Lady wants justice from car manufacturer - they damaged her car not once but TWICE!

[Liverpool Lou]

21 hours ago, kevc said:

I wouldn't accept it being bodged up

Who would, but where has it been suggested that the repair would be "bodged up"?

[Liverpool Lou]

15 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

How about a loan vehicle while this one is in the shop for months.... she only took it in for a service?

I'd agree with that, except that it shouldn't take months to repair.  On this occasion, when she left the car with them it was for a body repair, not a service.

[CharlieH]

Reported post with insult has been edited.

[vinny41]

1 hour ago, Longwood50 said:

Do you secretly work for Joe Biden as his speech writer. 

You have two cars both identical mileage identical condition. One has been in an accident and repaired, the other has never been in an accident and the price is the same.  WHICH ONE DO YOU PURCHASE

The fact that the damaged one is repaired at a dealer versus non dealer shop is irrelevant. 

In your opinion it might be irrelevant to someone that buys used vehicles such as a car dealer or part exchange at  a brand dealership it is relevant 

they would see the car that has been in an accident and repaired they should be able to negotiate a higher discount likewise a car that has been in an accident and repaired using a non dealer repair shop and using questionable parts depending on their business is likely to decline making an offer 

[Ralf001]

On 8/16/2022 at 8:46 PM, Longwood50 said:

Irrespective of how well the repair shop can repair the car it is now a repaired vehicle.  The value of her car went down.  Also from the pictures this is not a door dent.  It appears the car suffered significant damage.  I would not want it back after being repaired.  She also faces the liklihood that even after repairs she will have to go back to correct whatever defects remain after the repair.  Hard to get a badly damaged car with all the defects correct the first time. 

Bottom line, she entrusted them with a car that had zero damage.  She is owed back a car with zero damage.  There should not be a problem locating a virtually identical car with the same or lower mileage and for the dealership to repair the car and sell it.  They will then take the loss in value rather than her. 

 

No repaired data base and certainly no salvage title or anything like that.

That car will 100% be repaired if the costs are less than the insurance write off value.

 

The dealership locating a virtually identical car with the same or lower mileage really is a non starter as they may unwittingly give her one that is a repaired vehicle that suffered same or worse damage.

[ThailandRyan]

2 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

What's that got to do with it?     But if they were both in "identical condition", it, obviously, would not make any difference as they would both be in identical condition!

Yet they won't be in identical condition because one would be original undamaged steel and the other highly repaired and parts replaced. It might look the same to you but it is not...

[ThailandRyan]

1 hour ago, Ralf001 said:

No repaired data base and certainly no salvage title or anything like that.

That car will 100% be repaired if the costs are less than the insurance write off value.

 

The dealership locating a virtually identical car with the same or lower mileage really is a non starter as they may unwittingly give her one that is a repaired vehicle that suffered same or worse damage.

To bad there is no such thing as CarFax here...

[Liverpool Lou]

1 hour ago, ThailandRyan said:

4 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

What's that got to do with it?     But if they were both in "identical condition", it, obviously, would not make any difference as they would both be in identical condition!

Yet they won't be in identical condition because one would be original undamaged steel and the other highly repaired

In that case they would not be identical!   He referred to identical cars.

Edited August 18, 2022 by Liverpool Lou

[Longwood50]

3 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

No repaired data base and certainly no salvage title or anything like that.

Well the insurance industry disagrees with you.  I know I had just a door replaced and got a brand new door, repaired at an Authorized BMW repair facility and got an extra $500 just by asking.  I would have fought for more, but I was in the process of moving here to Thailand.  I know this, if I was searching for a car, and it was determined the car was in an accident, I would either not purchase the car or ask for a significant discount.  With repaired cars no matter "how well" you "think" the repairs are they really are an unknown so the car loses value. 

 

[Longwood50]

4 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

What's that got to do with it?     But if they were both in "identical condition", it, obviously, would not make any difference as they would both be in identical condition!

No, the fact is that the car in "identical condition" that has not been repaired is worth more than the one that has. 

[Longwood50]

3 hours ago, vinny41 said:

In your opinion it might be irrelevant to someone that buys used vehicles such as a car dealer or part exchange at  a brand dealership it is relevant 

No "not my opinion" the opinion of the insurance industry.  Even for the car that has been repaired the owner has suffered a loss because the resale value is less.  I personally have gotten a payment above the repair, plus loaner car for a door that had to be replaced.  Not even remotely the damage done to this persons vehicle.  I know personally if I had a car that had been in an accident, I either would not purchase it, or I would ask for a bigger discount.   The quality of the repair is an unknown hence buyers will ask for a discount. 

