Trump moves to dismiss his classified documents indictment, citing presidential immunity

[Skipalongcassidy]

8 minutes ago, ezzra said:

Having watched last night on Israeli Tv a middle east expert who was privy to the white house's

in and out going of Trump's presidency inner sanctum, saying that Trump was kowtowing to Putin  

phone calls in a subservient manners and addressed him with the out most respect,

which brings many to think that Trump will continue to be so if re-elected...

Source please... just outright misinformation

[stupidfarang]

On 2/24/2024 at 6:53 AM, Walker88 said:

Sorry, traitor, doesn't work that way.

 

The records are not about orders you gave staff to go pick up a bucket of Extra Crispy at KFC, what trump stole were documents classified TS, SCI,SAP, Codeword, SITK, HCS and RD. Not even KFC's secret recipe is rated like that.

 

The average country club director and wedding planner has no need for documents whose exposure endangers national security, and in the case of HCS documents, threatens the lives of clandestine assets and their families. Not even while actually serving as POTUS does a President have a 'need to know' the identities of clandestine assets. As a former case officer who both recruited and handled clandestine intelligence sources, it sickens me that that bloated, self-serving traitor would be so reckless and cavalier that he would put in danger people who risk their lives to help the US. Such assets and those willing to be such are not stupid. They see the news. They saw that fatboy is reckless and couldn't care less about their safety. Some assets likely quit. Others will never sign on. That leaves the US vulnerable to everything from understanding hostile nations' military capabilities and intent, to planned terrorist acts. Now if al Qaeda wanted to decimate Mar-a-Lago, I couldn't care less, and if there is any justice, let that be the canary.

 

The coward trump has no idea what it takes to either recruit and handle assets in hostile locations, nor the bravery of the assets who choose to aid the US and help keep it safe.

 

trump has zero immunity. Neither did he declassify, as that is a set process requiring sign-offs by agency heads and it leaves a paper trail. Also, not even a POTUS can declassify RD documents, as only the Dept of Energy has that legal authority.

 

Jail him, or execute him for treason, as it is patently obvious to anyone not caught up in his vapors that trump intended to monetize what he stole. putin would pay $billions to learn what 'sources and methods' US intel has working against him.

 

I can't imagine how much this has already cost. An entire damage assessment has to be done, as it has to be assumed what trump stole and kept in his club has been exposed. Undoubtedly some clandestine assets and their families probably had to be exfilled from denied areas, or it's also possible some were rolled up and killed. Effing trump, traitor.

 

Any co-opted elected official, such as an R Senator or Representative: If you buy trump's spurious argument, then let's take every document trump stole and publish them. Let's hand them out at Dulles Airport to incoming passengers. Send copies to putin, Xi, the mullahs in Iran, al Qaeda, the Haqqani Network, trump's lover Kim Jong-un. Let's toss them in Happy Meals at McDonalds. If these co-opted Sens and Reps are unwilling to do that, then they can shut up and get behind the lawful prosecution of the traitor trump.

The line I liked the most "The average country club director and wedding planner" 

[stupidfarang]

$114,000,000 million dollars a day in interest on top of the $450million he has to pay, this is the only thing that hurts him, plus there is the other $83million he has to pay E Jean Carrol and do not forget his lawyers he needs to pay. Slow train crash

[transam]

On 2/24/2024 at 6:46 AM, Skipalongcassidy said:

Anything trump does is uphill... but what is legal prosecution and what is contrived will soon be decided... he should just plead that he forgot that he was not the "incumbent"... that's what joe would do.

"He forgot" he had zillions of secret stuff........................🤣

[Skipalongcassidy]

1 minute ago, transam said:

"He forgot" he had zillions of secret stuff........................🤣

You are talking about joe... right?

[transam]

4 minutes ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

You are talking about joe... right?

But Joe is president, McTrump is a 'has been' with a lot of problems brought on by himself.

 

Oh, and if McD 'forgot' he had all of those secret documents in the fridge at home, then wanting to be president is a bit of a laugh.............🤣

[stevenl]

13 minutes ago, stupidfarang said:

$114,000,000 million dollars a day in interest on top of the $450million he has to pay, this is the only thing that hurts him, plus there is the other $83million he has to pay E Jean Carrol and do not forget his lawyers he needs to pay. Slow train crash

Check your numbers please.

[placeholder]

12 minutes ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

You are talking about joe... right?

After leaving office Trump actually read out loud to a journalist and others from a document he acknowledged was still classified.

[ozimoron]

58 minutes ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

Whether or not there is a benefit to society in using the N word in public or marching down the street yelling "jews will not replace us" is not relevant... where would the good or bad qualifiers for speech come from and where would it stop?

