Pattaya Condos: History and Future

Mark1969 · July 18

1 minute ago, Airalee said:

That being said….99% of condos here aren’t worth buying IMHO.

Most of them are not really condo's or apartments as many foreigners would define one. They are vacation or resort rooms marketed as a condo on long term leases. The cheaper ones are more like single occupancy hotel rooms.

They have some true living quality condo's in bangkok but they are very expensive.

One can reflect on what you're getting if you are coming to retire here after watching all those cheesy video's on cheap condo rooms and the cheap price rose colored glasses come off.

topt · July 18

2 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

The OP is an illegal real estate agent here, and starts these these threads to mislead readers.

If I was the OP and read this I think I would be at a minimum reporting you and ideally suing for defamation............

For what its worth I don't think your Leaver but I wish you would........

treetops · July 18

28 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Yes, of course a condo doesn't have to be vacant to be advertised for sale.

Yet you implied it when you said:

1 hour ago, KhunHeineken said:

FOR SALE (35 units )

followed by:

1 hour ago, KhunHeineken said:

35 units for sale in a block of 42, and less than 10 years old. That's a high percentage of vacant units.

The point being you cherry picked stats to suit your point of view and anyone can do that to suit their side of the argument. I'm sure newnative does the same, but not with the persistent bad attitude you show to others, both here and on the tax threads (both Aus and Thai tax).

There's a pattern to it throughout which I for one can't fathom but does nothing for the various discussions IMO.

KhunHeineken · July 18

12 minutes ago, treetops said:

Yet you implied it when you said:

followed by:

The point being you cherry picked stats to suit your point of view and anyone can do that to suit their side of the argument. I'm sure newnative does the same, but not with the persistent bad attitude you show to others, both here and on the tax threads (both Aus and Thai tax).

There's a pattern to it throughout which I for one can't fathom but does nothing for the various discussions IMO.

I did not cherry pick. I went to the Baht Sold website. The Vision Condo was at the top because it was a featured property. I guess this means the advertisers pays the website to always have the ad at the top of the page for a period of time.

Here's the link.

https://www.bahtsold.com/quicksearch2?c=11&ca=88&pr_from=0&pr_to=NULL&top=0&s=

Never heard of The Vision. Never set foot in the pace.

I Googled "The Vision Condo Pattaya" and at the top was the below website. (it was the first website that wasn't Google sponsored)

https://www.thailand-property.com/condo/3176/the-vision

At the top of this website it said the below, and I cut and pasted it.

The Vision

Pattaya , Chonburi

FOR SALE (35 units ) starting from ฿ 1,995,000
FOR RENT (6 units ) starting from ฿ 12,500

This a completely random look at the condo block. No cherry picking.

I then scrolled down and saw a condo block in Wongamat. The OP mentioned Wongamat in a few posts, so I did the same.

It's called The Riviera Wongamat. I cut and pasted also.

https://www.thailand-property.com/condo/2985/the-riviera-wongamat

The Riviera Wongamat

Pattaya , Chonburi

FOR SALE (228 units ) starting from ฿ 2,300,000

FOR RENT (122 units ) starting from ฿ 12,000

One was completely random, the other I stumbled across on the same first page of Baht Sold, and it it in Wongamat. No cherry picking.

Regardless of what you think of my posting style, which I couldn't care less about, have I made the above up, or it it there for you to see for yourself with your own eyes?

KhunHeineken · July 18

26 minutes ago, topt said:

If I was the OP and read this I think I would be at a minimum reporting you and ideally suing for defamation........

I seem to remember the OP being asked if he had a work permit in one of his previous threads. From memory, I believe he stated he did not. I could be wrong, but he can clarify this himself.

It's probably all in his wife's name, but you are no doubt aware of the strict labor laws here.

Occupations reserved for Thai's.

https://aimbangkok.com/restricted-jobs-for-foreigners-in-thailand-complete-list

"19. Brokerage or agency work, except brokerage or agency work in international trade or investment.

Working as an intermediary or contact between two parties to make deals on insurance, trading commodities, trading or renting and letting property, or trading or participating in business services, and receiving a commission in return, except for work related to international trade or investment."

Note trading or renting and letting property.

"2. Bricklaying, carpentry, or construction work

Building construction: Work that requires knowledge or skills in building, installing, maintaining, and repairing buildings and other structures, such as making concrete models, pouring concrete, retouching concrete surfaces, making metal reinforcements, erecting concrete structures supplemented with various materials, roofing, terrazzo flooring, and installing flooring and walls with tiles or mosaics, plastering on walls and ceilings, installing insulating materials on walls, floors, and ceilings, cutting and assembling glass panes into windows or doors, painting, installing drain and water pipe systems, installing sanitary ware, and electrical wiring inside buildings or other structures."

Note construction work can only be done on the behalf of an employer, so a work permit needed.

Only the OP knows if he swung a hammer, changed a tap washer, painted a wall, showed through a prospective buyer, placed a for sale ad on the internet etc etc etc etc.

