How did President Zelensky get to Washington?

[radiochaser]

9 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Ummmm, not true, I believe Israel threatened Iraq in 1990 or thereabouts, and I believe India and Pakistan have used words in the 70's and 90's, but feel free to correct me.

 

You see to me there is a clear difference between words and actions, which brings me to Hiroshima and Nagasaki in Japan where you would be aware that two nuclear bombs were dropped 3 days apart from each other, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people, just trying to remember which country that was that used those action, not words, apart from a few leaflets they dropped over the cities beforehand.

As a sort of off topic response to your last paragraph ...

I used to know a woman that lived on the outskirts of Hiroshima when it was nuked.   She was 12 at the time.  I asked her what she thought about the U.S. bombing Hiroshima with a nuclear bomb.   

Her response did surprise me a little, "It was a war.  That's what happens in a war."

Hopefully, there will be no more nukes used in a war anywhere or any time again.   No fire bombing either.   War is enough of a horror as it is now!

[radiochaser]

8 hours ago, billd766 said:

Not really disgraceful in my eyes.

 

More par for the course for them.

 

In the UK they could well be described as "champagne socialists".

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champagne_socialist

 

Champagne socialist is a political term commonly used in the United Kingdom.[1][2] It is a popular epithet that implies a degree of hypocrisy, and it is closely related to the concept of the liberal elite.[3] The phrase is used to describe self-identified socialists whose luxurious upper class or "preppy" lifestyles, metonymically including consumption of champagne, are ostensibly in conflict with their political beliefs.

How can they be socialists if the left describes them as far right wingers?

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, radiochaser said:

How can they be socialists if the left describes them as far right wingers?

Easy. Many of the far right capitalize on their profits, and socialize their losses. Just ask Alex Jones. Or Trump.

Edited December 23, 2022 by Lacessit

[Lacessit]

9 hours ago, ed strong said:

A Man with my level of education! ????

Given the spelling and punctuation errors I've seen in a couple of your posts, permit me to doubt that.

[nauseus]

19 hours ago, billd766 said:

But it may have been Air Force 2, which is the VPs call sign when the VP is aboard.

 

However it could also have been any other aircraft of the  89th Airlift Wing aircraft, such as the Boeing C-40 Clipper, C-20B, C-37A, and C-37B, have also served in this role.

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Force_Two

 

Air Force Two is the air traffic control designated call sign held by any United States Air Force aircraft carrying the U.S. vice president, but not the president.[1][2] The term is often associated with the Boeing C-32, a modified 757 which is most commonly used as the vice president's transport. Other 89th Airlift Wing aircraft, such as the Boeing C-40 Clipper, C-20B, C-37A, and C-37B, have also served in this role.[3] The VC-25A, the aircraft most often used by the president as Air Force One, has also been used by the vice president as Air Force Two

US Air Force Boeing C-40B

[bendejo]

18 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Washington Post reporter Leigh Ann Caldwell tweeted: "During one standing ovation, Rep. Clyde (R-Ga.) was one of the few who didn't stand. When Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio) encouraged him to stand, Clyde seemed to mouth 'I'm not. I'm not,' while shaking his head."

As a public service for those who have trouble keeping track of the minor players, Andrew Clyde was one of the people barricading the doors of the House chamber on that day.  He was also the one who later described the redneck rampage as "well-behaved tourists." 

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2021/05/18/andrew-clyde-capitol-insurrection-photographer-tom-williams-newday-sot-vpx.cnn

Seems like ol' Clyde is living in fear of the Orange Countenance.  Or maybe he knows Jordan is a 2-faced bootlick.

 

 

 

Edited December 23, 2022 by bendejo

[4MyEgo]

4 hours ago, radiochaser said:

Hopefully, there will be no more nukes used in a war anywhere or any time again.   No fire bombing either.   War is enough of a horror as it is now!

Agree, but one really has to ask oneself, why, why was this war created and how was it all planned as most are, fact of the matter is most keyboard warriors here and people around the world just point fingers at Putin thinking he is the aggressor, typically from the mainstream media that is feeding them the information that the US and others want them fed, all they do is blame, blame, blame, but can't see it's big business for the US & others.

