Only one in four British Muslims believe Hamas committed murder and rape in Israel, report

[Brickleberry]

10 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   A difficult question for Americans, Australians , Canadians and Kiwis .

We can do it, but Jews cannot .

Not even taking into considering that the West Bank was once Jewish land and America, Australia , Canada and Kiwi was never White peoples land .

   (Buts that's enough history from me , but I may as well reply to your soon to be reply : The Philistines were nothing to do with the Palestinians) 

 

The problem is that argument hinges on everything being the same now, as it was then in the past. Wrong!

 

These days, acquiring land by force is illegal (unlike when Britain, France, Spain etc. took over countries). These conventions were signed after WW11, in 1945. Israel is also a signatory.

[placnx]

37 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

  The rights to land can easily be changed  , just ask the Americans, Australians and New Zealanders for advice on how to do it 

That was in the early days of colonialism. The end of WW2 was the time for decolonization, except for Israel which resurrected the British occupation laws from 1967 to run apartheid in the West Bank.

[placnx]

14 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

You're both talking nonsense. You are talking about Israeli citizens, not Palestinians. Arab Israelis can indeed serve in the IDF.

Sorry, I just checked. Israeli Arabs can indeed volunteer to serve in the IDF.

[Nick Carter icp]

23 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

You're both talking nonsense. You are talking about Israeli citizens, not Palestinians. Arab Israelis can indeed serve in the IDF.

 

   Eeeeeerm Arab Israelis are Palestinians .

They stayed in Israel and accepted the Israeli state and got Israeli citizenship .

Those who rejected the state of Israel , fled the ..............................jeeez enough history , lets get back on topic .

   Why can t you guys learn some history for yourselves  , instead of keep saying things that are historically wrong ?

[Hummin]

30 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   A difficult question for Americans, Australians , Canadians and Kiwis .

We can do it, but Jews cannot .

Not even taking into considering that the West Bank was once Jewish land and America, Australia , Canada and Kiwi was never White peoples land .

   (Buts that's enough history from me , but I may as well reply to your soon to be reply : The Philistines were nothing to do with the Palestinians) 

I have been called a Hamas apologists over and over even I only point out why things happens, while you guys are pro stealing land, killing and abuse larger population and do knot even realize how bad you guys carry yourselves in the debate, totally blinded by propaganda and lack of self awareness. 

[candide]

2 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   So you will accept forcing 700 000 people from the land , ethically cleansing Jews from the West Bank, you would agree to genocide ?

   Romans forcibly removed Jews from the land 2000 years ago and you would be in favour of a Jews removal 2024 ?

 

They have settled there illegally and their presence has been imposed by force. Additionally, they will never accept to be ruled by Palestinians.

 

Be realistic, there is no practical way it can work on short-term or even middle-term. Both Israeli settlers remaining inside a Palestinian State, and Palestinian refugees returning to Israel are completely illusory options

 

It could be that on a longer term (like 50 years) the two States may make a reciprocal agreement, but not on short-term.

 

Of course, there will be some border adjustments in case of a two-State solution, to include some settlements located near the border.

[Nick Carter icp]

14 minutes ago, candide said:

They have settled there illegally and their presence has been imposed by force. Additionally, they will never accept to be ruled by Palestinians.

 

Be realistic, there is no practical way it can work on short-term or even middle-term. Both Israeli settlers remaining inside a Palestinian State, and Palestinian refugees returning to Israel are completely illusory options

 

It could be that on a longer term (like 50 years) the two States may make a reciprocal agreement, but not on short-term.

 

Of course, there will be some border adjustments in case of a two-State solution, to include some settlements located near the border.

 

Isn't there a genocide happening and all the Palestinians will all be wiped out soon ?

Wont Palestinians be non existent by the end of this war ?

[Nick Carter icp]

1 hour ago, Hummin said:

I have been called a Hamas apologists over and over even I only point out why things happens, while you guys are pro stealing land, killing and abuse larger population and do knot even realize how bad you guys carry yourselves in the debate, totally blinded by propaganda and lack of self awareness. 

 

    This is about  the 2 nd Yom Kippur war and the reason for this war is because Palestinians tried to steal Israeli land and I have no problem with Israel killing those murderous rapist baby killing war criminals 

[Brickleberry]

13 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

    This is about  the 2 nd Yom Kippur war and the reason for this war is because Palestinians tried to steal Israeli land and I have no problem with Israel killing those murderous rapist baby killing war criminals 

 

Nope, wrong again. Yom Kippur was Egypt and Syria attacking Israel 50 years ago, and there was only ever ONE, not two.

 

It had nothing to do with Palestinians, or stealing any land. In fact, this war had a significant impact on the trajectory of an eventual peace process between Egypt and Israel, which culminated in the return of the entire Sinai Peninsula to Egypt in exchange for lasting peace.

 

So actually, it was the Israelis who were giving back land they had stolen (again!!!).

 

FYI rape & dead babies have both been found to be false. 

