2 minutes ago, Fact said:

It is essential to protect them from violent individuals on the left.

Being a law enforcement agent may not be the safest of jobs. But creating a secret police force is a grave threat to civil liberties.

3 minutes ago, Fact said:

 

I'm sorry to bring you the inconvenient truth.

Another irrelevancy.

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

Another irrelevancy.

No, it's not. 

1 minute ago, Alan Zweibel said:

Being a law enforcement agent may not be the safest of jobs. But creating a secret police force is a grave threat to civil liberties.

It's not a secret; everyone knows about it.   

Just now, Fact said:

No, it's not. 

Claiming something is the truth without establishing its relevance is an irrelevancy.

5 minutes ago, candide said:

You mean radical Left like Harris? 

 

“She’s lazy as hell, and she’s got that reputation, and she’s a radical left lunatic, she’s further left than Bernie Sanders or Pocahontas.”

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-election/trump-unleashes-torrent-personal-attacks-harris-calling-worst-lazy-hel-rcna176599

Is there anything incorrect in that statement?

1 minute ago, Alan Zweibel said:

Claiming something is the truth without establishing its relevance is an irrelevancy.

I enjoy the sound of someone losing a debate.

You think that what makes an agency secret is that no one knows it exists? So the Gestapo and the GPU were known to exist and therefore they weren't secret police forces?

Just now, Fact said:

I enjoy the sound of someone losing a debate.

No facts from youre side - you lost.

 

I enjoy how easy you loose.

2 minutes ago, Fact said:

I enjoy the sound of someone losing a debate.

Appointing yourself the referee and judge is just another irrelevancy. And a very sad one.

14 minutes ago, Fact said:

 

There is nothing unprecedented about this situation. People on the left often frame issues to make them seem worse than they are. The fact is that if someone is an illegal alien, they need to be deported.

Since you claim an adherence to facts, can you please provide the definition of ‘Illegal Alien’ in Federal Law and a reference to the statute, and clause within which the definition is provided?

1 hour ago, save the frogs said:

 

nothing has changed.

it's all taking place in the mind.

 

Try again

How much has the cost of groceries, housing and gas gone up? – Deseret News

Just now, Schoggibueb said:

No facts from youre side - you lost.

 

I enjoy how easy you loose.

I have successfully derailed both of you.

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

Appointing yourself the referee and judge is just another irrelevancy. And a very sad one.

I have totally dismantled you.   You are now stuck in a loop of defeat. 

1 minute ago, still kicking said:

Try again

How much has the cost of groceries, housing and gas gone up? – Deseret News

Under Joe Biden, costs increased by 21% based on the BLS CPI. 

3 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Since you claim an adherence to facts, can you please provide the definition of ‘Illegal Alien’ in Federal Law and a reference to the statute, and clause within which the definition is provided?

In U.S. federal law, the term “illegal alien” does appear, though in recent years it’s been replaced in many contexts by “undocumented immigrant” or simply “alien” (which itself is being phased out in policy).

 

Here’s the legal background:

 

---

 

📜 Federal Law References

 

1. Immigration and Nationality Act (INA)

 

• The INA (originally passed in 1952, amended many times) is the core body of immigration law.

• The law uses the term “alien” (defined at 8 U.S.C. § 1101(a)(3)) as:

  “The term alien means any person not a citizen or national of the United States.”

• While the INA does not formally define “illegal alien,” the term is used in statutory language in a few places, often to describe aliens present in violation of law.

 

---

2. Examples of “Illegal Alien” in U.S. Code

 

• 8 U.S.C. § 1365(b) (Reimbursement of States for costs of incarceration):

  “The term illegal alien means any alien who is unlawfully present in the United States.”

• 8 U.S.C. § 1621(a) (Eligibility for State and Local Public Benefits):

  Uses “illegal aliens” when limiting eligibility for certain benefits.

• Other sections also refer to “illegal alien” in relation to employment, benefits, or criminal provisions.

 

---

3. Modern Shifts in Language

 

• Under the Biden Administration, federal agencies like DHS and USCIS were directed (2021 memos) to avoid “illegal alien” and instead use terms like:

   

  • noncitizen

  • undocumented noncitizen

  • non-U.S. national

• However, the statutory language in U.S. Code has not yet been amended by Congress — so “illegal alien” remains in the law, though it is politically and socially controversial.

 

---

✅ Summary:

Federal law defines “alien” clearly, and explicitly uses “illegal alien” in certain statutes (e.g., 8 U.S.C. §§ 1365, 1621) to mean an alien unlawfully present in the U.S. While agencies now prefer softer terms, the phrase still exists in U.S. Code.

 

---

Do you want me to pull the direct text excerpts from the U.S. Code where “illegal alien” appears, so you can cite them word-for-word?

5 minutes ago, Alan Zweibel said:

You think that what makes an agency secret is that no one knows it exists? So the Gestapo and the GPU were known to exist and therefore they weren't secret police forces?

Did they wear masks?  

2 minutes ago, Fact said:

I have successfully derailed both of you.

So nice that you have agreed to be a looser.

 

But to pick it up - hate speach and lies are ok if Trump says something. 

 

I haven't read one comment here who could give me a clear statement why he is allowed to do so.

 

 

9 minutes ago, Fact said:

In U.S. federal law, the term “illegal alien” does appear, though in recent years it’s been replaced in many contexts by “undocumented immigrant” or simply “alien” (which itself is being phased out in policy).