 

Just because Australians don't believe their free speech rights are impinged... doesn't mean it isn't true... denial doesn't changed the definition.

 

If it's a matter of civility why does there have to be censorship... after all the public from both sides of the spectrum are totally civil... oh wait... neither side is and it is usually the side that perceives a threat to their agenda who calls for censorship.  Tolerance is usually not their forte.

 

53 minutes ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

Right... 555  democrats look at everything as an incitement to violence... except the real violence... ie BLM just to name one.  

 

Believe it or not there is much wisdom in the proverbial... "sticks and stones will break your bones, but words will never hurt you"  unless you want them to and let them.

 

totally wrong. it's not just Australia. The single western country that allows hate speech is the US.

[gargamon]

20 minutes ago, stupidfarang said:

$114,000,000 million dollars a day

That would be what, 1.14 gazillion dollars? $114,000,000,000,000. Even Musk doesn't have that much coin. 

[Danderman123]

47 minutes ago, stupidfarang said:

$114,000,000 million dollars a day in interest on top of the $450million he has to pay, this is the only thing that hurts him, plus there is the other $83million he has to pay E Jean Carrol and do not forget his lawyers he needs to pay. Slow train crash

That's $114,000 per day as of Friday.

 

The number will go higher.

 

I don't see any Trump fans here volunteering to send money.

[johnnybangkok]

On 2/24/2024 at 6:26 AM, Skipalongcassidy said:

• Establishes in law that any incumbent Presidential records (whether textual or electronic) held on courtesy storage by the Archivist remain in the exclusive legal custody of the President and that any request or order for access to such records must be made to the President, not NARA.

You seem to forget the timelines involved here;-

 

'The federal government tried and failed repeatedly for more than a year and a half to retrieve classified and sensitive documents from former President Donald J. Trump before resorting to a search of his Mar-a-Lago property this month, according to government documents, statements by Mr. Trump’s lawyers, and a newly unsealed indictment.

The documents make clear the lengths to which the National Archives and the department went before officials pursued a law enforcement action to recover the material' 

'The documents in Mr. Trump’s boxes include information regarding defense and weapons capabilities of both the United States and foreign countries; U.S. nuclear programs; potential vulnerabilities of the United States and its allies to military attack; and plans for possible retaliation in response to foreign attack, according to prosecutors'.     

Timeline of the Trump Classified Documents Investigation - The New York Times (nytimes.com)

 

And VERY importantly, the National Archives (with no political affiliation) 'warned Mr. Trump’s representatives that there could be a referral to the Justice Department or an alert to Congress if the former president continues to refuse to comply with the Presidential Records Act'.

 

Why would anyone hold on to these things after numerous requests and a 'final warning'? This court case is completely self-inflicted and Trump only has his own incompetence to blame for where he is now.

 

 

[Skipalongcassidy]

21 hours ago, ozimoron said:

 

 

 The single western country that allows hate speech is the US.

If it were not allowed the liberal left would have nothing to say...

[scorecard]

On 2/24/2024 at 6:26 AM, Skipalongcassidy said:

• Establishes in law that any incumbent Presidential records (whether textual or electronic) held on courtesy storage by the Archivist remain in the exclusive legal custody of the President and that any request or order for access to such records must be made to the President, not NARA.

Nice try, but other posts indicate the opposite.

[scorecard]

21 hours ago, johnnybangkok said:

You seem to forget the timelines involved here;-

 

'The federal government tried and failed repeatedly for more than a year and a half to retrieve classified and sensitive documents from former President Donald J. Trump before resorting to a search of his Mar-a-Lago property this month, according to government documents, statements by Mr. Trump’s lawyers, and a newly unsealed indictment.

The documents make clear the lengths to which the National Archives and the department went before officials pursued a law enforcement action to recover the material' 

'The documents in Mr. Trump’s boxes include information regarding defense and weapons capabilities of both the United States and foreign countries; U.S. nuclear programs; potential vulnerabilities of the United States and its allies to military attack; and plans for possible retaliation in response to foreign attack, according to prosecutors'.     

Timeline of the Trump Classified Documents Investigation - The New York Times (nytimes.com)

 

And VERY importantly, the National Archives (with no political affiliation) 'warned Mr. Trump’s representatives that there could be a referral to the Justice Department or an alert to Congress if the former president continues to refuse to comply with the Presidential Records Act'.

 

Why would anyone hold on to these things after numerous requests and a 'final warning'? This court case is completely self-inflicted and Trump only has his own incompetence to blame for where he is now.

 

 

And would any intelligent president / former president store them in a location easily accessible by the pubic / restaurant goers at his resort? 

 

Just another example, trump thinks he's god and he can make the rules / make new rule / make new laws as he see fit, on any subject.

