The Troubles Of Rapid Urbanisation!

[khall64au]

Since this thread has morphed into topics of multi-discussion, I renamed it to focus more on the multiple problems of Phuket's rapid growth and fractured urbanisation resulting from a lack of planning and infrastructural and public service funding.

With all due respect, the local media have talked about some of these issues of late - but perhaps the horse has already bolted?

I have used, below, the small village of Nai Harn in Phuket's far south as an example of issues faced on the entire island. I hope this makes more sense to those confused by original topic.......

It's great to see police finally patrolling the roads in Rawai and Nai Harn now - albeit early in the evening, but seems to be working with few reports of late night motorcycle muggings at present.... hooray!

But now we have a new safety menace ... congested sois filled with speeding vehicles that are intent on running all off the road. Today I recorded my observances for several hours before and after sunset. This is my last record:

The rumbling trucks power past on recently sleepy Soi Sai Yuan, Nai Harn beach at 9.38pm on a Saturday night - delivering land fill to the last few rice paddies, vegetable gardens and lily ponds. Once the charm, this area is rapidly becoming suburbs of Costa del Sol. Speeding sports cars that run us bicyclists off the narrow sois- particularly in the late afternoon- meant for songtaews and motorcyclists just last year from memory - and now attracting ever increasing numbers of those who prefer to bicycle for fitness or out of need to beat rising fuel prices. Still the exclusive speeding sports vehicles and SUVs come - cos they can and they are the pompous new owners of the land-filled luxury villas just a few short years ago occupied by buffaloes and rice farmers.

Long live the new-age bicyclists? It's scary out there - I dare not learn to ride a motorcycle cos it's much easier to ditch a slower moving pushie than a quick multi-gear Honda Dream when faced with a speeding ten-ton truck facing a collision with a zippy Honda Accord.....

I think I'll take up power-walking! But then again ... that's not a viable solution when trying to cross the road in formerly sleepy Soi Sai Yuan...

I've heard about a great island in Phang Nga Bay - not far from the airport - has internet access, cable TV, clean beaches, cheap seafood.....

Edited by khall64au

[stuandchris]

Sorry but this makes no sense at all, are you complaining that SUV's have taken the place of buffalo's, or is it a cycle track thing?

You have a point about the charm going but mixing it with a complaint about pompous car owners is nonsense.

And yes I do have a SUV, I am not pompous at all, am courteous to bike riders even stupid farang bike riders who themselves seem to have forgotten how to drive in a safe manner.

You seem to be after the days were you could drive down deserted roads in any manner you want. Money has arrived and you resent it.

[stuandchris]

Also forgot this, what the hel_l has this got to do with Rawai muggings? Don't hijack a serious thread for your own petty complaints.

[bratpack]

Also forgot this, what the hel_l has this got to do with Rawai muggings? Don't hijack a serious thread for your own petty complaints.

Flaming and hijacking by a super moderator too.

Edited June 28, 2008 by bratpack

[khall64au]

Also forgot this, what the hel_l has this got to do with Rawai muggings? Don't hijack a serious thread for your own petty complaints.

Flaming and hijacking by a super moderator too.

Flaming and hijacking by a super moderator too.

Basically, we are talking about the same thing as the Rawai muggings thread - the rapid expansion of Phuket economic development without any foresight of social development models - which - considering your member post count you know or think little about as recent "immigrants" to the island or members of the forum in view of such discussions.

Some of us have been considering these issues for years now - saw them coming and - unfortunately, since we are just "guests" of this country can do little about. We can still discuss the issues here on ThaiVisa though.

My point was - it's not only dangerous to be out after dark now but... if you're not careful, you'll be flat on your back by the same neglect of rapid development in broad daylight... just as if you were mugged by a ya bah freak at midnight. How's that for flaming?

[bratpack]

you called the car drivers pompous

[Boo]

and? please dont attempt to take this off topic with your own agenda. I have a zero tolerance policy towards that kind of nonsense.

The op expressed an opinion, she didn't hijack a thread as she opened her own & she didn't flame anyone. So drop it.

