Are we now feeling the effects of Ukraine's situation in Asia?

[placeholder]

18 minutes ago, Saanim said:

Do you mean when they had chosen the wrong one during Korean, Vietnam war, hadn't they? 

From the point of view of Thailand's self-interest, did it make the wrong choice?

[FritsSikkink]

7 hours ago, heybruce said:

NATO rightly sees Russia as a threat since Russia is an expansionist wanna-be empire.  Putin is demonstrating that now.

 

NATO has been expanding towards Russia in the last decades.

[Saanim]

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

Dismal Russian Record in Occupied Eastern Ukraine Serves as Warning

The areas, once engines of the Ukrainian economy, are now impoverished, depopulated enclaves that increasingly rely on Russian subsidies to survive. It’s what many fear could happen to the rest of the country if Vladimir Putin carries out a broader invasion

https://www.wsj.com/articles/dismal-russian-record-in-occupied-eastern-ukraine-serves-as-warning-11643988253

What a surprise that they are impoverished?  when 7 years - after the Maidan coup - they had wanted their autonomy, similarly as the Crimea Republic always had had. What was the reaction of the new Ukraine govt towards them? Deprive them of all supply and support, even the Russian language.

 

And who will want to have the poorest European country (OK, perhaps the 2nd poorest one)? What has happened during the 7 long "free" years? And that despite of all the injections? Where all the money had gone? Surely not to the country development and to the population.

 

In UK you can get a plumber who has a college education from Kiev...

 

Anybody will want this country? (beside as a military base?)     

[Saanim]

24 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I'm sure Ukraine would be happily neutral if Russia had stayed out of its politics, hadn't seized Ukrainian territory and wasn't supporting rebel militias.

Haven't we seen it during the last 7 years? ????

[itsari]

3 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

Absolutely correct.  The rebels may hold those two locations but the locations are still part of Ukraine and they have been fighting there for the last 8 years.  Putin wants to reunite all of the former soviet union back into a new and remade USSR.  His land grab is just the first of many more to come I fear.

Hi Thailand Ryan , I have to make contact this way as you do not allow messages . I had correspondence with you early in this day of the 23rd of February 2022 and now that correspondence has disappeared from Asia Now . What is your game sir ?

Have you the power to eradicate what you do not like ?

[placeholder]

9 minutes ago, Saanim said:

What a surprise that they are impoverished?  when 7 years - after the Maidan coup - they had wanted their autonomy, similarly as the Crimea Republic always had had. What was the reaction of the new Ukraine govt towards them? Deprive them of all supply and support, even the Russian language.

 

And who will want to have the poorest European country (OK, perhaps the 2nd poorest one)? What has happened during the 7 long "free" years? And that despite of all the injections? Where all the money had gone? Surely not to the country development and to the population.

 

In UK you can get a plumber who has a college education from Kiev...

 

Anybody will want this country? (beside as a military base?)     

The Ukrainina economy went into freefall under Yanukovych. Ukraine still has a big corruption problem, but under Yanukovych it became an utter cesspool.

https://www.ceicdata.com/en/indicator/ukraine/gdp-per-capita

 

Ukraine still has a big corruption problem, but under Yanukovych it became an utter cesspool.

[juice777]

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

Oddly enough, most people probably don't have a problem not thinking conspiracy. If you're looking for problems with thinking, try looking closer to home

Bit out of hand there  I think, I ant one of those tin foil hat people is what I am saying and at the moment I don't think it is one but if there a war and the Vaccine don't get through I will have to start thinking the possibility it is.

Edited February 23, 2022 by juice777

[KhunLA]

Unless Ukrainian or Russian, or operate import / export to and or from, not sure how anything about that region would effect Thailand or expats here.

[gearbox]

4 hours ago, arithai12 said:

If you cared to follow the real facts and not what CNN/BBC feed you, it's obvious that NATO -an obsolete institution trying to justify its immense budget and infinite number of generals- has planned the confrontation with Russia to justify its existence.

The whole Ukrainian mess started in 2014 when the Americans staged a coup and replaced the democratically elected president. Whether the president was good or bad was questionable, but he was elected. It all went downhill since then.

[NanaSomchai]

2 hours ago, Harveyboy said:

rather be nuked here than freezing cold Birmingham

Rightfully so, I can't think of a single place I'd chose/want to live in England (apart maybe from YO1 7LZ and even then it's only shops and tourist attractions).

Edited February 23, 2022 by NanaSomchai

[gejohesch]

11 hours ago, Soikhaonoiken said:

As the EU & USA started to impose sanctions on Russia, this will start to affect tourists from the block visiting Thailand and mainly Phuket 

Fewer Russian tourists (rather than other Western tourists?) to be expected? A calculation / expectation by TAT that could lead to a change of its tourist entry regulations?

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, Chris.B said:

Well there you are, a plausible peace plan. Why is no one discussing it? ????

 

I'm sure every country but one would be happy to have Russia out of Ukraine's politics, out of its borders, and no longer supporting rebel militias.  Under these circumstances I'm sure every country but one would be happy to have a neutral Ukraine.

 

You can see the one country that is a problem, can't you?

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, FritsSikkink said:

NATO has been expanding towards Russia in the last decades.

Every country that joined NATO did so eagerly.  None of these country's trust Russia and want to face it alone.

 

Now if Russia would stop seizing territory from neighboring countries and interfering in their affairs...

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, gearbox said:

The whole Ukrainian mess started in 2014 when the Americans staged a coup and replaced the democratically elected president. Whether the president was good or bad was questionable, but he was elected. It all went downhill since then.

