Why A Non Thai Can Never Integrate In Thailand

[geriatrickid]

I was reading my RSS and was surprised to see a story coming out of Taiwan

TAIPEI (Reuters) – An American-born caucasian is running for Taiwan's parliament next month, a first for the island, to fill a seat. Robin Winkler, a Taipei-based lawyer, environmental activist and Taiwan citizen since 2003, would be the first caucasian to run for parliament in Taiwan, which is 98 percent ethnic Chinese and 2 percent aboriginal. Any Taiwan citizen can run for parliament regardless of birthplace, an election official said. Winkler, a fluent Chinese speaker who has lived in Taiwan since 1977 and became a local citizen in 2003, renouncing his U.S. nationality, said he would run in the March 28 election either with Taiwan's Green Party or on his own.

Ok, that's something, but it shows that if one respects local laws and adapts, one can become part of the process. So I had a look and wondered if a farang that had integrated into Thailand, taking Thai citizenship, could ever aspire to be part of the country and to contribute to the government? After all, the definitive statement of acceptance is if an immigrant is allowed to run for public office. I had a look at the law in Thailand; age: at least 25 years old - Thai citizenship by birth

The law also makes a specific reference to "deaf and dumb persons". In the old days, that ignorant expression referred to the deaf and mute.

Well, isn't that special. One has to be Thai by birth to have a chance at running for the house of Representatives. A flagrant denial of human rights if ever there was one, as it discriminates on the basis of national origin. It also discriminates against those with a disability that can be adapted for. A quick comparison to other countries shows that Thailand is in the minority on this.

Philippines: age: 18 years - Philippine citizenship

Vietnam: age: 21 years - Vietnamese citizenship

Cambodia: age: 25 years - Cambodian citizenship

China: age: 18 years - Chinese citizenship

Laos: - age: 21 years - Lao citizenship

Burma: No representation

Malaysia: age: 21 years - Malaysian citizenship

Source: http://www.ipu.org/english/home.htm

That to me says it all. If you are not born in Thailand or that if you are hearing and voice impaired, you can not belong, nor will you ever be allowed to belong. Such a position then becomes ingrained in everything the government does in respect to foreigners that immigrate. It then trickles down into the attitudes extended to expats.

No matter how much the apologists want to joke it off or say who wants to run for office anyway (I'm also waiting for the deaf and dumb comments about the politicos), this really is an affront. The eligibility law is blatant discrimination. If a foreigner, no matter how fluent in Thai, no matter how long residing in Thailand, no matter how loyal and no matter how adapted, is denied this basic civil right, what does it say about the country? The message I take away, is that in the eyes of Thailand, no matter how good a citizen you are, you are not good enough. To say otherwise is to deny the reality.

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

[ClaytonSeymour]

what does it say about the country?

It confirms what many of us already know.

[kiakaha]

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

Is your middle name "knee jerk reaction" perhaps ?

How about this example then from the cornerstone of world democracy.......

An American citizen not born in USA territory(ie: a naturalized citizen) can not run for president. You must be a natural born citizen.

No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

[wxpwzrd]

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

Is your middle name "knee jerk reaction" perhaps ?

How about this example then from the cornerstone of world democracy.......

An American citizen not born in USA territory(ie: a naturalized citizen) can not run for president. You must be a natural born citizen.

No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

Well, not meant for this topic, but I agree with the US Constitution on that one. There are plenty of other offices a person can represent in our 'cornerstone of world democracy'

Now on the topic of what the poster mentioned - Total overreaction on the OP. So be it... They want natural citizens of their country to hold office then cool. They are supposedly the ones with the most vested interest in the progress of their country.

