British Pensioner Struggles with Frozen Pension in Thailand

[webfact]

 

An 87-year-old British woman is grappling with her move to Thailand as she struggles to survive on a UK state pension frozen at just £300 per month, equivalent to approximately 14,000 baht.

 

Christine Gloria Fox relocated to Thailand’s east coast near Pattaya 24 years ago to be closer to her family. Instead of enjoying her retirement, nearly all her pension is consumed by healthcare costs. Due to a UK policy, Fox’s pension has remained static since her move, as the UK does not uprate pensions in certain countries.

 

Fox now longs to return to the UK. However, deteriorating health has rendered her unfit to fly, imposing significant financial strain on her and her son, Jon Fox, aged 63. Jon, who has resided in Thailand for 35 years, constructed a modest studio apartment for his mother behind his car rental business.

 

“She’s taken too many tumbles. She can’t walk properly, falls over frequently, and has worsening vision. We’re trying to gather £5,000 to £6,000 for her eye operation,” Jon explained. 

 

Despite Christine’s intense desire to return to the UK, local doctors have yet to grant her a fit-to-fly certificate, anchoring her in Thailand. Jon and his daughter contribute significantly, doubling Christine’s income to cover essential living and healthcare expenses. 

 

 

“That’s just for necessities, not luxuries like handbags,” Jon added. The financial burden has been compounded by the COVID-19 pandemic, which has further strained their finances. 

 

This situation affects around 500,000 British citizens living outside Europe, who do not receive annual state pension increases. According to iNews UK, retirees in countries like Australia and Canada face similar challenges due to this UK policy. 

 

Christine remains deeply regretful about her decision to move and has voiced her dissatisfaction. She believes she would have been better off staying in the UK.

 

The Department for Work and Pensions maintains that information about the financial implications of moving abroad is available on its website.

 

Picture courtesy: Head Topics UK

 

-- 2024-06-01

 

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[sidneybear]

That's sad. There's no reason, other than cruelty, for the British government to freeze overseas pensions of people who have paid National Insurance all their lives.

[Hornell]

Many attempts have been made to get a UK Government to pay all UK expatriates the State pension that is rightfully theirs: all have fallen on stoney ground for reasons that are pretty incomprehensible to those of us on the receiving end. We have paid our NI contributions all our working lives (one assumes!) and we make no demands on the NHS. Private and Government Department (eg armed forces) pensions receive the annual increase; only the 'Old Age ' pension does not. It's not right, whatever the reasons to do with inter-country tax arrangements that are glibly trotted out. I feel very sorry for Mrs Fox and there will be many others in many countries around the world in a similar situation. It is no comfort to be told that we knew of (or should have known) about the regulation before we moved; it still doesn't make it right.

[freeworld]

A lesson to all the digital nomads roaming about the world living in the present and not worrying about the future and retirement money and benefits.

[freeworld]

13 minutes ago, sidneybear said:

That's sad. There's no reason, other than cruelty, for the British government to freeze overseas pensions of people who have paid National Insurance all their lives.

Sorry sounds harsh but while one sympathises and that they could return to the UK where the govt should take care of them at that age the conditions they are in are solely of their choice.

 

The govt is one thing but one has a personal responsibility to also make private financial arrangements for health and retirement and has a choice to not have ventured to Thailand to reside without considering longetivity and future health and financial requirements.

[ChaiyaTH]

Governments are crooks, people work 30-40 years to then get screwed over being paid out, if living abroad. This while if you not pay tax and save up money yourself, and then add the same compound interest, it takes like half the time or half the money with the same time. Same with suddenly increasing ages from like originally 65 it's now at 71 for people my age. 1/4 guys not even make it to that age.

[Chris Daley]

Put the man in prison for illegally owning a business.  Get the woman on the 90 days treadmill.

[sidneybear]

55 minutes ago, freeworld said:

Sorry sounds harsh but while one sympathises and that they could return to the UK where the govt should take care of them at that age the conditions they are in are solely of their choice.