I'm sure he will say his wife did it all by herself. If you know what I mean. :smile:

Perhaps the OP can clarify under what status he has flipped the properties.

There's been debate over the years that if you live in the property, you can renovate it yourself, and sell it for a profit, that's not considered "working" here. With the OP's history of flipping properties, if not working, what would you call it? Making money is involved, so I wouldn't call it a hobby.

KhunHeineken · July 18

1 hour ago, Airalee said:

I wouldn’t want to be a long distance (or local) landlord myself

My properties are in the hands of agents. They deal with the tenants. They also pay all fees and taxes, and report to me any repairs that need doing, and I sign off on them. They have a list of preferred tradesmen, and I have found their prices reasonable. The money goes into my Australian bank account fortnightly / monthly. I have very little to do with the properties.

1 hour ago, Airalee said:

I don’t need to look at my choice of housing as an “investment”.

I have no problem with this. I have said it numerous times. I have no problem with people who chose to buy.

I disagree with the notion the OP puts forward that choosing to buy here is an "investment" and I disagree with the OP that there is not an oversupply of condo's on the market in Pattaya. It's as simple as that.

1 hour ago, Airalee said:

That being said….99% of condos here aren’t worth buying IMHO.

Construction methods, and the quality of fixtures and fittings, certainly are not the best.

Buy today, and 6 months later the tiles start lifting in the bathroom and who has to pay for that?

newnative · July 18

27 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

Do you think newly retired expats to Thailand, who are weighing up the pros and cons of buying, versus the pros and cons of renting, should take their age into consideration? If yes, why, and if no, why?

Do you have health insurance? If so, that contradicts your statement, as insurance is there to cover the unforeseen, and if not, many would view that as irresponsible.

You state buying a property here is a good investment. Who invests in anything without considering the return on investment / profit. You are changing your narrative now to focus on a property being a "home" and not an investment.

Are you advocating buying to be a home, an investment, or both? If an investment, or both, why is it not prudent for one to factor in their age, thus the amount of years they have the use of the asset?

You started the thread. I had no idea it was only open to owners. What would be the point of that, owners already own. What would there be to discuss?

Are you suggesting they sell and upgrade? Are you suggesting they sell and downgrade? Are you suggesting they cash out and rent? What is the purpose of your thread if it's only for owners? I bet your thread doesn't exclude perspective buyers.

The data comes from the BoT. Condo prices are declining. The data shows that. The condo market could decline more, could flatten out, or start to rise. The whole time, more and more condo's are coming onto the market.

1. My posting that I have made a profit buying property here does not translate to me sayng that buying here is a good investment. I have said that buyers should understand that their property may not increase in value, may even decline or just maintain value.

2. Yes, I have good health insurance, which is why I don't spend time worrying about getting an illness, nor do I make decisions based on whether or not I might get an illness. That's me, the way I operate. Only applies to me.

3. I read the BoT data as condo prices rising, just at a slower rate, more in line with houses and townhouses. When you post that condo prices are 'declining', in fairness you should present the full information, that they are actually still rising-at what was it 2% or something?

4. I have not 'suggested' in this thread,or any thread, that buyers or sellers do anything, sell, upgrade, or whatever. Where would you even get that idea when I simply posted about an article on the history and upcoming condos in Pattaya? In the past, on some condo threads, I have suggested, based on my personal experience, if someone is going to buy a condo they should consider buying in foreign quota--and I gave several reasons for the suggestion. I would still suggest that--and, once again, that doesn't translate to me saying everyone should dash out and buy a condo.

5. I am not 'advocating' anything, nor have I ever. I will sometimes post a response if I see some glaring misinformation, such as the poster who posted that Thailand condos will go crashing to the ground when they hit age 30--several Pattaya condos have reached that mark and are still standing. You will read, over and over, 'Whatever floats your boat.' And, sometimes, 'One size does not fit all' .

My buying or renting is not based on my age; what others do based on their age is up to them. I mostly post what I am doing and many times my next sentence is: That's me. Readers should take that as exactly that--me, not them. If I mention in passing that I own Netflix stock, again, it doesn't mean I am 'advocating', 'hawking', giving 'advice', etc., on anything nor does it mean everyone should rush out and buy Netflix stock.

6. The thread I posted was of course not just for owners--and once again you've made a fool of yourself with your foolish, ridiculous comment stating that you 'had no idea it was only open to owners.' Of course you had no idea because nowhere did I ever say that. Par for the course with you as you are always doing that--with most of this post of yours I am responding to a good example.

The thread was simply about Pattaya condos--which have both owners and renters. But you know that. I found it to be an interesting history. If you've read it, you'll know it seems to be a complete list of the condos and when they were built. Owners and renters can check the list for their condo and see what was also being built around the same time. That 's all the article is but you're trying mightily to make it the be all and the end all of all aspects of condo owning or renting.

treetops · July 18

47 minutes ago, KhunHeineken said:

One was completely random, the other I stumbled across on the same first page of Baht Sold, and it it in Wongamat. No cherry picking.