[khall64au]

you called the car drivers pompous

Well, they drive really fast.... it's just a village with skinny roads - not the M5! What's wrong with 'pompous'?

[LivinLOS]

What muggings ?? What twist on mugging ??

Perhaps learning to ride a vehicle that can move at road vehicle speeds ??? Or joining the ranks of the car drivers ??

If its pastoral quiet life of rice paddies and buffalo your after.. Huge swathes of Thailand still have it..

[ade100]

Also, just back to the title of this thread for a moment.

I haven’t been at my holiday home in Pookers for a few weeks and was starting to feel very negative about the place with all the violence against Caucasians. Can anyone give a quick update on the measures police are taking? Is it true what the OP says that they are only patrolling in the early evening? I believe most of the muggings have taken place in the early hours so this might not be very affective.

Thanks

Ade

[smartecosse]

well i live on saiyuan and only a few years ago it was a safe road to walk along

now as the op pointed out there are that many people that are hurrying to get from their gated villa to central that its not nice walking the road with the amount of traffic

obviously more condo's/houses etc mean more traffic but they dont have to drive like <deleted> in what is a residential area with lots of kids about

[steelepulse]

well i live on saiyuan and only a few years ago it was a safe road to walk along

now as the op pointed out there are that many people that are hurrying to get from their gated villa to central that its not nice walking the road with the amount of traffic

obviously more condo's/houses etc mean more traffic but they dont have to drive like <deleted> in what is a residential area with lots of kids about

I just came back from having lunch and driving on sai yuan I had to get over to the far left as a nice black SUV for some reason thought that he needed to be doing 70 to pass a motorbike.  All these people in a hurry to ..............slow down behind the next moderately paced vehicle/motorbike.  

Slightly O/T, but I think the thread title should be changed to " Crappy fast driving in Nai Harn"  Oh wait, that would apply to all of Phuket.

[chickencurry]

am courteous to bike riders even stupid farang bike riders who themselves seem to have forgotten how to drive in a safe manner.

Yes, we've noticed the stupid farang bike riders too (from our nice villa previously rice paddy with buffaloes blah blah blah) but we don't have a SUV. Before we moved here, we were told about the "driving standards" in Phuket and assumed people meant local Thais but definitely not the case - certainly not down Sai Yuan, Soi Naya and the likes. And when you see some of these bikers outside minimarts drinking beer at 9 in the morning, it's not surprising is it.

[slackula]

I drive through the area pretty regularly and I think the clowns meandering along the middle of the road at 20km/h on mopeds and those dilapidated tricycle things without a care in the world for other road users are the biggest threat to road safety.

I always give way to cyclists and bike riders *if* they take the time to inform those behind them of what they intend to do; sadly too few do and I am not psychic. Most seem to prefer to maneuver and *then* indicate.

My biggest bug-bear is about those not wearing helmets: If the rider shows a blatant disregard for his own personal safety then why the hel_l should I care about it? You wanna cruise in shorts and flip flops? Fine, but don't come crying when you become a drooling vegetable having road rash scraped out of your elbows and knees.

/I ride a bike regularly, I understand the risks and I take measures to mitigate them, and I take responsibility for my actions.

//rant over

[LivinginKata]

My biggest bug-bear is about those not wearing helmets: If the rider shows a blatant disregard for his own personal safety then why the hel_l should I care about it? You wanna cruise in shorts and flip flops? Fine, but don't come crying when you become a drooling vegetable having road rash scraped out of your elbows and knees.

I agree, but the fact of the matter/law is that the vehicle causing the accident will have to pay the hospital/disability claim for that 'drooling vegetable). The police/court take no account about wearing helmet/valid driving licence/tax or insurance/illegal vehicles (such as a trolley). It's a no win situation.

[LeungKen]

.

Please would the OP consider retitling this thread as it is misleading when first read.

[cotambear]

The biggest scandal - I know I am preaching to the converted - is the lack of cheap affordable public transport. I know accidents do happen but travelling in a sedately moving, large and relatively well protected bus has got to be one of the safest ways to travel.

