His fault or not, that is one s**thole of a predicament to be in. Badly injured in a foreign country, and no one caring enough to treat you because of money. Scary.

After a motorbike accident around 09:30 one morning, I was only provided minimum treatment, and kept in the emergency room until around 17:00 when the OK came through from my insurer. After that I was moved to a private room to await surgery.

Nowadays, the cost of medical insurance is going through the roof, so others are likely to be unable to afford it.

1 hour ago, DualSportBiker said:

Riding in Thailand is safer than you think. Most people are distracted by the headline stats; ~80% of both road accidents and road fatalities are bikes. 20,000+++ per year is horrendous - no argument there. However, there are nearly 23 million registered bikes here verses 9, 3.5 and 1.3 in the US, France and UK respectively. Bikes here are ridden daily as most users' only transport. Usage patterns in the US, France and the UK are very different. Most use their bikes for recreation, not obligatory daily use. The severity of the accidents here are due to not wearing helmets; 84% of Thai bikers hospitalised were not wearing helmets. More small accidents end up in hospital as almost nobody wears 'all the gear'.

When looking at the number of accidents per 1,000 bikes, it turns out that Thailand is very slightly safer than the US . But it is still 3x as dangerous as France or the UK.

Riders with genuine experience are more than likely to ride here in complete safety if they stick to some basic principles. Only those who can't ride, or can't understand numbers, or both, think that Thailand is especially dangerous.

Oh and yes, one needs specific insurance to ride here, especially as a tourist. That insurance hinges on having the correct permits to ride which the insurance companies are duty bound to confirm/deny before buying. You pay your pennies, you makes your choice...

I broadly agree with your overall assessment.

One point that often gets lost is simple exposure: roughly half the vehicles on Thai roads are motorcycles. That alone creates a high-risk mix, with two-wheelers sharing space with much larger and heavier vehicles, often in dense traffic.

Helmet use is improving, but it remains a major problem. Riders without helmets are dramatically more likely to die in a crash—around three times more likely according to multiple studies—and far more prone to traumatic brain injuries. Globally, helmets are known to reduce both mortality and severity of injury; the issue in Thailand is not a lack of evidence, but a failure to address the risk consistently through enforcement, education, and road culture.

Foreigners’ behaviour on Thai roads also deserves scrutiny. Many do things here they would never attempt at home: riding without licences, without experience, and without protective clothing, because they believe they’re in “paradise” and normal rules somehow don’t apply. That combination of inexperience, complacency, and poor equipment predictably ends badly.

Anyone thinking of riding here should consider spending an hour in a Thai A&E department. You’ll see a steady stream of road rash, fractures, dressing changes—and those who don’t walk out again. One injury that’s rarely mentioned is foot trauma from crashes while wearing flip-flops. (thongs/jandals) - These injuries can be life-changing, sometimes resulting in permanent mobility problems.

Another uncomfortable reality is the variability of emergency care. Thailand’s pre-hospital emergency system is well below international standards: partially trained first responders, inconsistent ambulance services, and emergency departments that some hospitals regard as “unprofitable”—to the extent that many facilities don’t even have a proper A&E.

Finally, insurance is often misunderstood. The compulsory insurance bundled with road tax offers only minimal cover. Tourists must check their travel insurance carefully: many policies exclude motorcycle riding entirely, or impose engine-size limits (often 125cc). Given that many rental bikes exceed this, insurers are quick to deny claims—even if the police or other parties don’t raise an issue.

In short, experienced riders who understand the risks and manage them carefully can ride here safely—but the statistics, injuries, and insurance realities are not abstract numbers. They’re visible every day on Thai roads and in Thai hospitals.

5 minutes ago, kwilco said:

In short, experienced riders who understand the risks and manage them carefully can ride here safely—but the statistics, injuries, and insurance realities are not abstract numbers. They’re visible every day on Thai roads and in Thai hospitals.

That may be true. but there's a list of very experienced TVF scooter guys who don't post any more because they're no longer with us. On account of scooter tragedies.

28 minutes ago, phetphet said:

His fault or not, that is one s**thole of a predicament to be in. Badly injured in a foreign country, and no one caring enough to treat you because of money. Scary.

