Opinion: American and western arrogance will lose this region to China’s influence

[webfact]

 

By Cod Satrusayang

 

There have been many editorials on the pages of this outlet dedicated to countering, exposing, and shedding light on China’s increasing influence in South East Asia and the Asia Pacific region.

 

For the past ten years, Beijing has courted, bribed, invested, and threatened their way into domestic political conversations from Bangkok to Tokyo, from Seoul to Yangon. Like it or not, the region now lives under the shadow of Beijings growing military and economic might.

 

The west has looked on with alarm as Beijing’s Belt and Road Initiative snares one country after another while its Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank now rivals the IMF and the World Bank prestige and credit.

 

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Yet despite its anxiety at China’s growing might, the “west” (if there is such a thing anymore) continues to mismanage its Far East policy and continues to lose influence and prestige among leaders in the region.

 

Take Thailand for example, years of neglect by Washington and her allies have ensured that today’s batch of leaders look to Beijing for investment, military equipment, and direction. 

 

Full story: https://www.thaienquirer.com/38945/opinion-american-and-western-arrogance-will-lose-this-region-to-chinas-influence/

 

-- © Copyright Thai Enquirer 2022-03-28

 

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[Pattaya Spotter]

I wouldn't call it "arrogance" that is costing Western influence to decline in Asia/SE Asia...more a combination of incompetent (President Obama did nothing to counter Beijing while it built-up its militarized "string of pearls" in the South China Sea during his administration) and China resuming its historical place as the dominant economic and political power in the region.

[mokwit]

He makes some very good points, but even without neglect/utter stupidity be e.g. Obama , China is going to make it very clear that they are either aligned with it/buy only from it or they will be seen as something akin to an enemy. Thailand thinks it will play them both, IMO it won't, it will have to choose. The Chinese believe themselves to have dominion over all Chinese descended "black haired" peoples.

 

I think what the Thais don't understand is that SE Asia is no longer strategically important in the way it was in The Vietnam war era. The Thais IMO are using that outdated interest as their reference point and not understanding why it won't continue.

[Zozod]

That’s a tough one.  China’s wuhan virus, Russia’s nuclear threat or the “arrogance” of the West.  Decisions, decisions.   
 

But, seriously, who cares.  SE Asian countries are all little China puppets anyway.  

Edited March 28, 2022 by Zozod

[Excel]

"Take Thailand for example, years of neglect by Washington and her allies have ensured that today’s batch of leaders look to Beijing for investment, military equipment, and direction. "

 

I would suggest that is not correct. It is more likely that as the US and the Western nations have cracked down on bribe paying and other corrupt financial activities over the years, Thailand and it's corrupt leaders have gone elsewhere where dodgy deals and back-handers can be undertaken. Nothing to do with neglect by the West, but everything to do with Thailand's regime leaders and benefactors lining their own pockets without ethical or moral considerations.

[Credo]

26 minutes ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

I wouldn't call it "arrogance" that is costing Western influence to decline in Asia/SE Asia...more a combination of incompetent (President Obama did nothing to counter Beijing while it built-up its militarized "string of pearls" in the South China Sea during his administration) and China resuming its historical place as the dominant economic and political power in the region.

Well, there was a president after Obama who did even less.  

 

It's pretty hard to compete when you have a powerful neighbor right next door.  It's always a wise idea to stay on their good side.  

[MyFriend You]

American and western arrogance

 

Yeah, it's all our fault, it was America that released the Corona Virus, and China saved the world by creating a vaccine.............who writes this crapola......

 

when will Thailand realize China never does anything for 'nothing'  there will always be a price to pay............soon menu prices will be in Yuan and Baht.   Thailand  wise up, you will reap what you sow.   Peace

[Pattaya Spotter]

18 minutes ago, Credo said:

Well, there was a president after Obama who did even less. 

After the eight years of incompetence, it was too late...a fait accompli.

Edited March 28, 2022 by Pattaya Spotter

[ftpjtm]

1 hour ago, webfact said:

It should be noted that the Chinese government were the first to provide Covid-related aid to Thailand and readily supplied us with our first batches of vaccines at a time when the United States was busy hoarding its share and shutting out the rest of the world

That's not the way I remember it. 

 

I remember private hospitals begging the Thai government to sign off on their purchases of western vaccines and the government refusing until there was a huge public uproar over the local company's inability to make AstraZeneca in quantity and the Thai medical community's insistence the Sinovac, which the rest of the world shunned, was effective. 

 

I also remember the Thai government not receiving western vaccines as quickly as other countries in the region because they chose not to join COVAC.

 

Meanwhile, as the rest of the world is moving forward, China is afraid to open their country because they refused to use Western vaccines and the home brew is so ineffective. 

[bkk6060]

China's big influence on Cambodia worked well, so it should work the same here.