 

The govt is one thing but one has a personal responsibility to also make private financial arrangements for health and retirement and has a choice to not have ventured to Thailand to reside without considering longetivity and future health and financial requirements.

I think you're missing the point. In Britain, you only get a pension if you pay into National Insurance before retirement age. It isn't a free pension. Why should people who leave be penalised, when they've paid in?

[MalcolmB]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

survive on a UK state pension frozen at just £300 per month, equivalent to approximately 14,000 baht.

Which is a lot more than most Thais get from their government.

Son must be useless.

[SAFETY FIRST]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

UK state pension frozen at just £300 per month, equivalent to approximately 14,000 baht.

 

This situation affects around 500,000 British 

This explains why we have so many miserable, moaning people here on this forum. 

 

Who can survive on this little money? 

 

[DaLa]

Would it make more sense to lobby the Thai government to enter into a reciprocal social security agreement with the UK government. An increase in all those 'frozen' pensions would result in £ entering the country and ฿ in the economy. If the Philippines have the facility/legislation then it can't be rocket science for it to be introduced here.

[charleskerins]

fit to fly???

[cnx101]

Disgusting, the British government, F,,, the British people take care of the immigrants 

[Celsius]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Fox now longs to return to the UK.

 

As will many Brits who bash UK and NHS 

[wensiensheng]

1 hour ago, Hornell said:

Many attempts have been made to get a UK Government to pay all UK expatriates the State pension that is rightfully theirs: all have fallen on stoney ground for reasons that are pretty incomprehensible to those of us on the receiving end. We have paid our NI contributions all our working lives (one assumes!) and we make no demands on the NHS. Private and Government Department (eg armed forces) pensions receive the annual increase; only the 'Old Age ' pension does not. It's not right, whatever the reasons to do with inter-country tax arrangements that are glibly trotted out. I feel very sorry for Mrs Fox and there will be many others in many countries around the world in a similar situation. It is no comfort to be told that we knew of (or should have known) about the regulation before we moved; it still doesn't make it right.

There is nothing that says this lady paid NI all her life. She might have, or she might have been a wife and mother who stayed at home while her husband worked and paid NI.

 

the rules might be regarded as wrong by some, right by others, but they are the rules and people take personal decisions based on them. Perhaps she didn’t think she would live so long?

[Georgealbert]

Yes it is not fair, but being realistic it is not going to change, however many online petitions or stories like this appear.

 

The UK pension is a 100 years old next year, here is the history of why it remains frozen in Thailand.

 

1925 - Pension introduced and only payable in Great Britain, Northern Ireland and Isle Of Man.

 

1929 - The Contributory Pension Act, which allowed pensions to be paid in HM’s Dominions (as a means of encouraging emigration to countries of the ‘British Empire’).

 

1946 - The National Insurance Act and Regulations, provide that the pension was typically not paid abroad, except it was payable for pensioners in HM Dominions, or when an absence abroad didn’t exceed 12 months.

 

1948 - The first pension increase was from 10 shillings to 26 shillings per week.  This significant increase was not paid abroad because the pensioners concerned were deemed not to have made sufficient contribution to the new insurance scheme.

 

1948 to 1981 - First reciprocal agreements with France, Italy, Switzerland, the Netherlands and Luxembourg provided for uprating. There was a special arrangement for UK pensioners living in Ireland to also receive the state pension, but they didn’t receive the uprating until 1966. Later UK negotiated reciprocal agreements with 30 countries which allowed for uprating  (Barbados; Bermuda; Bosnia-Herzegovina; Croatia; Guernsey; Isle of Man; Israel; Jamaica; Jersey; Mauritius; Montenegro; the Philippines; Serbia; Turkey; the United States of America; and, the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia plus all EU countries)

 

1955 - Pensions became payable anywhere in the world, but without uprating, without a reciprocal agreement.

 

So in 99 years of the pension, there has never been any uprating in Thailand, and before 1955 there would be nothing paid.

