from official stats

Tourism in Thailand - Wikipedia

 

Not really sure where you got 5% from. Most reputable websites indicate far higher official figures.

Edited January 30, 2022 by tlcwaterfall

[sanmyintmaung]

5 hours ago, GeorgeCross said:

what i don't understand is why thailand tightens its policy when numbers are high in country and loosens when the numbers go down!

When the boat is flooded, plug all the holes or boat will sink. When numbers are rising, tighten all restriction to flatten the curve or health care system will collapse. 

[BusyB]

OP:

 

Most definitely. After wandering around for 5 days, even boostered and taking sensible precautions, the chances of contracting mild or asymptomatic Omicron is huge. Then it's off to totally unnecessary 'quarantine hospitels' to be gouged for hundreds or thousands of euros. It's a gigantic elephant trap.

I read Jonathan Miller's report. Even if the facilities were of a better standard it's not worth it. I have better things to do with my time and money, even as a long-stay.

Now we see people being tested to get onto Koh Samet. Another trap. Other traps will also likely pop up. And if you test positive before leaving the country on a plane you'll also get packed off to 'hospitel' because obviously you can't board then.

I've already delayed my return till later in the year. But if they haven't got this lunacy sorted by then, I'll be looking for somewhere else. I have no desire to spend another winter in Germany, even if they are rather mild these days.

Very sad for me, but true.

 

Edited January 30, 2022 by BusyB
correcting the spelling corrector ;(

[HashBrownHarry]

3 minutes ago, BusyB said:

OP:

 

Most definitely. After wandering around for 5 days, even boostered and taking sensible precautions, the chances of contracting mild or asymptomatic Omicron is huge. Then it's off to totally unnecessary 'quarantine hospitels' to be gouged for hundreds or thousands of euros. It's a gigantic elephant trap.

I read Jonathan Miller's report. Even if the facilities were of a better standard it's not worth it. I have better things to do with my time and money, even as a long-stay.

Now we see people being tested to get onto Koh Samet. Another trap. Other traps will also likely pop up. And if you test positive before leaving the country on a plane you'll also get packed off to 'hospitel' because obviously you can't board then.

I've already delayed my return till later in the year. But if they haven't got this lunacy sorted by then, I'll be looking for somewhere else. I have no desire to spend another winter in Germany, even if they are rather mild these days.

Very sad for me, but true.

 

Long stayers can self isolate at home.

 

Tourists i guess are buggered.

[BusyB]

1 hour ago, HashBrownHarry said:

Who on earth would want to go to Phillipines - lol.

Having never been there I'd do it as a one off out of curiosity if Thailand is still insisting on its post arrival tests and PI isn't. Just to check it out though.

More likely to split the trip with Cambodia though, although Cambo (which I have been to) would not normally be a place I'd want to spend more than a couple of weeks either. But I think probably more interesting in terms of being longer stay in 'South East Asia' than PI, at least from what I've read on these forums.

[BusyB]

11 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

Long stayers can self isolate at home.

 

Tourists i guess are buggered.

I'm not sure at all if I'll already have an apartment at 5 days. And I wouldn't be living anywhere near Koh Samet either ???? 

For anyone not resident post arrival tests are an elephant trap. And to begin with I'll be more of a longer term tourist than resident even with a Non-O.

[HashBrownHarry]

13 minutes ago, BusyB said:

For anyone not resident post arrival tests are an elephant trap. And to begin with I'll be more of a longer term tourist than resident even with a Non-O.

Agreed.

[Jeffr2]

57 minutes ago, tlcwaterfall said:

Tourism in Thailand - Wikipedia

 

Not really sure where you got 5% from. Most reputable websites indicate far higher official figures.

Yes, I've seen figures higher than 11% from several reputable sites.  Who knows, but it's for sure not 5%.