Gall Bladder Stone

[KannikaP]

2 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Give us an update on here or start a thread about the India trip, will be interesting and good luck

Two quotes already, USD 1100 & 4000

[KannikaP]

2 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Give us an update on here or start a thread about the India trip, will be interesting and good luck

Today's update. Arrived at hospital 9.30am, checked in OK. Waited 2.5 hours to see a Doctor who said I must first consult with the Surgeon, who is only there on Mondays. Then it is usually an eight week wait for any inflammation to subside. 

Next visit........next Monday,

[freeman01]

if the pain is bearable, i would try serious diet and follow some non conventional medicine, in India you should try to visit an Ayurvedic doctor, very interesting. Natural remedies always takes time so don't expect fast result ...

 

you don't want any part of your body removed unless it is absolutely necessary imho.

[KannikaP]

15 minutes ago, freeman01 said:

if the pain is bearable, i would try serious diet and follow some non conventional medicine, in India you should try to visit an Ayurvedic doctor, very interesting. Natural remedies always takes time so don't expect fast result ...

 

you don't want any part of your body removed unless it is absolutely necessary imho.

Like tonsils, appendix, gall bladder and foreskin?

[KannikaP]

6 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Give us an update on here or start a thread about the India trip, will be interesting and good luck

Here's a reply I got from an Indian Hospital.

 

Yeah sure..u should get it done there itself.
In India, HealthCare is affordable and offers world class treatment but not
as cheap as Thailand.
Best of Luck for ur surgery and Warm Regards.

[scubascuba3]

40 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

Here's a reply I got from an Indian Hospital.

 

Yeah sure..u should get it done there itself.
In India, HealthCare is affordable and offers world class treatment but not
as cheap as Thailand.
Best of Luck for ur surgery and Warm Regards.

The person replying probably doesn't understand the cost in Thailand, you'd think it would be cheap but isn't. You have to compare costs

[Sheryl]

25 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

The person replying probably doesn't understand the cost in Thailand, you'd think it would be cheap but isn't. You have to compare costs

Agree.

 

As a general rule, top tier private hospitals in India cost about what government hospitals do in Thailand but exceptions are things that involve expensive equipment or consumables: CTs, MRIs, PET scans, ortho surgery with instrumentation (screws, plates, rods etc)  and endoscopic procedures. These may cost less in India than even at a  government hospital in Thailand. And  might include laparoscopic cholecystectomy. Though for that I don't think difference will be huge, especially when travel and hotel etc factored in.

[Ralf001]

On 6/1/2023 at 3:43 PM, Sheryl said:

 

 

These abdominal ultrasounds also turn up a of of harmless cysts on liver and kidney. 

 

 

Found out 3 weeks ago xrays for my pneumonia and perforated large intestine in January also showed a 3cm lump on kidney.

Am hoping it is a harmless cyst.

[KannikaP]

13 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

The person replying probably doesn't understand the cost in Thailand, you'd think it would be cheap but isn't. You have to compare costs

I did. Bht 60000 here, and from Bht 38000 PLUS FLIGHTS and time in India. About the same in the end.

[Sheryl]

14 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

Found out 3 weeks ago xrays for my pneumonia and perforated large intestine in January also showed a 3cm lump on kidney.

Am hoping it is a harmless cyst.

Have you had ultrasound yet? This will show if if is a cyst vs solid mass

[Ralf001]

57 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Have you had ultrasound yet? This will show if if is a cyst vs solid mass

Doc has ordered a CT scan later this month.

[cmjl]

On 6/2/2023 at 4:39 AM, Sheryl said:

If I follow your story correctly you had a kidney stone, not gallstones.

 

Your pain stopped because you had passed the stone.

 

No way that olive oil + orange juice would help with a kidney stone except  if it meant taking in more fluid. (more fluid aids in passing the stone).

 

 

 

 

My mother used the same remedy when she had gall stones,it worked for her hence why I tried it for my kidney stone(s)

[Ben Zioner]

Got a series of episodes of intense right abdominal discomfort, between Christmas last year and  this July.I Suspected Gallstones, adjusted my diet somewhat and didn't have any painful symptoms since. Got checked yesterday, at Bumrungrad, by ultrasound and confirmed that I had now more stones (<10mm) than 5 years ago (CT/Scan, which I had forgotten). Doctor recommended removal, I said ok let's do it in January, but only if you get pre-approval from Cigna first.