OK, potentially no cherry picking, but no cross checking and no due diligence. Equally as disturbing when putting things out as fact and using incorrect data in order to try and score a point. Makes one wonder about the accuracy of anything else you post.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a renter and own property in my country of birth, so coming from the same side as you, but if I ever found myself posting like you I'd take a forum holiday before I was given (another) one.

newnative · July 18

3 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

As I said in another post, I am not familiar with Leavers. Their chestnuts are the same chestnuts for the buying v renting debate that many, including myself, put forward. They are nothing new. Ask any renter why they chose to rent and not buy and they will tell you all the same chestnuts.

I have never said newnative did not have any success flipping properties. I have challenged his notion than an expat buying a property here is a good "investment" and I have posted my reasons, backed up by links, data, stats, and examples. All the OP posts is his opinion and experience.

Aren't you contradicting yourself? On one hand, you agree with newnative, and point to his success flipping properties, then on the other hand, say it's impossible to pick the direction of the property market here? Does that mean you agree it's possible the market becomes stagnant, or dips? (note - I have never suggested collapse)

This is a really strange comment. As usual, I will explain why.

So, I go to the Baht Sold website and punch in "real estate - apartments / condos for sale - Pattaya." The very first one on the list is titled "A million dollar view from The Vision."

Here's the link. (note - the ad may have slipped by the time you open the link, but it was the first one on the list at the time of this post)

https://www.bahtsold.com/quicksearch2?c=11&ca=88&pr_from=0&pr_to=NULL&top=0&s=

So, I Google "The Vision Condo Pattaya" and the first online real estate agent that is sponsored is in the below link.

https://www.thailand-property.com/condo/3176/the-vision

This appears at the top.

The Vision

Pattaya , Chonburi

FOR SALE (35 units ) starting from ฿ 1,995,000
FOR RENT (6 units ) starting from ฿ 12,500

"The Vision is a condo project The Vision construction was completed in 2016. The Vision has 23 floors and contains 42 total units, Units range from Studio to 2 bedroom."

For the record, I am not familiar with the building. I have never stepped foot in there. 35 units for sale in a block of 42, and less than 10 years old. That's a high percentage of vacant units.

I did not cherry pick the above. It's was the first ad on Baht Sold.

So, I scrolled down Baht Sold and I saw an ad for Wongamat. The OP mentioned Wongamat, so I did the same.

Same first page on Baht Sold as the above link. The title is "Special Off - Riviera Wongamat."

I Google "The Riviera Condo Wongamat" and the forth website down is the same online agent as above.

Here's the link.

https://www.thailand-property.com/condo/2985/the-riviera-wongamat

This appears at the top.

The Riviera Wongamat

Pattaya , Chonburi

FOR SALE (228 units ) starting from ฿ 2,300,000
FOR RENT (122 units ) starting from ฿ 12,000

"The Riviera Wongamat is a condo projectThe Riviera Wongamat construction was completed in 2017. and contains 321 total units, Units range from Studio to 3 bedroom."

321 units and 228 are for sale, and it's also less than 10 years old. That's a high percentage. Once again, I have never stepped foot in that building.

There above are two random selections, but it's a common theme. I can post example after example of the same.

So, is the above struggling to sell, or not?

I don't know what Leavers' idea was, but as I said in another post, if Thailand was serious about taxing remittances, it was 6 months Thailand and 6 months Vietnam for me. I posted this over a year ago on various Thailand Tax threads, with some others posting they would do the same. I explained my choice of Vietnam in another post. I know Vietnam does not have a retirement visa, but all I was going to do was 179 days a year in Thailand so I wasn't a resident of Thailand for tax purposes.

You really are totally clueless. There are NOT 228 units for sale at Riviera Wongamat. Even someone with a minimum of common sense would question that number when you have the total number as 321. You are getting 228 because real estate offices are posting the same condo for sale multiple times. Same for rentals. When we sold our Northshore condo it was listed at least a dozen times on these websites by different agencies. So, it wasn't a dozen condos for sale, it was one condo listed 12 times by various agencies. (If you add 228 and 122 you get more units than Riviera even has.)

KhunHeineken · July 18

38 minutes ago, newnative said:

1. My posting that I have made a profit buying property here does not translate to me sayng that buying here is a good investment. I have said that buyers should understand that their property may not increase in value, may even decline or just maintain value.

So, it's an expensive place to hang "Chinese wall art." :smile:

Glad we cleared up it's not an investment.

But didn't you say, "no troughs" so only peaks for you, right? The only way that is possible is to hold onto a property until the next peak, that's why I asked about time on market. You said 6 months. Peaks and troughs don't occur in a property market every 6 months. This means you had to have held onto the property waiting for the next peak. So, your capital was tied up in a Thai property not earning.

39 minutes ago, newnative said:

2. Yes, I have good health insurance,

But you said you don't think about any nasty things that could happen in the future. You have contradicted yourself.

40 minutes ago, newnative said:

I read the BoT data as condo prices rising, just at a slower rate,

I read it exactly as it says, "decelerating" and by a substantial percent.