 

Watch this space, the US and it's pony's will walk away soon as they have made enough money out of this and Ukraine will fall back into the hands of Russia.

 

Tis is not new, it's business, they invest and they win, in some cases, they lose, it's a numbers game.

 

This has nothing to do with democracy, that is the blanket that is over everyone's heads, it's about the gas and the pipelines and now that the US has shored up contracts securing Europe nations, it's job is almost done, fact of the matter is, Zalenski smelt this and went to Washington to shore up more support.

 

Time will tell I am right, I'm content sitting here, and will be more content when what I am predicting happens, what then, will the keyboard warriors go quite, nope they will continue to be sucked into the finger pointing, the blame game, to which I will say, so long suckers.

[ozimoron]

14 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Agree, but one really has to ask oneself, why, why was this war created and how was it all planned as most are, fact of the matter is most keyboard warriors here and people around the world just point fingers at Putin thinking he is the aggressor, typically from the mainstream media that is feeding them the information that the US and others want them fed, all they do is blame, blame, blame, but can't see it's big business for the US & others.

 

Watch this space, the US and it's pony's will walk away soon as they have made enough money out of this and Ukraine will fall back into the hands of Russia.

 

Tis is not new, it's business, they invest and they win, in some cases, they lose, it's a numbers game.

 

This has nothing to do with democracy, that is the blanket that is over everyone's heads, it's about the gas and the pipelines and now that the US has shored up contracts securing Europe nations, it's job is almost done, fact of the matter is, Zalenski smelt this and went to Washington to shore up more support.

 

Time will tell I am right, I'm content sitting here, and will be more content when what I am predicting happens, what then, will the keyboard warriors go quite, nope they will continue to be sucked into the finger pointing, the blame game, to which I will say, so long suckers.

That's an easy one. Putin compared himself to Peter the Great and sought to create a legacy for himself. That's what happens when one man controls the nation as a fascist dictator.

[placeholder]

11 hours ago, Sydebolle said:

The US could not give a rats ....... about Zelensky. Yet, as the Ukraine's puppet since 2014, put in place by higher forces, he plays an important role in keeping NATO's interest focussed and under this preamble the "state visit" of the Ukrainian president is to be seen. 

If it is not NATO to sign the swindle sheet, then the American taxpayer will be entrusted with the coverage of this PR tour for sure. 

Unless you can name those "higher forces", there's every reason to believe that you've got nothing. Care to share a link with us all?

[Bkk Brian]

8 hours ago, ed strong said:

They weren't aloud to join as they have missed so many European Union, International Monetary Fund, and U.S. reform encouragements since 2014.

 

This is further undercut by the reality that Ukraine is not in control of all of its territory. Russia has annexed Crimea and supports separatist republics in the Donbas.

Can you provide a link for that? Particularly since they never even received a NATO Membership Action Plan, from there its still a 5 to 10 year process. It was not till 2021 at a Brussels summit that NATO leaders promised a MAP as an integral part of the process. However the Russian invasion started before that even got of the ground.

Ref's:

https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-is-ukraine-still-not-in-nato/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine–NATO_relations

 

You also missed completely the offer by Zelensky to commit to NOT joining NATO in return for peace talks, duly turned down by Putin. This was one month into the war, March 2022.

 

Zelensky says Ukraine prepared to discuss neutrality in peace talks

In nod to Russia, Ukraine says no longer insisting on NATO membership

Zelensky: We won’t join NATO if that brings peace

 

Anyone who thinks this was anything other than Putin's imperialist ambitions is obviously just reading RT NEWS

Edited December 24, 2022 by Bkk Brian

[Mad mick]

Flew by plane ???? 

[fredge45]

A/C pictured appears to be a C-40B - USAF version of the 737 Next Generation.

 

Sorry - no Air Force One or Two as neither the President nor the Vice-President was on board.

[blazes]

On 12/23/2022 at 9:06 AM, billd766 said:

But it may have been Air Force 2, which is the VPs call sign when the VP is aboard.

 

However it could also have been any other aircraft of the  89th Airlift Wing aircraft, such as the Boeing C-40 Clipper, C-20B, C-37A, and C-37B, have also served in this role.