 

As a matter of interest I asked to nurse what the cost was; she showed me a (20233) package for one night in-patient at a cost of 234k. No problem I said, if I don't pay. Guys make sure you got a proper insurance, Thai immigration are right, with this regard.

[scubascuba3]

4 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

Got a series of episodes of intense right abdominal discomfort, between Christmas last year and  this July.I Suspected Gallstones, adjusted my diet somewhat and didn't have any painful symptoms since. Got checked yesterday, at Bumrungrad, by ultrasound and confirmed that I had now more stones (<10mm) than 5 years ago (CT/Scan, which I had forgotten). Doctor recommended removal, I said ok let's do it in January, but only if you get pre-approval from Cigna first.

 

As a matter of interest I asked to nurse what the cost was; she showed me a (20233) package for one night in-patient at a cost of 234k. No problem I said, if I don't pay. Guys make sure you got a proper insurance, Thai immigration are right, with this regard.

I read, change your diet and leave alone unless discomfort, they'll come back if same diet

[Ben Zioner]

6 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

I read, change your diet and leave alone unless discomfort, they'll come back if same diet

Yes but I am a sinner. And I had a look at my ultrasound pics this morning and it was pretty ominous. Also I am 71 and still acceptably fit. So I'd rather do it now, than in a few years when I am less able to cope, or when it could clash with other treatments.

[KannikaP]

On 6/8/2023 at 8:57 AM, KannikaP said:

I did. Bht 60000 here, and from Bht 38000 PLUS FLIGHTS and time in India. About the same in the end.

UPDATE. Had it done laparoscapally at Nauresan University Hospital in Phitsanulok two weeks ago. Two nights in hospital, one before one after. No problems whatsoever except lousy WiFi. Cost was Bht 45000 all in. Very pleased. Staples taken out yesterday.

[QuantumQuandry]

On 6/1/2023 at 8:48 AM, Sheryl said:

Small asymptomatic stones are another matter but that is not your situation.

 

What about large asymptomatic stones?  From what I had read, the size of the gallstone was less of an indicator for intervention then symptoms?

 

Asking since I have a very large gallstone (almost 5cm if my last ultrasound is correct).  I had two attacks many years ago and chose not to deal with it at the time and haven't had an attack since then (my dietary habits changed a lot since then).  Not sure what the size was at that time.

 

Still, considering having it done as I would like to go on Ozempic and I have some concerns that weight loss will lead to aggravating the gallstone.  So considering having it done pre-emptively.

 

Couple follow up questions along those lines...

 

Any idea if the size will make laparoscopic removal a problem?  I am far more willing to entertain laparoscopic removal then open surgery, given the current lack of symptoms.

 

The part I would really like your advice on...based in Jomtien, I can consider having it done at Queen Sirikit naval hospital (at government rates, I think?)...or going to Bumrungrad in BKK and paying 260,000.  I haven't lived here long enough to know if there is a big difference in quality.  I have read about incomplete gallbladder removals leading to sepsis or other complications (like cystic duct stump issues).

 

I would hate to get an operation for something that isn't clearly needed...and then make things worse.  Would love some thoughts.

  

Just now, KannikaP said:

UPDATE. Had it done laparoscapally at Nauresan University Hospital in Phitsanulok two weeks ago. Two nights in hospital, one before one after. No problems whatsoever except lousy WiFi. Cost was Bht 45000 all in. Very pleased. Staples taken out yesterday.

 

Thank you for the update.  How's the post-op pain and/or discomfort?  Considering having it done.

 

 

[KannikaP]

6 minutes ago, QuantumQuandry said:

 

What about large asymptomatic stones?  From what I had read, the size of the gallstone was less of an indicator for intervention then symptoms?

 

Asking since I have a very large gallstone (almost 5cm if my last ultrasound is correct).  I had two attacks many years ago and chose not to deal with it at the time and haven't had an attack since then (my dietary habits changed a lot since then).  Not sure what the size was at that time.

 

Still, considering having it done as I would like to go on Ozempic and I have some concerns that weight loss will lead to aggravating the gallstone.  So considering having it done pre-emptively.

 

Couple follow up questions along those lines...

