23 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Indeed, Tai Chi, Wing Chun, JKD, Taekwondo, all these things can be useful for flexibility, fitness and such. However, it would be very foolish to rely on Wing Chun, JKD or Taekwondo techniques you have learnt to defend yourself against a knife attack, because you will most likely end up very dead.

 

Equally, in a fight with a real fighter you will also end up badly injured, as Xu Xiaodong has shown with the various Kung Fu masters he demolished in under 2 minutes.

 

So when people say that Wing Chun, Kung Fu, JKD, Taekwondo and such are useless in a real fight, that is not just idle talk. It's reality.

As I wrote, if it's real combat one wants then join a school that teaches such. However, even then there are going to foam/rubber mats but in a real street fight it's more likely concrete that one will fall on to, and that might hurt a lot. Knife and stick attacks are something else and unless one in proficient in such combat...

Another point that people rarely consider is the motive for an attack. If the attacker just wants your money the you know they'll leave at some point but if the attack is by vengence or some life threatening agenda then options are much more limited. In the former you can have time to weigh things up but in the latter you don't have that 'luxury'.

41 minutes ago, parallelman said:

As I wrote, if it's real combat one wants then join a school that teaches such. However, even then there are going to foam/rubber mats but in a real street fight it's more likely concrete that one will fall on to, and that might hurt a lot. Knife and stick attacks are something else and unless one in proficient in such combat...

Another point that people rarely consider is the motive for an attack. If the attacker just wants your money the you know they'll leave at some point but if the attack is by vengence or some life threatening agenda then options are much more limited. In the former you can have time to weigh things up but in the latter you don't have that 'luxury'.

 

You make a good point. There are limits to realism in training.

 

However, clearly a martial art where sparring with an aggressive non-compliant partner is the norm, like with Boxing, Muay Thai etc, is closer to real fighting than a martial art where only compliant pupils gently jab at each other to learn technique, as is the case in Wing Chun, Wushu, JKD, Taekwondo or Aikido. 

 

So yes, whilst there are limits to realism in training, some arts train more real than others, and it is these arts that, unsurprisingly, prevail in the Octagon.

 

 

36 minutes ago, Thingamabob said:

I repeat, movies are mostly fantasy entertainment and should not be taken seriously.

 

 

I repeat, Bruce Lee was not just pretending to be a movie fighrter, he pretended in real life that he was a fighting savant and went so far as to concoct his own, totally ineffectual, martial art, based on false premises.

3 hours ago, phetphet said:

That Silat (Suffian Bela Diri) looks pretty handy in a knife fight. Maybe even in a street fight.

 

There's hardly or never a thing like a knife fight. 

 

Let's both pull our knifes and let's duel - engarde 😆 That was way in the old days or in Hollywood movies.

 

A knife is made to be felt and not to be seen

 

But Silat is fun to practice as like every other martial art there is. 

4 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

There is Tai Chi and Taekwondo in Jeet Kune Do

 

"As an eclectic martial art, it relies on a fighting style heavily influenced by Wing Chun, Tai Chi, taekwondo, boxing, fencing and jujutsu."

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeet_Kune_Do

 

Bruce Lee learnt Taekwondo techniques from hoongoo Rhee, who taught him the side kick in detail. He also learned aspects of Taekwondo from Chuck Norris, who was a Taekwondo instructor. Bruce Lee used Taekwondo techniques, like high kicks and spinning kicks, as building blocks for, Jeet Kune Do. 

 

Bruce's own father Lee Hoi Chuen.taught Tai Chi and passed on the fundamentals to Bruce Lee. Towards the end of his life Bruce Lee also studied Tai chi with  with Liang Zi Peng. Here's video of Bruce Lee demonstrating his Tai Chi moves. In fact Jesse Glover, whom you mentioned earlier has said that Bruce Lee was more obsessed with learning Tai Chi than learning Wing Chun, though it is the case that there are less Tai Chi elements in JKD than Wing Chun:

 

 

If you're still stuck in the "nucleus" then Carruthers obviously didn't teach you very well. Here is a quote from Bruce Lee himself on how the nucleus is only the first stage, and has to be overcome in JKD:

 

 "Now there are three stages in the cultivation of Jeet Kune Do, each of them interrelated. The first stage is “sticking to the nucleus”; the second stage, “liberation from the nucleus”; the third stage, “returning to the original freedom.”

 

https://jkdwednite.com/stages-in-the-cultivation-of-jeet-kune-do/

 

Either way it doesn't matter. Wing Chun is just as discredited as all forms of Kung Fu are, including Tai Chi. Taekwondo is equally  discredited in that it is useless in a real fight.

There is what he studied and what he would use and teach. I studied both JKD streams and my money is on nucleus...what he would use as conveyed by Ted wong and Jesse Glover and other OG students...Inosanto went and took another path.