47 minutes ago, newnative said:

I will sometimes post a response if I see some glaring misinformation,

As I will.

You have posted there is no oversupply here, yet in your original post you talk about the number of massive condo projects going ahead. The very first post, not by myself, the member said "Great for renters."

Your posts suggest a buoyant condo market here with supply equaling demand, thus stable condo prices. I disagree and have posted links, data, stats, and examples showing why I have formed my opinion. All you have posted is some success in the past of flipping some properties.

51 minutes ago, newnative said:

My buying or renting is not based on my age; what others do based on their age is up to them.

Correct, and I suggest they take their age into consideration as part of the mix when deciding if buying or renting is best for them. Simple as that. I have never suggest at late 60's one is too old to buy.

53 minutes ago, newnative said:

The thread I posted was of course not just for owners--

Great, so, as a renter, can you post some credible links, stats, data, and recent examples and "sell" buying over renting to me and other readers? What's the point of discussing your previous flipping of properties. It's history. Those days are over.

56 minutes ago, newnative said:

The thread was simply about Pattaya condos--which have both owners and renters. But you know that. I found it to be an interesting history. If you've read it, you'll know it seems to be a complete list of the condos and when they were built. Owners and renters can check the list for their condo and see what was also being built around the same time. That 's all the article is but you're trying mightily to make it the be all and the end all of all aspects of condo owning or renting.

You have a long, long history of talking up the property market here in many different threads and forums. I have posted my opinion why I think this is so, that is, you have a conflict of interest. You flip properties here.

KhunHeineken · July 18

58 minutes ago, treetops said:

OK, potentially no cherry picking,

Glad we cleared that up.

58 minutes ago, treetops said:

Equally as disturbing when putting things out as fact and using incorrect data

I have posted links. Is the link taken by itself not a fact? If you disagree with the content in those links, please post a link to counter. I'm more than happy to take a look at it.

1 hour ago, treetops said:

Don't get me wrong, I'm a renter and own property in my country of birth, so coming from the same side as you, but if I ever found myself posting like you I'd take a forum holiday before I was given (another) one.

What forum rules have I broken?

I just smelt some BS, disagreed with the OP, called him out on his history of talking up the market here across multiple forums and threads, and gave my opinion that it's because he has a conflict of interest, that being, he flips properties here.

KhunHeineken · July 18

51 minutes ago, newnative said:

There are NOT 228 units for sale at Riviera Wongamat.

How many condo's do you say are for sale in The Riviera Wongamat then?

The below website has 23 pages of condo's for sale in The Riviera Wongamat, at 10 condo's listed per page. Did I go through all 23 pages, no. Could some, possibly many, be listed more than once, sure. Still a lot of condo's in that one block for sale.

You mentioned how unique a condo with a seaview with two bedrooms and two bathrooms is in Wongamat. In just one condo block in Wongamat it appears such a condo is not so unique.

https://www.thailand-property.com/condo/2985/the-riviera-wongamat

newnative · July 18

2 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

How many condo's do you say are for sale in The Riviera Wongamat then?

The below website has 23 pages of condo's for sale in The Riviera Wongamat, at 10 condo's listed per page. Did I go through all 23 pages, no. Could some, possibly many, be listed more than once, sure. Still a lot of condo's in that one block for sale.

You mentioned how unique a condo with a seaview with two bedrooms and two bathrooms is in Wongamat. In just one condo block in Wongamat it appears such a condo is not so unique.

https://www.thailand-property.com/condo/2985/the-riviera-wongamat

I never said a 2 bedroom seaview condo is unique. But you know that. What I asked was how many of the thousands of condos for sale in Pattaya are 2 bedroom 2 bath seaview condos in Wongamat, making the point with buying and selling you continue to pretend not to understand.

newnative · July 18

4 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

How many condo's do you say are for sale in The Riviera Wongamat then?

The below website has 23 pages of condo's for sale in The Riviera Wongamat, at 10 condo's listed per page. Did I go through all 23 pages, no. Could some, possibly many, be listed more than once, sure. Still a lot of condo's in that one block for sale.

You mentioned how unique a condo with a seaview with two bedrooms and two bathrooms is in Wongamat. In just one condo block in Wongamat it appears such a condo is not so unique.

https://www.thailand-property.com/condo/2985/the-riviera-wongamat

No, I did not mention, and have never mentioned, how 'unique' a seaview condo is, anywhere. Putting words in my mouth, once again. I also don't know how many condos are for sale--anywhere, not just Riviera Wongamat. What I do know is that when you click on '2 Bedroom', those numerous pages you mentioned reduce to 6. Which, once again, illustrates my point that when you punch in the 3 minimum wants most buyers have--size, price, and location--the number of property choices for sale reduces greatly. Just one criteria, size, reduced the pages down to 6. When you put in price, the numbers will further reduce, and so on.

newnative · July 18

4 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

So, it's an expensive place to hang "Chinese wall art."

Glad we cleared up it's not an investment.

