Seems the Unvaccinated Topic hit home, 50/50 in response

[webfact]

 

by Michael Bridge

 

What an enormous response to our topic “Are we just going to have to live with unvaccinated people across Thailand?”

 

Over 600 responses and 13,200 views in six days.

At the time of writing, this topic has had the greatest number of replies for a very long time. So, obviously, this topic obviously hit home to many of you.

 

We, therefore, decided to run our own survey on Expat Vaccinations. It is very simple and quick, so here is the link. https://kwiksurveys.com/s/ZvkkBpjz#/0

 

We will be posting the results sometime in the next week.

 

Your Responses

 

Having trawled through all your responses (over five hundred and sixty-six to date) it seems there is not a clear outcome of those who agree unvaccinated people should or should not be allowed the same access as Vaccinated people.

 

That said many of you cared enough to write in, and it was very clear many had heated sub debates even while posted with others already online.

 

Here is just a snapshot of a few of our reader’s posts.

 

What do you think is the correct route to take?

 

If you want to travel, get vaccinated...
If you want to stay home do not bother.

 

Agree, the silver lining from this pandemic is it showed that how ill-prepared and divided we are it's hard to get consensus on decisions and society is divided into partisan lines. Hope some learning from this world can utilize to make things better for everyone. Now Pfizer tablet Paxlovid is available for treatment after the fact, so I guess worse is behind us.

 

I do not know of anyone who got vaccinated because they were actually told to. I know that some people (health care workers, first responders, military) have been given the choice of getting vaccinated or finding a new job, but they did have a choice.
 
I very eagerly got vaccinated because I wanted to stay healthy, visit elderly relatives without putting their lives at risk, and do my part to end the pandemic. I assume people who choose not to get vaccinated do so because these reasons mean little to them.

People who don't vaccinate against medical advice without a medical exemption deserve far less than respect. They are incubating the virus and increasing the risk of mutations as well as passing it on to others. 

 

In the case of the delta variant, the chance of a breakthrough infection once vaccinated are minuscule and there is still plenty of delta floating around.

 

Omicron cases are overwhelming hospitals simply because it's so infectious and the vast bulk of patients in ICU are unvaccinated. meanwhile, elective surgery is being cancelled. I would be in favour of vaccine mandates with criminal prosecutions for those who don't comply.

 

I really do not understand this, in my opinion it makes no difference, whether customers are vaccinated or not. Those vaccinated have some protection, those not vaccinated, take the risk, it matters not, even to staff, who also take the risk of not being vaccinated. Oh, and before anyone accuses me, of not being vaccinated... I have had three jabs.

 

It will be some time (if ever) before most countries allow the unvaccinated in.

 

Can anyone please explain why vaccinated people, i.e., those who instigate OPs such as this, are concerned about those who exercise their right to not be vaccinated? How can it affect them? 
 
I am vaccinated and boostered, I don't give a toss if the person next to me is unvaccinated, that's their concern, not mine, in fact, how would I ever know who else is vaccinated?

 

We have to live with the unvaccinated just as we have to live with drunk drivers, but we need a strategy to control, contain and educate them. In parts of New York there has been a resurgence of Measles due to the refusal of a superstitious religious minority group. They cannot and must not be allowed to endanger more enlightened and cooperative people in their area.

 

 "All breakthrough infections were mild, and no hospitalisations and deaths were observed."?
 
Regarding my claim the study shows unvaccinated people were one and a half times more likely to get infected, all that is required is simple arithmetic. 38% of 232 "contacts" is 88 contacts.   25% of 232 contacts is 58 contacts.

 

One and a half times 58 is 87, so the unvaccinated were slightly more than one and a half times more likely to get infected.

 

Reading your posts makes me even more concerned about getting vaccinated 
Makes me concerned about the harmful effects it may have 

 

How many of the vaccinated people needed hospitalization or died? According to the US Center for Disease Control, unvaccinated people are fifty-three times more likely to die of a Covid infection than people vaccinated with a booster shot.
 
"During October–November, unvaccinated persons had 13.9 and 53.2 times the risks for infection and COVID-19–associated death, respectively, compared with fully vaccinated persons who received booster doses, and 4.0 and 12.7 times the risks compared with fully vaccinated persons without booster doses. https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7104e2.htm

 

The vaccinated are less likely to catch and spread the virus. That's a good thing.  Risk reduction in general is a good thing. Don't you agree?

 

It is up to Thailand to demand vaccines for its citizens or not, not expatriates. They will do as they do. 

 

One thing that I can assure you is if you want to travel to Thailand and are not vaccinated, I highly doubt that they will ever let you in. It does not matter how you feel about it, that is just the way it will be. 
 
I have traveled for 33 years all around this planet and I will tell you that you cannot get into South America without a yellow fever vaccine. And that is that. 