 

As I said Tommy would rip your head off in under 30 seconds and I'd put every penny I own on it without seeing you...but that's my opinion and i cannot speak from him.

 

Thanks for uploading your physical condition...which will be some podgy expat boozebag 4sure....another paper tiger keboard jokey

 

You're just another armchair s-stirrer.

14 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

Well, because Jesse Glover was black.

 

 

Conditioned you mean...conditioned through practicing continually till they end...unlike you who probably practices raising beer glasses 7 days above that balloon belly you made through dedication.

 

4 minutes ago, freedomnow said:

I studied both JKD streams

 

You might as well have studied Origami, which is probably just as useful in a real fight as Jeet Kune Do. Don't rely on it in real life, for your own sake.

 

4 minutes ago, freedomnow said:

Tommy would rip your head off in under 30 seconds

 

Carruthers would "rip" nobody's head off, not in 30 minutes not in 30 hours, he' s an old man. As the substantially younger man I would easily defeat him.

 

But then this blind belief in the "master" is typical of Kung Fu, Wing Chun and Wushu and JKD. The guys that Xu Xiaodong defeated in under 2 minutes also had 80000 blind followers.

 

Me, I trust evidence.

6 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

I have actually fought a Pencak Silat master, I mean sparring, not for real obviously, and was very impressed. Indeed it seems like one of the more effective marital arts.

There are apparently several different Silat styles. You should look at some of this guys videos: https://silat.net/maul-mornie-the-bruneian-silat-master/

10 minutes ago, phetphet said:

There are apparently several different Silat styles. You should look at some of this guys videos: https://silat.net/maul-mornie-the-bruneian-silat-master/

 

He looks very impressive. I think Silat is a very underestimated martial art. They also incorporate sparring  in a serious way, which is why they are so good I think. When I met that Pencak Silat master he did some very impressive things. 

 

Yes,. there are different Silat styles, there is one in Southern Thailand as well, but the only one I saw was Pencak Silat, which was quite effective and impressive.

On 5/12/2025 at 8:31 PM, Cameroni said:

 

Hundred per cent accurate, running away is the best option in 99.9% of cases. But that assumes you are fit and able to run of course.

 

If you cannot even do that much, you ain't gonna put up much of a fight whatever your pugilistic art.

22 minutes ago, BusyB said:

 

If you cannot even do that much, you ain't gonna put up much of a fight whatever your pugilistic art.

 

You're mistaken.  The 45 year old George Foreman wouldn't have run away from anyone. But he could still put up a fight.

7 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

You might as well have studied Origami, which is probably just as useful in a real fight as Jeet Kune Do. Don't rely on it in real life, for your own sake.

 

 

Carruthers would "rip" nobody's head off, not in 30 minutes not in 30 hours, he' s an old man. As the substantially younger man I would easily defeat him.

 

But then this blind belief in the "master" is typical of Kung Fu, Wing Chun and Wushu and JKD. The guys that Xu Xiaodong defeated in under 2 minutes also had 80000 blind followers.

 

Me, I trust evidence.

Get your martial arts physique photo up big man..go on..shows us your cage fighter physique.

I can already guess what you look like.

Joke.

40 minutes ago, freedomnow said:

Get your martial arts physique photo up big man..go on

 

Is this how you train with Carruthers as well, you  look at photos of guys' bodies?

 

No wonder JKD isn't cutting it in MMA.

 

 

27 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Is this how you train with Carruthers as well, you  look at photos of guys' bodies?

 

No wonder JKD isn't cutting it in MMA.

 

 

Haha, case closed...another s-talker about martial arts systems.

 

A mouth nearly as big as his definite beer belly and podgy arms....best days behind you - if you had any.

17 minutes ago, freedomnow said:

Haha, case closed...another s-talker about martial arts systems.

 

A mouth nearly as big as his definite beer belly and podgy arms....best days behind you - if you had any.

 

I'm svelte like a Cheetah. I don't even drink beer.

 

And I still have muscle pain from yesterday's biceps curls.

23 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

You're mistaken.  The 45 year old George Foreman wouldn't have run away from anyone. But he could still put up a fight.

 

If you aren't fit and able to run then you probably ain't fit and able to fight.

 

Foreman could have run but would  c h o o s e  not to.

 

I'm fit and able enough to run and that's what I'd probably do. Though not always.

 

I have actually been chased by gangs through (UK of course) city streets a couple of times in an earlier life ;D

 

Either they let me off or I outran them (I was very fit back then) - I didn't go back to ask them ...

1 hour ago, BusyB said:

Foreman could have run but would  c h o o s e  not to.

 

No the 45 year old Foreman couldn't run anywhere. 

 

But he could fight.

 

 

There is little skill in street/bar fights, its normally first hit wins, be that head butt, fist, cue, glass or bottle.