Thai Airlines Urged to Conduct Inspection of Boeing 737-800

[ozfarang]

44 minutes ago, BusyB said:

Dunno where they parked them in Asia or how they were maintained ... but airlines have operators' certificates to keep current ... anyone any ideas, links?

Some asian airlines parked their aircraft at Alice Springs, Australia

 

 

https://apas.com.au

[pacovl46]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Of course, there's always the possibility that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Of course there's also always the possibility that you're pompous! 

[Moonlover]

43 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

But why the very slow decent rate then? As I've said before the plan traveled at a speed of 360 kilometers an hour. That's literally engines off, nose down!

So am i right in thinking that you believe that 360kph is a reasonable speed for an aircraft with no engine power in a vertical dive? If so I'm not going to argue with you. In fact I'll even offer you a possible explanation.

 

One of the pilots spooled down the engines and put the aircraft into a vertical dive, That's literally engines off, nose down!

 

Does that keep you happy?

 

 

[BusyB]

4 hours ago, ozfarang said:

Some asian airlines parked their aircraft at Alice Springs, Australia

 

 

https://apas.com.au

Yeah, Oz makes sense there. Thanks

[daejung]

14 hours ago, mbenson said:

Saving face for the Chinese. The way the Chinese plane fell from the sky, experts suspect terrorism. So, yeah blame it on the American plane. The plane (737-800) that crashed in China is not the same one that had the two crashes (737 Max) that required the plane to be taken off the market.

Will the plane black box remain in China ?

[Isaan sailor]

Almost 22.000 ft decent in 72 seconds.  And a witness (unverified) saw a plane heading nose down. Doesn’t look like a mid-air breakup.

[sezze]

15 hours ago, pacovl46 said:

6000 meters in a minute equals 360 kilometers an hour, that's very slow for an airliner. It's essentially the max speed a plane can reach by just

falling nose down straight out of the sky, which makes me think engines failure, but it's definitely not being massively overspeed. 

I dropped vertically in the mountain . Vertically means massive overspeed . Engine failure does not lead to vertical crash , unless pilot error . A airplane can fly from 8km high without any engine pretty far and land without problem .

skip to 1:21 and you see the security cam recording the plane falling vertically from the sky .

There are not many reasons to do so . 1 of them is serious pilot error , 2nd big reason is the tail section ( horizontal stabilizer ) being gone for 1 reason or another . And actually not many other reasons are there ,

[pacovl46]

6 hours ago, Moonlover said:

So am i right in thinking that you believe that 360kph is a reasonable speed for an aircraft with no engine power in a vertical dive? If so I'm not going to argue with you. In fact I'll even offer you a possible explanation.

 

One of the pilots spooled down the engines and put the aircraft into a vertical dive, That's literally engines off, nose down!

 

Does that keep you happy?

 

 

Terminal velocity...

[pacovl46]

1 hour ago, sezze said:

I dropped vertically in the mountain . Vertically means massive overspeed . Engine failure does not lead to vertical crash , unless pilot error . A airplane can fly from 8km high without any engine pretty far and land without problem .

skip to 1:21 and you see the security cam recording the plane falling vertically from the sky .

There are not many reasons to do so . 1 of them is serious pilot error , 2nd big reason is the tail section ( horizontal stabilizer ) being gone for 1 reason or another . And actually not many other reasons are 

I don't get your point. This type of aircraft has a max speed of 946km/h. It crashed with about 360 km/h, so there's no way the engines were oversped during the free fall. Going nose down is not the definition of being overspeed. 

 

Overspeeding in a jet plane means the turbine rotates so fast that it exceeds the structural integrity and then the engine disintegrates. 

 

The maximum velocity a jet plane can reach with its engine/ engines will always be much greater than the terminal velocity a plan can reach by falling out of the sky. 

 

Edited March 26, 2022 by pacovl46

[sezze]

38 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

I don't get your point. This type of aircraft has a max speed of 946km/h. It crashed with about 360 km/h, so there's no way the engines were oversped during the free fall. Going nose down is not the definition of being overspeed. 

 

Overspeeding in a jet plane means the turbine rotates so fast that it exceeds the structural integrity and then the engine disintegrates. 

 

The maximum velocity a jet plane can reach with its engine/ engines will always be much greater than the terminal velocity a plan can reach by falling out of the sky. 

 

How do you get that speed ? The speed measured in Flightradar is horizontal ground speed , not speed in general . Even the horizontal ground speed exceeded the max of 540mph ( 590mph) .

 

[Moonlover]

7 hours ago, sezze said:

How do you get that speed ? The speed measured in Flightradar is horizontal ground speed , not speed in general . Even the horizontal ground speed exceeded the max of 540mph ( 590mph) .

 

Wrong Sezza! The speed shown on Flighttracker is airspeed, in knots, as measured by the pitot/static system of the aircraft and relayed, by telemetry to FT.

 

Ground speed is a measurement of the aircraft's progress over the ground and is not always the same as airspeed. During the aircraft's final decent, the 'groundspeed' would in fact have been just about zero.

 

When the aircraft pitched down it began to increase in speed. No surprise there, it was trading lift for speed and thus accelerating. It reached a terminal velocity of 590kn at 7,850ft and then began to slow down again as it came into denser air. Impact speed was 370kn 

[Moonlover]

8 hours ago, pacovl46 said:

Terminal velocity...