After a motorbike accident around 09:30 one morning, I was only provided minimum treatment, and kept in the emergency room until around 17:00 when the OK came through from my insurer. After that I was moved to a private room to await surgery.

Nowadays, the cost of medical insurance is going through the roof, so others are likely to be unable to afford it.

One has to question the ethics of the Thai healthcare industry when confronted with someone who can't pay.

55 minutes ago, impulse said:

That may be true. but there's a list of very experienced TVF scooter guys who don't post any more because they're no longer with us. On account of scooter tragedies.

anecdotal claptrap – And you don't seem to understand the statistics either. What are you actually trying to say?

The word "experienced" is highly subjective and usually just means the accumulation of bad habits.

A post using trolling misspelling removed. @impulse

The same story on Facebook. There is CCTV footage, showing him crossing the road on his bike. The Belgian guy was to blame for the accident.
I'll see if I can get hold of the video.

Video is on a French language Belgian website, so I can't link.

6 hours ago, lordgrinz said:

One....don't ride a motorcycle in Thailand......two.....don't trust insurance companies......three.....pick a better and safer country to travel in....Thailand is dangerous for travelling in/on any vehicle, and you will be held hostage until you pay your medical bill. Also, no matter who is at fault, you will pay!

2 hours ago, Sir Dude said:

Riding bikes here is a fool's errand.

Compared to your previous post, now only this reason?

I guess you are not in Thailand now and will never visit Thailand in the future?

two.....don't trust insurance companies...... >>> you never insure anything?

three.....pick a better and safer country to travel in.... >>> please do let us know of some examples, including hospitals (foreign) that treat you free with no medical bill to pay.

36 minutes ago, stevenl said:

The same story on Facebook. There is CCTV footage, showing him crossing the road on his bike. The Belgian guy was to blame for the accident.
I'll see if I can get hold of the video.

Video is on a French language Belgian website, so I can't link.

I saw the same on FB..the pics looked staged and i think its a fraud.

3 hours ago, kwilco said:

No, it isn't – it's just stupid foreigners who don't know howsto drive in Thailand.

It seems, by the accident figures, that there are a lot of Thais who also don't know how to drive in Thailand.There have been many times I would feel safer not renting a motorbike, but after hearing quotes from taxis for even short journeys, I have felt there was no reaistic alternative.

3 hours ago, DualSportBiker said:

Hard to tell if we are being 'disliked' by someone who can't do numbers, or doesn't have the cohones to ride...

I think some people don't like me and they probably downvoted you because of association.

The CCTV footage can be viewed here: https://www.hln.be/buitenland/belgische-jeremy-wordt-aangereden-in-thailand-maar-mag-ziekenhuis-niet-verlaten-tot-hij-60-000-euro-betaalt-ik-revalideer-alleen-zonder-medische-zorgen~ab278b40

4 hours ago, DualSportBiker said:

Riding in Thailand is safer than you think. Most people are distracted by the headline stats; ~80% of both road accidents and road fatalities are bikes. 20,000+++ per year is horrendous - no argument there. However, there are nearly 23 million registered bikes here verses 9, 3.5 and 1.3 in the US, France and UK respectively. Bikes here are ridden daily as most users' only transport. Usage patterns in the US, France and the UK are very different. Most use their bikes for recreation, not obligatory daily use. The severity of the accidents here are due to not wearing helmets; 84% of Thai bikers hospitalised were not wearing helmets. More small accidents end up in hospital as almost nobody wears 'all the gear'.

When looking at the number of accidents per 1,000 bikes, it turns out that Thailand is very slightly safer than the US . But it is still 3x as dangerous as France or the UK.

Riders with genuine experience are more than likely to ride here in complete safety if they stick to some basic principles. Only those who can't ride, or can't understand numbers, or both, think that Thailand is especially dangerous.

Oh and yes, one needs specific insurance to ride here, especially as a tourist. That insurance hinges on having the correct permits to ride which the insurance companies are duty bound to confirm/deny before buying. You pay your pennies, you makes your choice...

when you look at the number of deaths for motorbike riders, it offers a different perspective and would challenge that it is safer to ride a bike in Thailand.