[NanLaew]

On 8/16/2022 at 6:59 PM, Rampant Rabbit said:

I kept the letter  to this  day.

Can you post it here? I'm keen on seeing what a "beautifully written reply" looks like.

[timberpond]

I'm no car expert but do maintain a small fleet of mobile machinery. By the look of that car, it will not come back to it's original condition. The way the door closes and the tires/bearing wears, etc... 

 

They should agreed as insurance would covered 60% of the value top up the balance 40% give her a new car and keep the service center/brand's reputations. 200k baht... I have nothing against Nissan but after this incident, I would advise anyone to stay away from Nissan Thailand.    

 

 

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, Longwood50 said:

No "not my opinion" the opinion of the insurance industry.  Even for the car that has been repaired the owner has suffered a loss because the resale value is less.  I personally have gotten a payment above the repair, plus loaner car for a door that had to be replaced.  Not even remotely the damage done to this persons vehicle.  I know personally if I had a car that had been in an accident, I either would not purchase it, or I would ask for a bigger discount.   The quality of the repair is an unknown hence buyers will ask for a discount. 

The opinion of the Thai insurance industry? Your new door + 500 bucks was here?

 

I learned a few years back that here in Thailand, there's usually no difference between the 'dealer-only or 'any garage' repair options in your insurance. The dealerships generally don't have in-house body shops and they take 'dealer-only' covered cars to to be repaired in the same pool of body shops that they take 'any garage' covered cars to. They sit side by side being worked on by the same artisans and, if you're not careful, used or 'recovered' parts will be the first option on any repair regardless of any higher premium paid. The insurance company's and the body shop's primary business is to earn their shareholders money/make profit so it's very important that you closely inspect any repairs before signing off.

 

In my instance, I spotted the recovered parts, around 15,000 baht total for new equivalents and refused to sign off. I did raise this with the insurance company with the suggestion that maybe the Thai insurance ombudsman would be interested but they didn't need the big stick. Subsequently, they contacted the dealership to order the new parts and the body shop kept the truck a week longer and replaced the recovered parts with the new ones. Everyone happy.

 

Back on topic: it's still a p*ssing contest between insurance companies and with the revelation that a third-party's speeding pickup was what caused the damage after the dealership had fulfilled their repair work commitment and were collecting the car, there's now another couple of insurance companies trying to minimize their losses: that of the pickup, the other car involved, the unfortunate car owner's and the unlucky dealerships.

 

She's not entitled to a new car but this being Thailand and 'face' being a big thing, someone may blink, especially with the media coverage.

Edited August 18, 2022 by NanLaew

[Ralf001]

6 hours ago, Longwood50 said:

Well the insurance industry disagrees with you.  I know I had just a door replaced and got a brand new door, repaired at an Authorized BMW repair facility and got an extra $500 just by asking.  I would have fought for more, but I was in the process of moving here to Thailand. 

Insurance industry where, Thailand or ?

 

 

[jacko45k]

14 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

I'd agree with that, except that it shouldn't take months to repair.  On this occasion, when she left the car with them it was for a body repair, not a service.

Who knows, when I got rammed from behind it was 4 weeks plus....and a friend with a damaged Toyota was waiting on parts for two months with the dealer. The reason for this particular body repair, was damage caused by the shop.... it all started with a service and through no fault of her own, she is still without a vehicle. To say this is 'not a service' as if to apportion blame to her in any way is barefaced nonsense. Her claim for a brand new car is unreasonable.... but she has certainly been poorly treated. Who on earth does this garage employ, they need to get a good driver to move vehicles around. 

Edited August 18, 2022 by jacko45k

[PremiumLane]

20 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

No one gets a new car to replace  damaged old one, doesn't matter what you'd be demanding, insurance does not work that way.   You'd be "taking it there" also.

They should if it a) wasn't your fault b) it devalues the car c) it causes structural issues

 

Strange hill to die on, championing the corporate company, go figure

[Liverpool Lou]

1 hour ago, PremiumLane said:

21 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

No one gets a new car to replace  damaged old one, doesn't matter what you'd be demanding, insurance does not work that way.   You'd be "taking it there" also.

They should if it a) wasn't your fault b) it devalues the car c) it causes structural issues

 

Strange hill to die on, championing the corporate company, go figure

You think that they should. There's no rational reason that an accident damaged old car should be replaced by a brand new one.  No insurers, anywhere do that, insurers obligations are to put the policy holder in back to the position their car was before the accident (or pay write-off compensation of the car's value before the accident or agreed value), not to put them in a better position. 