[Iamfalang]

America is NOT on the border to all these countries.  Who wrote this comedy?  Should be in the jokes section.

 

Mexico will not bow to China, but America instead.    Wow!!!!    Canada will be owned by America, not China.  Wow!!

 

1 million people still in camps, likely more.   China backs Russia and their senseless war.   China would give me a negative 100 social score for this one post.   then i can't fly, eat, talk to friends.   sound like fun?  

 

China cracks down, America allows guy/girls to be binary something and whatever.    America broadcasts the race riots, China won't allow one twitter post against the narrative.

 

plus, how many Chinese movies do you watch?  Chinese music?  Fashion?   

 

could go on forever....

[Dcheech]

1 hour ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

President Obama did nothing to counter Beijing while it built-up its militarized "string of pearls" in the South China Sea during his administration

They shocked me also. Obama cared more about the wall street implosion disaster and the end game of Weapons of Mass Destruction Iraqi desert invasion fiasco, than countering China.

Just what was that guy thinking?!  

[ftpjtm]

5 minutes ago, Dcheech said:

They shocked me also. Obama cared more about the wall street implosion disaster and the end game of Weapons of Mass Destruction Iraqi desert invasion fiasco, than countering China.

Just what was that guy thinking?!  

While there's a lot of truth to that, Obama's plan to reign in China economically was his proposed TPP free trade zone. Trump killing that off didn't help prospects for increased trade in the region. 

 

But the elephant in the room is democracy. The west didn't embrace the coup leaders in Thailand, and China was happy to. Same is true of all of China’s closest allies in the region and world. 

[Enzian]

History. I hate to think what Thailand would be like now without the past 200 years of Chinese economic imperialism and influence. One out of every 6 Thais have a significant if not majority element of Chinese background. American culture will continue to be important, but this is Chinese country in some ways, maybe just not as much as Singapore for example.

[Misterwhisper]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

For the past ten years, Beijing has courted, bribed, invested, and threatened their way into domestic political conversations

There is your answer. China's growing influence has preciously little to do with "western arrogance".

 

Southeast Asia simply does no longer hold the strategic value it once had for "the West". Instead, thanks to its rapidly growing economic and financial means (and yes, its unashamed bullying, too!), it is only natural for China to strive and "keep her own front yard tidy, in line and under control" -- just as much as the U.S. is doing precisely the same with the Central and Caribbean countries (and Canada, LOL). As per Europe... forget Europe. It has become a toothless paper tiger due to the corrosive influence of the increasingly autocratic EU. European nations struggle against their very own, entirely home-made economic demons at the moment and couldn't care less about what is going on in Southeast Asia -- as long as frozen Thai chicken and prawns remain reasonably cheap, that is. Secondly, impotent Europe has foolishly brought HERSELF under the sway of China. Look around in European stores and realize where practically every other product indeed comes from. Heck, when you purchase a Mercedes-Benz these days, you cannot even be sure anymore whether it has actually been assembled in Germany.  

[CrunchWrapSupreme]

2 hours ago, ftpjtm said:

I remember private hospitals begging the Thai government to sign off on their purchases of western vaccines

Indeed. The Thonburi Hospital CEO had the orders and cash ready for that huge shipment of Moderna many are still waiting for. Yet Moderna doesn't give backhanders like the Chinese do, something concerning the Thai govt more than actually receiving quality vaccine. They just love those backhanders, as much as Mr. P loves smiling for the cameras holding up those boxes of Sinovac, knowing that they mean more cash in his and his buddies' pockets.

[sharecropper]

That cretin Trump didn't help by pulling the US out of the TPP on his first day. The damage that idiot did to US interests around the world was incalculable.

[pokerface1]

3 hours ago, Excel said:

Nothing to do with neglect by the West, but everything to do with Thailand's regime leaders and benefactors lining their own pockets without ethical or moral considerations.

Was there ever a time when business was do any other way in Asian countries. I think not. If the west  want to compete they have to play the same game and fill the brown paper envelopes to seal the deals.

[friendofthai]

I can't register an account in Sina Weibo in Thailand. Chinese phone number is needed for it. Everyone is using Facebook instead. That means Thai people will think that America is good and China is bad. To reverse the situation, it is necessary to ban Facebook and allow registration at Sina Weibo.

Edited March 28, 2022 by friendofthai

[ftpjtm]

1 hour ago, Enzian said:

History. I hate to think what Thailand would be like now without the past 200 years of Chinese economic imperialism and influence. One out of every 6 Thais have a significant if not majority element of Chinese background. American culture will continue to be important, but this is Chinese country in some ways, maybe just not as much as Singapore for example.

It would be nice if Thailand followed Singapore's example of celebrating their Chinese cultural heritage while rejecting the current Chinese authoritarian tendencies of stifling free speech and banning political opposition. 