 

Any idea if the size will make laparoscopic removal a problem?  I am far more willing to entertain laparoscopic removal then open surgery, given the current lack of symptoms.

 

The part I would really like your advice on...based in Jomtien, I can consider having it done at Queen Sirikit naval hospital (at government rates, I think?)...or going to Bumrungrad in BKK and paying 260,000.  I haven't lived here long enough to know if there is a big difference in quality.  I have read about incomplete gallbladder removals leading to sepsis or other complications (like cystic duct stump issues).

 

I would hate to get an operation for something that isn't clearly needed...and then make things worse.  Would love some thoughts.

  

 

Thank you for the update.  How's the post-op pain and/or discomfort?  Considering having it done.

 

 

No pain or discomfort at all, except laying off the beer for a week or so. 

[QuantumQuandry]

21 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

No pain or discomfort at all, except laying off the beer for a week or so. 

 

How about the common...ahm...stool changes, shall we say? :)

[KannikaP]

9 minutes ago, QuantumQuandry said:

 

How about the common...ahm...stool changes, shall we say? :)

Took a week before I had a good dump, but I wasn't eating so much. Now, all back to normal, and 2kg down!

[Sheryl]

3 hours ago, QuantumQuandry said:

 

What about large asymptomatic stones?  From what I had read, the size of the gallstone was less of an indicator for intervention then symptoms?

 

Asking since I have a very large gallstone (almost 5cm if my last ultrasound is correct).  I had two attacks many years ago and chose not to deal with it at the time and haven't had an attack since then (my dietary habits changed a lot since then).  Not sure what the size was at that time.

 

Still, considering having it done as I would like to go on Ozempic and I have some concerns that weight loss will lead to aggravating the gallstone.  So considering having it done pre-emptively.

 

Couple follow up questions along those lines...

 

Any idea if the size will make laparoscopic removal a problem?  I am far more willing to entertain laparoscopic removal then open surgery, given the current lack of symptoms.

 

The part I would really like your advice on...based in Jomtien, I can consider having it done at Queen Sirikit naval hospital (at government rates, I think?)...or going to Bumrungrad in BKK and paying 260,000.  I haven't lived here long enough to know if there is a big difference in quality.  I have read about incomplete gallbladder removals leading to sepsis or other complications (like cystic duct stump issues).

 

I would hate to get an operation for something that isn't clearly needed...and then make things worse.  Would love some thoughts.

  

 

Thank you for the update.  How's the post-op pain and/or discomfort?  Considering having it done.

 

 

 While it is true that surgery is usually recommended only for symptomatic gallstones, with very large gallstones (i.e. >2 cm) it is advisable to remove. The problem is that they can end up blocking the common bile duct causing severe complications.

 

I do not know if Queen Sirikit can do laparoscopic surgery. If they can, should be fine.  Otherwise you might inquire at Phyathai Sri Racha or Samitivej Sri Racha, both are likely to cost less than Bumrungrad and would surely be able to do laparoscopic.

 

 

[Chris Daley]

My dad had this.  The pain came on suddenly and took a grown man to the floor.  He was screaming in pain.  My mom called the doctor and the doctor canceled all patients and came around with his bag.  He injected some morphine and the pain went away.

 

Then they did the checks over the next few days to see how big the stone were.  It turned out he had passed all the stones so no need for an operation.

 

Thailand's doctors are just monkeys in a gown, so who knows what they will do.

 

[Felton Jarvis]

Try to get them to remove only the stones and NOT the gall bladder. Since my gall bladder removal ten years ago, I have had a permanent case of diarrhea. The doctors will usually tell you that this is temporary, but ten years is NOT temporary in my view.

[connda]

I had a friend who had them.  His daughter too.  Get them taken out at the government hospital  Then check remedies so you don't develop them again.
In the meantime really watch your fat intake.  Sorry to hear.  All the best.  That really sucks.

Update - just realized you had the surgery and it went well.  Excellent and great to hear! 

[connda]

On 6/7/2023 at 8:26 AM, KannikaP said:

The cost for laparoscic surgery  will be Bht 60000 and 3 or 4 days in hospital @ Bht 600 per night

$2000 USD if you put it into perspective.  If I had what you have I'd go to CMU Maharaj Hospital here in Chiang Mai.  They did my inguinal hernia and the hospital was top-notch.  Again - best of luck.  Let us know how it shakes out. 