We all have choices to make and are all free to exercise them accordingly. 

 

It is maybe informative for you and me. But people who have no understanding of statistics are surprised when they see a big number, or when someone says, "it's 150% more effective." The reality is that the study says: 25% of vaccinated got infected, and 38% of unvaccinated got infected. 

 

There is no chance of eliminating this virus. Not in this decade, at least. Even if everyone gets vaccinated. There will be new variants. Let us hope they get less and less dangerous in severity.

 

I agree. This article  provides some insight for both sides of that argument. 

 

So, there you have it, some are keen for everyone to be vaccinated, some are just not concerned either way and some just are neutral.

 

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[paul1804]

It is still early days yet as to whether we get any long term side effects from the vaccine and personally if I didnt intend to travel I would have held off getting Vaxxed until there was more confidence in it. There are too many unanswered questions about the whole Covid outbreak, its origin and so much more that is not clear and we are not being told. Regarding unvaccinated entry into Thailand, an Australian  friend of mine arrived from the UK mid January 2022 unvaxed, quarantined in BKK and now back living on Samui so I guess that puts your argument to an end!!! Again there is so much miss information spread in every aspect associated with this virus by individuals & government so called medical experts what do you really believe!! Recently some NZ medics found foreign matter in the Pfizer vaccine and after publicly putting the NZ government on notice 3 other countries reported the same findings so how can we be confident with any of the vaccinations given the situation & its uncertainty!  

[chilly07]

So difficult for expats to get boosters in Thailand that I would never refuse! It's my responsibility to the human race to get vaccinated when I can! Universal vaccination is the only way out of this mess and further evidence of Lab manipulation still occuring shows clearly how at risk we are from malign intervention!

[AgentSmith]

I'm surprised this is still such a hot topic. Omicron has changed this pandemic by a large degree. The virus became much more contagious. Vaccination has a smaller effect now on the transmission of the virus. At the same time omicron is far less of a threat to our physical health and it's becoming quite clear now it's mostly the elderly and the sick who still benefit from vaccination.

 

I am vaccinated and probably also will get my booster shot when it's my turn in April here in LOS. However depending on how the virus keeps mutating that could very well be my last shot.

 

I think we should all stop demonizing the unvaccinated. Popular debate has been behind actual developments since the start of the pandemic for the simple reason that research and development goes really fast these days. It's just really hard to keep up from the sidelines.

 

Now we're approaching an endemic rather than a pandemic situation. I think it's best if we all shifted our attention to more prominent issues.

[Paul Kernell]

I'm vaccinated, my booster is due. I'm sceptic about my booster because I've heard some bad reports of the after affects. It still is a trial drug! You can't get unvaccinated! Vaccinating children and young fit adults is ridiculously. It should be your choice, your body your health.

Look at the BS we've been told over the last 2years and fallow the dollar trail.

[GrandPapillon]

6 minutes ago, Paul Kernell said:

I'm vaccinated, my booster is due. I'm sceptic about my booster because I've heard some bad reports of the after affects. It still is a trial drug!

a few friends who got nothing for the first 2 shots, got major side effects at the third shot, with heart acceleration, pains etc...

[JustAnotherHun]

20 minutes ago, GrandPapillon said:

a few friends who got nothing for the first 2 shots, got major side effects at the third shot, with heart acceleration, pains etc...

Fake news! Misleading! To be deleted!

????

[connda]

On 2/11/2022 at 2:18 AM, webfact said:

I do not know of anyone who got vaccinated because they were actually told to. I know that some people (health care workers, first responders, military) have been given the choice of getting vaccinated or finding a new job, but they did have a choice.

If someone goes into a gold shop and says, "Give me all of your money and jewelry or I'll shoot you." 
So there would be nothing wrong with that - The gold-shop owner/employee did have a choice?

You missed the key concept:  "Under Duress."  That's not a choice.  That's survival.

[piewarmer]

My wife says her and a few friends have had changes to their menstral cycle, 

My wife used to get tender a week before but now it's 1 day, others have delays.

Who knows what these new vaccines do in the long run, I would keep it away from young people.

[Danderman123]

On 2/10/2022 at 10:50 PM, paul1804 said:

It is still early days yet as to whether we get any long term side effects from the vaccine and personally if I didnt intend to travel I would have held off getting Vaxxed until there was more confidence in it. There are too many unanswered questions about the whole Covid outbreak, its origin and so much more that is not clear and we are not being told. Regarding unvaccinated entry into Thailand, an Australian  friend of mine arrived from the UK mid January 2022 unvaxed, quarantined in BKK and now back living on Samui so I guess that puts your argument to an end!!! Again there is so much miss information spread in every aspect associated with this virus by individuals & government so called medical experts what do you really believe!! Recently some NZ medics found foreign matter in the Pfizer vaccine and after publicly putting the NZ government on notice 3 other countries reported the same findings so how can we be confident with any of the vaccinations given the situation & its uncertainty!  

