Does Pheu Thai-led coalition spell death for the red-shirt movement?

[webfact]

 

Pheu Thai’s recent decision to embrace parties linked with the 2010 bloody military crackdown on red-shirt protesters may have shaken many members of the movement. However, it has far from destroyed its spirit.

 

“The red shirts have existed and will continue to exist,” affirmed Thida Thavornseth, a former leader of the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD), the group that led the red-shirt movement for more than a decade.

 

While noting that the movement got behind the Thai Rak Thai (TRT) Party and its reincarnations, People’s Power and Pheu Thai, Thida prefers to see “red” as synonymous with the struggle against injustice. The red shirts, she explained, are people who want to secure power for the people.

 

Full story: https://www.thaipbsworld.com/does-pheu-thai-led-coalition-spell-death-for-the-red-shirt-movement/

 

-- Thai PBS 2023-08-31

 

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[Soupdragon]

Add some yellow to make orange ????

[mfd101]

Red Shirts are probably necessary for the long-term success of MFP (ie major change & reform in Thailand). They're the ones who do the heavy breathing out on the streets for moving forward, along with - now - the orange students.

 

(In the Oz context I'm a right-of-centre person. But TIT ...)

[klauskunkel]

1 hour ago, webfact said:

“The red shirts have existed and will continue to exist,” affirmed Thida Thavornseth

Thida affirms her need to stay relevant

 

1 hour ago, webfact said:

The red shirts, she explained, are people who want to secure power for the people

Yes! Power for the People! (or rather for Thida who leads those people)

[hotchilli]

2 hours ago, webfact said:

The red shirts, she explained, are people who want to secure power for the people.

Pheu Thai lied through their back teeth..

if you want power for the people vote MFP at the next election, at least Pita is a man of his words.

[mfd101]

25 minutes ago, hotchilli said:

Pheu Thai lied through their back teeth..

if you want power for the people vote MFP at the next election, at least Pita is a man of his words.

And I think the Red Shirts have already reached that conclusion ...

[OneMoreFarang]

It seems some former red-shirt leaders know by now that they never fought for democracy. They fought for Thaksin and his interest.

If those Thaksin supporting red-shirts don't exist anymore then that is good news.

 

It seems some of the red-shirts actually want democracy and grassroot power. They might play a role in the future of Thailand. That is, IMHO, good. But they have to be careful that not another billionaire hires them for his personal interests. 

[spidermike007]

It would appear they have lost alot of support, and nearly all the goodwill they once had, when they betrayed the voters and jumped into bed with their sworn enemy. That was a move that conveyed a high degree of moral depravity, and hunger for power. I for one hope they are not forgiven, for giving the dinosaurs additional years to lie, steal, fleece the nation and continue moving it backwards.

[bannork]

Two types of red shirts imo, though there may be more.

1.: The grassroots who love Thaksin and his populist policies.

'It's the economy, stupid.

Oh! and Yingluk's so cute too, yeah, love ' em. Not so keen on Ink though '

2. The democrat loving red shirts who now must become orange, bright or blood, or some other shade. 

At a wild guess I would say the ratio of group 1 to 2 is 80% to 20%

[Eric Loh]

2 hours ago, bannork said:

Two types of red shirts imo, though there may be more.

1.: The grassroots who love Thaksin and his populist policies.

'It's the economy, stupid.

Oh! and Yingluk's so cute too, yeah, love ' em. Not so keen on Ink though '

2. The democrat loving red shirts who now must become orange, bright or blood, or some other shade. 

At a wild guess I would say the ratio of group 1 to 2 is 80% to 20%

Don't think the grassroots who love Thaksin and his populist policies are red shirts. Past misconception of the Red Shirts being a part of TRT and its reincarnation parties have been dispelled in the election. The Red Shirts got behind TRT etc because they believed that see injustice against the people. They have their ideological principle that is their struggle to secure power for the people. They will vote for any party that shares their beliefs and the shifting of support to MFP is evidence that they are not devoted to any single party. 

