Assault on Kiev: Russian helicopters swoop above Ukraine's capital

[heybruce]

6 hours ago, SunnyinBangrak said:

this must be n error. Isn't the use of these considered a "war crime" by the biden admin? So they are hardly going to knowingly commit war crimes, right?

 

"we've seen a range of reports, dana, that are horrifying about the use of barbaric tactics whether cluster bombs or other tactics that we've seen that could be classified as a war crime" Jen Psaki

https://archive.org/details/FOXNEWSW_20220301_140000_Americas_Newsroom_With_Bill_Hemmer__Dana_Perino/start/3870/end/3930

 

An interesting collection of comments regarding these cluster bombs.

https://blog.gdeltproject.org/how-television-news-has-covered-cluster-bombs-as-war-crimes/

Many nations do regard use of cluster bombs a war crime.  However there is a long established precedent that if one side is using tactics or weapons that are against the laws of war the other side is allowed to respond in kind.  Russia has used cluster bombs against civilian targets:

 

"The cluster munition attack with the highest known civilian casualties occurred on April 8, 2022, when Russia launched a Tochka-U ballistic missile equipped with a cluster munition warhead at a crowded train station in the eastern city of Kramatorsk as hundreds of people were trying to leave the area. A detailed Human Rights Watch investigation found that the attack killed at least 58 civilians and injured over 100 others."  https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/05/29/cluster-munition-use-russia-ukraine-war

 

I trust Ukraine will use the weapons against legitimate military targets.

[jvs]

More good news.

I am sure putin does not like this.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/7/8/ukraine-deserves-nato-membership-turkeys-erdogan-says

[Mavideol]

3 hours ago, jvs said:

More good news.

I am sure putin does not like this.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/7/8/ukraine-deserves-nato-membership-turkeys-erdogan-says

Erdogan is to close to Putin and to Xi.... wouldn't trust the guy

[scottiejohn]

9 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

Erdogan is to close to Putin and to Xi.... wouldn't trust the guy

He does not care who he is close to as long as THEY give HIM what HE wants!

[Mavideol]

1 minute ago, scottiejohn said:

He does not care who he is close to as long as THEY give HIM what HE wants!

u r correct, Erdogan is all about $$$$$$$$ ..... however still a dictator type guy

[jvs]

29 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

Erdogan is to close to Putin and to Xi.... wouldn't trust the guy

Well if he said this in public he can not back out and he is already helping the Ukraine on other fronts.

He can not really afford to upset the EU and NATO,i think he is sincere in this.

[ThailandRyan]

The crazy thing is that people like this are allowed to run countries. Russia is only out for itself and really doesn't care what occurs as long as Putin achieves his goals, psychopathic goals with a view of ethnic cleansing. The world has definitely taken a step backwards as far as freedoms go.

[Bkk Brian]

More good news for Ukraine on this new memorandum agreement with Erdogan

 

Ukraine and Turkey to cooperate in the production of UAVs

Ukraine has signed a memorandum of cooperation with Turkey on the development of facilities and capabilities for the production of various types of drones.

This was announced by the Office of the President of Ukraine on July 8.

A memorandum of understanding in the field of strategic industries was signed within the framework of the working visit of the President of Ukraine to Turkey.

https://mil.in.ua/en/news/ukraine-and-turkey-to-cooperate-in-the-production-of-uavs/

 

[Bkk Brian]

On 7/6/2023 at 6:15 PM, ThailandRyan said:

One has to wonder if the Wagner boss is alive or dead with this information.

 

 

 

The mystery as to where he is is just getting deeper. In my opinion all this negative press from the Kremlin and Russian TV pundits is setting the stage for his continued long term disappearance. Dead or being held securely out of sight somewhere with him having no contact with the outside world?

 

Prigozhin’s Movements a Mystery as Wagner Fans Gather in St. Petersburg

The mystery surrounding the whereabouts of Wagner founder Yevgeny Prigozhin continued Saturday as supporters of the mercenary group gathered in his hometown, St. Petersburg, adding to questions over his future role in Russia after he sparked the most serious challenge to President Vladimir Putin in his 23 years in power.

