American man arrested for allegedly abusing 14-year-old Thai student

[MalcolmB]

35 minutes ago, PuiPuiHarry said:

For only holding hands and hugging ? ?

Oh wait... it is the USA, where a jogging Afro-American can be shot as seen by WHITE people as a criminal.

He had Leroy in his name but in the photo he definitely looked like he was a Caucasian 

[LukKrueng]

15 minutes ago, chippendale said:

He looks malnutritioned and poorly dressed. Typical English teacher in Thailand, therefore.

 

He's off to Thai jail, then deportation and banned, with a criminal record as a child abuser in his native USA, ..... and all he got for his troubles was a little "holding hands and hugging".

Not sure how it works usually, but I think there should be a trial first, then conviction and only then sentencing.

Yet so many on AN already sentenced him....

[terryofcrete]

3 hours ago, Hakuna Matata said:

 

OMG, those perky Americans are committing crimes in Thailand once again? Stricter visa rules are required for citizens of countries like United States, Great Britain, Poland, Romania, Lithuania, Belarus, Russia, Ukraine, China, Kazakhstan, Korea, etc. to allow them to enter Thailand.

So who Will you let in commander? 

[bradiston]

1 hour ago, Wake Up1 said:

Why does a grown 41year old man allow a 14 year female old student alone in his condo ? Does not take a rocket scientist to answer this question. 

No. It takes sworn in witnesses, evidence, a judge, lawyers and a sworn in jury.

 

You're right though. Rocket science is quite useless in this situation.

[bradiston]

3 hours ago, Oliver Holzerfilled said:

Let's see his photo.  Dollars to doughnuts he looks like an obvious pedo.

You'll not be required for jury service.

[BritScot]

3 hours ago, Hakuna Matata said:

 

OMG, those perky Americans are committing crimes in Thailand once again? Stricter visa rules are required for citizens of countries like United States, Great Britain, Poland, Romania, Lithuania, Belarus, Russia, Ukraine, China, Kazakhstan, Korea, etc. to allow them to enter Thailand.

So bizzar, I not sure if satire but if ment, it's crazy. Yes, stop all foreign tourists entry to Thailand! Turn it into a North Korea. Have every tourist that dares to come, have them guided and followed. Then if they break any law just torture them to near death then send them back only to die days later!!! Be thankful for every tourist and expat that decides to visit or stay. Start taking care of then because one-day you may wakeup and they are gone!!! There are good and bad in every corner of the world including Thailand. 

[steven100]

This thread has gotten out of hand ....    let's stick to the facts   :  

 

*  It doesn't matter where he's from .. he could be from the UK, Pakistan, Argentina or wherever.

*  It is completely wrong and dangerous to take any young girl, child, boy, anyone into your room alone.

*  Even for teaching privately, there should be another adult friend with the student. 

 

It's quite simple to understand.   

[Gknrd]

I agree it is not right for a teacher to take a child to his condo.  Reading this I am sure the police have more evidence than just holding hands and a hug?

[Jiggo]

Something about this story does not add up, this supposed to have happened on 16th February and he has just been questioned about it.

Also hugging and holding hands at his Condo, not a sexual assault just unprofessional and strange behaviour.

[dunroaming]

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

I am all against any kind of child abuse, and I think that even attempting to have sex with a girl that young is is absolutely heinous. But they did come right out and say that he held hands with her and hugged her, so there was no sex. No nudity. Nothing horrible happened, as far as we know.

 

Granted, taking her back to his condo was improper, and very poor judgment, as was holding her hand and hugging her.

The guy is obviously not normal, but is he a pervert?

Is he engaging in child abuse?

Did he molest her?

 

Those are all very serious questions that need to be asked, and they need to be answered in a rational fashion. Society is way too quick to pronounce judgment in a situation like this. And these are the kind of judgments that can completely destroy a man's life on multiple levels. 

 

I agree with you and I think there is more to this account that has been reported here.  It would be useful to know if there are any other complaints been laid against this man in the past.  Sounds like it could be the early days of a grooming process if he just held her hand and hugged her.  But then this could just be the girls description of what happened.  Clearly she is in a lot of trouble with her parents and may be trying to play down any activity that actually happened.

 

Fourteen year old girls often develop crushes on teachers and he being American could be an extra attraction. The fact that the girl lied about where she was shows a level of complicity.  But that is why teachers like this must never cross the line nor get even close to it.

[Irish star]

Schools need better Vetting , but these creepy silent types are hard to figure 

[Irish star]

1 hour ago, MalcolmB said:

He had Leroy in his name but in the photo he definitely looked like he was a Caucasian 

Southerner in America maybe 

[steven100]

4 minutes ago, Irish star said:

Southerner in America maybe 

again ... it's got absolutely nothing to do with where he's from or his name ...

stop trying to stir trouble ....  

