Breakdown and deterioration of materials.

[phetphet]

Talking about tyres ageing in another thread  got me thinking.

 

Has anyone else noticed how badly and quickly things seem to degrade here in Thailand? Mainly plastic and oil based materials. I'm not talking about solar  UV damage which is another problem. Many of these are items that have been kept in a drawer or cupboard in those sealed plastic storage boxes.

 

I am talking everything from casings of dive computers, Garmin GPS device, linings in backpacks, even the feet on my laptop protective case. some turn to powder, other to a sticky mush. The case on my hardly used Garmin Nuvo first turned sticky, and bits started falling off. Now it is covered in a white powder. I tried cleaning a small area with alcohol, but no joy.

 

The water resistant lining in my Osprey backpack started to break away in small, tea leaf like flakes.

 

Not sure what is causing it. Heat? Humidity? Does anyone know? Is there anything that can be done to avoid it? 

 

Keeping everything in a temperature and humidity controlled room is not really feasible.

 

See image of the black coming off my computer case feet at this moment:

 

 

 

Edited September 27, 2022 by phetphet

[warrima]

Yes I've had the same with lots of things.

 

Was gifted a nice pair of original trainers a few years ago and as i didn't need them straight away they were stored for a few years. First time i put them on and went somewhere they basically fell apart. All the glues and rubbers had turned to a sticky mess.

 

Also have a limited edition signed motorcycle helmet that i keep for display (Covered 95% of the time). All the rubber seal parts have perished and fell of in chunks or got sticky and oily. The neck lining has disintegrated like your backpack lining. Strangely the one i use everyday is fine. 

 

Always assumed its the humidity and high ambient heat as you can control the other things. 

 

 

[ThomasThBKK]

I think it's the humidity, even my loudspeakers degraded and my gfs leather bags got moldy when we weren't in our condo and the AC was off the whole time...

A fotographer friend has his equipment in a room with AC 24/7 here even when he's not in Thailand, else it just rots away...
 

 

 

[scubascuba3]

Occupational hazard of living here, annoying for sure. I've noticed the same IKEA furniture deteriorating far quicker here than in UK. Stainless steel rusts here also, i put it down to Chinese dumped steel but maybe it's just the climate 

[Aussieroaming]

Sounds a bit like what has happened to my body and hair over the last decade, everything breaking down or falling apart.

[sandyf]

4 hours ago, phetphet said:

Not sure what is causing it. Heat? Humidity? Does anyone know? Is there anything that can be done to avoid it? 

A lot of the plastic material in Thailand is produced with little or no plasticizer. This makes the material cheaper but a limited life span. Built in obsolescence may well be a commercial  decision.

Where the material is made to a standard, degradation may well be down to some other cause.

We have some old 25ltr paint pots that are been used as buckets and have been in use for longer than the 14 years I have been here. Washing up bowls and the like tend to go brittle and hardly last 2 years.

[sandyf]

4 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Stainless steel rusts here also, i put it down to Chinese dumped steel but maybe it's just the climate 

There is a type 430 stainless steel that has a ferritic content and that will rust, easily identified with a magnet.

Any of the austenitic stainless steel types will not rust whatever the climate.

[scubascuba3]

8 minutes ago, sandyf said:

There is a type 430 stainless steel that has a ferritic content and that will rust, easily identified with a magnet.

Any of the austenitic stainless steel types will not rust whatever the climate.

Things like bolts which are stainless steel all the same but one will rust, or even expensive bicycle fittings designed for outside use so shouldn't rust but they do sometimes, that's why I'm suspicious it's poor quality Chinese steel

[Iamfalang]

I agree, and then wonder if maybe what I thought was legit was fake....  probably real, not 100% sure.

 

Zippers lock up...... 

shoes are horrible here

jacket liners....yup, issues

most things will have to be replaced.....   buy used, if you can.

 

Just lower your expectations.......  i'd rather live in a humid place with this than Iceland with things staying pristine

 

i remember when bolts on my bicycle would snap off if I tried to tighten them just a little........more rust this year but bolts seem stronger.  lol.  

 

shoes are a lose-lose for sure

 

learning curve.....

 

 

 

[scubascuba3]

A couple of my plastic laundry baskets died after about 3 years, became really brittle. Also I've got a leather belt 30 years old, here goes mouldy, I've just treated it again

[richard_smith237]

Trainers !!... 

 

Use em or loose em... !!....  I’ve quite a few pairs of trainer of varying type and brands.

Some I don’t wear for over year - I put them on and they just fall apart. 

 

We have large a shoe cupboard which is outside, but under cover etc...  shoes in here get trashed if not worn regularly. 

Wife hates it, but I keep most of my decent footwear in the spare room because of this. 

 

I can go back to the UK and use the same pair of trainers kept there from 6 year ago !!!

 

Basically, anything rubber, plastic or foam type material degrades really quickly.

[scorecard]

2 hours ago, Aussieroaming said:

Sounds a bit like what has happened to my body and hair over the last decade, everything breaking down or falling apart.