 

If, say, a five-year old car was written off do you really think that the owner should be given a brand new car despite the fact that the insurance policy does not provide that cover? 

 

Strange hill to die on, championing irrationality.

[PremiumLane]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

You think that they should. There's no rational reason that an accident damaged old car should be replaced by a brand new one.  No insurers, anywhere do that, insurers obligations are to put the policy holder in back to the position their car was before the accident (or pay write-off compensation of the car's value before the accident or agreed value), not to put them in a better position. 

 

If, say, a five-year old car was written off do you really think that the owner should be given a brand new car despite the fact that the insurance policy does not provide that cover? 

 

Strange hill to die on, championing irrationality.

not up to the insurers though is it, the dealership is liable. Don't know why this is so hard for you to understand - they f^cked her car, they should pay for it. 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

10 minutes ago, PremiumLane said:

not up to the insurers though is it, the dealership is liable. Don't know why this is so hard for you to understand - they f^cked her car, they should pay for it. 

They have offered to pay for the car's repair!   

[Ralf001]

2 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

You think that they should. There's no rational reason that an accident damaged old car should be replaced by a brand new one.  No insurers, anywhere do that,

 

Insurers is Australia do.

https://www.suncorp.com.au/learn-about/my-car/new-for-old-car-replacement.html

[jacko45k]

43 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

They have offered to pay for the car's repair!   

Give it a week, they might hit it with another car yet!

[Liverpool Lou]

2 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

5 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

You think that they should. There's no rational reason that an accident damaged old car should be replaced by a brand new one.  No insurers, anywhere do that,

 

Expand  

Insurers is Australia do.

https://www.suncorp.com.au/learn-about/my-car/new-for-old-car-replacement.html

Yes, but it's not a standard policy.  I'm sure there may be Thai insurers that will offer that type of cover for the extra premium involved and sure as shiit the woman involved won't have one.  My comments on this thread have referred to "normal" policies.

[Ralf001]

3 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Yes, but it's not a standard policy.  I'm sure there may be Thai insurers that will offer that type of cover for the extra premium involved and sure as shiit the woman involved won't have one.  My comments on this thread have referred to "normal" policies.

Doubt there is any Thai insurers that would do it.

 

Its common amongst most Aus inurers though.

 

I only mention it as your post I qouted implies it is not a thing anywhere in the world.

[vinny41]

Happy ending for the car owner

1. A new car, Nissan brand, Almera 1.0 V Turbo (MY 2022), which he can pay in installments for this car in the 17th installment until the end of the contract at the original price of the lost car. go

2.Save Safe Platinum Package 5 years and Extended Warranty 2 years for new cars.

https://www.khaosod.co.th/around-thailand/news_7220416

[Longwood50]

13 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

Insurance industry where, Thailand or ?

I don't know if Thailand insurance pays for diminished value or not in the USA they do.  One way or another common sense says if a buyer is looking at two cars, identical in all respects except one has been in an accident and the other is factory original if the price is the same, you are going to take the one that has never been damaged. 

That is no different than if you have two brand new items but one is a floor sample, and the other in the box, you expect some sort of a discount for the fact the package has been open.  But with an accident, it can look repaired but no matter how good the repair is, it will never be the same as if it has never been damaged.  Then there is the unknown factor.  The buyer not being able to ascertain how well the repairs have been made will demand a discount to offset the uncertainty. 
 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

2 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

Doubt there is any Thai insurers that would do it.

 

Its common amongst most Aus inurers though.

 

I only mention it as your post I qouted implies it is not a thing anywhere in the world.

In my posts I did refer to "normal" policies a couple of times and also to agreed values.  Normal car insurance policies aren't new for old.

[Ralf001]

1 hour ago, Longwood50 said:

I don't know if Thailand insurance pays for diminished value or not in the USA they do.  
 

 

Ahh you are comparing to USA.... explains your posts.

 

USA is not relevant in Thailand.

[Ralf001]

34 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

In my posts I did refer to "normal" policies a couple of times and also to agreed values.  Normal car insurance policies aren't new for old.

They "normal' in Aus.. Hence I was replying to this part "No insurers, anywhere do that" of your post.

[Longwood50]

1 minute ago, Ralf001 said:

USA is not relevant in Thailand.

Oh so a damaged car in the USA is different than a damaged car in Thailand.  WOW who could have guessed.