 

I agree with your ratio. 

[Srikcir]

MFP should adopt the Blue color reflecting a fresh and clean direction towards democracy. 

[ikke1959]

Red will fade to orange

[trainman34014]

I live in a predominently 'Red Shirt' area and every Thai person i speak to has said they will never vote for Pheu Thai ever again and there is now seems to be a desire to wipe them out at any future Election.   How that would affect the overall Red Shirt situation i'm not sure but Pehu Thai have certainly shot themselves in both feet !

[GinBoy2]

I think the title is somewhat wrong.

 

I don't think it spells death for the Red Shirt Movement, but I do think it does spell death for Pheu Thai.

 

Lust for power at whatever price comes with consequences!

[candide]

11 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

It seems some former red-shirt leaders know by now that they never fought for democracy. They fought for Thaksin and his interest.

If those Thaksin supporting red-shirts don't exist anymore then that is good news.

 

It seems some of the red-shirts actually want democracy and grassroot power. They might play a role in the future of Thailand. That is, IMHO, good. But they have to be careful that not another billionaire hires them for his personal interests. 

They always fought for elections, so they fought for democracy. Unlike the other side (yellow) they never fought against elections. Actually, there would be no red shirts if the yellow shirts did not attack democracy.

[still kicking]

7 hours ago, ikke1959 said:

Red will fade to orange

It did already, some of my Thai friends who voted for PT changed to MFP 

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, candide said:

They always fought for elections, so they fought for democracy. Unlike the other side (yellow) they never fought against elections. Actually, there would be no red shirts if the yellow shirts did not attack democracy.

And there would have been no yellow-shirts if Thaksin would have worked according to the laws.

 

And guess who financed the red-shirts... 

[herfiehandbag]

14 hours ago, Srikcir said:

MFP should adopt the Blue color reflecting a fresh and clean direction towards democracy. 

Oh dear no - I have a number of blue shirts, it is my preferred colour, and one of the few that are "safe" to wear "politically"!

[lordgrinz]

Correction: The red shirts, she explained, are people who want to secure power for the RED SHIRTS.

 

Quote

"The red shirts, she explained, are people who want to secure power for the people."

 

[mfd101]

17 hours ago, Srikcir said:

MFP should adopt the Blue color reflecting a fresh and clean direction towards democracy. 

Depends whether you are from Usofa or from the rest of the 'Western' world.

 

In Usofa: Republicans - far right - Red; Democrats - right - Blue

 

In the rest of the 'Western' world: Left - Red; Right - Blue

[kimamey]

11 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

And there would have been no yellow-shirts if Thaksin would have worked according to the laws.

 

And guess who financed the red-shirts... 

A good point. He did some good things but that may well have been just to get votes for his own benefit and from what I've read the economic situation at the time, in particular the level of the baht made those moves easier. It won't be so easy this time, and to some extent it wasn't under Yingluck either.

What seems to have been illegal activity, and some of it fairly obvious wasn't a good move for Thaksin, except economically of course. 

There's a certain similarity with Trump in the US. If he'd just accepted the election result and started planning for 2022 and 2024 he might have found himself in less trouble.

[candide]

12 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

And there would have been no yellow-shirts if Thaksin would have worked according to the laws.

 

And guess who financed the red-shirts... 

Lol! As if the yellow shirts and their masters ever cared about following laws.

[OneMoreFarang]

30 minutes ago, candide said:

Lol! As if the yellow shirts and their masters ever cared about following laws.

I remember the history of the yellow shirts, I was here at that time.

You obviously don't remember it. You could look it up.

[Artisi]

On 8/31/2023 at 5:05 PM, OneMoreFarang said:

It seems some former red-shirt leaders know by now that they never fought for democracy. They fought for Thaksin and his interest.

If those Thaksin supporting red-shirts don't exist anymore then that is good news.

