If Your Daughter's Boyfriend Beat Her Up?

[taxexile]

can you please stop attacking heather mills , its a very difficult time for her .

according to a close friend she's running around in circles , she

will need all the support she can get , its not like its easy to walk out

on a relationship like this"

as for paul , well at least he wont have to listen to all that hip hop stuff any more.

Edited March 22, 2008 by taxexile

[Neeranam]

Many have attributed this to a problem which started with the present

that Paul had got prior to the wedding; he gave her a new prosthetic leg

for Christmas but that was just a stocking-filler. The main gift was a

plane but then he gave her a Ladyshave for the other leg.

I thought that her name was really Eileen.

Nice one Doc.

[PhilHarries]

Lots of people here think they know what they'd do but there's only one person who knows what they'd do because he went through it. Truth is none of us have a clue what we'd do in such a situation.

So you storm over there only to find he's spent ten years pumping iron and learning every martial art possible and you get the living shit beaten out of you.

Or

You storm over there and he's a wimp of a lad, you smack him and he goes down and catches his head awkwardly and ends up paralysed from the neck down. How are you going to feel then? Does that count as justice in your eyes?

If it's the first time he's hit her a talking to in front of his parents is probably the most likely to succeed and avoid family feuds.

But having said that if I had a daughter and she came home with a bloodied nose I'd most likely lose my rag. But this is where a good wife comes in and dispenses common sense and directs a calm, cool and collected response.

[PeaceBlondie]

I do not recommend any person, male or female, Thai or farang, staying in a relationship where they are being beaten.

I would like to ask, though, on the basis of what the posters here have already recommended (and forget the when it is right after a suggestion to kill or maim) - which recommendations on this topic so far, are in accord with the ethical imperatives given in Scripture by the Buddha or the Christ?

--------------

I never suggested to kill or maim. However a good Qss kicking is sometimes in order.

More over and more seriously this discussion is not governed by the imperatives given in scriptures that you may hold sacred.

Like I said, if I bashed your face in and you had another stroke your ensuing love and forgiveness of me sounds like BS.

Just My opinion.

If I'm wrong then I stand corrected...

Some of the suggestions here have far exceeded a good ass-kicking.

As for moral imperatives, ideas of right or wrong, of course that is what we are discussing. I simply point out that the teachings of the two major philosophies held by many ThaiVisa members do not allow most of the measures being proposed here.

Pepe, you need not repeat your absurd hypothetical, but I answer it again: I would love you, as I showed my love to both my future sons-in-law. You may stand corrected.

Love is far more difficult to show than hatred. Some men just aren't strong enough.

[lukey1979]

Id go on an internet forum and tell everyone how hard i am, what a fcuken stupid topic.

How many of you people that have posted break his legs or similar have ever premeditatedly gone round to someones house and beat them up severly so they know know not to come back, easier said then done for most i think.

I was a bouncer for 10 years....I fought people nearly every weekend...I wouldn't hesitate to put the fear of God into someone who beat my daughter.

I once hunted down a junkie who had burgled my home....took weeks....saw him riding in a friends car, smashed the windshield with a 50 lb. rock, pulled the prick out through the hole and beat him unconscious.

Maybe I'm an idiot for doing it...but I did it....and for a few possessions......if it were my daughter?.....find a hole and stay there.

Haha !!!! Will you be able to find time between Snake catching on the Mekong delta and counter insurgency operations into Burma?? You Sound like a regular hardman John Rambo. Pull the other one mate it's got bells on it. You must have had a few drinks before writing that post..

Edited March 22, 2008 by lukey1979

[rethaired]

Unlike most of the posters here,

a. It actually happened. My daughter was 18 and about six months pregnant with their first child, about to graduate from high school, very much in love, and confused. He punched her in the lower abdomen, hard.

b. We are Christians, nonviolent, pacifist, peace-makers, and I taught her to love the enemy. If I had not passed this test, I would have had a miserable relationship with my son-in-law forever.

My wife called me at work, and I immediately left work after calling the work place of the boy's father, leaving word that he had a family emergency of the highest priority and must go home at once.

I went home, put my daughter on the back of my Yamaha 550, and we went to the boyfriend's house, where his grief-stricken parents met us in the living room with a very repentant, remorseful young man.