The lack of these means that traffic increases, drunk driving increases, walking and cycling are more hazardous, the tuk tuk option has the scary risk of a drunken driver who may get violent when he tries to over overprice and the lack of protection if a tuk tuk crashes. The cartel is indirectly responsible for many deaths I feel.

[Felt 35]

Money has arrived

and the result is:

Thailand’s premier island destination took a slating from National Geographic recently. National Geographic called on 522 so-called experts to assess the world’s top island destinations in terms of the affect that tourism is having on the islands. As you can imagine, Phuket did not come off too favorably.

Each destination was given a score out of 100. Phuket’s score was a lowly 46, which means the island is “in serious trouble”.

The National Geographic experts commented as follows:

“Chaotic development. The Thai people do not realize what a beautiful island we have. They continue to over-exploit all the island’s resources. Old buildings from the pioneer settlement era still can be found downtown. However, many are not taken care of. No building code harmonizing construction with the natural settings, especially on Pathong beach (ugly high-rise building). We missed the window of opportunity after the 2004 tsunami to clean out illegal coastal development. Very sad.”

“Phuket’s original charm as an astonishingly beautiful, unspoiled, and culturally rich destination has been completely lost.”

“Given the tsunami, it’s wonderful to see what has been achieved to rebuild people’s lives in two and a half years. What I experienced is a credit to small and micro businesses that kept faith in the tourism future of the island. Like all destinations, there are various ecological, social, and economic challenges.”

“A planning disaster! Reputation for bars and illicit activities overwhelm the natural charm of the Thai people. Prostitution and urban sprawl rampant.”

“Too much tourism development without a plan. Pathong is a classical sex-tourism destination, probably worse than Bangkok. Some nice resorts and beaches. The water ‘looks’ fine, but is polluted.”

[geriatrickid]

I understand the OP's post, and they are valid observations. As an avid cyclist I have very fond memories of cycling the Karon to Kata strip as recently as 5 years ago. I don't dare do it alone now because of the speeding SUV's and pickups. Unfortunately, some drivers of SUVs develop a sense of invulnerability in their gas guzzlers and tend to forget speed limits. An SUV can't stop as quickly as a reliable Honda or Toyota and way too often I've seen these SUVs tailgating and honking when someone doesn't move fast enough for them. Everytime I look in one of those errant SUVs, the type of driver I see is a male aged 40-60. It's never a young driver and it's never a driver accompanied by a farang lady. Maybe they are having 2nd childhoods behind the wheel and could do with a talking to by their mummies.

[slackula]

...Maybe they are having 2nd childhoods behind the wheel and could do with a talking to by their mummies.

Ironic coming from someone called geriatrickid

[petitechevre]

i think you are over reacting, the only dumbness of thai drivers is.. their <deleted> need to drive at 80 and brake 2meters before the cars that are stopped at a redlight...

every single day i get honked about 30 meters from the redlight by cars that want to go faster than 60 when they have to stop in less than 5secs literaly... i seriously dont get it and do my best to stay in the middle of 2 lanes and then proceed to wave my hand to make them more angry hoping that they crash and never drive again.

No joke, last week i went to the movies, on my street, 2 car beeped me 4 shops away from the light that just turned red 5secs before... they pass me by going into the wrong way when cars where coming. speeding and then drifting when they had to break 15meters later... i pass them going 10kilo.. go in fromnt of the cars... 1kilo later same car does the same thing in the middle of traffic, goes in the wrong way... almost crashes... when theres a red light 100meters away... i once again drive by him when hes trying to push motorbikes waiting for the green light(he tried to get in the small lane on the left)... then he speeds away just to get to a new red light, honks everyone... again he does the same thing at the central light, he tries to pass me by going around 80 with about 80meters left... gets less than 10cm away from a car that was going at a normal speed...

and then i see this idiot going to central... ya life threatening speeds to goto a shopping mall..

sorry for the rant, i just HATE those idiots who cannot stop pressing the beeper and gas pedal when they are about to get to a red light... im getting a pickup this month and i will definately block the whole street when i see those idiots arriving. one day they'll kill a old lady or a family with a baby on their bikes.