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Force_Two

 

Air Force Two is the air traffic control designated call sign held by any United States Air Force aircraft carrying the U.S. vice president, but not the president.[1][2] The term is often associated with the Boeing C-32, a modified 757 which is most commonly used as the vice president's transport. Other 89th Airlift Wing aircraft, such as the Boeing C-40 Clipper, C-20B, C-37A, and C-37B, have also served in this role.[3] The VC-25A, the aircraft most often used by the president as Air Force One, has also been used by the vice president as Air Force Two

 

Yaaaawwnnnnnnn????????????

[blazes]

On 12/23/2022 at 11:08 AM, Bkk Brian said:

MAGA venom is real, the critical take on Zelensky is more than they've ever said about Putin. Even down to their criticisms of what Zelensky was wearing. Fox News and Tucker Carlson their favoured Putin apologist being featured heavily on Russian state TV.

 

https://twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1605927757770330114

 

Carlson  is the ONLY anchor on the MSM who asks difficult questions, who does not sing from the same hymn-sheet as all the other bleating sheep toeing the party line.  Watching American news tv, you might as well be in the old Soviet Union.  It's actually quite alarming to hear all that unified bleating.

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, blazes said:

Carlson  is the ONLY anchor on the MSM who asks difficult questions, who does not sing from the same hymn-sheet as all the other bleating sheep toeing the party line.  Watching American news tv, you might as well be in the old Soviet Union.  It's actually quite alarming to hear all that unified bleating.

Carlson sings from the far right hymn sheet. He's far from some independent thinker.

[blazes]

On 12/23/2022 at 11:11 AM, Slip said:

Tug, I saw just now on twitter he's already back in Poland.

Aw, shucks, isn't that great....Zelynski made it back safe and sound.  He's got to be the smartest politician around: he's extracted, so far, 100 Billion dollars from the US taxpayer.  Nice one. Great news for democracy....

[blazes]

On 12/23/2022 at 12:00 PM, Phoenix Rising said:

This individual and his followers bring a new dimension to the term despicable.

Sad, sad, sad.  There's none so blind as those who cannot see.

[ozimoron]

5 minutes ago, blazes said:

Aw, shucks, isn't that great....Zelynski made it back safe and sound.  He's got to be the smartest politician around: he's extracted, so far, 100 Billion dollars from the US taxpayer.  Nice one. Great news for democracy....

Where's your link?

[wwest5829]

On 12/23/2022 at 8:56 AM, habuspasha said:

Looks like Air Force One in the photo.

Maybe Air Force 2. Air Force One is a 747.

[blazes]

On 12/23/2022 at 3:07 PM, rudi49jr said:

Apparently, Lauren Boebert and Matt Gaetz didn’t stand up and applaud either. And Marjorie Taylor Green and Josh Hawley didn’t even bother showing up. Disgraceful, to say the least.

Such naughty boys and girls.  This  kind of  "watchfulness" is right out of Orwell and also reminds me of some schoolteachers whose day was perfect when they could put in detention those who tried to defy convention in some way.

 

At the end of the day, nothing is more cringeworthy than watching a roomful of grown-ups (over 400 of them) rising as (nearly) one to applaud whatever lies are being spouted at that particular moment. 

Shameful picture of a debased civilization.

[rudi49jr]

12 minutes ago, blazes said:

Aw, shucks, isn't that great....Zelynski made it back safe and sound.  He's got to be the smartest politician around: he's extracted, so far, 100 Billion dollars from the US taxpayer.  Nice one. Great news for democracy....

Indeed, nice one, and great news for democracy. If the USA and EU hadn’t helped Ukraine, Russia would now be knocking on the doors of the Baltic states, maybe eastern Poland and Hungary. So Ukraine, with the help of the West, is keeping the fascist dictator Putin and his cronies from achieving their goal of restoring the old USSR in all its old glory. I would say that is great news for democracy. 

[ozimoron]

Just now, blazes said:

Such naughty boys and girls.  This  kind of  "watchfulness" is right out of Orwell and also reminds me of some schoolteachers whose day was perfect when they could put in detention those who tried to defy convention in some way.