[dseawarrior]

I was reading my RSS and was surprised to see a story coming out of Taiwan

TAIPEI (Reuters) – An American-born caucasian is running for Taiwan's parliament next month, a first for the island, to fill a seat. Robin Winkler, a Taipei-based lawyer, environmental activist and Taiwan citizen since 2003, would be the first caucasian to run for parliament in Taiwan, which is 98 percent ethnic Chinese and 2 percent aboriginal. Any Taiwan citizen can run for parliament regardless of birthplace, an election official said. Winkler, a fluent Chinese speaker who has lived in Taiwan since 1977 and became a local citizen in 2003, renouncing his U.S. nationality, said he would run in the March 28 election either with Taiwan's Green Party or on his own.

Ok, that's something, but it shows that if one respects local laws and adapts, one can become part of the process. So I had a look and wondered if a farang that had integrated into Thailand, taking Thai citizenship, could ever aspire to be part of the country and to contribute to the government? After all, the definitive statement of acceptance is if an immigrant is allowed to run for public office. I had a look at the law in Thailand; age: at least 25 years old - Thai citizenship by birth

The law also makes a specific reference to "deaf and dumb persons". In the old days, that ignorant expression referred to the deaf and mute.

Well, isn't that special. One has to be Thai by birth to have a chance at running for the house of Representatives. A flagrant denial of human rights if ever there was one, as it discriminates on the basis of national origin. It also discriminates against those with a disability that can be adapted for. A quick comparison to other countries shows that Thailand is in the minority on this.

Philippines: age: 18 years - Philippine citizenship

Vietnam: age: 21 years - Vietnamese citizenship

Cambodia: age: 25 years - Cambodian citizenship

China: age: 18 years - Chinese citizenship

Laos: - age: 21 years - Lao citizenship

Burma: No representation

Malaysia: age: 21 years - Malaysian citizenship

Source: http://www.ipu.org/english/home.htm

That to me says it all. If you are not born in Thailand or that if you are hearing and voice impaired, you can not belong, nor will you ever be allowed to belong. Such a position then becomes ingrained in everything the government does in respect to foreigners that immigrate. It then trickles down into the attitudes extended to expats.

No matter how much the apologists want to joke it off or say who wants to run for office anyway (I'm also waiting for the deaf and dumb comments about the politicos), this really is an affront. The eligibility law is blatant discrimination. If a foreigner, no matter how fluent in Thai, no matter how long residing in Thailand, no matter how loyal and no matter how adapted, is denied this basic civil right, what does it say about the country? The message I take away, is that in the eyes of Thailand, no matter how good a citizen you are, you are not good enough. To say otherwise is to deny the reality.

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

You gotta be careful in the Land Of Smiles...

Ever hear of "yim haeng" ?

= "dry smile"

There are lots of "dry smiles" of Thais towards foreigners or anyone who they feel is "beneath" them...

I believe this lovely "tradition" comes from the legacy of slavery that still exists in many ways...

A hierarchical society makes an egalitarian society impossible...

Until Thais embrace the basic goodness of all people

And all peoples' basic rights

This inequality will continue

Universal Thai access to a good quality education needs to come first...

...before Thais will ever be "wise" enough to consider foreigners as "equal enough" to join their body politic...

Right now, most Thais do not even have a clue about the important discussion in this thread...

Ignorance is bliss, right?

Kaw hai tuk tuk kon mee kwamsuk na krab...

May every person have happiness...

[dotcom]

So you mean I have to give up my dream of being Prime Minister? Shattered.

[kiakaha]

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

Is your middle name "knee jerk reaction" perhaps ?

How about this example then from the cornerstone of world democracy.......

An American citizen not born in USA territory(ie: a naturalized citizen) can not run for president. You must be a natural born citizen.

No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

Well, not meant for this topic, but I agree with the US Constitution on that one. There are plenty of other offices a person can represent in our 'cornerstone of world democracy'

Now on the topic of what the poster mentioned - Total overreaction on the OP. So be it... They want natural citizens of their country to hold office then cool. They are supposedly the ones with the most vested interest in the progress of their country.

off topic you say ?

topic - only a natural born citizen can run for office in thailand

my reply - an example of another country where only a natural born citizen can run for office, as per the OP's stance, and I quote "...I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts..."