Organizers advised attendees that “this event is a meeting with you, nothing more,” in a message on Telegram. “In light of recent events, this is extremely important. There is no need to carry flags or to campaign.”

Yet the gathering, though small, added to the speculation swirling around Prigozhin’s plans after he last month led his Wagner forces in a revolt against Russia’s military leadership that at one point threatened to plunge the country into civil war.

https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/prigozhins-movements-a-mystery-as-wagner-fans-gather-in-st-petersburg-f17302ad

 

https://archive.ph/6vyLh

[sammieuk1]

Haunt of the 500th day for the Kremlin  ????

 

[Jingthing]

2 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

The crazy thing is that people like this are allowed to run countries. Russia is only out for itself and really doesn't care what occurs as long as Putin achieves his goals, psychopathic goals with a view of ethnic cleansing. The world has definitely taken a step backwards as far as freedoms go.

What gets me are the naive fools that think you can "negotiate" with Putin. 

[Mavideol]

18 hours ago, jvs said:

Well if he said this in public he can not back out and he is already helping the Ukraine on other fronts.

He can not really afford to upset the EU and NATO,i think he is sincere in this.

agreed... was skeptical about his motifs but after further reading the guy did surprised me and overstepped Putin "agreement"

Zelenskiy brings home Azovstal fighters given to Turkey

https://au.yahoo.com/news/zelenskiy-brings-home-azovstal-fighters-170621455.html

[steven100]

could Prigozhin be planning another coup attempt on Moscow    ?

 

source:https://www.yahoo.com/news/prigozhin-fate-remains-unclear-signals-050154899.html

 

[jvs]

7 minutes ago, steven100 said:

could Prigozhin be planning another coup attempt on Moscow    ?

 

source:https://www.yahoo.com/news/prigozhin-fate-remains-unclear-signals-050154899.html

 

This is some thing i already thought about earlier.

What if putin has him killed?

Will his men take revenge?

There is no way the russians can catch and torture/kill all of the wagner family members.

94 % of the russian army in is the Ukraine?

How will they defend Moscow?With a bunch of old men and kids?

 

 

 

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, Mavideol said:

agreed... was skeptical about his motifs but after further reading the guy did surprised me and overstepped Putin "agreement"

Zelenskiy brings home Azovstal fighters given to Turkey

https://au.yahoo.com/news/zelenskiy-brings-home-azovstal-fighters-170621455.html

It does appear that Erdogan has detected a change in the winds and is signaling an openness to work with others.

 

Potentially a good thing, but always remember what kind of player Erdogan is.

[jvs]

4 minutes ago, heybruce said:

It does appear that Erdogan has detected a change in the winds and is signaling an openness to work with others.

 

Potentially a good thing, but always remember what kind of player Erdogan is.

Keeping in mind who he is he is well aware the russia will have nothing at all

for the next 20 years or so.

They will have to pay a massive amount of money to the Ukraine and they will also need to borrow a lot of money some where.

I will not be surprised if in a few years from now the west will pay russia

30 % of the price of gas just to help them pay for the damage they have done.

 

[LosLobo]

3 hours ago, jvs said:

Keeping in mind who he is he is well aware the russia will have nothing at all

for the next 20 years or so.

They will have to pay a massive amount of money to the Ukraine and they will also need to borrow a lot of money some where.

I will not be surprised if in a few years from now the west will pay russia

30 % of the price of gas just to help them pay for the damage they have done.

 

The West supported Russia during WWI, the 1921 Great Famine and WW2 with billions worth of aid with little recognition.

 

As Putin has used Russia's single-handed great victory over the Germans to promote the war on Ukraine, I suggest that the West help them as little as possible.

 

 

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by LosLobo

[jvs]

9 minutes ago, LosLobo said:

The West supported Russia during WWI, the 1921 Great Famine and WW2 with billions worth of aid with little recognition.

 

As Putin has used Russia's single-handed great victory over the Germans to promote the war on Ukraine, I suggest that the West help them as little as possible.

 

 

 

I understand your sentiment but i do not think we will see the same russia again when this is over and it is not over by a long shot.

Imo the plan is to have russia broken up into smaller states and the way it is going the west will have to do very little.

More unrest inside of russia and it will get out of hand.