In 2023, 6,335 motorcyclists were killed in the United States, marking the highest number of fatalities since record-keeping began in 1975 and representing 15% of all traffic deaths that year.

The Thai Health Promotion Foundation states that, on average, about 70 people die each day as a result of road accidents in Thailand, with 74% being motorbike riders and passengers. Of the 20,000 people killed on roads each year in Thailand, 15,000 of them are motorcyclists, accounting for three out of four fatalities. Aug 31, 2025

Interesting bit on deaths in hospital

In Thailand, when a person dies in a hospital following a road accident, the official cause of death (COD) listed is the specific medical condition or injury that initiated the sequence of morbid events leading to death, such as "craniocerebral injury" or "blunt force trauma". The death is also classified as a road traffic death if it occurs within 30 days of the accident.

26 minutes ago, Myran said:

The CCTV footage can be viewed here: https://www.hln.be/buitenland/belgische-jeremy-wordt-aangereden-in-thailand-maar-mag-ziekenhuis-niet-verlaten-tot-hij-60-000-euro-betaalt-ik-revalideer-alleen-zonder-medische-zorgen~ab278b40/

He was clearly crossing a street, and at a pretty good speed too, not sure if it is a controlled intersection, but it doesn't appear to be, who knows though.

6 minutes ago, stupidfarang said:

when you look at the number of deaths for motorbike riders, it offers a different perspective and would challenge that it is safer to ride a bike in Thailand.

In 2023, 6,335 motorcyclists were killed in the United States, marking the highest number of fatalities since record-keeping began in 1975 and representing 15% of all traffic deaths that year.

The Thai Health Promotion Foundation states that, on average, about 70 people die each day as a result of road accidents in Thailand, with 74% being motorbike riders and passengers. Of the 20,000 people killed on roads each year in Thailand, 15,000 of them are motorcyclists, accounting for three out of four fatalities. Aug 31, 2025

Interesting bit on deaths in hospital

In Thailand, when a person dies in a hospital following a road accident, the official cause of death (COD) listed is the specific medical condition or injury that initiated the sequence of morbid events leading to death, such as "craniocerebral injury" or "blunt force trauma". The death is also classified as a road traffic death if it occurs within 30 days of the accident.

THe poster you are replying to didn't state there are fewer motorcycle deaths in Thailand. Thailand has about 2.5x the number of motorcycles on the roads which make the US slightly more dangerous. Interesting and not sure about how the death numbers nor the motorbikes on the roads is determined but interesting nonetheless.

13 minutes ago, lordgrinz said:

He was clearly crossing a street, and at a pretty good speed too, not sure it is a controlled intersection, but it doesn't appear to be, who knows though.

The police looked at it and determined the same. He was on a big bike which can complicate road crossing if you lack experience. What a crappy holiday...

5 minutes ago, atpeace said:

The police looked at it and determined the same. He was on a big bike which can complicate road crossing if you lack experience. What a crappy holiday...

If there is no traffic light there, I wouldn't even attempt to cross that (nor turn right), not in a million years.

8 hours ago, lordgrinz said:

Also, no matter who is at fault, you will pay!

Not at all what happens in my experience. I know friends and I have had two bad accidents here where the Thai was found guilty and forced to pay damages. This was before dashcams were common and today with a dashcam getting over the language barrier would be much easier. No guarantees though and I definitely would rather get in an accident in America than here.

6 minutes ago, lordgrinz said:

If there is no traffic light there, I wouldn't even attempt to cross that (nor turn right), not in a million years.

It is scary here at times. I don't like having to trust other drivers and wish there was more structure.

9 minutes ago, atpeace said:

Not at all what happens in my experience. I know friends and I have had two bad accidents here where the Thai was found guilty and forced to pay damages. This was before dashcams were common and today with a dashcam getting over the language barrier would be much easier. No guarantees though and I definitely would rather get in an accident in America than here.

Ultimately, you are paying, if you get reimbursed wonderful (absolutely no guarantee of that here), but us "rich" farangs are expected to pay our bills once we enter the hospital. "Damages", meaning vehicle damages? Even those are covered by your first class insurance, they go after the other guy later, but I doubt Somchai will ever pay up. But medical? Yeah, good luck collecting on that from the other party before you enter and exit a hospital.