[Jimjim]

Never say never

That may be, but I have heard of farang becoming akin to mayors of small villages in Isaan (forget the Thai words for this). I guess it was not legal and official in every way, but in rare cases it happens.

[kiakaha]

Never say never

That may be, but I have heard of farang becoming akin to mayors of small villages in Isaan (forget the Thai words for this). I guess it was not legal and official in every way, but in rare cases it happens.

I believe the word you are after is ผู้ใหญ่บ้าน.

I may be wrong, but I don't believe this position carrys with it a constitutional status.

[Naam]

There are lots of "dry smiles" of Thais towards foreigners or anyone who they feel is "beneath" them...

that might be true, but in my [not so] humble opinion only foreigners burdened with a bunch of inferiority complexes care about it.

[Heng]

One can still rise to the top (or near it anyway) of the local business world, become a captain of industry, have substantial sway on the SET like Bill Heinecke and undoubtedly INFLUENCE Thai politics and no doubt the course of the nation.

IF you had what it takes of course.

[sassienie]

I love Thailand the way it is. So very difference from the rat race in the West I managed to escape from.

Would hate to see too many Western influences here that could destroy Thai culture and unique way of life.

Too many undesirable Farangs here already, pray be that they never put any in charge.

[Heng]

There's most certainly a rat race here. It's just that the fattest 100,000 or so of the jumbo mega rats keep the 5-10 million of the big-n-fat rats in check and they in turn don't allow the majority of the 40-50 million smaller rats to even "run" on a meaningful level. Foreigners who manage to get past the whole 'purple ink stamp hoops/chutes/and ladders qualifying rounds' are allowed to run in some select races.

[dave9988]

funnily enough i think B.H. is married to a western woman. go figure!

[bkkjames]

One can still rise to the top (or near it anyway) of the local business world, become a captain of industry, have substantial sway on the SET like Bill Heinecke and undoubtedly INFLUENCE Thai politics and no doubt the course of the nation.

IF you had what it takes of course.

unlike most of us.... In 1991, Bill Heinecke became a Thai citizen.

[dave9988]

When is it that you guys are going to realize that most of what you like about Thailand is simply a result of Thailand being cheap. Happiness in life is directly correlated to wealth and its dirt cheap here. Now these simple facts and the fact that farm girls will look in your direction gets projected in the silliest of notions, such as "I want to be a Thai citizen".... "I want to run for Thai government"....

You aren't Thai. And why would a Thai person even respect you when you have so little respect for your own country? Alpha males tend to dominate in their own environment. Lions don't tend to wander off out of the jungle and into the forest if you know what I mean.

So simply enjoy the pleasures that come with living in a dirt poor society where the wealth is horded by the select few and leave all the other egotistical insecurities out of it.

[bkkjames]

When is it that you guys are going to realize that most of what you like about Thailand is simply a result of Thailand being cheap. Happiness in life is directly correlated to wealth and its dirt cheap here. Now these simple facts and the fact that farm girls will look in your direction gets projected in the silliest of notions, such as "I want to be a Thai citizen".... "I want to run for Thai government"....

You aren't Thai. And why would a Thai person even respect you when you have so little respect for your own country? Alpha males tend to dominate in their own environment. Lions don't tend to wander off out of the jungle and into the forest if you know what I mean.

So simply enjoy the pleasures that come with living in a dirt poor society where the wealth is horded by the select few and leave all the other egotistical insecurities out of it.

With a post count of nearly 500, I would have thought you had lived here quite awhile. Apparently, I was wrong.

[dave9988]

You want to be Thai. You aren't. I am pretty sure there is a whole section of books in the children section of the library which deal with this.

[bkkjames]

You want to be Thai. You aren't. I am pretty sure there is a whole section of books in the children section of the library which deal with this.