We talked at length, with the father making it clear that he had never taught the boy to hit a woman, and the boy promised to never do it again. We decided to trust him. He never hit her again (the deal was he would not get a second forgiveness if he hit her again). He has spent the last 24 years at home, taking care of the three children, cooking and cleaning (his family is Mexican-American and he's a real man).

Oh, and back to the day we discovered she was pregnant. National Honor Society officer, straight A student, etc. Her boyfriend came rushing into the hospital (he knew she was pregnant, and an abortion or adoption was out of the question). When I entered the hospital room and he saw me, he was afraid I would harm him, seriously. I said, "I forgive you, and I love you." We hugged and when we had the later conversation about hitting my daughter, he knew I did not hate him.

Hate kills. Love saves. I prefer loving my enemies. You really should try it. Love works.

Thanks PB for sharing this story! Refreshing!

May all people and all nations learn from this ... that indeed human beings sometimes err! Especially the younger and the immature types!

One question though (which I think you did not answer): what led him to punch her? Maybe he found out that it was not his or maybe she lied about being protected! Not that this would excuse his actions, of course, but sometimes there are extenuating circumstances and sometimes some people have not reached this level of control or have that in them! We are not all ... born equal! Right?

Great story, PB!

Thanks for making my day!

There is hope!

Peace!

Edited March 22, 2008 by rethaired

[PeaceBlondie]

Thanks PB for sharing this story! Refreshing!

May all people and all nations learn from this ... that indeed human beings sometimes err! Especially the younger and the immature types!

One question though (which I think you did not answer): what led him to punch her? Maybe he found out that it was not his or maybe she lied about being protected! Not that this would excuse his actions, of course, but sometimes there are extenuating circumstances and sometimes some people have not reached this level of control or have that in them! We are not all ... born equal! Right?

Great story, PB!

Thanks for making my day!

There is hope!

Peace!

He never denied it was his baby; he had insisted they not use contraceptives because he was Catholic! Now they have both converted to Mennonite. They were under incredible strain at the time, finishing secondary school and trying to get scholarships (she got full scholarship to the most expensive school in Texas). It was totally out of character for him, and he truly repented. My second girl also came up preggers, and we did the same thing (although they were both academic underachievers). Each of those two girls has now had three babies, happily married, on good terms with all the parents, etc.

[initiala4]

1. If the bf came from an influential Thai family.

2. If the bf came from an uninfluential Thai family.

3. If the bf's parents were expat farangs.

perhaps your answer would be the same for each, or perhaps not.

The bf in question is 18 years old. Your daughter is also 18 years old. Assume your daughter had a black eye and bloody lip.

Tell your daughter to break up with the bf and then report to the police

1. Talk to his parents, but I dont think it will help since his parents will side him. The other thing is that they are airheaded parents to teaching their son to be violent.

2. Report to the cops.

3. Report to the cops.

If you ask me the same question some years ago I would go and beat him up for hurting my daughter!

[TokyoT]

As for moral imperatives, ideas of right or wrong, of course that is what we are discussing. I simply point out that the teachings of the two major philosophies held by many ThaiVisa members do not allow most of the measures being proposed here.

Many members might say they believe in one of these two philosophies, but in many cases folks rarely live up to the expectations of the teachers. And in my travels I have come across more believers that fall far short of living up to the teachings than those that actually diligently try to live by the teachings.

While the gospels are not exactly chock full of Jesus doing violent acts violence by Jesus is not absent – and considering the amount of probable editing over the centuries it is a pretty safe bet that other violent acts have conveniently been removed.

John 2:15 “So he (Jesus) made a whip out of cords, and drove them all from the temple area.”

And what would a non-violent one need to bring a sword for anyway?

Matthew 10:34 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace, but a sword”

Love is far more difficult to show than hatred. Some men just aren't strong enough.

That’s why we now have viagra.

[soundman]

Definately buy her a can of pepper spray and a tazer.

[Maizefarmer]

1. If the bf came from an influential Thai family.

2. If the bf came from an uninfluential Thai family.

3. If the bf's parents were expat farangs.

perhaps your answer would be the same for each, or perhaps not.

The bf in question is 18 years old. Your daughter is also 18 years old. Assume your daughter had a black eye and bloody lip.

Whats the issue here?