[SatEng]

We are in a bipolar world now - a new cold war. On one side will be the Sino-russians and in the other side will US,UK,Europe,Australia,New Zealand,Canada,Japan and S. Korea.

Thailand and other Asean countries are minor concerns -and it will just be a tug-of-war -the main concern will not be which way Thailand goes but which way India goes.

[spidermike007]

4 hours ago, Excel said:

"Take Thailand for example, years of neglect by Washington and her allies have ensured that today’s batch of leaders look to Beijing for investment, military equipment, and direction. "

 

I would suggest that is not correct. It is more likely that as the US and the Western nations have cracked down on bribe paying and other corrupt financial activities over the years, Thailand and it's corrupt leaders have gone elsewhere where dodgy deals and back-handers can be undertaken. Nothing to do with neglect by the West, but everything to do with Thailand's regime leaders and benefactors lining their own pockets without ethical or moral considerations.

Alot of truth to that. And the US could be doing alot more. Questionable foreign policy under Obama. Horrific foreign policy under Trump. He strengthened China's influence to no end. And Biden? Very unimpressed, though preferable to Trump. The US seems a bit lost, and on the decline. 

 

Other than countering China, Thailand is becoming less relevant as each year passes. And it is hard to cozy up to a highly corrupt, hugely incompetent, paranoid and morally bankrupt army junta. Though it would not be the first time for the US. 

Edited March 28, 2022 by spidermike007

[timendres]

4 hours ago, ftpjtm said:

That's not the way I remember it. 

 

I remember private hospitals begging the Thai government to sign off on their purchases of western vaccines and the government refusing until there was a huge public uproar over the local company's inability to make AstraZeneca in quantity and the Thai medical community's insistence the Sinovac, which the rest of the world shunned, was effective. 

 

I also remember the Thai government not receiving western vaccines as quickly as other countries in the region because they chose not to join COVAC.

 

Meanwhile, as the rest of the world is moving forward, China is afraid to open their country because they refused to use Western vaccines and the home brew is so ineffective. 

I remember photos of Chinese citizens queued up at Suvanabhumi with mountains of PPE being flown back to China.

[MasterBaker]

i think China's influence is better than American's. especially with potato head running the show in Washington

[sandyf]

5 hours ago, mokwit said:

I think what the Thais don't understand is that SE Asia is no longer strategically important in the way it was in The Vietnam war era. The Thais IMO are using that outdated interest as their reference point and not understanding why it won't continue.

What you do not understand is what the Thais understand.

What the Thais understand is that in the 30's about 12% of the people in Thailand were Chinese nationals and a significant percentage of today's population are of Chinese descent.  Nothing whatsoever to do with the west or their arrogance, it is a cultural affiliation, something difficult for foreigners to understand.

[IAMHERE]

Not sure I want Thailand as a 'Friend' anyway. The only reason would be if you (USA) wanted to put boots on the ground in Asia, again. Better to blow the whole place up than get bogged down in another land war in Asia. Or just get the heck out, its all Chinese DNA anyway; belongs to them. Never gonna win or be buddies with SEA; better to use time money effort where you have a chance of a return.

[sandyf]

5 hours ago, ftpjtm said:

That's not the way I remember it. 

You can remember it any way you want, doesn't make it right.

The first vaccines into Thailand were AZ from South Korea in Feb 2021, followed by the Chinese.

The Thai government didn't get their order for AZ because of a dispute between the UK and EU, the order was diverted to India but got caught up in an export ban. In the end they had to wait for the Thai production facility to start up in June 2021.

COVAX wouldn't have made any difference, GDP was too high to be at the front of the queue and at that point in time the only vaccine COVAX had available was the Chinese.

[JonnyF]

Nothing to do with arrogance. The Thai leaders will make more personal gain by dealing with China than dealing with the West. They both do business the same way, corruptly. Prayut aspires to be "leader for life" like Xi. They both have disdain for human rights and Democracy. They're like 2 peas in a pod.

 

At his point, Thailand (under the current regime) choosing China over the West is a compliment to The West.

[ftpjtm]

12 minutes ago, sandyf said:

You can remember it any way you want, doesn't make it right.

 

The first vaccines into Thailand were AZ from South Korea in Feb 2021

Then I guess we can agree that the paragraph I quoted from the OP was factually incorrect. 

 

And saying US vaccines didn't come because of hoarding is a misrepresentation of reality when the Thai government themselves delayed the first doses of US vaccines by months when they refused to allow them to be imported. 

Edited March 28, 2022 by ftpjtm

[klauskunkel]

7 hours ago, webfact said:

For the past ten years, Beijing has courted, bribed, invested, and threatened their way

 

Take Thailand for example, years of neglect by Washington and her allies have ensured that today’s batch of leaders look to Beijing for investment, military equipment, and direction. 

My suggestion to the author:

Maybe it's time to change your current "batch of leaders" to those who can't be bought, flattered and intimidated. Just a thought.