[stevenl]

im getting a pickup this month and i will definately block the whole street when i see those idiots arriving. one day they'll kill a old lady or a family with a baby on their bikes.

Do that, and you'll be involved in an accident very quickly, or (even worse) you'll force them to swirve around you and hit others who may not have the same kind of protection as you do.

IMO it is not a very wise thing to contribute to road rage this way.

[LivinginKata]

im getting a pickup this month and i will definately block the whole street when i see those idiots arriving. one day they'll kill a old lady or a family with a baby on their bikes.

Do that, and you'll be involved in an accident very quickly, or (even worse) you'll force them to swirve around you and hit others who may not have the same kind of protection as you do.

IMO it is not a very wise thing to contribute to road rage this way.

Completely agree, especially after looking into the barrel of a gun held by an enraged driver. Just not worth getting into a road rage situation .... anywhere in the world.

[khall64au]

.

Please would the OP consider retitling this thread as it is misleading when first read.

OK - how about "Phuket infrastructure sucks for silly rich farang investors and other alien residents"?

Why am I sitting outside Don's Mall (thankyou Don!) sending an urgent email to a client on the otherside of the world - risking being mugged in the early hours? Because I can't get a phone line to my house and all other satellite technology is blocked for one reason or another~

[Sir Burr]

^

On the one hand, you decry the loss of rice paddy field and buffaloes to make way for development while on the other, you are complaining about the crap technology.

What do you want? Make up your mind, you can't have it both ways........

[LivinLOS]

Exactly..

And the fact is CAT aircards work great.. EDGE on GSM is useable, and IPStar was around 5 years ago.. I too couldnt get a phone line.. Surprise surprsie 15k later and the line is in with the best net connection I have had in Thailand 2Mbps real international speeds !! The 'no phone line' is just the opening gambit in a bribery dance..

[HDRIDER]

.

Please would the OP consider retitling this thread as it is misleading when first read.

OK - how about "Phuket infrastructure sucks for silly rich farang investors and other alien residents"?

Why am I sitting outside Don's Mall (thankyou Don!) sending an urgent email to a client on the otherside of the world - risking being mugged in the early hours? Because I can't get a phone line to my house and all other satellite technology is blocked for one reason or another~

Hi

CAT telecom, EV-DO USB modem, works good here in Nai Harn,

Download Speed: 1068 kbps (133.5 KB/sec transfer rate)

Upload Speed: 89 kbps (11.1 KB/sec transfer rate)

[LeungKen]

.

Please would the OP consider retitling this thread as it is misleading when first read.

OK - how about "Phuket infrastructure sucks for silly rich farang investors and other alien residents"?

Why am I sitting outside Don's Mall (thankyou Don!) sending an urgent email to a client on the otherside of the world - risking being mugged in the early hours? Because I can't get a phone line to my house and all other satellite technology is blocked for one reason or another~

I give up.

I have tried to understand.

Now I refuse to follow this diatribe as I fear the OP is only inviting agitatation, IMHO.

[Nirvana]

.

Please would the OP consider retitling this thread as it is misleading when first read.

OK - how about "Phuket infrastructure sucks for silly rich farang investors and other alien residents"?

Why am I sitting outside Don's Mall (thankyou Don!) sending an urgent email to a client on the otherside of the world - risking being mugged in the early hours? Because I can't get a phone line to my house and all other satellite technology is blocked for one reason or another~

How did you become a super moderator by making conflicting and confusing posts like that. Utter nonsense, first complaining about old days and then about modern technology. Might as well delete the whole post for what it is worth.

[MustaphaMond]

Yes I'm afraid I agree SuV drivers tend toward pomposity and I'd add stupidity with a propensity for sheep like " must conform "behavior

Gas guzzling -unsafe from rollover Unsafe fom crashes unsafe for others on the road ,

Why does anyone need such a big vehicle ?

What are they trying to make up for??

Oh.... I see