Impact velocity. which was 370 knots. Terminal velocity (the highest) was 590 knots.

[bunnydrops]

It seems people keep missin g that the plane pulled out and regained some altitude before the final plunge. Someone got control for a short time.

[Will B Good]

Just now, bunnydrops said:

It seems people keep missin g that the plane pulled out and regained some altitude before the final plunge. Someone got control for a short time.

One suicidal pilot and one with a thirst for life?

[Paul Kernell]

On 3/26/2022 at 6:19 AM, 4MyEgo said:

Having all of those planes around the world sitting idle has made me weary of flying for at least a year to allow those cobwebs to clear up, so to speak.

 

Now that they have found the 2nd black box, hopefully the cause can be revealed and not covered up like Malaysian flight MH370.

 

RIP to all on board.

 

MH 370 went to Diego Garcia, 

[stratocaster]

There have previously been three proven similar accident scenarios involving 737's.

Hijacker entered cockpit and shot pilot and co-pilot

Short circuit in wiring harness caused thrust reversers to deploy in mid flight.

A wrongly assembled elevater servo motor jammed in the maximum nose down position.

 

A major safety concern with the 737 class is that it  still uses  steel cables to activate the control surface hydraulic servo motors. Even the 737 max. This is termed a single point failure and is one of the few commercial aircraft to be certified with such. To refit the class with a two point of failure system ie. fly by wire, or double cable would have involved re certificating the fuselage.

[stoutfella]

On 3/26/2022 at 5:43 AM, mbenson said:

Saving face for the Chinese. The way the Chinese plane fell from the sky, experts suspect terrorism. So, yeah blame it on the American plane. The plane (737-800) that crashed in China is not the same one that had the two crashes (737 Max) that required the plane to be taken off the market.

But I do believe that the 737NG series, which includes the 737-800, has known and reported problems.

[Stargeezr]

Considering there was no communications from this jet liner, makes me think that something

serious happened to knock out the ability for the pilots to communicate. I do hope that the flight data recorder 

will give good data. If a voice recorder is also located at the tail end of the aircraft, then we may get some

date. It sounded like  the one black box they found was very damaged, so hope they can still get the data.

  It was a tragic crash.

[Liverpool Lou]

18 hours ago, pacovl46 said:

20 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Of course, there's always the possibility that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Of course there's also always the possibility that you're pompous! 

Of course, there's always the much more likely possibility that I'm correct and you just didn't like having it pointed out!

[Andrew65]

"If the crash doesn't kill the pilot, the inquiry will".

[Moonlover]

2 hours ago, bunnydrops said:

It seems people keep missin g that the plane pulled out and regained some altitude before the final plunge. Someone got control for a short time.

The same happened to Egyptair 990 in 1999. which was attributed to a tussle for control between 2 of the crew members. I already suspected that this latest incident was a deliberate act and that glitch in the dive does give my suspicion some credence.

 

Anyway they have found the CVR so all may be revealed soon.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EgyptAir_Flight_990

[Ralf001]

53 minutes ago, stoutfella said:

But I do believe that the 737NG series, which includes the 737-800, has known and reported problems.

Total of 13 fatal flights killing 786 people since the 737-800 NG started flying.

 

Known problem appears to being able to not kill passengers and flight crew !!

[peter zwart]

Are we reaching the point where we no longer select by price, but whether they use Boeing planes?
 

Edited March 27, 2022 by peter zwart

[ozfarang]

1 hour ago, stoutfella said:

But I do believe that the 737NG series, which includes the 737-800, has known and reported problems.

What are the reported problems, do tell

 

 

[ozfarang]

35 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

Total of 13 fatal flights killing 786 people since the 737-800 NG started flying.

 

Known problem appears to being able to not kill passengers and flight crew !!

Pilot error appears to be a cause in some of these accidents, nothing to do with the aircraft

Edited March 27, 2022 by ozfarang

[Ralf001]

1 minute ago, ozfarang said:

Pilot error appears to be a cause in some of these accidents, nothing to do with the aircraft

the plane is the common denominator.

[Moonlover]

1 hour ago, stoutfella said:

But I do believe that the 737NG series, which includes the 737-800, has known and reported problems.

I  don't know where you're getting your ideas from but this article disagrees with you.

 

'The NG has one of the best safety records among all aircraft, with just 11 fatal accidents out of more than 7,000 planes delivered since 1997'.

 

https://www.livemint.com/news/world/boeing-737-800-jet-has-good-safety-record-but-crashed-a-few-times-full-list-11647879049037.html

 

 

[ozfarang]

7 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

the plane is the common denominator.

No, the pilots are the common denominator.

 

Research the cause of the 13 fatal B737/600/700/800/900 accidents 

[Heng]

As in my choice of seafood restaurants, I prefer airlines that are financially solvent when safety is a consideration.   

[billd766]

On 3/26/2022 at 9:02 AM, WingFat said:

And of course, the Chinese pilots are fully competent and China Eastern Airlines kept up with the required maintenance of these airplanes...yeah right, B***S***. I've flown China Eastern Airlines before years ago...and decided never will I do again.

Naturally you have the links to prove this, or are we supposed to take the word of an internet thread poster as gospel?