[spidermike007]

4 hours ago, Andrew65 said:

Japan invests multi-billions in Thailand, I don't think insisting on Japanese golfers having to get a Thai visa before travelling would go down very well! There's always Malaysia - Truly Asia instead.😊

Also, the Thais would want to keep it in perspective, XXX,000 Japanese people visit Thaland every year, and probably XXX (number) get in trouble with the law. (Replace Japanese with just about any other nationality).

I totally agree, my guess is that the Japanese probably have one of the lowest percentage of visitors who commit crimes. Generally speaking they're pretty straight arrows, and I've always found them to be quite respectful in their behavior, other than the fact that some of them do have some slightly peculiar sexual tendencies, but as long as it's consensual, it's all good. 

[Sig]

I happen to know someone (very well) who had their life destroyed by unfounded accusations and an over zealous District Attorney (in the US). This article makes me remember that nightmare... and from what this article stated, there's nothing that I can see that is even remotely illegal. All the speculation is insane. You would think differently if you ever knew a decent guy who got caught up in the wrong place at the wrong time and said some stupid things to manipulative police, and went from a 160,000 USD/year job +bonuses (with 4 kids in private schools (now in grotesque government schools), a nice house, and 4 cars - 2 hobby cars and 2 luxury cars) to finding it extremely difficult to find a job, losing his million dollar house, and all but one car, (not to mention about $50,000 USD for bail and lawyer) after having pleaded out to a sexual crime that they were trying to throw him in State Prison for years, to a lesser crime, it was a very long and stressful year+ for him and family. And of course, his reputation is tainted forever in the community. The "authorities" (Sheriffs and Child Protection authority who kept up a threat of removing his daughters to State custody - with no reason other than their accusation, made up out of thin air, that he sexually abused them) couldn't care less about real evidence, just a conviction to keep their record looking good. It would take too long to explain, but it was a complete farce with somewhat similar undertones as the case here. The best thing for this guy to do is to not say a word to ANYONE - AT ALL - and get a lawyer as soon as the police arrested him.

[spidermike007]

11 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

 

I agree with you and I think there is more to this account that has been reported here.  It would be useful to know if there are any other complaints been laid against this man in the past.  Sounds like it could be the early days of a grooming process if he just held her hand and hugged her.  But then this could just be the girls description of what happened.  Clearly she is in a lot of trouble with her parents and may be trying to play down any activity that actually happened.

 

Fourteen year old girls often develop crushes on teachers and he being American could be an extra attraction. The fact that the girl lied about where she was shows a level of complicity.  But that is why teachers like this must never cross the line nor get even close to it.

Absolutely, it was truly a horrendous mistake, and no doubt the guy has learned his lesson if it was a relatively innocent mistake. I'm sure he will never do it again. Assuming there was nothing more that happened. If anything else happened I would guess that the daughter would talk about it.

 

In this world there are varying classes of mistakes, a simpler one is to wear white in New York City after Labor Day at a formal event. A whole more serious class  of mistake is for the Germans to invade Russia with the onset of winter coming, wearing buttons on their coats made of nickel, and the inability to factor in the weather. 

 

Slightly off topic, but in the vein of terrible mistakes. 

Rain and melting snow fell in early October, bringing with them the infamous rasputitsa, the muddy season that turned the Russian landscape into such a quagmire that vehicles sank to their axles. They had to be hauled out by teams of sweating soldiers whose boots also disappeared into the glutinous morass. Not only couldn't the combat troops advance, but neither could the supply trucks. Meanwhile, Soviet counterattack after Soviet counterattack, even if repelled, left German forces battered and exhausted.

 

Also unpleasant were the Soviet T-34 tanks. More heavily armed and armored than their Teutonic counterparts, the Germans gasped in dismay as their anti-tanks weapons bounced off the T-34's thick hide. To make matters worse, the T-34 had wide tracks, which gave it better maneuverability in the mud.