23 minutes ago, Myran said:

The CCTV footage can be viewed here: https://www.hln.be/buitenland/belgische-jeremy-wordt-aangereden-in-thailand-maar-mag-ziekenhuis-niet-verlaten-tot-hij-60-000-euro-betaalt-ik-revalideer-alleen-zonder-medische-zorgen~ab278b40

So he was clearly at fault, as I immediately suspected when I read "despite the differing Thai legal findings" in the OP.

20 minutes ago, lordgrinz said:

Ultimately, you are paying, if you get reimbursed wonderful (absolutely no guarantee of that here), but us "rich" farangs are expected to pay our bills once we enter the hospital. "Damages", meaning vehicle damages? Even those are covered by your first class insurance, they go after the other guy later, but I doubt Somchai will ever pay up. But medical? Yeah, good luck collecting on that from the other party before you enter and exit a hospital.

That's why you have insurance. They will pay, hospital and vehicle, and if the other party is at fault, go after that other party.

8 hours ago, lordgrinz said:

One....don't ride a motorcycle in Thailand......two.....don't trust insurance companies......three.....pick a better and safer country to travel in....Thailand is dangerous for travelling in/on any vehicle, and you will be held hostage until you pay your medical bill. Also, no matter who is at fault, you will pay!

Don't drive a motorbike in Thailand if you are an inexperienced tourist with inadequate insurance and an invalid licence, that much I agree with.

If you have formal motorcycle training, a Thai driving licence, practice defensive driving and wear a full-face certified helmet, you will most likely be fine. A good insurance coverage will pay for everything in case of an accident.

Just now, stevenl said:

That's why you have insurance. They will pay, hospital and vehicle, and if the other party is at fault, go after that other party.

Most people here have almost nothing to their name, and with minimal insurance on a scooter? Good luck collecting on your damages or medical bills.

1 minute ago, rattlesnake said:

Don't drive a motorbike in Thailand if you are an inexperienced tourist with inadequate insurance and an invalid licence, that much I agree with.

If you have formal motorcycle training, a Thai driving license, practice defensive driving and wear a full-face certified helmet, you will most likely be fine. A good insurance coverage will pay for everything in case of an accident.

You have more faith in Thai drivers than I do, you can do everything right and end up dead here, it's not worth it.

Just now, lordgrinz said:

Most people here have almost nothing to their name, and with minimal insurance on a scooter? Good luck collecting on your damages or medical bills.

Which part about 'That's why you have insurance. They will pay, hospital and vehicle, and if the other party is at fault, go after that other party.' did you not understand?

Just now, lordgrinz said:

You have more faith in Thai drivers than I do, you can do everything right and end up dead here, it's not worth it.

It can happen to anyone anywhere, my dad had a serious motorbike accident in France when a woman who was texting on her phone just turned in front of him and he didn't even have time to put his hands on the brakes.

I would never drive a 'big bike' in Thailand, a PCX (or ADV 350 at most) doing 30-60 km/h most of the time reduces risk to an acceptable level IMO.

1 minute ago, rattlesnake said:

It can happen to anyone anytime, my dad had a serious motorbike accident in France when a woman who was texting on her phone just turned in front of him and he didn't even have time to put his hands on the brakes.

I would never drive a 'big bike' in Thailand, a PCX (or ADV 350 at most) doing 30-60 km/h most of the time reduces risk to an acceptable level IMO.

I drove a big bike here for a few years, the cars around were easy to deal with, the biggest issue was the other suicidal motorcyclist out there. Way too many of them, and they love screaming past you in the same lane with inches to spare, God forbid you move slightly in your own lane to avoid something in the road. They lack any formal training here, and seem to believe they are invincible.

Just now, lordgrinz said:

They lack any formal training here, and seem to believe they are invincible.

No denying that. Especially the mindless teenagers.

9 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Which part about 'That's why you have insurance. They will pay, hospital and vehicle, and if the other party is at fault, go after that other party.' did you not understand?

You mean "you" are paying, then hoping your insurance repays you afterwards, and covers some, or all of the costs.