 

[ThailandRyan]

More information on the return of the Azov Commanders.  Seems that Putin was definitely snubbed by Erdogan

 

Putin Cheated by Erdogan RIGHT After Announcing Turkey Trip (msn.com)

 

After wrapping up talks with Erdogan in a visit to Istanbul, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky returned home with five Azov commanders, who were initially taken prisoner by Moscow during a months-long battle to defend the port city of Mariupol.

The commanders were freed in a prison swap overseen by Ankara in September—but only under the condition that they would stay put in Turkey until the end of the war.

Zelensky posted a video of himself shaking hands with and hugging the soldiers, hailing them as “heroes” and celebrating that “they will finally be with their relatives,” according to Al Jazeera. The president also tweeted on Saturday a photo with the commanders using the caption “Home ????????.”

[jvs]

I see in an article that there a quite o lot of wagner fighters returning from

Africa.

To help in the Ukraine or to help in russia?

More going on then we know of for sure.

 

[onthedarkside]

Off topic trolling incomprehensible post removed along with replies

[Pink Mist]

A comment on moderation has been removed 

[RanongCat]

1 hour ago, jvs said:

I see in an article that there a quite o lot of wagner fighters returning from

Africa.

To help in the Ukraine or to help in russia?

More going on then we know of for sure.

 

Or is concern from Wagner fighters  no p-ay coming from Putin now boat is rocking?

These are not conscript! They expect money agreed to to die ?

[LosLobo]

Ukraine marks 500 days of war by admitting it blew up Russia's bridge to Crimea last year.......

 

 

Ukraine Admits Blowing up Russia's Bridge to Crimea (businessinsider.com)

 

and they are still trying!

 

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by LosLobo

[Mavideol]

On 7/9/2023 at 1:13 PM, heybruce said:

It does appear that Erdogan has detected a change in the winds and is signaling an openness to work with others.

 

Potentially a good thing, but always remember what kind of player Erdogan is.

we are on the same page... would not turn my back to him

[LosLobo]

 

On 7/9/2023 at 3:43 PM, heybruce said:

It does appear that Erdogan has detected a change in the winds and is signaling an openness to work with others.

 

Potentially a good thing, but always remember what kind of player Erdogan is.

Obviously Erdogan is going all out 'on openness to work with others' and to possibly alienate his mate Putin.

 

 

Turkey to back Sweden's NATO bid in return for EU membership: Erdogan (msn.com)

[Bkk Brian]

3 minutes ago, LosLobo said:

 

Obviously Erdogan is going all out 'on openness to work with others' and to possibly alienate his mate Putin.

 

 

Turkey to back Sweden's NATO bid in return for EU membership: Erdogan (msn.com)

Excellent news, lets hope he keeps his word

[Bkk Brian]

Yes, it is........................

 

https://twitter.com/RishiSunak/status/1679097815232831490

 

[Rimmer]

Wagner Turns Over 2,000 Heavy Weapons Including Tanks, SAM Systems

 

In the wake of his aborted mutiny last month, Yevgeny Prigozhin and his Wagner Private Military Company turned over more than 2,000 weapons and pieces of equipment more than 2,500 tons of ammunition and over 20,000 small arms, the Russian Defense Ministry (MoD) said on its Telegram channel Wednesday. A video showing turned over Wagner tanks and other armor, artillery pieces, land mines and boxes apparently full of munitions has also been distributed.

 

Full story:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/wagner-turns-over-2000-heavy-weapons-including-tanks-sam-systems

 

[jvs]

40 minutes ago, Rimmer said:

Wagner Turns Over 2,000 Heavy Weapons Including Tanks, SAM Systems

 

In the wake of his aborted mutiny last month, Yevgeny Prigozhin and his Wagner Private Military Company turned over more than 2,000 weapons and pieces of equipment more than 2,500 tons of ammunition and over 20,000 small arms, the Russian Defense Ministry (MoD) said on its Telegram channel Wednesday. A video showing turned over Wagner tanks and other armor, artillery pieces, land mines and boxes apparently full of munitions has also been distributed.

 

Full story:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/wagner-turns-over-2000-heavy-weapons-including-tanks-sam-systems

 

I assume this means Prigozhin is dead?