 

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/reboot/how-russian-winter-froze-hitler’s-nazi-empire-its-tracks-190821

[spidermike007]

2 minutes ago, Sig said:

I happen to know someone (very well) who had their life destroyed by unfounded accusations and an over zealous District Attorney (in the US). This article makes me remember that nightmare... and from what this article stated, there's nothing that I can see that is even remotely illegal. All the speculation is insane. You would think differently if you ever knew a decent guy who got caught up in the wrong place at the wrong time and said some stupid things to manipulative police, and went from a 160,000 USD/year job +bonuses (with 4 kids in private schools (now in grotesque government schools), a nice house, and 4 cars - 2 hobby cars and 2 luxury cars) to finding it extremely difficult to find a job, losing his million dollar house, and all but one car, (not to mention about $50,000 USD for bail and lawyer) after having pleaded out to a sexual crime that they were trying to throw him in State Prison for years, to a lesser crime, it was a very long and stressful year+ for him and family. And of course, his reputation is tainted forever in the community. The "authorities" (Sheriffs and Child Protection authority who kept up a threat of removing his daughters to State custody - with no reason other than their accusation, made up out of thin air, that he sexually abused them) couldn't care less about real evidence, just a conviction to keep their record looking good. It would take too long to explain, but it was a complete farce with somewhat similar undertones as the case here. The best thing for this guy to do is to not say a word to ANYONE - AT ALL - and get a lawyer as soon as the police arrested him.

The US is one of the most overzealous nations on earth when it comes to prosecuting underage crimes committed by US citizens, all over the world.

 

They are completely out of control. They will throw 5 to 10 million dollars at a conviction, and unless you're a centimillionaire and can afford to spend millions of dollars on a legal team, you are going to spend 10 years in a federal penitentiary for sex with a gal 16 or under. 

[spidermike007]

4 hours ago, Zack61 said:

No problems with this if he is guilty. All speculation and hearsay at this stage. 

Absolutely correct and though having sex with an underage gal is a crime and the punishment can be and should be very severe. Last I heard holding hands and hugging a 14-year-old in a consensual manner is a pretty minor crime, if a crime at all. A tremendous lack of judgment yes, a horrendous mistake yes, but a crime? I am not so sure about that. 

 

Granted, it would seem that many are willing to put the guy away for life, based on very thin facts and evidence. 

 

But is that right, is that justice? Or is that just symbolic of the state of netizen outrage in 2024? 

 

[couchpotato]

8 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Absolutely correct and though having sex with an underage gal is a crime and the punishment can be and should be very severe. Last I heard holding hands and hugging a 14-year-old in a consensual manner is a pretty minor crime, if a crime at all. A tremendous lack of judgment yes, a horrendous mistake yes, but a crime? I am not so sure about that. 

 

Granted, it would seem that many are willing to put the guy away for life, based on very thin facts and evidence. 

 

But is that right, is that justice? Or is that just symbolic of the state of netizen outrage in 2024? 

 

Normally your posts are very good, but you are way out of line on this one.

Intimacy with a minor is a crime.. not a minor indiscretion. 

[proton]

So what are the charges, is holding hands and hugging illegal? He did not kidnapp her, she went to his condo willingly. Strange case.

[BusyB]

4 hours ago, hotchilli said:

It's called grooming... one thing will lead to another given the opportunity.

 

At last! Someone's said it.

 

A teacher has no business holding hands or hugging students in their condos or anywhere else ... 

 

And the shame and confusion that kind of perverse behavior induces means it takes a while for the victims to come out about it.

 

The opportunity would have been provided, of that you can be sure.

 

[ujayujay]

5 hours ago, adrin said:

Just another day in Isan. Police could check every house there

You have no idea about geography.....Bang Khae District is not in Isaan 

[steven100]

37 minutes ago, proton said:

So what are the charges, is holding hands and hugging illegal? He did not kidnapp her, she went to his condo willingly. Strange case.

 

yes,  the headline says he was arrested for abusing a 14yr old.    Inciting her into his condo with intension of indecent conduct perhaps or words of similar ... 

but I think the cops are playing the Thai game of Ka-Ching ....    maybe. 

 

This is what the cops said :  

Keller faces charges including taking a child under fifteen for indecent purposes and abducting a minor from a parent or guardian.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[connda]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

On March 6, 2024, the mother learned from a schoolteacher that Keller had taken her daughter to his condo.

That was stupid beyond belief.  Ain't no way you want to ever be in a "he said, she said" situation were you are alone with an underage girl. It could very well be as innocent as just that - a hand hold and a hug after a study session.  But alone?  Dude was asking for trouble and unfortunately he found it.  Sucks to be him.  There are enough predatory men around that you have to give the girl the benefit of the doubt and go with her story. 
"Stupid is as stupid does," as Forrest's mama always said! 

[spidermike007]

51 minutes ago, couchpotato said:

Normally your posts are very good, but you are way out of line on this one.

Intimacy with a minor is a crime.. not a minor indiscretion. 