It sounds like you have been misinformed about the vaccine by your internet friends.

 

The first clue that you are misinformed is that you believe what you read on the internet, rather than the findings of the medical community.

 

The second is that you posted about foreign matter found in Pfizer vaccine in New Zealand, but did not provide a link. Because you don’t have one.

 

The vast majority of people dying from Omicron today are unvaccinated. Why is it you don’t worry about that?
 

 

[JustAnotherHun]

6 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

The vaccines mostly prevent death. I guess that’s not important to you.

vaxxed or not, the risk to die from covid is minimal outside the vurnerable group. Even less with Omicron.

[Danderman123]

1 minute ago, JustAnotherHun said:

vaxxed or not, the risk to die from covid is minimal outside the vurnerable group. Even less with Omicron.

That’s small comfort to those who die who don’t think they are in the vulnerable group.

[placeholder]

1 minute ago, JustAnotherHun said:

vaxxed or not, the risk to die from covid is minimal outside the vurnerable group. Even less with Omicron.

Early days yet as the latest study of cardiovascular consequences shows.

[thainet]

45 minutes ago, piewarmer said:

My wife says her and a few friends have had changes to their menstral cycle, 

My wife used to get tender a week before but now it's 1 day, others have delays.

Who knows what these new vaccines do in the long run, I would keep it away from young people.

Now only a bad mood for a day....that can only be a good thing. ???? 

[connda]

18 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

The vaccines mostly prevent death. I guess that’s not important to you.

Paxlovid prevents death.  I'm a fanboy of early treatment, not mRNA and AVV shots.

[sirineou]

every single person responding and or reading this Op has some sort of vaccinations, and aside from their mental defects, seem to be fine otherwise. 

So why this vaccine? Why are they so much against it? is there something wrong with this vaccine or are they tools in a political football? 

[Danderman123]

1 minute ago, connda said:

Paxlovid prevents death.  I'm a fanboy of early treatment, not mRNA and AVV shots.

Yeah, you don’t like mRNA shots because you don’t know what’s in them.

 

But you love Paxlovid.

 

BTW, where can you get Paxlovid?

Edited February 13, 2022 by Danderman123

[ozimoron]

23 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Yeah, you don’t like mRNA shots because you don’t know what’s in them.

 

But you love Paxlovid.

 

BTW, where can you get Paxlovid?

Emergency Use Authorization (EUA) for ritonavir-boosted nirmatrelvir (Paxlovid) for the treatment of patients with mild to moderate COVID-19 who are within 5 days of symptom onset and at high risk of progression to severe disease.

 

https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/therapies/statement-on-paxlovid-drug-drug-interactions/

[pedro01]

Ill go with what i know.

 

Wife and i got 2nd AZ shot in December.

 

Seemed pretty useless to me personally.

 

Both of us got covid in Feb. Daughter has had 1 shot, didnt get it.

 

 

 

Ill take my chances from here.

 

Ill have another shot if it prevents me from getting sick.

 

The higher the qty of self righteous people pushing me to get it for their good, not mine, the less inclined ill be.

 

After all - wolves love sheep

Edited February 13, 2022 by pedro01

[jackspade]

I am pro-vaccines (I have had quite a few, especially during adolescence) but happily skipped COVID mRNA therapy since I don’t trust the manner in which they were produced and blanket foisted onto the public with zero regard for age, preexisting conditions, or risk factor. I am young and healthy and not at risk. The vast majority of my friends, both here and scattered around the world, also passed on this “vaccine”. Like attracts like, as they say. I have lost quite a few friends over the past year—once they heard I did not get mRNA therapy, they simply stopped engaging with me. I assume they are paralyzed by hatred and fear that I am some type of murderer for not putting my head down and complying like they did. And now that the inefficacy of the mRNA therapies is becoming obvious, they are probably angry at themselves and projecting that into the rest of us.

 

Ironically, neither I nor any of my unvaxxed friends has been sick in the past couple of years, and certainly not with COVID. One friend of mine who went back to a job in Northern Europe told me that all of his vaxxed coworkers have been out sick frequently over the past several months. Last week he was the only one working in the office, since the rest was out sick! A few of my jabbed coworkers back in my home country have all been suffering very oddly recurrent sicknesses after getting jabbed. They will get sick, then recover then be sick again within just a month or two. Quite odd and I don’t remember that sort of thing happening years ago.

 

While my good friends are all unvaxxed, most of their girlfriends, on the other hand, have gotten vaxxed and boosted, and nearly all of them have complained of disruptions to their menstrual cycles. One friend’s GF got vaxxed 7 months ago and hasn’t had a period since. My girlfriend has shared text messages revealing her coworkers discussing such things, though they wouldn’t dare bring it up in the workplace due to fear of losing face. One must wonder how permanent the damage to their reproductive systems will prove to be.