I didn't say I wanted to be Thai, but then again I don't want to be a fool either.

[jrbkk64]

Thailand is one of the better places to live if you have money. The real rich frequent more sophisticated places/areas although you do find one or two in the bars :-) on SC.

Thailand is however mostly a 3rd world country, where basic human rights do not exist, justice depends on money/social status, free and fair elections do not exist, corruption is endemic at all levels in society, etc, etc.

So why would anyone in his right mind want a Thai passport or get involved in all the very dirty politics here? Just doing business here and living a very comfortable lifestyle is all I need from Thailand while keeping my EU passport!

I can't care less that some Thais don't like me, I know many who do.

Good luck

Edited February 5, 2009 by jrbkk64

[thaiwanderer]

Ok, that's something, but it shows that if one respects local laws and adapts, one can become part of the process. So I had a look and wondered if a farang that had integrated into Thailand, taking Thai citizenship, could ever aspire to be part of the country and to contribute to the government?

A flagrant denial of human rights if ever there was one, as it discriminates on the basis of national origin. It also discriminates against those with a disability that can be adapted for. A quick comparison to other countries shows that Thailand is in the minority on this.

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

Which exact human rights are offended by this?

[madjbs]

So are you going to give a source for this amazing info that you have found.......

Are you sure the source is accurate? After all, it will be a translation and not the official law.

Are you another one of those farangs which deliberately goes around looking for things to moan and be offended by? It certainly looks like it!

[Heng]

One can still rise to the top (or near it anyway) of the local business world, become a captain of industry, have substantial sway on the SET like Bill Heinecke and undoubtedly INFLUENCE Thai politics and no doubt the course of the nation.

IF you had what it takes of course.

unlike most of us.... In 1991, Bill Heinecke became a Thai citizen.

Of course. After you've acquired enough mass and momentum in a society, it's a rather logical thing to do. No different from illegal (at first) South and Central Americans who later become US citizens.

[Heng]

You aren't Thai. And why would a Thai person even respect you when you have so little respect for your own country? Alpha males tend to dominate in their own environment. Lions don't tend to wander off out of the jungle and into the forest if you know what I mean.

Alpha male humans tent to prosper in whatever environment they live in, pass through, or relocate to as in the cases of the aforementioned Bill, or Jim Thompson, or Adoph Link, etc.

The rest tend to get whatever visa they are required to get, push their carts around Tesco Lotus whilst making sure that the the price of each item doesn't blow their daily "budget," and spend their lives waiting for the scraps/dividends paid to them by the alphas to come in on "pay day."

I don't think any of the whingers or Thailand haters actually want to just get citizenship, or become a member of parliament. What they want, and what they have long been missing IMO is their own dignity and self respect.

[DP25]

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

[/color][/color]

I hope you're not from America. In the USA if you want to be president, you have to have been a US citizen BY BIRTH. Legal immigrants who are citizens of the United States are not eligible for the job, only people born in the US.

[Geekfreaklover]

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

[/color][/color]

I hope you're not from America. In the USA if you want to be president, you have to have been a US citizen BY BIRTH. Legal immigrants who are citizens of the United States are not eligible for the job, only people born in the US.

... I seem to recall that Governor Arnold Swarzenegger is/was trying to change the constitution on that item.

[geriatrickid]

Which exact human rights are offended by this?

Discrimination on the basis of national origin and/or physical disability. These are pretty well acknowledged by all countries. Even Thailand signed off on that one in the International Conventions.

I can understand if they said it for being Regent or even Prime Minister, but c'mon, applying it to a basic member of the House of Representatives? If it is that important to local culture, how come no other regional member has such a requirement. OK, there's Burma, but it does not have elections. Fine company to be keeping.

Edited February 5, 2009 by geriatrickid

[thaiwanderer]

Which exact human rights are offended by this?

Discrimination on the basis of national origin and/or physical disability. These are pretty well acknowledged by all countries. Even Thailand signed off on that one in the International Conventions.