[Nick Carter icp]

7 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Nope, wrong again. Yom Kippur was Egypt and Syria attacking Israel 50 years ago, and there was only ever ONE, not two.

 

 

   It doesn't matter who the opponents are .

Israel had a war in 1973 which happened on Yom Kippur and thus was called the Yom Kippur war.

Israel had another war in 2023 which also happened on Yom Kippur and is called the 2 nd Yom Kippur war .

   Yom Kippur is an Israeli holiday , Yom Kippur isn't a pair of Arab Countries 

[Nick Carter icp]

20 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

FYI rape & dead babies have both been found to be false. 

 

   What about the taking of babies as hostages , which is a war crime .

Was that found to be false ?

[cooked]

15 hours ago, placnx said:

SInce when can Palestinians join the army? Druze can, though. Army service confers various advantages, so Palestinians are disadvantaged.

According to the "Palestinians" everyone living in that area is a Palestinian. Arabs living in Israel can do all of that and more. They aren't interested in participating in the Gaza conflict.

[stevenl]

24 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   What about the taking of babies as hostages , which is a war crime .

Was that found to be false ?

Better not talk about war crimes.

[cooked]

17 hours ago, candide said:

And as I already replied, it's a false equivalence.

Palestinian people living in Israel were already living there before the creation of Israel. They are not settlers imposed by force like Israeli settlers in the West Bank.

If Israel refuses that Palestinians can settle in Israel (for understandable reasons from their side), there is no reason to accept that Israelis may have a right to settle in the West Bank. One of the basic principle of fair international law is reciprocity.

Jews were always present in the area, before Islam invaded and bloodily expelled the original inhabitants, including Christians, from large parts of the Middle East including Turkey. The Crusades that the Islamists complain about so bitterly were caused by the mistreatment of Christians and Christian holy places in Israel, as well as the closing of the trade routes and wholesale slave raiding committed by the Arabd throughout the Mediterranean and even up to Iceland and England. I wish we could get away from complaints about what happened many generations ago and try to find a rational solution based on the present situation.

[stevenl]

2 minutes ago, cooked said:

Jews were always present in the area, before Islam invaded and bloodily expelled the original inhabitants, including Christians, from large parts of the Middle East including Turkey. The Crusades that the Islamists complain about so bitterly were caused by the mistreatment of Christians and Christian holy places in Israel, as well as the closing of the trade routes and wholesale slave raiding committed by the Arabd throughout the Mediterranean and even up to Iceland and England . I wish we could get away from complaints about what happened many generations ago and try to find a rational solution based on the present situation.

"I wish we could get away from complaints about what happened many generations ago and try to find a rational solution based on the present situation."

 

He says while referring to what happened many generations ago.

[Brickleberry]

2 hours ago, cooked said:

Jews were always present in the area, before Islam invaded and bloodily expelled the original inhabitants, including Christians, from large parts of the Middle East including Turkey. The Crusades that the Islamists complain about so bitterly were caused by the mistreatment of Christians and Christian holy places in Israel, as well as the closing of the trade routes and wholesale slave raiding committed by the Arabd throughout the Mediterranean and even up to Iceland and England. I wish we could get away from complaints about what happened many generations ago and try to find a rational solution based on the present situation.

 

Wrong.

Arabs were always present in the area, before Jews invaded Canaan from Iraq circa 3,000 years ago. 

It was the Roman Empire that cleared out the Jews in the 5th century, not 'Islam'

Islam cleared out the Romans and allowed Jews to live with Arabs for over 1,500 years.

Crusades were to reclaim the holy land - nothing to do with mistreatment of Christians. Crusades were meant to stop the expansion of Muslim states, to reclaim for Christianity the Holy Land in the Middle East, and to recapture territories that had formerly been Christian.

[Brickleberry]

4 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   It doesn't matter who the opponents are .

Israel had a war in 1973 which happened on Yom Kippur and thus was called the Yom Kippur war.

Israel had another war in 2023 which also happened on Yom Kippur and is called the 2 nd Yom Kippur war .

   Yom Kippur is an Israeli holiday , Yom Kippur isn't a pair of Arab Countries 

 

Wrong again. I can see why you don't like talking about the history, because your always wrong!

 

2023 is the Gaza conflict - not the 2nd Yom Kippur war.... I'm well aware it is an Israeli holiday, and in 2023, it fell in September - almost 2 months after the start of Gaza. 

[stevenl]

3 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Wrong again. I can see why you don't like talking about the history, because your always wrong!

 

2023 is the Gaza conflict - not the 2nd Yom Kippur war.... I'm well aware it is an Israeli holiday, and in 2023, it fell in September - almost 2 months after the start of Gaza. 

2 weeks before Gaza, but yes, Yom kippur 2 is nonsense.

[Nick Carter icp]

8 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Wrong again. I can see why you don't like talking about the history, because your always wrong!