Is it the youngster abusing a female or is it the influential family abusing due proces when you try to correct the situation??

"Influential family" - another idea that creeps into conversation on the forum from time to time - that if you are "influential" you behave differently in Thailand.

Its actualy a very small percentage of those who are "influential" who attract attention through how they handle and respond to situations. Sure there are the few that constantly exploit and abuse situations, but the majority of these folk are normal folk who are where they are in Thai society because they respect and obey rules & regulations - and do not use their "influence" to manipulate due process.

[Smithson]

Tell your daughter to break up with the bf and then report to the police

1. Talk to his parents, but I dont think it will help since his parents will side him. The other thing is that they are airheaded parents to teaching their son to be violent.

2. Report to the cops.

3. Report to the cops.

If you ask me the same question some years ago I would go and beat him up for hurting my daughter!

What exactly do posters expect the police to do? There's been heaps of other threads with posters saying how the police won't get involved in domestic violence. Getting the matter to court would be extremely difficult, even if the girl agreed to press charges.

If she was willing to press charges, then it would seem logical that she'd split with the guy, which is the best outcome you could hope for. But trying to convince her to do so may only push her closer to the BF.

[PeaceBlondie]

As for moral imperatives, ideas of right or wrong, of course that is what we are discussing. I simply point out that the teachings of the two major philosophies held by many ThaiVisa members do not allow most of the measures being proposed here.

Many members might say they believe in one of these two philosophies, but in many cases folks rarely live up to the expectations of the teachers. And in my travels I have come across more believers that fall far short of living up to the teachings than those that actually diligently try to live by the teachings.

While the gospels are not exactly chock full of Jesus doing violent acts violence by Jesus is not absent – and considering the amount of probable editing over the centuries it is a pretty safe bet that other violent acts have conveniently been removed.

John 2:15 “So he (Jesus) made a whip out of cords, and drove them all from the temple area.”

And what would a non-violent one need to bring a sword for anyway?

Matthew 10:34 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace, but a sword”

Thanks for your answer, and surely the first part is true. Christians, Buddhists, and others simply fall far short of obeying the teachings.

However, about Jesus and violence, you are wrong, but you are entitled to your misinterpretations. In John 2:15 Jesus only used a simple whip of cords (grass) to chase some animals out of the temple, not to touch them or any human. In Matthew 10:34, Jesus clearly meant a spiritual sword, or else a sword to guard against animals on the road, not to defend himself against 500 armed soldiers who would arrest him that same evening, when he ordered Peter to not use the sword against a person, because "those who live by the sword, die by the sword." In a world war 2 essay, "Why I Am Not a Pacifist," theologian R. Neibuhr began by admitting the entire early church was pacifist, following the examples and mandates of Jesus. I imagine the Lord Buddha would not advise us to "break the boy's legs" or "kick his ass" or "nail his head to a coffee table."

[TokyoT]

Thanks for your answer, and surely the first part is true. Christians, Buddhists, and others simply fall far short of obeying the teachings.

However, about Jesus and violence, you are wrong, but you are entitled to your misinterpretations. In John 2:15 Jesus only used a simple whip of cords (grass) to chase some animals out of the temple, not to touch them or any human. In Matthew 10:34, Jesus clearly meant a spiritual sword, or else a sword to guard against animals on the road, not to defend himself against 500 armed soldiers who would arrest him that same evening, when he ordered Peter to not use the sword against a person, because "those who live by the sword, die by the sword." In a world war 2 essay, "Why I Am Not a Pacifist," theologian R. Neibuhr began by admitting the entire early church was pacifist, following the examples and mandates of Jesus. I imagine the Lord Buddha would not advise us to "break the boy's legs" or "kick his ass" or "nail his head to a coffee table."

Well I think we will have to agree to disagree, and I am certainly no expert in the bible or Jesus for that matter. And if my assumption is correct based upon an earlier post and you have a Mennonite background then you certainly are better versed on this matter than I – especially as it relates to passivism.

One of the most certain things about the bible is that there are many different interpretations, and based upon the bulk of the information Jesus would be much, much, closer to the pacifist than a hawk.

IMHO the Temple incident is hardly clear-cut, especially when considering that the wording differs depending upon the version of the bible one uses.