I can understand if they said it for being Regent or even Prime Minister, but c'mon, applying it to a basic member of the House of Representatives? If it is that important to local culture, how come no other regional member has such a requirement. OK, there's Burma, but it does not have elections. Fine company to be keeping.

From the constitution:-

Section 101. A person having the following qualifications has the right to be a candidate in an election of members of the House of Representatives: (1) being of Thai nationality by birth; (2) being not less than twenty five years of age on the election day; (3) being a member of any and only one political party for a consecutive period of not less than ninety days up to the election day, except that in the case where a general election takes place as a consequence of the dissolution of the House of Representatives such person must be a member of any and only one political party for a consecutive period of not less than thirty days up to the election day; (4) a candidate in an election on a constituency basis shall also possess any of the following qualifications: (a) having his or her name appear in the house register in a province where he or she stands for election for a consecutive period of not less than five years up to the date of applying for candidacy; ( being born in a province where he or she stands for election; c) having studied in an educational institution situated in a province where he or she stands for election for a consecutive period of not less than five academic years; (d) having served in the official service or having had his or her name appear in the house register in a province where he or she stands for election for a consecutive period of not less than five years. (5) a candidate in an election on a proportional representation basis shall also possess any of the following qualifications under (4), provided that any of such qualification which refers to a province shall refer to a group of provinces; (6) other qualifications as provided in the Organic Act on the Election of Members of the House of Representatives and the Acquisition of Senators.

Section 102. A person under any of the following prohibitions shall have no right to be a candidate in an election of members of the House of Representatives: (1) being addicted to drugs; (2) being a bankrupt or having been a fraudulent bankrupt; (3) being disfranchised under section 100 (1), (2) or (4); (4) being sentenced by a judgment to imprisonment and being detained by a warrant of the Court; (5) having been discharged for a period of less than five years on the election day after being sentenced by a judgment to imprisonment except for an offence committed through negligence or a petty offence; (6) having been expelled, dismissed or removed from the official service, a State agency or a State enterprise on the ground of dishonest performance of duties or corruption; (7) having been ordered by a judgement or an order of the Court that his or her assets devolve on the State on the ground of unusual wealthiness or an unusual increase of his or her assets; (8) being a Government official holding a permanent position or receiving a permanent salary except a political official; (9) being a member of a local assembly or a local administrator; (10) being a senator, or having been a senator with membership having terminated for not more than two years; (11) being an official or employee of a Government agency, a State agency, a State enterprise or other State official; (12) being a judge of the Constitutional Court, an Election Commissioner, an Ombudsman, a member of the National Counter Corruption Commission, a member of the State Audit Commission or a member of the National Human Rights Commission; (13) being under the prohibition from holding a political position under section 263; (14) having been removed from office by the resolution of the Senate under section 274.

What is your source? I recall some stuff regarding capability (as a juristic person) from the CCC which is a little arcane?

The ability to become part of a foreign country's government, judiciary, executive etc. is not a human right by any stretch of the imagination.

Indeed the same applies to even the ability to visit a foreign contry.

The world is not one country. There is such a thing as national sovereignty and self determination.

Edited February 5, 2009 by thaiwanderer

[jbowman1993]

I was reading my RSS and was surprised to see a story coming out of Taiwan

TAIPEI (Reuters) – An American-born caucasian is running for Taiwan's parliament next month, a first for the island, to fill a seat. Robin Winkler, a Taipei-based lawyer, environmental activist and Taiwan citizen since 2003, would be the first caucasian to run for parliament in Taiwan, which is 98 percent ethnic Chinese and 2 percent aboriginal. Any Taiwan citizen can run for parliament regardless of birthplace, an election official said. Winkler, a fluent Chinese speaker who has lived in Taiwan since 1977 and became a local citizen in 2003, renouncing his U.S. nationality, said he would run in the March 28 election either with Taiwan's Green Party or on his own.