But didn't you say, "no troughs" so only peaks for you, right? The only way that is possible is to hold onto a property until the next peak, that's why I asked about time on market. You said 6 months. Peaks and troughs don't occur in a property market every 6 months. This means you had to have held onto the property waiting for the next peak. So, your capital was tied up in a Thai property not earning.

But you said you don't think about any nasty things that could happen in the future. You have contradicted yourself.

I read it exactly as it says, "decelerating" and by a substantial percent.

As I will.

You have posted there is no oversupply here, yet in your original post you talk about the number of massive condo projects going ahead. The very first post, not by myself, the member said "Great for renters."

Your posts suggest a buoyant condo market here with supply equaling demand, thus stable condo prices. I disagree and have posted links, data, stats, and examples showing why I have formed my opinion. All you have posted is some success in the past of flipping some properties.

Correct, and I suggest they take their age into consideration as part of the mix when deciding if buying or renting is best for them. Simple as that. I have never suggest at late 60's one is too old to buy.

Great, so, as a renter, can you post some credible links, stats, data, and recent examples and "sell" buying over renting to me and other readers? What's the point of discussing your previous flipping of properties. It's history. Those days are over.

You have a long, long history of talking up the property market here in many different threads and forums. I have posted my opinion why I think this is so, that is, you have a conflict of interest. You flip properties here.

Correct, no troughs for me here since 2010, and a property sale July 4th, so not exactly 'history', not exactly 'days over'. But, as always, that's me. That's my experience. Your mileage may differ.

How is having health insurance, which gives me some peace of mind with the possibility of a catastrophic illness, a 'contradiction'? You might be showing your poor reading skills once again--I did say that I, personally, don't make decisions about anything governed by the thought I might develop an illness down the road, or tomorrow. Remember that?

I have never suggested a 'buoyant' property market, anywhere. You are making that false interpretation, based on my saying I have been able to find buyers for my properties. Not the same thing at all, but you know that. I'm not a renter so, no, I can't post some 'credible links'--do the work yourself.

I have a 'long history' of talking about the property market, not talking up the market. If you go back and re-read my posts, you'll find a number that relate some of my experiences, a number that explain some realty things, a number that correct some things, a number answering questions members have posted, a number relating how I prepare a property for sale, a number explaining how I put a property up for sale, a number talking about real estate agents and my experiences using them, and others on pricing, illegal daily renters, off-plan buying, foreign quota, AGM meetings, delinquent owners, Pattaya's different neighborhoods, real estate Youtube websites, the joys of owning, and others. That all seems more 'about' than 'up', doesn't it?

newnative · July 18

7 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

I seem to remember the OP being asked if he had a work permit in one of his previous threads. From memory, I believe he stated he did not. I could be wrong, but he can clarify this himself.

It's probably all in his wife's name, but you are no doubt aware of the strict labor laws here.

Occupations reserved for Thai's.

https://aimbangkok.com/restricted-jobs-for-foreigners-in-thailand-complete-list

"19. Brokerage or agency work, except brokerage or agency work in international trade or investment.

Working as an intermediary or contact between two parties to make deals on insurance, trading commodities, trading or renting and letting property, or trading or participating in business services, and receiving a commission in return, except for work related to international trade or investment."

Note trading or renting and letting property.

"2. Bricklaying, carpentry, or construction work

Building construction: Work that requires knowledge or skills in building, installing, maintaining, and repairing buildings and other structures, such as making concrete models, pouring concrete, retouching concrete surfaces, making metal reinforcements, erecting concrete structures supplemented with various materials, roofing, terrazzo flooring, and installing flooring and walls with tiles or mosaics, plastering on walls and ceilings, installing insulating materials on walls, floors, and ceilings, cutting and assembling glass panes into windows or doors, painting, installing drain and water pipe systems, installing sanitary ware, and electrical wiring inside buildings or other structures."

Note construction work can only be done on the behalf of an employer, so a work permit needed.

Only the OP knows if he swung a hammer, changed a tap washer, painted a wall, showed through a prospective buyer, placed a for sale ad on the internet etc etc etc etc.

I'm sure he will say his wife did it all by herself. If you know what I mean.

Perhaps the OP can clarify under what status he has flipped the properties.

There's been debate over the years that if you live in the property, you can renovate it yourself, and sell it for a profit, that's not considered "working" here. With the OP's history of flipping properties, if not working, what would you call it? Making money is involved, so I wouldn't call it a hobby.

I'm not a realtor--I have said many, many times I am way too lazy, with way too little patience. What I mostly do is shop--for condos, tvs, refrigerators, furniture, washing machines, beds, mattresses, houses, etc. As far as I know, 'shopping' is not an occupation reserved for Thais.

When we renovate, we use Thai workers who do the work--plumbing, tiling, painting, carpentry, etc. My Thai spouse does the hiring and directs all the work. We always buy in either foreign quota or Thai name. Except for our rental condos, which we no longer have, we always live in what we buy and renovate. We never buy to flip--we buy to live in. Then we get bored and we sell and repeat the process. It's short periods of ownership while living in a property we legally own. One is allowed to buy a property in foreign quota, fix it up with Thai workers, live in it, and sell it after a time. Some like to boast that they move frequently as renters; we're just doing the same, but as owners.

aBigSmile · July 19

On 7/16/2025 at 7:54 PM, KhunHeineken said:

Perhaps you can explain how foreign condo owners actually own the land their condo block sits on?