New International Version:

John 2:14-15 “In the temple courts he found men selling cattle, sheep and doves, and others sitting at tables exchanging money. So he made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple area, both sheep and cattle; he scatted the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables.”

I would say this version more easily supports a view that the whip was not used on people.

New American Standard version

John 2:14-15 “And He found in the temple those who were selling oxen and sheep and doves, and the money changers seated at their tables. And He made a scourge of cords, and drove them all out of the temple, with the sheep and the oxen; and He poured out the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables”

But I would say this version more easily supports a view that the whip was used to drive out the people as well as the animals.

Then the question becomes does using the whip mean that he actualy hit anyone or anything with it?

And the “but a sword” bit is not as clear-cut either – there certainly are those that interpret the “sword” to be “the truth”, “the word”, or such – support for such a view is easier if one considers Luke 49 as well. But there are those that also interpret it more literally.

Then one can go down the road of the issue of discussing the pacifist Jesus vs the rather mean spirited god of the old testament.

And if we were not off topic enough: Being that you are one of the moderators of the “Gay people in Thailand” section, and if my earlier assumption about your Mennonite background are true you sir would be one interesting person to share a drink with.

[IMA_FARANG]

1. If the bf came from an influential Thai family.

2. If the bf came from an uninfluential Thai family.

3. If the bf's parents were expat farangs.

perhaps your answer would be the same for each, or perhaps not.

The bf in question is 18 years old. Your daughter is also 18 years old. Assume your daughter had a black eye and bloody lip.

This is a true story. I do NOT recommend this method.

Some years ago my friend ###### was working in the Middle East. He had a thai girlfriend in BKK who he was supporting in an apartment. One day when he came back on vacation from the Middle East, he found that the apartment where his girl friend was supposed to be living had been rented out to someone else and his girl friend was working in a bar. My friend ######, didn't get angry, he just went up country to Chiang Mai.

What a surprise, while he was gone, a motorcycle jumped the curb and ran into his girl friend! She ended up in the hospital with a broken leg, The Thai motercycle driver jusr drove off after the "accident".

The next well my friend ###### went to visit his girl friend in the hospital. When he showed up she started cursing at him. I wonder why?

Not that I would ever recommend such a thing.

[pop_corn]

Very simple. If it were my daughter, I'd kick his ass, no ifs, ands or buts.

I agree

[lukey1979]

1. If the bf came from an influential Thai family.

2. If the bf came from an uninfluential Thai family.

3. If the bf's parents were expat farangs.

perhaps your answer would be the same for each, or perhaps not.

The bf in question is 18 years old. Your daughter is also 18 years old. Assume your daughter had a black eye and bloody lip.

This is a true story. I do NOT recommend this method.

Some years ago my friend ###### was working in the Middle East. He had a thai girlfriend in BKK who he was supporting in an apartment. One day when he came back on vacation from the Middle East, he found that the apartment where his girl friend was supposed to be living had been rented out to someone else and his girl friend was working in a bar. My friend ######, didn't get angry, he just went up country to Chiang Mai.

What a surprise, while he was gone, a motorcycle jumped the curb and ran into his girl friend! She ended up in the hospital with a broken leg, The Thai motercycle driver jusr drove off after the "accident".

The next well my friend ###### went to visit his girl friend in the hospital. When he showed up she started cursing at him. I wonder why?

Not that I would ever recommend such a thing.

My father was old school and he raised me that way, i would not condone violence on women for any reason no matter what. If a man is burn't the bigger guys just walk away and don't look back. Your friend may have a smug look on his face but he is still a complete tosser

[mikethevigoman]

1. If the bf came from an influential Thai family.

2. If the bf came from an uninfluential Thai family.

3. If the bf's parents were expat farangs.

perhaps your answer would be the same for each, or perhaps not.

The bf in question is 18 years old. Your daughter is also 18 years old. Assume your daughter had a black eye and bloody lip.

it would be the first and last time, i dont like bullys, and he would be aware of that if he hit my daughter,.

[muhammad10280]

1. If the bf came from an influential Thai family.

2. If the bf came from an uninfluential Thai family.

3. If the bf's parents were expat farangs.

perhaps your answer would be the same for each, or perhaps not.

The bf in question is 18 years old. Your daughter is also 18 years old. Assume your daughter had a black eye and bloody lip.