 

He publicly stated to the crown, on the day he was swollen in:

"I am your president of law and order".

 

Right there / right then his lies / untruths / total lack of respect for the law and for all US citizens started.  

[Walker88]

23 hours ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

Right... 555  democrats look at everything as an incitement to violence... except the real violence... ie BLM just to name one.  

 

Believe it or not there is much wisdom in the proverbial... "sticks and stones will break your bones, but words will never hurt you"  unless you want them to and let them.

Aaahhh...another grad of trump university trying to show off his degree in Whataboutism!

 

Dems, in contrast to the fascist right, have something called perspective. While nobody condones looting a pair of sneakers from a Footlocker, Dems see a difference between that and trying to overthrow 250 years of American democracy. The latter is infinitely more important.

 

See, few Dems would vote for anyone who proudly says he looted sneakers, whereas the fascist right worships the morbidly obese traitor who is so proud of his goobers trying to overthrow US democracy that he calls them 'hostages' and vows to pardon them all, even the ones who beat law enforcement officers or who crapped inside the Capitol and rubbed their feces on the wall.

 

You and your ilk support cop beaters and feces smearers, while decent people support democracy.

[Skipalongcassidy]

4 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

Aaahhh...another grad of trump university trying to show off his degree in Whataboutism!

Unlike you I do have an advanced degree from an accredited university... TDS is a mental disease... help is available but you have to want to get better.

[stupidfarang]

22 hours ago, stupidfarang said:

$114,000,000 million dollars a day in interest on top of the $450million he has to pay, this is the only thing that hurts him, plus there is the other $83million he has to pay E Jean Carrol and do not forget his lawyers he needs to pay. Slow train crash

sorry, $114,0000.00 a day not million

[Walker88]

17 minutes ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

Unlike you I do have an advanced degree from an accredited university... TDS is a mental disease... help is available but you have to want to get better.

I don't think you want to match degrees.

 

Real TDS---not the typical projection of trump goobers---is a serious and anti-US affliction.

 

As I wrote, you support a morbidly obese guy who hates democracy, loves dictators,  champions cop beaters and feces smearers, not to mention he's a convicted sex offender, a convicted charity fraudster, a convicted bank fraudster, a convicted insurance fraudster, and a thief and pathological liar. He has so many bad points that his 'best' attribute is that he's a serial philanderer.

 

The sickness is clearly on the side of those who support him.

[placeholder]

23 hours ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

Source please... just outright misinformation

You could well be right. But for rather alarming reasons:

President Trump went to 'extraordinary lengths' to hide details of Putin meetings, report says

President Donald Trump went to "extraordinary lengths" to keep details from his conversations with Russian President Vladimir Putin secret – even from officials within his own administration, The Washington Post reported this weekend, citing unnamed sources.

After meeting with Putin at the 2017 Group of 20summit in Hamburg, Germany, Trump took his interpreter's notes and told him not to discuss the meeting with anyone, including other U.S. officials, the Post reported.

The paper said Trump's handling of the Hamburg meeting was "part of a broader pattern by the president of shielding his communications with Putin from public scrutiny and preventing even high-ranking officials in his own administration from fully knowing what he has told one of the United States’ main adversaries."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2019/01/13/trump-putin-meetings-interpreter-notes/2565471002/

[Walker88]

8 minutes ago, placeholder said:

You could well be right. But for rather alarming reasons:

President Trump went to 'extraordinary lengths' to hide details of Putin meetings, report says

President Donald Trump went to "extraordinary lengths" to keep details from his conversations with Russian President Vladimir Putin secret – even from officials within his own administration, The Washington Post reported this weekend, citing unnamed sources.

After meeting with Putin at the 2017 Group of 20summit in Hamburg, Germany, Trump took his interpreter's notes and told him not to discuss the meeting with anyone, including other U.S. officials, the Post reported.

The paper said Trump's handling of the Hamburg meeting was "part of a broader pattern by the president of shielding his communications with Putin from public scrutiny and preventing even high-ranking officials in his own administration from fully knowing what he has told one of the United States’ main adversaries."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2019/01/13/trump-putin-meetings-interpreter-notes/2565471002/

At his Helsinki meeting, he refused to allow any American in the room, save for his interpreter Marina Gross. He also took her notes.

 

Helsinki was where trump came out of the meeting ashen faced, while putin could barely keep his Cheshire Cat grin under control. trump then announced putin had told him Russia had no part in the 2016 election (an obvious lie even the Republican-chaired SSCI did not believe), and that trump believed putin over the US intelligence community.

 

Oh, and in the infamous Oval Office meeting with Lavrov and Kislyak, trump did not allow any other American in the room...not Pompeo, not Coates, not Mattis...no American. The only other person in the room was a photographer---who was a Russian GRU agent.