 

Here’s the legal background:

 

---

 

📜 Federal Law References

 

1. Immigration and Nationality Act (INA)

 

• The INA (originally passed in 1952, amended many times) is the core body of immigration law.

• The law uses the term “alien” (defined at 8 U.S.C. § 1101(a)(3)) as:

  “The term alien means any person not a citizen or national of the United States.”

• While the INA does not formally define “illegal alien,” the term is used in statutory language in a few places, often to describe aliens present in violation of law.

 

---

2. Examples of “Illegal Alien” in U.S. Code

 

• 8 U.S.C. § 1365(b) (Reimbursement of States for costs of incarceration):

  “The term illegal alien means any alien who is unlawfully present in the United States.”

• 8 U.S.C. § 1621(a) (Eligibility for State and Local Public Benefits):

  Uses “illegal aliens” when limiting eligibility for certain benefits.

• Other sections also refer to “illegal alien” in relation to employment, benefits, or criminal provisions.

 

---

3. Modern Shifts in Language

 

• Under the Biden Administration, federal agencies like DHS and USCIS were directed (2021 memos) to avoid “illegal alien” and instead use terms like:

   

  • noncitizen

  • undocumented noncitizen

  • non-U.S. national

• However, the statutory language in U.S. Code has not yet been amended by Congress — so “illegal alien” remains in the law, though it is politically and socially controversial.

 

---

✅ Summary:

Federal law defines “alien” clearly, and explicitly uses “illegal alien” in certain statutes (e.g., 8 U.S.C. §§ 1365, 1621) to mean an alien unlawfully present in the U.S. While agencies now prefer softer terms, the phrase still exists in U.S. Code.

 

---

Do you want me to pull the direct text excerpts from the U.S. Code where “illegal alien” appears, so you can cite them word-for-word?

So the term ‘illegal alienation does not exist in the immigration and nationality act, but used to assign costs and determine benefits elsewhere.

 

It‘s idd, don’t you think, to rant about expelling ‘illegal immigrants’ when the actual law applied to immigration and nationality doesn’t define the term?!

 

 

3 minutes ago, Schoggibueb said:

So nice that you have agreed to be a looser.

 

But to pick it up - hate speach and lies are ok if Trump says something. 

 

I haven't read one comment here who could give me a clear statement why he is allowed to do so.

 

 

 

Define hate speech. 

11 minutes ago, DezLez said:

Trump's so called policies, otherwise known as flights of fancy, which are alienating all bar his blindsided MAGAlamanic supporters like you!

We'll see at the mid-terms and the next election. Time to put your hate away. It's irrational and driven by rhetoric,

Just now, Chomper Higgot said:

So the term ‘illegal alienation does not exist in the immigration and nationality act, but used to assign costs and determine benefits elsewhere.

 

It‘s idd, don’t you think, to rant about excelling ‘illegal immigrants’ when the actual law applied to immigration and nationality doesn’t define the term?!

 

 

Pre-2000s

 

• The term “illegal alien” was common in statutes, court rulings, and agency documents.

• Still appears in places like 8 U.S.C. § 1365(b) and 8 U.S.C. § 1621.

 

2013 – 2015

 

• The Associated Press (AP) and many media outlets dropped “illegal alien” in favor of undocumented immigrant.

• This began the shift in common usage, but not in law.

 

2016 – Obama Administration (late)

 

• Agencies increasingly used “undocumented immigrant,” though no law changed.

 

2021 – Biden Administration

 

• In February 2021, DHS and ICE were instructed to avoid “illegal alien” and instead use:

   

  • noncitizen

  • undocumented noncitizen

• USCIS Policy Alert (April 2021) officially replaced “alien” with “noncitizen” in policy manuals.

 

Current (2025)

 

• U.S. Code still uses “illegal alien” in some provisions.

• Federal agencies no longer use it in official communication (unless citing law directly).

 

 

11 hours ago, Alan Zweibel said:

And the son of a very wealthy man whose business empire he destroyed.

 

If we started a thread about individual posters on here, it might start to look like The Rocky Horror Picture Show. 

 

With all the failed ventures between all of us, myself included.

 

It's a psychological disorder to keep projecting on the president. 

He's a flawed creature . And so are you and me and everyone else. 

 

3 minutes ago, Fact said:

 

Define hate speech. 

Any criticism of Charlie Kirk, or so it would seem.

1 minute ago, Fact said:

 

Define hate speech. 

"I hate my oppenent..." 

 

The very first post in this thread. You like to loose - don't you?!

Just now, save the frogs said:

 

If we started a thread about individual posters on here, it might start to look like The Rocky Horror Picture Show. 

 

With all the failed ventures between all of us, myself included.

 

It's a psychological disorder to keep projecting on the president. 

He's a flawed creature . And so are you and me and everyone else. 

 

I remember seeing that back in the late 70s 

Just now, Schoggibueb said:

"I hate my oppenent..." 

 

The very first post in this thread. You like to loose - don't you?!

How can that be considered hate speech? That’s simply a statement of fact.

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Any criticism of Charlie Kirk, or so it would seem.

Please define "hate speech".

3 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

 

If we started a thread about individual posters on here, it might start to look like The Rocky Horror Picture Show. 

 

With all the failed ventures between all of us, myself included.

 

It's a psychological disorder to keep projecting on the president. 

He's a flawed creature . And so are you and me and everyone else. 

 

Except that he's repeatedly touted by right wingers as a great businessman. And touted by himself, too.

Posts using derogatory nicknames to belittle or mock individuals with differing political views have been removed.