Don't you know you can own a condo in a freehold arrangement as long as at least 51% of the units in that buildings are owned by Thai nationals?
In other words, you own a percentage of the building's land, given that the total percentage owned by foreigners doesn't exceed 49%.

Happy to help.

treetops · July 19

21 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

Glad we cleared that up.

No, potentially is not a definitive.

Your selective quote (rule 28 to add to those below), cut out the "but . . . . etc" following it which indicated that even if it wasn't cherry picking (we only have your word for that) it was still using inaccurate information.

21 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

I have posted links. Is the link taken by itself not a fact? If you disagree with the content in those links, please post a link to counter. I'm more than happy to take a look at it.

Already done. Two links both containing wrong numbers which you then based your argument on.

21 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

What forum rules have I broken?

What was your most recent suspension for?

Offensive content.

Disruptive or inflammatory posts.

Troll posts.

Stalking behaviour.

Off topic posts.

Take your pick. Twisted logic should be an offence too. I doubt if I've read all ~ 6,000 of your posts but there's certainly a pattern of behaviour in those I have read.

KhunHeineken · August 7

On 7/18/2025 at 2:21 PM, newnative said:

I'm not a realtor--I have said many, many times I am way too lazy, with way too little patience. What I mostly do is shop--for condos, tvs, refrigerators, furniture, washing machines, beds, mattresses, houses, etc. As far as I know, 'shopping' is not an occupation reserved for Thais.

When we renovate, we use Thai workers who do the work--plumbing, tiling, painting, carpentry, etc. My Thai spouse does the hiring and directs all the work. We always buy in either foreign quota or Thai name. Except for our rental condos, which we no longer have, we always live in what we buy and renovate. We never buy to flip--we buy to live in. Then we get bored and we sell and repeat the process. It's short periods of ownership while living in a property we legally own. One is allowed to buy a property in foreign quota, fix it up with Thai workers, live in it, and sell it after a time. Some like to boast that they move frequently as renters; we're just doing the same, but as owners.

If I understand correctly, you are 73 years of age and sold your first property here in 2005. That means you were 53 years of age at the time. You may have been holidaying here frequently, but if living here, that's quite young to retire.

You also say you have sold 20 properties, so that averages at one property a year. I would not call buying, renovating, and selling a property every year a hobby. It is clearly a money making exercise.

You also say you have never experienced any toughs, only peaks in the property market here, and the TOM (Time On Market) for your properties for sale was never greater than 6 months.

You have the long term chart from the BoT in a previous link. I shows, of course, property increasing in value over the long term, and there has never been any argument from me about that, but it shows many peaks and troughs along the way, with some troughs lasting more than 6 months.

So, you are either using your own purchase and sale prices to make such a comment, or, you have purchased distress properties and flipped them as an out of line sale to some newbie who has paid too much.

For you to do what you claim, you would be know all over Pattaya as "The Wolf of Wongamat" and they will make a movie based on you in the future. :cheesy:

KhunHeineken · August 7

On 7/19/2025 at 7:28 AM, treetops said:

No, potentially is not a definitive.

That's a contradiction.

On 7/19/2025 at 7:28 AM, treetops said:

Already done.

Where?

On 7/19/2025 at 7:28 AM, treetops said:

What was your most recent suspension for?

I forget. What was your's for?

KhunHeineken · August 7

On 7/19/2025 at 5:57 AM, aBigSmile said:

Don't you know you can own a condo in a freehold arrangement as long as at least 51% of the units in that buildings are owned by Thai nationals?

How can it be truly "freehold" if your everyone's vote is not equal to each others? Serious question.

On 7/19/2025 at 5:57 AM, aBigSmile said:

In other words, you own a percentage of the building's land, given that the total percentage owned by foreigners doesn't exceed 49%.

Perhaps you can post about your "freehold" percentage of the land the condo block sits on, and the rights you have over it. :smile:

newnative · August 7

3 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

If I understand correctly, you are 73 years of age and sold your first property here in 2005. That means you were 53 years of age at the time. You may have been holidaying here frequently, but if living here, that's quite young to retire.

You also say you have sold 20 properties, so that averages at one property a year. I would not call buying, renovating, and selling a property every year a hobby. It is clearly a money making exercise.

You also say you have never experienced any toughs, only peaks in the property market here, and the TOM (Time On Market) for your properties for sale was never greater than 6 months.

You have the long term chart from the BoT in a previous link. I shows, of course, property increasing in value over the long term, and there has never been any argument from me about that, but it shows many peaks and troughs along the way, with some troughs lasting more than 6 months.

So, you are either using your own purchase and sale prices to make such a comment, or, you have purchased distress properties and flipped them as an out of line sale to some newbie who has paid too much.