Then I would get severely punish the boy.

Then I would punish the daughter for bringing shame to the family by having a boyfriend.

[dee123]

...I encountered a situation while working at a concert last year where my wife was providing Thai food, for while using a portable toilet a group of teenagers pushed it on its side,...(yes there is a funny side),...but seriously frightening ,....luckily she wasn't hurt but shocked and angry,...she shouted to me in a distressed manner,and after realising she was in trouble I ran over where 10/15 smiling yobs were standing,....I was angry but outnumbered, never the less I let leash with my tongue "your really fxxxing tough you lot,aren't ya !picking on a little old lady",...u bunch of wanke_rs "etc...luckily for me they didn't attack me cause I'm not as strong as I used to be,.PHEEW ! my wife wanted to go back for a knife!!..I tried to calm her down and told my friend to go and get my mobile to phone the cops,....anyway eventually the cops came and arrested the perpetrators,....but when asked if we wanted to press charges my wife and I declined as they had already spent a night in the cell..... this was in UK...my advice .... .best to let the cops sort it!!!

Edited March 22, 2008 by dee123

[dee123]

.....ooooh Ive just noticed a new member .....muhammad10280,...... ...

[muhammad10280]

.....ooooh Ive just noticed a new member .....muhammad10280,...... ...

Thank you for the welcome. Although my reception has not been warm from some peoples.

[howtoescape]

This is one of those hypothetical subjects you get drunk <deleted> propping the bar discussing whilst puffing their chests out, making out they are double hard barstewards, then the same <deleted> all testosteroned up from imagining they can take on the world start a bit of bother with some innocent polite guy who can genuinellydefend himself and kicks the <deleted> out the drunk <deleted>.

Without doubt this is the most stupid topic on TV for a long time and is no way Thai related in any way shape or form, i prefered the topic about the waitress dropping the fork in Pattaya at least it actually happened.

And it should be closed if the Mods wish to keep TV highbrow.

Edited March 22, 2008 by howtoescape

[dee123]

...yes its gonna start getting messy ......good point howtoescape.....but sometimes its good fun listening to the RAMBO'S"

Edited March 22, 2008 by dee123

[bina]

actually,

if my now 20 yr old was abused by her boyfriend, or hit, i would be talking to her, not her boyfriend. she is the one that has to decide to get out of the situation, not me and hitting hte boyfriend certainly wouldnt help.... and if she stays in the relationship then i would seriously be checking my own and her relationships and suggesting that she take a good hard look at the situation so she doesnt carry on with him or repeat at a future date what has happened now.

if u all think that beating up the boyfriend will help, go ahead. if your daughter doesnt do anything about the situation, u will just be bailing her out again and again from similar situations.

peace blondie, good for your. i went to school in a quaker school for four years and previously had a judo teacher from japan that always told us, while your mouth still works, use it. if u cant use your mouth, then hit hard... or run....

i certainly wouldnt appreciate a rambo father barging on in and beating up my boyfriend; i would prefer that we all sat down and had a little chat, depending on the cercumstances of being hit... (my best friend is fast with her temper so getting hit back once may have been cause she hit first....).

but i'm a woman, so what do i know....

bina

israel

[onethailand]

if u all think that beating up the boyfriend will help, go ahead. if your daughter doesnt do anything about the situation, u will just be bailing her out again and again from similar situations.

I mostly agree with what you said.

Kicking the boy's ass may not help the situation - but it will sure give me the satisfaction of letting my steam off. If it had been my boy, depending on the circumstances, I'd probably tell him to fight his own fight... but the girls, not, even if my eldest could probably hold her own against most boys.

After blowing off steam, then I come back to my daughter and ask her what she is going to do next.

The daughter may have been part of the problem - but that is no excuse for her boyfriend to hit her. Ultimately there's only so much a parent can do - forbidding contact may actually make it worse. Best to let the daughter make up her mind - if I don't agree, then she's free to start supporting herself.

[pop_corn]

1. If the bf came from an influential Thai family.

2. If the bf came from an uninfluential Thai family.

3. If the bf's parents were expat farangs.

perhaps your answer would be the same for each, or perhaps not.

The bf in question is 18 years old. Your daughter is also 18 years old. Assume your daughter had a black eye and bloody lip.