Edited February 26 by Walker88

[heybruce]

7 hours ago, placeholder said:

You could well be right. But for rather alarming reasons:

President Trump went to 'extraordinary lengths' to hide details of Putin meetings, report says

President Donald Trump went to "extraordinary lengths" to keep details from his conversations with Russian President Vladimir Putin secret – even from officials within his own administration, The Washington Post reported this weekend, citing unnamed sources.

After meeting with Putin at the 2017 Group of 20summit in Hamburg, Germany, Trump took his interpreter's notes and told him not to discuss the meeting with anyone, including other U.S. officials, the Post reported.

The paper said Trump's handling of the Hamburg meeting was "part of a broader pattern by the president of shielding his communications with Putin from public scrutiny and preventing even high-ranking officials in his own administration from fully knowing what he has told one of the United States’ main adversaries."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2019/01/13/trump-putin-meetings-interpreter-notes/2565471002/

I'm pretty sure such actions are illegal.  Unfortunately I think the applicable laws were written with the assumption that no President would actually break such obvious and necessary laws so penalties and procedures for prosecution were not specified.

 

Considering Trump's contempt for laws with actual penalties, what are the chances he'd pay attention to laws with no penalties specified?

 

Ethics requirements for POTUS and other elected officials, and the penalties for violating them, need to be seriously rethought and rewritten now that Trump has demonstrated what can go wrong.

[Chomper Higgot]

On 2/23/2024 at 11:26 PM, Skipalongcassidy said:

• Establishes in law that any incumbent Presidential records (whether textual or electronic) held on courtesy storage by the Archivist remain in the exclusive legal custody of the President and that any request or order for access to such records must be made to the President, not NARA.

So when Trump was no longer President and the Biden administration demanded the return of classified documents that Trump had removed to Mar A Largo?

[placeholder]

50 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I'm pretty sure such actions are illegal.  Unfortunately I think the applicable laws were written with the assumption that no President would actually break such obvious and necessary laws so penalties and procedures for prosecution were not specified.

 

Considering Trump's contempt for laws with actual penalties, what are the chances he'd pay attention to laws with no penalties specified?

 

Ethics requirements for POTUS and other elected officials, and the penalties for violating them, need to be seriously rethought and rewritten now that Trump has demonstrated what can go wrong.

I wonder if anyone from the Biden administration has questioned the translator about his recollections of the meeting. Presumably, while a President can keep confidential the substance of his conversations with a foreign official while he's in office, once out of office that authority should vanish.

[ozimoron]

29 minutes ago, placeholder said:

I wonder if anyone from the Biden administration has questioned the translator about his recollections of the meeting. Presumably, while a President can keep confidential the substance of his conversations with a foreign official while he's in office, once out of office that authority should vanish.

 

I believe it doesn't. Kind of a special case for translators. Don't hold me to it but I recall reading that.

[Roo Island]

This isn't news. Trump and his lawyers try to dismiss and delay every court case against him. And so they should. That's their job.

[Walker88]

10 hours ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

Unlike you I do have an advanced degree from an accredited university... TDS is a mental disease... help is available but you have to want to get better.

"Accredited" sounds like 3rd or 4th tier.

 

Now if you had said "top", that would suggest an Ivy, or MIT, CalTech or Stanford. However, you didn't say "top"

 

I can say for me, a "top" Ivy and another "top" university for my advanced degree.

 

Heck, I even turned down the school trump's dad got him into, where one professor said trump was the dumbest student he ever had. I had two better choices than Wharton, and chose the best.

[Danderman123]

It's striking that no Trump fan here has supported Trump's claim of presidential immunity.

[Walker88]

2 hours ago, Skipalongcassidy said:

But my dick is bigger than yours...HAHAHA

 

 

You started this exchange and took a shot claiming I lacked an "advanced degree from an accredited university". You lost.

 

You just lost again.

 

If it's any consolation, your hero, who was similarly shortchanged by an impish Universe, got a tryst with Stormy, though she did laugh at his "boyish charm" (trying to be a bit polite here). It only cost him $130,000, and an upcoming trial where Stormy will take the stand. In order to prove her bonafides, she will be asked by the prosecution to describe that donny "charm" for all the world to hear. Her testimony will likely be corroborated by Karen McDougal, and maybe even Marla Maples. Prosecution might even take a shot and call Ivanka to the stand.

 

 

[Walker88]

12 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

It's striking that no Trump fan here has supported Trump's claim of presidential immunity.

Though I might be giving them more credit than due, perhaps they understand that trump's continual demands of immunity are an outright admission that he is guilty of all charges, from theft of documents to trying to overthrow the government. trump just thinks he's entitled to any crime he chooses to commit.