Ok, that's something, but it shows that if one respects local laws and adapts, one can become part of the process. So I had a look and wondered if a farang that had integrated into Thailand, taking Thai citizenship, could ever aspire to be part of the country and to contribute to the government? After all, the definitive statement of acceptance is if an immigrant is allowed to run for public office. I had a look at the law in Thailand; age: at least 25 years old - Thai citizenship by birth

The law also makes a specific reference to "deaf and dumb persons". In the old days, that ignorant expression referred to the deaf and mute.

Well, isn't that special. One has to be Thai by birth to have a chance at running for the house of Representatives. A flagrant denial of human rights if ever there was one, as it discriminates on the basis of national origin. It also discriminates against those with a disability that can be adapted for. A quick comparison to other countries shows that Thailand is in the minority on this.

Philippines: age: 18 years - Philippine citizenship

Vietnam: age: 21 years - Vietnamese citizenship

Cambodia: age: 25 years - Cambodian citizenship

China: age: 18 years - Chinese citizenship

Laos: - age: 21 years - Lao citizenship

Burma: No representation

Malaysia: age: 21 years - Malaysian citizenship

Source: http://www.ipu.org/english/home.htm

That to me says it all. If you are not born in Thailand or that if you are hearing and voice impaired, you can not belong, nor will you ever be allowed to belong. Such a position then becomes ingrained in everything the government does in respect to foreigners that immigrate. It then trickles down into the attitudes extended to expats.

No matter how much the apologists want to joke it off or say who wants to run for office anyway (I'm also waiting for the deaf and dumb comments about the politicos), this really is an affront. The eligibility law is blatant discrimination. If a foreigner, no matter how fluent in Thai, no matter how long residing in Thailand, no matter how loyal and no matter how adapted, is denied this basic civil right, what does it say about the country? The message I take away, is that in the eyes of Thailand, no matter how good a citizen you are, you are not good enough. To say otherwise is to deny the reality.

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

This whole thread is bullsh*t, because the OP's premise is wrong. This is taken from the 2007 Thai Constitution - no deaf or dumb clause. Just a whole lot of hot air from the OP.

CHAPTER VI

The National Assembly

Part 1

General Provisions

Section 101. A person having the following qualifications has the right to be a candidate in an election of members of the House of Representatives:

(1) being of Thai nationality by birth;

(2) being not less than twenty five years of age on the election day;

(3) being a member of any and only one political party for a consecutive period of not less than ninety days up to the date of applying for candidacy in an election, or being a member of any and only one political party for a consecutive period of not less than thirty days up to the date of applying for candidacy in an election in the case where the general election is conducted on account of the dissolution of the House of Representatives;

(4) a candidate in an election on a constituency basis shall also possess any of the following qualifications:

(a) having his name appear in the house register in Changwat where he stands for election for a consecutive period of not less than five years up to the date of applying for candidacy;

( being born in Changwat where he stands for election;

© having studied in an education institution situated in Changwat where he stands for election for a consecutive period of not less than five academic years;

(d) having served in the official service or having had his name appear in the house register in Changwat where he stands for election for a consecutive period of not less than five years;

(5) a candidate in an election on a proportional basis shall also possess any of the qualifications under (4) but the reference to Changwat therein shall means a group of Changwat;

(6) other qualifications as prescribed in the organic law on election of members of the House of Representatives and acquisition of senators.