 

At the end of the day, nothing is more cringeworthy than watching a roomful of grown-ups (over 400 of them) rising as (nearly) one to applaud whatever lies are being spouted at that particular moment. 

Shameful picture of a debased civilization.

Most decent people will stand for any foreign leader addressing congress. That's the decent thing to do. They a re also on record claiming that Zelensky is a moocher (my words) or a welfare queen (Trump's words). You're trying to paint them as some kind of non conformists when they are just traitors.

[rudi49jr]

3 minutes ago, blazes said:

Such naughty boys and girls.  This  kind of  "watchfulness" is right out of Orwell and also reminds me of some schoolteachers whose day was perfect when they could put in detention those who tried to defy convention in some way.

 

At the end of the day, nothing is more cringeworthy than watching a roomful of grown-ups (over 400 of them) rising as (nearly) one to applaud whatever lies are being spouted at that particular moment. 

Shameful picture of a debased civilization.

If you want to discuss shameful pictures of a debased civilization, maybe you should go and take a look in Ukraine, how Russia is systematically trying to destroy the infrastructure there, and is knowingly and willingly sending millions of people into a very cold winter. 
Maybe you should go and take a look in Bucha, where the Russian military tortured, raped and executed hundreds of innocent civilians. Like they did as well in many other towns and villages in Ukraine.
Maybe you should go and take a look in Mariupol, where the Russians are eradicating every single sign that it was ever a Ukrainian city. Including that concert hall, where hundreds of people were taking shelter, and Russia decided to drop a bomb on it.

So if you want to discuss debased civilization, I think Russia should be the number one topic.

[blazes]

16 minutes ago, rudi49jr said:

If you want to discuss shameful pictures of a debased civilization, maybe you should go and take a look in Ukraine, how Russia is systematically trying to destroy the infrastructure there, and is knowingly and willingly sending millions of people into a very cold winter. 
Maybe you should go and take a look in Bucha, where the Russian military tortured, raped and executed hundreds of innocent civilians. Like they did as well in many other towns and villages in Ukraine.
Maybe you should go and take a look in Mariupol, where the Russians are eradicating every single sign that it was ever a Ukrainian city. Including that concert hall, where hundreds of people were taking shelter, and Russia decided to drop a bomb on it.

So if you want to discuss debased civilization, I think Russia should be the number one topic.

This kind of whataboutery, while accurate in its depiction of a history of savagery, refuses to acknowledge what is the actual truth: that the history of mankind is littered with all kinds of debauched militarism. 

 

But don't you see that if I now respond by drawing your attention to all the savagery that has been committed in the name of America in the last 200 and more years, we are no further ahead in the task of creating a better civilization.   In the midst of all the savagery, America produced an advanced technological civilization that makes us all "freer" in so many ways.  At the same time, Russia produced a revolution that, whatever its later  consequences, overthrew a repressive regime in an attempt to create something close to democracy.  Russia also produced the likes of Tolstoy, Tchaikovsky, Dosoevsky, the Bolshoi Ballet......etcetcetc

 

These sorts of "whatabout" arguments can go on for ever, but they may have the advantage of reminding people that politics is a complex and serious business.

Happy Christmas.

[ozimoron]

5 minutes ago, blazes said:

This kind of whataboutery, while accurate in its depiction of a history of savagery, refuses to acknowledge what is the actual truth: that the history of mankind is littered with all kinds of debauched militarism. 

 

But don't you see that if I now respond by drawing your attention to all the savagery that has been committed in the name of America in the last 200 and more years, we are no further ahead in the task of creating a better civilization.   In the midst of all the savagery, America produced an advanced technological civilization that makes us all "freer" in so many ways.  At the same time, Russia produced a revolution that, whatever its later  consequences, overthrew a repressive regime in an attempt to create something close to democracy.  Russia also produced the likes of Tolstoy, Tchaikovsky, Dosoevsky, the Bolshoi Ballet......etcetcetc

 

These sorts of "whatabout" arguments can go on for ever, but they may have the advantage of reminding people that politics is a complex and serious business.