For you to do what you claim, you would be know all over Pattaya as "The Wolf of Wongamat" and they will make a movie based on you in the future.

A few corrections to your post. I made my first visit to Thailand in December 2009, not 2005--I don't know where you got 2005. I moved to Thailand in June 2010, at age 59. Yes, I did retire early and it was one of the best decisions I've made. Also took American Social Security early, at age 62--no regrets there, either.

Second correction--I never said the time on the market for our Pattaya property sales was never more than 6 months. We had some that took more than 6 months and one that took more than a year. I might have said 6 months could perhaps be an average TOM. Third correction--I never said I have only experienced 'peaks' in the property market here. What I have said is we have not lost any money on selling a property here. Not the same thing. Also, we are not living in Wongamat, although we liked that area.

Except for 5 rental condos that we owned at various times, we live in all the properties that we buy and, after a time, sell. We owned 2 condos in Rayong before moving to Pattaya in December 2010 and we have also owned 2 getaway condos in Bangkok, one of which we still own.

Spouse and I recently bought our 23rd property in Thailand, a house on the Darkside. How long we will be living here is anyone's guess. We're trying to figure out if we want to build another house or look for one to buy. Meanwhile, we have a roof over our head that we are enjoying living in and putting our stamp on. Life is good, wherever we are.

I consider what we do a hobby. Yes, it's a hobby that makes some money but we know going in that there's no guarantee we will make any money when we get restless and decide to move and buy something else. Several times we have risked what was, for the small potatoes we are, a great deal of money when we bought, first, a large wreck of a 3-bedroom condo and, several years later, an even worse wreck of a 3-bedroom pool villa. Either one could have been a money-loser but I've said many times that we like to own and would own even if we might lose money. That's us. Just us.

Yes, there are peaks and 'troughs' in real estate--and the stock market. However, during a trough, that doesn't mean that every stock is decreasing in value. Nor does a housing trough mean that every property goes down in value.

If the stock market hits a trough and my 'X' stock loses value, I'm not required to sell the stock at a loss. I can continue to own it and wait for it to regain value. Again, it's the same for real estate. We sell only when we can make a profit--not seeing much 'Wolf' there.

gk10012001 · August 7

On 7/12/2025 at 8:35 AM, Mark1969 said:

I'm looking now and I don't see very many deals. In fact, several of the real estate agencies in town have nothing but junk and I can't even find available units on their websites and they don't have much of anything when I ask, even after trying for a couple weeks. It's always unavailable.

I did find some very few in town for around 18k baht I like that were not rented out. I don't call that cheap, although I'm used to living up in Chiang Mai. Other buildings all say full when I ask. There were others for 13k-15k a month, but they were just box type vacation condos, not something I would consider as a permanent living situation.

I even resorted to getting an Airbb for a month, as I could find nothing suitable. Your report of a glut of places and/or cheap prices is off base.

I am pretty sure that the Owners will sit on and hold back the top units. Any deals will be like you described and probably poor quality or attributes.

Mark1969 · August 8

9 hours ago, gk10012001 said:

I am pretty sure that the Owners will sit on and hold back the top units. Any deals will be like you described and probably poor quality or attributes.

I found one where I rent directly from the condo building. The room is cared for and they know what they are doing. Skip private owners and agents altogether if you can. I'm also not locked into a year lease.

Private owners who rent out in Pattaya probably have a lot of problems. Likely financial problems and a long history of difficulties with people damaging the units, partying, not being around to monitor the place, etc. That's the vibe I got anyway, like something was not right.

treetops · August 8

Oh <deleted>, he's back.

The forum has been a much more pleasant place to be just recently, but the illogical drivel percentage will now increase courtesy of one returning poster.

KhunHeineken · August 8

15 hours ago, newnative said:

A few corrections to your post. I made my first visit to Thailand in December 2009, not 2005--I don't know where you got 2005. I moved to Thailand in June 2010, at age 59. Yes, I did retire early and it was one of the best decisions I've made. Also took American Social Security early, at age 62--no regrets there, either.

Second correction--I never said the time on the market for our Pattaya property sales was never more than 6 months. We had some that took more than 6 months and one that took more than a year. I might have said 6 months could perhaps be an average TOM. Third correction--I never said I have only experienced 'peaks' in the property market here. What I have said is we have not lost any money on selling a property here. Not the same thing. Also, we are not living in Wongamat, although we liked that area.

Except for 5 rental condos that we owned at various times, we live in all the properties that we buy and, after a time, sell. We owned 2 condos in Rayong before moving to Pattaya in December 2010 and we have also owned 2 getaway condos in Bangkok, one of which we still own.

Spouse and I recently bought our 23rd property in Thailand, a house on the Darkside. How long we will be living here is anyone's guess. We're trying to figure out if we want to build another house or look for one to buy. Meanwhile, we have a roof over our head that we are enjoying living in and putting our stamp on. Life is good, wherever we are.