 

It seems some of the red-shirts actually want democracy and grassroot power. They might play a role in the future of Thailand. That is, IMHO, good. But they have to be careful that not another billionaire hires them for his personal interests. 

"Billionaire hire them for his personal interest." is probably the best comment that has come out of this nonsense so far. 

[OneMoreFarang]

13 minutes ago, Artisi said:

"Billionaire hire them for his personal interest." is probably the best comment that has come out of this nonsense so far. 

Unfortunately it seems a lot of poor people all over the world somehow think that billionaires are the perfect people to represent them... 

[Srikcir]

6 hours ago, mfd101 said:

Depends whether you are from Usofa or from the rest of the 'Western' world.

 

In Usofa: Republicans - far right - Red; Democrats - right - Blue

 

In the rest of the 'Western' world: Left - Red; Right - Blue

I was thinking blue skies and oceans for freedom, blue tea for common folk and blue in the Thai flag for country. 

[candide]

2 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I remember the history of the yellow shirts, I was here at that time.

You obviously don't remember it. You could look it up.

What I meant is that yellow shirts and their masters never cared about other people than Thaksin following laws or not, and certainly not themselves.

 

Thaksin was a crook, but not more than the others. The real reason why he was ousted was that he was threatening the power of the dominant clique (led by someone who's name started with the letter P. As you've been there for some time, you know who I mean).

It is demonstrated again by the fact that, now that he is not a threat any more to the dominant powers, he is fully accepted

[OneMoreFarang]

6 minutes ago, candide said:

What I meant is that yellow shirts and their masters never cared about other people than Thaksin following laws or not, and certainly not themselves.

 

Thaksin was a crook, but not more than the others. The real reason why he was ousted was that he was threatening the power of the dominant clique (led by someone who's name started with the letter P. As you've been there for some time, you know who I mean).

It is demonstrated again by the fact that, now that he is not a threat any more to the dominant powers, he is fully accepted

I disagree with:

"Thaksin was a crook, but not more than the others. "

"now that he is not a threat any more to the dominant powers, he is fully accepted"

 

Like in many situations, there is not just one single reason why things happen the way they happen.

It is very difficult to impossible to judge which of several reasons was the most important one.

I am sure if Thaksin would have been an honest man, working for Thais and Thailand, then the coup could not have happened the way it did happen. The military had a lot of support, at least in Bangkok, because Thaksin did his very best that many people hated him and wanted to get rid of him. 

[bannork]

23 minutes ago, candide said:

What I meant is that yellow shirts and their masters never cared about other people than Thaksin following laws or not, and certainly not themselves.

 

Thaksin was a crook, but not more than the others. The real reason why he was ousted was that he was threatening the power of the dominant clique (led by someone who's name started with the letter P. As you've been there for some time, you know who I mean).

It is demonstrated again by the fact that, now that he is not a threat any more to the dominant powers, he is fully accepted

I wouldn't say he's accepted.

I'd say the establishment is using his desperation to come back to neuter his party and make them toe the conservative line.

Any Pheu Thai MPs with an ounce of democracy in their bones can't stay with the present motley crew..

But they probably will till the money runs out 

[candide]

5 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I disagree with:

"Thaksin was a crook, but not more than the others. "

"now that he is not a threat any more to the dominant powers, he is fully accepted"

 

Like in many situations, there is not just one single reason why things happen the way they happen.

It is very difficult to impossible to judge which of several reasons was the most important one.

I am sure if Thaksin would have been an honest man, working for Thais and Thailand, then the coup could not have happened the way it did happen. The military had a lot of support, at least in Bangkok, because Thaksin did his very best that many people hated him and wanted to get rid of him. 

Really? In general, were politicians before Thaksin less crook? And those after him, including military politicians?

 

Yes the military had some support in Bangkok, because that was the propaganda. They have lost that support. Bangkok switched to MFP. Why? Because the previous virtuous establishment supporters understood that they (and the related political parties, including the Dems) fooled them, and that they were at least as corrupt as Thaksin.