 

 

[prakhonchai nick]

 

An 87-year-old British woman is grappling with her move to Thailand as she struggles to survive on a UK state pension frozen at just £300 per month, equivalent to approximately 14,000 baht.

 

In reality it is likely £300 every 28 days.

 

Up here in Isaan, most labourers earn less than 14,000bt/month, but manage to support a wife and family on that!

 

Healthcare problems affect us all.............that is why it is essential that every foreigner contemplating a full time move to Thailand has adequate health insurance

 

 

 

[NorthernRyland]

1 hour ago, freeworld said:

Sorry sounds harsh but while one sympathises and that they could return to the UK where the govt should take care of them at that age the conditions they are in are solely of their choice.

 

The govt is one thing but one has a personal responsibility to also make private financial arrangements for health and retirement and has a choice to not have ventured to Thailand to reside without considering longetivity and future health and financial requirements.

 

This makes no sense and provides no reasons why the government has this policy against certain countries. They paid in equally so why does it matter where they live?

 

"sounds harsh but" means what exactly? "It sounds harsh I had to kick his teeth in but he deserved it". like that you mean?

[NorthernRyland]

5 minutes ago, cnx101 said:

Disgusting, the British government, F,,, the British people take care of the immigrants 

Prime minister is an immigrant. If you think just because someone has papers or was born in a certain place that they're "of" that people you're sadly mistaken. 

[Felton Jarvis]

This is surprising to me. I always thought the UK had a functioning welfare state. This is the kind of thing I associate with my home country, America. Very sad to see this woman in this kind of distress.

[Blueman1]

1 hour ago, Chris Daley said:

Put the man in prison for illegally owning a business.  Get the woman on the 90 days treadmill.

YOU Very SAD Person......

[transam]

27 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

This explains why we have so many miserable, moaning people here on this forum. 

 

Who can survive on this little money? 

 

Well you go get a job then.........

[milesinnz]

So the British government says please stay in Britain and be a burden on the hospital and social services as they dont have enough to do. Good thinking Batman

 

[transam]

5 minutes ago, surfinglife said:

Bloody windging poms as usual. In some countries the pension is not portable, you can only claim it if you live there (e.g. New Zealand). So consider yourselves lucky and stop windging. 

You are the one that is "whinging", and I bet she can spell it..........

[Blueman1]

31 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

This explains why we have so many miserable, moaning people here on this forum. 

 

Who can survive on this little money? 

 

Who can survive on this little money?....I HAVE To, I've Got NO CHOICE !!

[OneMoreFarang]

2 hours ago, sidneybear said:

That's sad. There's no reason, other than cruelty, for the British government to freeze overseas pensions of people who have paid National Insurance all their lives.

There is no reason, or you don't want to see the obvious reason?

a) If she spends the money in the UK then this is part of the UK economy.

b) If she spends money in Thailand the money is lost for the UK.

Why should the UK government support b)?

 

 

[ronster]

I doubt she would get much in the UK after being away so long .

I returned during COVID and tried to claim disability benefits as I can't work due to my disabilities. Was told I couldn't get anything from any place I applied as I would need be in the country 2 years before being able to claim .

Is her son allowed to run a car rental business ? Thought a bunch of Russians got arrested last month for that 😀

[OneMoreFarang]

If she can't fly maybe there is a ship to the UK.

No problem if it takes a little longer.

[Homburg]

53 minutes ago, sidneybear said:

I think you're missing the point. In Britain, you only get a pension if you pay into National Insurance before retirement age. It isn't a free pension. Why should people who leave be penalised, when they've paid in?

Much of the pension money paid by UK government to pensioners resident in the UK is recovered through taxes paid by the pensioners in the UK.  These taxes are recovered through a variety of means - Council Tax, VAT, fuel taxes, IPT, taxes on the businesses that pensioners buy from (including supermarkets), etc.  These taxes cannot be recovered for non-resident pensioners who therefore cost the government more than resident pensioners, so the government "freezes" these pensions in order to compensate.

[ChumpChange]

Hub of financially unfit expat sob stories.