I consider what we do a hobby. Yes, it's a hobby that makes some money but we know going in that there's no guarantee we will make any money when we get restless and decide to move and buy something else. Several times we have risked what was, for the small potatoes we are, a great deal of money when we bought, first, a large wreck of a 3-bedroom condo and, several years later, an even worse wreck of a 3-bedroom pool villa. Either one could have been a money-loser but I've said many times that we like to own and would own even if we might lose money. That's us. Just us.

Yes, there are peaks and 'troughs' in real estate--and the stock market. However, during a trough, that doesn't mean that every stock is decreasing in value. Nor does a housing trough mean that every property goes down in value.

If the stock market hits a trough and my 'X' stock loses value, I'm not required to sell the stock at a loss. I can continue to own it and wait for it to regain value. Again, it's the same for real estate. We sell only when we can make a profit--not seeing much 'Wolf' there.

It's not a hobby. You are working illegally.

You constantly talk up property values and ownership on this forum. You clearly have a conflict of interest.

KhunHeineken · August 8

5 hours ago, treetops said:

Oh <deleted>, he's back.

The forum has been a much more pleasant place to be just recently, but the illogical drivel percentage will now increase courtesy of one returning poster.

Yes. He says he's not a realtor but he is.

newnative · August 8

2 hours ago, KhunHeineken said:

It's not a hobby. You are working illegally.

You constantly talk up property values and ownership on this forum. You clearly have a conflict of interest.

Buying a property to live in--or as an investment--is not 'working' and it is totally allowed and legal. All our properties have been either bought in foreign quota or Thai name--also totally legal. There is also not a required time limit on how long one lives in a property one buys--and there is no requirement to live in it at all. Thailand actually encourages expats to buy property as one way to fill the requirements for one type of a long-term visa, if I'm not mistaken. It is also not illegal to make repairs and renovations to a property, and to hire Thai workers to do the work.

Show me one post where I have urged readers to buy property in Thailand. I challenge you to find even a single one. I have certainly posted on what I see as some of the advantages of owning property--here or anywhere else--sometimes with examples of how I have benefitted, but that's not the same as telling people to go out and buy a property in Thailand.

I do also post on real estate issues, when I have something to say or if I feel incorrect information has been posted. In most cases, when I post, I relay my experiences, often with examples.

In the past, I have posted on all sorts of real estate issues, questions, and, yes, howlers. One such howler was the post stating that condo projects go crashing to the ground when they reach the age of 30. Not to be outdone, another poster said, no, it's actually age 20. I think I might have been living at Garden Cliff at the time, Pattaya's first condo project, which is well over 30 years old and still standing--which I pointed out in a post providing a second opinion. I probably also noted some other older projects as other examples.

Another howler, from more than one poster, was that once bought, a property is impossible to resell, at any price, in Thailand. Basically, you can't even give them away and nobody has ever sold a property and made any money in Thailand. I begged to differ.

That's probably what I do most of--give a different take on something. For example, someone will post, usually with no examples, a broad statement, such as 'all realtors are useless'. I'm of the opinion that all realtors are not useless so I've posted a second opinion several times in the past. Readers are welcome to reject my take, or not read my posts at all--which I highly recommend for you.

The main thing with me is I try to back up what I post with examples and my real life experiences. Why do I think realtors are not useless? It's based on 15 years of varied experiences buying and selling twentysome properties here. It's based on 15 years of varied experiences working with agents and agencies. It's observing for 15 years the hard work realtors do. And, most importantly, it's based on most of our properties being sold with the help of a realtor. Not all, but most. When we first came to Pattaya--and Rayong before that-- we didn't know a single soul. How the heck would we have sold a property, knowing nobody? Fortunately, we had realtors to find the buyers and do the selling for us.

I've also posted on such things as condo fees, how we stage a property for sale, how we list a property for sale, pricing, illegal daily renters, real estate contracts, off-plan buying, foreign quota, how we investigate a property to buy, how a property search should work, and other topics. Again, readers are welcome to ignore my posts.

I continue to be puzzled by your fascination with what I post--especially since you really have no interest in actually buying real estate in Thailand. Why are you wasting your time slavishly reading and commenting on my posts, I wonder.

With no interest in buying, it also doesn't explain your asking me the other day if I 'know of anyone selling a condo in Wongamat'. Huh? Shouldn't that have been 'renting a condo' since you wouldn't be caught dead buying anything? Makes no sense, but that can happen with your posts.

By the way, the correct question should have been: Do I know of any condos for sale in the size of_______ fill in the size of the condo, with the price range of _______fill in the price range of the condo in Wongamat? Remember, these are the basics you start with: Property type, property size, property price range, and property place. You only got two--property type and place . You're apparently not retaining anything from my posts--maybe stop wasting your time.

gk10012001 · August 9

On 8/7/2025 at 9:46 PM, Mark1969 said:

I found one where I rent directly from the condo building. The room is cared for and they know what they are doing. Skip private owners and agents altogether if you can. I'm also not locked into a year lease.

Private owners who rent out in Pattaya probably have a lot of problems. Likely financial problems and a long history of difficulties with people damaging the units, partying, not being around to monitor the place, etc. That's the vibe I got anyway, like something was not right.

you make a good point

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