Happy Christmas.

Whatever Russia became post Stalin, that's not what it is now.

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, Sydebolle said:

Call the CIA or the Pentagon for guidance ???? History repeating itself after 1950 in Tehran ........ for those in the know! 

The link dodgers are out in force today.

[Maejo Man]

On 12/23/2022 at 12:56 PM, habuspasha said:

Looks like Air Force One in the photo.

Air Force One is a Boeing 747 ...That's not

[ed strong]

9 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Can you provide a link for that? Particularly since they never even received a NATO Membership Action Plan, from there its still a 5 to 10 year process. It was not till 2021 at a Brussels summit that NATO leaders promised a MAP as an integral part of the process. However the Russian invasion started before that even got of the ground.

Ref's:

https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-is-ukraine-still-not-in-nato/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine–NATO_relations

 

You also missed completely the offer by Zelensky to commit to NOT joining NATO in return for peace talks, duly turned down by Putin. This was one month into the war, March 2022.

 

Zelensky says Ukraine prepared to discuss neutrality in peace talks

In nod to Russia, Ukraine says no longer insisting on NATO membership

Zelensky: We won’t join NATO if that brings peace

 

Anyone who thinks this was anything other than Putin's imperialist ambitions is obviously just reading RT NEWS

Seriously, did you even read your own link that you posted?

 

The same comments i made are in your atlantic council link. I will quote from your own link.

 

''It is worth emphasizing that Ukraine has also recently speeded up its own domestic Euro-Atlantic reforms. In particular, last month the Ukrainian parliament passed a first reading of the long-awaited reform of the Ukrainian Security Service in accordance with NATO recommendations. Growing trust between the special services of Ukraine and NATO member states, along with increasing interoperability between armed forces, is vital''

 

What exactly do you think these reforms relate to?

 

[ed strong]

9 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Can you provide a link for that? Particularly since they never even received a NATO Membership Action Plan, from there its still a 5 to 10 year process. It was not till 2021 at a Brussels summit that NATO leaders promised a MAP as an integral part of the process. However the Russian invasion started before that even got of the ground.

Ref's:

https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/why-is-ukraine-still-not-in-nato/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine–NATO_relations

 

You also missed completely the offer by Zelensky to commit to NOT joining NATO in return for peace talks, duly turned down by Putin. This was one month into the war, March 2022.

 

Zelensky says Ukraine prepared to discuss neutrality in peace talks

In nod to Russia, Ukraine says no longer insisting on NATO membership

Zelensky: We won’t join NATO if that brings peace

 

Anyone who thinks this was anything other than Putin's imperialist ambitions is obviously just reading RT NEWS

Never seen RT news whatever that is.

 

Sweden and Finland have been offered NATO membership and certainly have no MAP of 5 to 10 year time frame.

 

https://www.swedenabroad.se/en/embassies/usa-washington/current/news/sweden-applies-for-nato-membership/

 

Its only for Georgia and Ukraine and the country needs reforms before membership is granted.

Edited December 24, 2022 by ed strong
added a link

[Bkk Brian]

8 minutes ago, ed strong said:

Seriously, did you even read your own link that you posted?

 

The same comments i made are in your atlantic council link. I will quote from your own link.

 

''It is worth emphasizing that Ukraine has also recently speeded up its own domestic Euro-Atlantic reforms. In particular, last month the Ukrainian parliament passed a first reading of the long-awaited reform of the Ukrainian Security Service in accordance with NATO recommendations. Growing trust between the special services of Ukraine and NATO member states, along with increasing interoperability between armed forces, is vital''

 

What exactly do you think these reforms relate to?

 

Your claim:

"They weren't aloud to join as they have missed so many European Union, International Monetary Fund, and U.S. reform encouragements since 2014.

This is further undercut by the reality that Ukraine is not in control of all of its territory. Russia has annexed Crimea and supports separatist republics in the Donbas"

 

No link then?

 

Read them, that's why I posted them, the key to that statement being that was reported for January this year.

 

Zelensky offered to not join and Putin ignored that offer, Ukraine then applied

Ukraine formally applies for fast-track NATO membership