 

2023 is the Gaza conflict - not the 2nd Yom Kippur war.... I'm well aware it is an Israeli holiday, and in 2023, it fell in September - almost 2 months after the start of Gaza. 

 

   Seriously, does it really matter what the war is called ?

This current war began on the same date as the first Yom Kippur war and thus is called the 2 nd Yom Kippur war (By some people, but you can call it what you like )

    This war in Gaza began on October 7 th and Yom Kippur was September 25 which is a difference of 10 days , rather than 2 months .

[metisdead]

An off topic post about stabbings in a shopping center in Sydney, Australia has been removed, there is a topic about that running here:

 

 

[Brickleberry]

20 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Seriously, does it really matter what the war is called ?

This current war began on the same date as the first Yom Kippur war and thus is called the 2 nd Yom Kippur war (By some people, but you can call it what you like )

    This war in Gaza began on October 7 th and Yom Kippur was September 25 which is a difference of 10 days , rather than 2 months .

 

Wrong again. The ONLY Yom Kippur (or Ramadan war, or The 4th Israeli war as it is also known) war was fought on the 6th of October in 1973. Gaza happened on the 7th of October. 

 

I meant two weeks, not sure why I wrote 2 months. My old age finally getting to me?

[Brickleberry]

26 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Seriously, does it really matter what the war is called ?

This current war began on the same date as the first Yom Kippur war and thus is called the 2 nd Yom Kippur war (By some people, but you can call it what you like )

    This war in Gaza began on October 7 th and Yom Kippur was September 25 which is a difference of 10 days , rather than 2 months .

 

It wasn't just the name of the war, or the dates. You also got the participants wrong. You said it was Palestinians, it wasn't. It was Egypt and Syria.

Wrong on SO many levels.

[Nick Carter icp]

1 minute ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Wrong again. The ONLY Yom Kippur (or Ramadan war, or The 4th Israeli war as it is also known) war was fought on the 6th of October in 1973. Gaza happened on the 7th of October. 

 

I meant two weeks, not sure why I wrote 2 months. My old age finally getting to me?

 

   You should have written ten days and not 2 months or two weeks  .

Here is a Reddit group called the 2 nd Yom Kippur war , and its about the current war which began on Oct 7 th ,  it is  pro Israeli and that's we we pro Israelis call it there .

   Bur fair enough, some other people may refer to it as something else though 

 

   https://www.reddit.com/r/2ndYomKippurWar/

[Nick Carter icp]

8 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

It wasn't just the name of the war, or the dates. You also got the participants wrong. You said it was Palestinians, it wasn't. It was Egypt and Syria.

Wrong on SO many levels.

 

    I was talking about the current war when I referred to the Palestinians and not the previous wars   

[Nick Carter icp]

4 hours ago, stevenl said:

Better not talk about war crimes.

 

   Please do , everyone keeps making war crime accusations and not one person has actually stated what so called war crimes they are talking about , even after being asked numerous times 

[stevenl]

16 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Please do , everyone keeps making war crime accusations and not one person has actually stated what so called war crimes they are talking about , even after being asked numerous times 

I would trust the UN human rights council over an AN poster.

[Hummin]

14 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Please do , everyone keeps making war crime accusations and not one person has actually stated what so called war crimes they are talking about , even after being asked numerous times 

In a war that is almost sealed off from i independent witnesses, there is hard to have everything documented and verified.

 

Im sure you have read a few things,.but for what reasons I do not understand,  you have to turn the blind eye to it, 

 

But here you go.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crimes_in_the_Israel–Hamas_war

[Nick Carter icp]

3 minutes ago, Hummin said:

In a war that is almost sealed off from i independent witnesses, there is hard to have everything documented and verified.

 

Im sure you have read a few things,.but for what reasons I do not understand,  you have to turn the blind eye to it, 

 

But here you go.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crimes_in_the_Israel–Hamas_war

 

   Could you just write them yourself ?

So that I can reply to you and I don't have to talk to a wiki page 

So, could you state what war crimes Israel has committed ?

[Nick Carter icp]

5 minutes ago, stevenl said:

I would trust the UN human rights council over an AN poster.

 

  What did the UN human rights council say ?

[Nick Carter icp]

7 minutes ago, Hummin said:

In a war that is almost sealed off from i independent witnesses, there is hard to have everything documented and verified.

 

Im sure you have read a few things,.but for what reasons I do not understand,  you have to turn the blind eye to it, 

 

But here you go.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crimes_in_the_Israel–Hamas_war

 

  Interesting , you link contains this paragraph .

I trust that you agree with your own link that you provided 

 

 

 

"According to Israeli military forensic teams, eyewitness testimony, and reported photographic, documentary and video evidence, Hamas militants raped, assaulted, and mutilated Israeli women and girls during the attacks on Israel on October 7, 2023.^[80][81] Military personnel reported that the bodies of the victims of the October 7 attacks showed multiple signs of rape and "severe stages of abuse". Hamas was accused of gender-based violence, war crimes, and crimes against humanity.