 

That said, many of my family who are also unvaccinated did get COVID, and experienced varying levels of symptoms. My mother was affected the worst (sick for two weeks) but it was never worse than a bad flu. Even my 90 year old grandmother (who is vaccinated) got COVID, but she is also fine now.

[Rimmer]

Some misleading posts and out of date information also replies have been removed

[pedro01]

49 minutes ago, sirineou said:

every single person responding and or reading this Op has some sort of vaccinations, and aside from their mental defects, seem to be fine otherwise. 

So why this vaccine? Why are they so much against it? is there something wrong with this vaccine or are they tools in a political football? 

I am not against it. I found it ineffective.

 

I wouldnt take another.

 

I dont have a stake in others taking it. So i have no opinion.

[Danderman123]

37 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

Emergency Use Authorization (EUA) for ritonavir-boosted nirmatrelvir (Paxlovid) for the treatment of patients with mild to moderate COVID-19 who are within 5 days of symptom onset and at high risk of progression to severe disease.

 

https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/therapies/statement-on-paxlovid-drug-drug-interactions/

So, where can you get Paxlovid?

[Danderman123]

10 minutes ago, pedro01 said:

I am not against it. I found it ineffective.

 

I wouldnt take another.

 

I dont have a stake in others taking it. So i have no opinion.

Did you die from Covid?

 

[Danderman123]

16 minutes ago, jackspade said:

I am pro-vaccines (I have had quite a few, especially during adolescence) but happily skipped COVID mRNA therapy since I don’t trust the manner in which they were produced and blanket foisted onto the public with zero regard for age, preexisting conditions, or risk factor. I am young and healthy and not at risk. The vast majority of my friends, both here and scattered around the world, also passed on this “vaccine”. Like attracts like, as they say. I have lost quite a few friends over the past year—once they heard I did not get mRNA therapy, they simply stopped engaging with me. I assume they are paralyzed by hatred and fear that I am some type of murderer for not putting my head down and complying like they did. And now that the inefficacy of the mRNA therapies is becoming obvious, they are probably angry at themselves and projecting that into the rest of us. It’s quite Twilight Zone, really, because actually the mRNA-injected people are the ones brewing new variants due to the therapies being incredibly leaky.

 

Ironically, neither I nor any of my unvaxxed friends has been sick in the past couple of years, and certainly not with COVID. One friend of mine who went back to a job in Northern Europe told me that all of his vaxxed coworkers have been out sick frequently over the past several months. Last week he was the only one working in the office, since the rest was out sick! A few of my jabbed coworkers back in my home country have all been suffering very oddly recurrent sicknesses after getting jabbed. They will get sick, then recover then be sick again within just a month or two. Quite odd and I don’t remember that sort of thing happening years ago.

 

While my good friends are all unvaxxed, most of their girlfriends, on the other hand, have gotten vaxxed and boosted, and nearly all of them have complained of disruptions to their menstrual cycles. One friend’s GF got vaxxed 7 months ago and hasn’t had a period since. My girlfriend has shared text messages revealing her coworkers discussing such things, though they wouldn’t dare bring it up in the workplace due to fear of losing face. One must wonder how permanent the damage to their reproductive systems will prove to be.

 

That said, many of my family who are also unvaccinated did get COVID, and experienced varying levels of symptoms. My mother was affected the worst (sick for two weeks) but it was never worse than a bad flu. Even my 90 year old grandmother (who is vaccinated) got COVID, but she is also fine now.

Many unvaxxed who died from Covid were healthy until they got Covid.

 

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, Danderman123 said:

So, where can you get Paxlovid?

I have read that it will only be administered in a hospital

[Danderman123]

Just now, ozimoron said:

I have read that it will only be administered in a hospital

What hospitals have Paxlovid now?

[Danderman123]

19 minutes ago, pedro01 said:

Ill go with what i know.

 

Wife and i got 2nd AZ shot in December.

 

Seemed pretty useless to me personally.

 

Both of us got covid in Feb. Daughter has had 1 shot, didnt get it.

 

 

 

Ill take my chances from here.

 

Ill have another shot if it prevents me from getting sick.

 

The higher the qty of self righteous people pushing me to get it for their good, not mine, the less inclined ill be.

 

After all - wolves love sheep

Did the vaccines prevent you from dying from Covid?

[Danderman123]

We are getting a lot of posts like this:

 

” I am fully vaxxed, but I got Covid. It was like a cold. So, the vaccine didn’t work”.

 

instead, i am looking for posts like this:

 

”I am fully vaxxed, but I got Covid. I was on a vent for 2 months. I am not impressed by the vaccine”.

[ozimoron]

4 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

What hospitals have Paxlovid now?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-19-paxlovid-pill-monoclonal-antibodies-treatments/