It's kind of flattering that you think the US could pull off something like that.  But only the most paranoid conspiracy freak would believe it.

[ozimoron]

2 hours ago, Saanim said:

Haven't we seen it during the last 7 years? ????

No, they have continuously occupied Crimea and the Donbass regions and supplied arms to separatists.

[anandra]

9 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

No, they have continuously occupied Crimea and the Donbass regions and supplied arms to separatists.

One little correction, there were no separatists, it was russian army with collaborants thatstarted the war.

[tandor]

8 hours ago, gearbox said:

Speak of yourself, I certainly don't need any self appointed "world policeman" of any origin.

...well at least the US has stepped up, where the UN have failed miserably.

 

[Saanim]

23 minutes ago, heybruce said:

Every country that joined NATO did so eagerly.

Yes, they did so eagerly and also foolishly (under the meme: Oh, how we will be hey once we'll get here the boys from USA).

Perhaps you should go there now and ask them whether they would do again so "eagerly"...

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, gearbox said:

The whole Ukrainian mess started in 2014 when the Americans staged a coup and replaced the democratically elected president. Whether the president was good or bad was questionable, but he was elected. It all went downhill since then.

As noted above, one minor, practically negligible thing that went up rather than down was the economy.

[Virt]

It's interesting to see how China says sanctions are not the proper way and they are not joining the sanctions,

 but it's not so surprising.

 

China knows if they jump Taiwan they are getting sanctioned a hell of a lot more than Russia,

so off course China says sanctions are not the proper way to solve thinges.

 

Which is why i think China will sit in a corner very quietly and see how the santions affects Russia.

[Saanim]

6 hours ago, heybruce said:

"Western leaders never pledged not to enlarge NATO, a point that several analysts have demonstrated. Mark Kramer explored the question in detail in a 2009 article in The Washington Quarterly. He drew on declassified American, German and Soviet records to make his case and noted that, in discussions on German reunification in the two-plus-four format (the two Germanys plus the United States, Soviet Union, Britain and France), the Soviets never raised the question of NATO enlargement other than how it might apply in the former German Democratic Republic (GDR)."  https://www.brookings.edu/blog/up-front/2014/11/06/did-nato-promise-not-to-enlarge-gorbachev-says-no/

Quote

NATO's Eastward ExpansionDid the West Break Its Promise to Moscow?

Russian President Dmitry Medvedev has accused the West of breaking promises made after the fall of the Iron Curtain, saying that NATO's expansion into Eastern Europe violated commitments made during the negotiations over German reunification. Newly discovered documents from Western archives support the Russian position.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/world/nato-s-eastward-expansion-did-the-west-break-its-promise-to-moscow-a-663315.html

 

[overherebc]

I'm a bit concerned about the price of my weekly can of Buluga Caviar to be honest.

[placeholder]

12 minutes ago, overherebc said:

I'm a bit concerned about the price of my weekly can of Buluga Caviar to be honest.

Well, I read that negotiations with the Iranians are going well so not to worry.

[heybruce]

40 minutes ago, Saanim said:

Yes, they did so eagerly and also foolishly (under the meme: Oh, how we will be hey once we'll get here the boys from USA).

Perhaps you should go there now and ask them whether they would do again so "eagerly"...

If any of these countries want to leave NATO all they have to do is say so. 

 

Have any asked to leave?

[placeholder]

6 minutes ago, heybruce said:

If any of these countries want to leave NATO all they have to do is say so. 

 

Have any asked to leave?

Actually, France did leave. And American tanks did not cross the border into France. Are there any Eastern European nations pining for the Warsaw Pact?

[overherebc]

24 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Well, I read that negotiations with the Iranians are going well so not to worry.

Oil prices, transport costs could be a factor though.

????

[placeholder]

25 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Well, I read that negotiations with the Iranians are going well so not to worry.

And speaking of Iran, the latest developments are certainly working in their favor. Iran has huge natural gas reserves and is close to Europe. Well, sort of. It would have to circumnavigate most of Africa to deliver the gas via tanker.

[Tradewind777]

12 hours ago, Pique Dard said:

the warsaw pact is dead, and course, whether we like it or not,  in poutine/russia's eyes nato is a threat. i may be wrong, but i don't think the usa would react differently if one of their neighbors  become a "close friend" to moscou. remember the usa invasion  of  grenada...in 1983 (google!)

as for me, this is a dangerous game both superpowers are playing

You refer to the Munroe Doctrine whereby the US divided the world into two hemispheres, East and West. It did not permit any “Eastern Hemisphere state to form an alliance with a neighbour (ie No Russian bases in Mexico or Chinese troops on the ground in Canada (hypothetical). It came about after the Cuban missile crisis which is a similar analogue.

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, Tradewind777 said:

You refer to the Munroe Doctrine whereby the US divided the world into two hemispheres, East and West. It did not permit any “Eastern Hemisphere state to form an alliance with a neighbour (ie No Russian bases in Mexico or Chinese troops on the ground in Canada (hypothetical). It came about after the Cuban missile crisis which is a similar analogue

 That's news to me. I. was taught in school that there was Monroe Doctrine. But that was promulgated in the early 19th century. Did Cuba have missiles in the early 19th century?

[RichardColeman]

11 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

Be nice to see Russia be banned from all world sport, all citizens banned from all world travel and that pathetic pro Russian RT station banned in the UK

And lo and behold Uk reviewing the RT licence. Prophetic !