Then I would get severely punish the boy.

Then I would punish the daughter for bringing shame to the family by having a boyfriend.

emmmmmmmmmmm..................

[rethaired]

Thanks PB for sharing this story! Refreshing!

May all people and all nations learn from this ... that indeed human beings sometimes err! Especially the younger and the immature types!

One question though (which I think you did not answer): what led him to punch her? Maybe he found out that it was not his or maybe she lied about being protected! Not that this would excuse his actions, of course, but sometimes there are extenuating circumstances and sometimes some people have not reached this level of control or have that in them! We are not all ... born equal! Right?

Great story, PB!

Thanks for making my day!

There is hope!

Peace!

He never denied it was his baby; he had insisted they not use contraceptives because he was Catholic! Now they have both converted to Mennonite. They were under incredible strain at the time, finishing secondary school and trying to get scholarships (she got full scholarship to the most expensive school in Texas). It was totally out of character for him, and he truly repented. My second girl also came up preggers, and we did the same thing (although they were both academic underachievers). Each of those two girls has now had three babies, happily married, on good terms with all the parents, etc.

Thanks for clarifying!

Right! He was a Catholic. I did not know that all Catholics still follow the rule that one should not use contraception.

While I am sure that you have no reason to doubt you daugther's words or actions and while he did not deny it was his, it is still could be someone else's baby. I doubt very much that it would have been "wise" for him to even raise the topic after beating up your daughter. The scenario I am painting is IMHO not beyond the realm of possibilities as we know that a number of men raise illegitimate children: http://www.divorcereform.org/ill.html. Granted, it does not seem to be the case here!

Although I do have great respect for pacifism, I believe that --like all ideologies-- if pushed to its extreme, it is flawed. Flawed in the sense that one has to sometimes use other means to get a person to stop violence, be it psychological or physical. If my life is threatened or someone else's, then, it would follow that I would have the right to use force. As you have pointed before, you made a deal with him, giving him the benefit of the doubt and should he "reoffend", you stated that you would not be so lenient next time. Laying charges would have been my next move.

Cheers!

Edited March 22, 2008 by rethaired

[farang prince]

1. If the bf came from an influential Thai family.

2. If the bf came from an uninfluential Thai family.

3. If the bf's parents were expat farangs.

perhaps your answer would be the same for each, or perhaps not.

The bf in question is 18 years old. Your daughter is also 18 years old. Assume your daughter had a black eye and bloody lip.

Is the daughter living at home or with the bf? If she is living at home, then I would take her to the police station to file an assault and battery report. This is so that the next time the little prick touched her there would be grounds for justifiable homicide.

Then I would teach my daughter how to load double-aught buckshot (.00) into a .12-gauge shotgun. I would teach her how to aim the shotgun and then pull the trigger. If the little prick ever beat her again, the shotgun would be put to use, either by her or me. I would strongly suggest to my daughter that she never see the little prick again. But since she is 18, she can decide that for herself. I also would make sure the little prick's parents were aware of the assault and I would suggest that they keep junior away from my house if they wanted to see their son make it to 19.

Fortunately I don't have a daughter and if I did she would already have been trained on how to use a variety of deadly weapons. But if my son ever beat his girlfriend, I would beat him within an inch of his life. He already knows that and so he treats women very very well.

Edited March 22, 2008 by farang prince

[slapout]

They used to have a quick and semi perment solution for the first time lawbreakers (non felony). They could enlist in the service or charges would be pressed with possible conviction being in their future. Do not know of this being utilized for girl or lady beaters as this type of action seemed to come from older men. (married, short of money, drinking, just displaying an inflated sense of power, or what ever excuse) I am for second chance for minor offences but I cannot convience myself this type of action is minor. Okay. a one time blowup and a quick slap or hair pull, may deserve a dutch uncle talk. A beating is another matter, and most of us can agree on the difference is between the two. I am glad some of the mentioned cases have worked out, but if the womens abuse centers are any indication, 1000's have not. A enlistment in the service, would in many cases, teach these young men the value of thinking before acting, controling their temper, and instill in them the concept of their being responsible for their actions. When I was growing up to hit a girl friend was a action that would have brought down the wrath of your and her family as well as the whole community. (we all knew who the wife and kid beaters were) and they were excluded in many social activities.