Section 102. A person under any of the following prohibitions shall have no right to be a candidate in an election of members of the House of Representatives:

(1) being addicted to narcotics;

(2) being bankrupt or having been dishonestly bankrupt;

(3) being disfranchised under section 100 (1), (2) or (4);

(4) having been sentenced by a judgement to imprisonment and being detained by a warrant of the Court;

(5) having been discharged for a period of less than five years on the election day after being sentenced by a judgement to imprisonment except for an offence committed through negligence;

(6) having been expelled, dismissed or removed from the official service, a State agency or a State enterprise on the ground of dishonest performance of duties or corruption;

(7) having been ordered by a judgement or an order of the Court that his assets shall vest in the State on the ground of unusual wealth or an unusual increase of his assets;

(8) being a government official holding a permanent position or receiving salary except a political official;

(9) being a member of a local assembly or a local administrator;

(10) being a senator or having been a senator who vacates office for a period of less than two years;

(11) being an official or employee of a government agency, State agency or State enterprise or other State official;

(12) being a judge of the Constitutional Court, an Election Commissioner, an Ombudsman, a member of the State Audit Commission or a member of the National Human Right Commission;

(13) being under the prohibition from holding a political position under section 263;

(14) having been removed from office by the resolution of the Senate under section 274.

Thread should be closed

[uk2bkk]

I was reading my RSS and was surprised to see a story coming out of Taiwan

TAIPEI (Reuters) – An American-born caucasian is running for Taiwan's parliament next month, a first for the island, to fill a seat. Robin Winkler, a Taipei-based lawyer, environmental activist and Taiwan citizen since 2003, would be the first caucasian to run for parliament in Taiwan, which is 98 percent ethnic Chinese and 2 percent aboriginal. Any Taiwan citizen can run for parliament regardless of birthplace, an election official said. Winkler, a fluent Chinese speaker who has lived in Taiwan since 1977 and became a local citizen in 2003, renouncing his U.S. nationality, said he would run in the March 28 election either with Taiwan's Green Party or on his own.

Ok, that's something, but it shows that if one respects local laws and adapts, one can become part of the process. So I had a look and wondered if a farang that had integrated into Thailand, taking Thai citizenship, could ever aspire to be part of the country and to contribute to the government? After all, the definitive statement of acceptance is if an immigrant is allowed to run for public office. I had a look at the law in Thailand; age: at least 25 years old - Thai citizenship by birth

The law also makes a specific reference to "deaf and dumb persons". In the old days, that ignorant expression referred to the deaf and mute.

Well, isn't that special. One has to be Thai by birth to have a chance at running for the house of Representatives. A flagrant denial of human rights if ever there was one, as it discriminates on the basis of national origin. It also discriminates against those with a disability that can be adapted for. A quick comparison to other countries shows that Thailand is in the minority on this.

Philippines: age: 18 years - Philippine citizenship

Vietnam: age: 21 years - Vietnamese citizenship

Cambodia: age: 25 years - Cambodian citizenship

China: age: 18 years - Chinese citizenship

Laos: - age: 21 years - Lao citizenship

Burma: No representation

Malaysia: age: 21 years - Malaysian citizenship

Source: http://www.ipu.org/english/home.htm

That to me says it all. If you are not born in Thailand or that if you are hearing and voice impaired, you can not belong, nor will you ever be allowed to belong. Such a position then becomes ingrained in everything the government does in respect to foreigners that immigrate. It then trickles down into the attitudes extended to expats.

No matter how much the apologists want to joke it off or say who wants to run for office anyway (I'm also waiting for the deaf and dumb comments about the politicos), this really is an affront. The eligibility law is blatant discrimination. If a foreigner, no matter how fluent in Thai, no matter how long residing in Thailand, no matter how loyal and no matter how adapted, is denied this basic civil right, what does it say about the country? The message I take away, is that in the eyes of Thailand, no matter how good a citizen you are, you are not good enough. To say otherwise is to deny the reality.

I can't wait for someone to justify the Thai position, keeping in mind that if their home country tried to do that, there would be a human rights case before the homeland national courts.

You don't have to be born in Thailand to be a Thai. My son was born in England and is Thai.

Correct me if I am wrong but the two most important people in Thailand, Head of State and Head of Government were born outside of Thailand.

Also, if you want to work for mI5 in Uk, you must be a national and renounce other citizenships.