Regular doses of VB is the answer.

[GroveHillWanderer]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

A lot of the plastic material in Thailand is produced with little or no plasticizer. This makes the material cheaper but a limited life span. Built in obsolescence may well be a commercial  decision.

Where the material is made to a standard, degradation may well be down to some other cause.

We have some old 25ltr paint pots that are been used as buckets and have been in use for longer than the 14 years I have been here. Washing up bowls and the like tend to go brittle and hardly last 2 years.

Items bought outside of Thailand deteriorate in just the same way as those bought here. My computer, various containers, bags, suitcases, pairs of trainers etc that we have brought from outside Thailand have all suffered the same sort of deterioration mentioned by others above.

Edited September 27, 2022 by GroveHillWanderer

[AsianAtHeart]

It is known that ozone (triple-bonded oxygen, i.e. O₃) will break down certain kinds of plastic, foam, and most especially rubber.  In areas of high traffic, ozone is one of the pollution products from vehicle traffic that can be residual in the air for awhile until it breaks down.  Being heavier than air (48 AMU vs. 28 for N₂, 32 for O₂, 44 for CO₂, etc.), it tends to settle (called ground-level ozone).  Rubber products tend to turn to mush in its presence; other products will break down in other ways.

 

Because of the chemistry involved, there is less ozone potential with proper pollution controls (e.g. use of a functional catalytic converter).  Such controls are not uniformly mandated in Thailand.  Draw your own conclusions.

 

 

Edited September 27, 2022 by AsianAtHeart

[sometimewoodworker]

3 hours ago, sandyf said:

A lot of the plastic material in Thailand is produced with little or no plasticizer. This makes the material cheaper but a limited life span

While that is an interesting idea and there may be some degree of truth there I have items that when in use in other countries with a different climate to Thailand have an extremely long lifespan, however in Thailand, and I don’t pretend to know the reasons, they crumble away, an example are the Festool sanding pads (not local, not built down to a price, certainly with normal amounts of plasticisers) they have a remarkably short lifespan. The same pads used in the U.K. or stored in Japan will ware out before breaking down.

[mania]

While I agree many things made in Thailand or "For Thai market" in China is very low quality I do not limit this condition to just those things.

 

I have had high quality leather dress shoes made in Europe just fall apart in a shoe cupboard after a year or two in Thailand. I mean I went to pick them up & the uppers just came off the soles

 

I think it is just the insane heat & humidity that destroys many things things in Thailand

[sandyf]

16 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Things like bolts which are stainless steel all the same but one will rust, or even expensive bicycle fittings designed for outside use so shouldn't rust but they do sometimes, that's why I'm suspicious it's poor quality Chinese steel

By definition rust can only occur where there is an Iron(ferritic) content.

Type 430 stainless steel, wherever it is produced has always been regarded as a poor quality stainless steel and cannot be used in certain environments such as medical and food.

[sandyf]

15 hours ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

Items bought outside of Thailand deteriorate in just the same way as those bought here. My computer, various containers, bags, suitcases, pairs of trainers etc that we have brought from outside Thailand have all suffered the same sort of deterioration mentioned by others above.

What are you trying to say?

That the Thais use the same amount of plasticizer as other countries.

[sandyf]

13 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

While that is an interesting idea and there may be some degree of truth there I have items that when in use in other countries with a different climate to Thailand have an extremely long lifespan, however in Thailand, and I don’t pretend to know the reasons, they crumble away, an example are the Festool sanding pads (not local, not built down to a price, certainly with normal amounts of plasticisers) they have a remarkably short lifespan. The same pads used in the U.K. or stored in Japan will ware out before breaking down.

What did you find difficult about this statement in my post?

"Where the material is made to a standard, degradation may well be down to some other cause."

[sometimewoodworker]

2 hours ago, sandyf said:

What did you find difficult about this statement in my post?

"Where the material is made to a standard, degradation may well be down to some other cause."

What do you find difficult about the specific quotation used and my response to that specific quotation, pointing out that high quality items rot in Thailand but not in more temperate climates 
 

I did not use the part of your post that you are now using. 

[Bluetongue]

I try to make things as airtight as possible, shoes are double bagged, golf clubs similar if not in use, things that are left out and not used go very quickly, I too had a good quality motorcycle helmet, boots and jackets when I first got here which I wasn't using and all the liners and softer bits decayed very quickly. Had the leathers all wrapped up and they were fine so I sold them after they'd been here 10 years.

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

 

I did not use the part of your post that you are now using. 

Quite, you truncated the post and went off at a tangent.

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

Quite, you truncated the post and went off at a tangent.

No tangent. The post topic is Breakdown and deterioration of materials. The post gives examples of items that breakdown here that do not breakdown in other climates.

 

I replied to a quoted part of your post. There is no obligation to quote and reply to all of a post. Though I didn’t “go of on a tangent” going of on tangents are  common features of fora like these.