[connda]

On 6/7/2023 at 7:35 PM, Sheryl said:

Agree.

 

As a general rule, top tier private hospitals in India cost about what government hospitals do in Thailand but exceptions are things that involve expensive equipment or consumables: CTs, MRIs, PET scans, ortho surgery with instrumentation (screws, plates, rods etc)  and endoscopic procedures. These may cost less in India than even at a  government hospital in Thailand. And  might include laparoscopic cholecystectomy. Though for that I don't think difference will be huge, especially when travel and hotel etc factored in.

The other surgery in India would include Green Light Laser surgery for BHP.   I don't know of a government hospital who offers it.  They only do TURP which is freaking medieval.  Private hospitals charge upwards of 250K THB ($7,000+) for the procedure.  You can get it done in India for $3500 to $4000 USD. 

[Lucky Bones]

Interesting. I had a major diverticulitis (lack of fibre?) issue 14 year back. Ended up (in Oz) having final 3rd of colon removed, heavy duty stuff.

Joke was 1/3rd less s**t to put up with.

Surgeon said my gall bladder had many stones and the gall bladder could be removed.

OK I said 3 years on.

Gall bladder was removed & 4 weeks after I go down in a BIG heap with pancreatitis.

A gall stone is now blocking my pancreatic duct. 10 expensive days of hospitals with doctors shouting "you drink too much" & a lengthy recovery.

Major causes of pancreatitis are gallstones & booze.

Doctors screwed up but would never admit to it. A gallstone escaped.

Took 4 years (& one more 4 day hosp stay) for the gallstone to dissolve.

7 years on I can still have a beer and am strong, no pancreatic problems.

I will never, ever trust a doctor again.🙃🙃

[QuantumQuandry]

4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 While it is true that surgery is usually recommended only for symptomatic gallstones, with very large gallstones (i.e. >2 cm) it is advisable to remove. The problem is that they can end up blocking the common bile duct causing severe complications.

 

Just feels weird to have a preventive surgery for something that hasn't bene a problem for 20 years.  But I understand.

 

4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

I do not know if Queen Sirikit can do laparoscopic surgery. If they can, should be fine.  Otherwise you might inquire at Phyathai Sri Racha or Samitivej Sri Racha, both are likely to cost less than Bumrungrad and would surely be able to do laparoscopic.

 

Not sure about Samitivej.  I know Bumrungrad is 260k and Phyathai is 210k.  Is there a quality difference?  Would you feel comfortable having it done at a place like Qieen Sirikit or another government hospital, as opposed to Bumrungrad?

 

And do you think they can do laparoscopic cholecystectomy for a 5cm stone?

  

3 hours ago, Felton Jarvis said:

Try to get them to remove only the stones and NOT the gall bladder. Since my gall bladder removal ten years ago, I have had a permanent case of diarrhea. The doctors will usually tell you that this is temporary, but ten years is NOT temporary in my view.

 

I have read that if you get the stones removed, they will likely just come back.  But I have also read of what you are suffering.  Some people have no symptoms, some have temporary symptoms and some have permanent.  I don't know what the odds are of each.

  

2 hours ago, Lucky Bones said:

Gall bladder was removed & 4 weeks after I go down in a BIG heap with pancreatitis.

A gall stone is now blocking my pancreatic duct.

 

Scary.  See, this stuff is what makes me not want to get the surgery done, given that I have no symptoms (but an abnormally large stone).  Makes me wonder if am trying to fix something that isn't broken.

[mstevens]

3 hours ago, Felton Jarvis said:

Try to get them to remove only the stones and NOT the gall bladder. Since my gall bladder removal ten years ago, I have had a permanent case of diarrhea. The doctors will usually tell you that this is temporary, but ten years is NOT temporary in my view.

 

A friend of mine has had exactly the same problem. Ever since his gallbladder was removed, he has yet to have a well-formed stool.

 

Have you tried an ox bile supplement? This can help with the digestion of fats.

[scubascuba3]

7 hours ago, Felton Jarvis said:

Try to get them to remove only the stones and NOT the gall bladder. Since my gall bladder removal ten years ago, I have had a permanent case of diarrhea. The doctors will usually tell you that this is temporary, but ten years is NOT temporary in my view.

caused by the contant drip drip of the bile?