And you are defining intimacy as a hug? Really? I don't think a lawyer, nor the courts would agree. Unless this was California, maybe. Historically, prosecutors have rarely ever been able to get more than a misdemeanor charge for hugging. Though the anti-hugging movement is gaining steam. 

 

The movement to restrict hugging emerged in 1983 when Pam Church created the “Good-Touch/Bad-Touch” curriculum after learning that her children had been sexually abused. Designed to teach 1st- through 6th-grade students about abuse prevention, the curriculum has since been revised 11 times, is used by over 6,000 educators, and operates in most states. Age-appropriate programs teach children “body safety” rules through an interactive syllabus intended to help them feel confident in saying “no.” In 2005, the program was acquired by Childhelp, the leading nonprofit organization for preventing child abuse, which now operates under the name “Speak Up, Be Safe.” Almost 30 years after the implementation of Good-Touch/Bad-Touch, other related policies have been implemented by thousands of schools, churches, and childcare centers.

To thwart potentially inappropriate contact between their staff members and children, hordes of institutions across the country and around the world have instituted “hugging policies.” Some institutions have banned hugs of all kinds to prevent perceived sexual advances by staff members toward children and to protect their legal liability. Schools in New Jersey, Florida, Arizona, and elsewhere have made hugging an offense punishable by suspension or expulsion, even for children hugging one another.

 

https://www.cato.org/regulation/winter-2012-2013/pedophiles-regulation-hugging#the-anti-hugging-movement

 

 

[steven100]

There was a young guy named Keller

who turned out not such a shy fella

he met a girl from the school 

but he broke all the rules

and now mum knows the game 

it's put him all to shame 

and now he's gotta stand up and tell her ...

[stoner]

5 hours ago, NemoH said:

honestly only few cultures have pedos and SEA Asian countries traditionally don’t have pedos

 

how obtuse can you really be ?

 

 

[couchpotato]

23 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

And you are defining intimacy as a hug? Really? I don't think a lawyer, nor the courts would agree. Unless this was California, maybe. Historically, prosecutors have rarely ever been able to get more than a misdemeanor charge for hugging. Though the anti-hugging movement is gaining steam. 

 

The movement to restrict hugging emerged in 1983 when Pam Church created the “Good-Touch/Bad-Touch” curriculum after learning that her children had been sexually abused. Designed to teach 1st- through 6th-grade students about abuse prevention, the curriculum has since been revised 11 times, is used by over 6,000 educators, and operates in most states. Age-appropriate programs teach children “body safety” rules through an interactive syllabus intended to help them feel confident in saying “no.” In 2005, the program was acquired by Childhelp, the leading nonprofit organization for preventing child abuse, which now operates under the name “Speak Up, Be Safe.” Almost 30 years after the implementation of Good-Touch/Bad-Touch, other related policies have been implemented by thousands of schools, churches, and childcare centers.

To thwart potentially inappropriate contact between their staff members and children, hordes of institutions across the country and around the world have instituted “hugging policies.” Some institutions have banned hugs of all kinds to prevent perceived sexual advances by staff members toward children and to protect their legal liability. Schools in New Jersey, Florida, Arizona, and elsewhere have made hugging an offense punishable by suspension or expulsion, even for children hugging one another.

 

https://www.cato.org/regulation/winter-2012-2013/pedophiles-regulation-hugging#the-anti-hugging-movement

 

 

Your 2nd silly post..This is not the USA..it is Thailand which you definitely know different regulations apply. Interesting to know how you would feel if it was your 14 year daughter.

The guy is an idiot for doing what he did, and sadly (being Thailand, and a farang) he will suffer the consequences.

 

[topcat333]

The big news here is that he is American! It would have been big news if he was European or Japanese or a Monkey. Some of these things you read about stronger Visa rules or foreigners are bad for Thailand are just ridiculous. Thai's abuse their young as much as any other culture and it's a well know fact that many pedophiles come to places like Thailand or the Philippines because it's easier to do here than in their countries. What they should be talking about is more enforcement, more task forces, more resources and a greater public knowledge to make it less attractive for Thais or any other nationality to attempt such acts in Thailand. America and European countries have committed many resources to these people, and they work with countries like Thailand to share information. This has nothing to do with nationality. It's a human scum problem. 

[Hugh Jarse]

6 hours ago, Hakuna Matata said:

 

OMG, those perky Americans are committing crimes in Thailand once again? Stricter visa rules are required for citizens of countries like United States, Great Britain, Poland, Romania, Lithuania, Belarus, Russia, Ukraine, China, Kazakhstan, Korea, etc. to allow them to enter Thailand.

Don’t teachers need a criminal clearance check before working here as a teacher. It’s basic clearance the world over?