A SECOND police force flies a Gay Rights flag — again causing outrage. The Gay Rights banner above was unfurled outside the South Wales headquarters in Bridgend.

Earlier this week a similar flag flew outside Limehouse police station, East London. It was removed after protests.

Yesterday a South Wales police spokesman said the colours would fly throughout February to celebrate Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender History Month.

But a police insider said: “If you’re gay it’s surely your personal business and nothing to do with the State or the police.”

source - http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article2214786.ece

But a police insider said: “If you’re gay it’s surely your personal business and nothing to do with the State or the police.”

And i think he's right.

Yeah, but the flag is so cute! I like it, though I'd never wear it as nothing would match...

Stereotyping gays as always well dressed?

Hmmm..... not all the time.

Yeah, but the flag is so cute! I like it, though I'd never wear it as nothing would match...

One small question please:

February to celebrate Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender History Month.

What is LGBT 'History' ?

Maybe I'm too stupid to understand at a glance, but isn't this just a constructed sub-set of human, male, female 'groups' as our shared history. Is March "Hetrosexual History" month? April might be "A Bit Poofy But Never Took It From Behind." month.

Will there be a 'Beastialty Awareness' or "Celibration of Sadomasochism' event as well...

Hopeless.

^Probably - if you can garner sufficient interest...

E: Forgot the wee smilie

Hey Cuban, you could start a pole!

Edited for spelling and thn didn't bother...

Gay Flag Cop Row......., PC at its best in the UK

Actually there doesn't seem to be much of a row at all, apart from the comment by the 'police insider' who, if he exists at all, is happy to whine anonymously.

Maybe I'm too stupid to understand at a glance, but isn't this just a constructed sub-set of human, male, female 'groups' as our shared history. Is March "Hetrosexual History" month? April might be "A Bit Poofy But Never Took It From Behind." month.

Will there be a 'Beastialty Awareness' or "Celibration of Sadomasochism' event as well...

Hopeless.

I sure hope that February is "Two's company, but Three is a Wild Party" month, followed by "October is for Orgy" month. Which one is "Leather and Lace" month again ? Of course, July has to be the "You're Hot, But Your Mom Does That Thing With Her Tongue" month !

January really bites though. The "Racially Mixed, Sexually Challenged, Gender Confused, Averagely Privileged, Moderately Non-Conformist Awareness" month !

The problem with all these special days, weeks, months and years, is that there are just too many of them ! Information overload and most people just tend to "tune" them out.

(ps: the "Two's Company and Three's a Wild Party" month doesn't officially start until 12 Feb, or 3 hours after I get home, which ever comes later !)

I actually won a writing award for a Black History Month writing contest.  The main theme of my topic was somewhat against the concept of Black History Month. It was not that I felt that Afrcian-Americans had noto contributed to our society, but rather the practice of the "month" was for blacks and white politicians to go to banquets and such while the rest of the country politely ignored it. I felt that a person should be judged by his or her worth, not by his or her race. If I never need a transfusion, I am going to thank Charles Richard Drew, M.D. for making it possible.  He was an American inventor, a part of my history, not only a part of African-American history. And I don't care for well-intentioned groups trying to take that part of my history away from me and regulating it to the month of February.

As such, while I hahve no problem with awarenes programs which teach all of history, making sure that the accomplishments of all are noted, I do somewhat have a minor problem with the proliferation of (fill-in-the-blank) History Months which are cropping up like mushrooms after a summer shower.

One small question please:

February to celebrate Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender History Month.

What is LGBT 'History' ?

Henry II

The Sexual Offences Act 1967

The Stonewall Riots

Alan Turing

Pierre Seel

Paragraph 175

The Admiral Duncan

Matthew Shepard

Jody Dobrowski

Excellent list, Endure- add to that

James Buchanan

James Baldwin

Harvey Milk

Quentin Crisp

Coming Out Under Fire

Mark Twain

Oscar Wilde

Walt Whitman

I really truely don't care if Alan Turing was taking his friend up the wrong'n while he was working on code breaking, it is simply not relavent to his primary achievement.

I can't see how making a special focus on one section of a person's private life does anything positive for people that share membership of that group other than draw attention to the differances that exist between them and the average person.

And if a focus is made for one grouping within society then to ensure fairness then every sub-group should recieve such focus in turn, just to show that people might have a funny hair style but also contribute in some way.

Not wishing to be controversial but looking at the child sex offenders that pop up within the music industry is there need to acknowlege that these people (term used loosely) have zero control over abnormal sexual feelings and have uses their power/money/status to abuse children 'but hey they make great music' so let us celibrate that. Gary Glitter, Micheal Jackson, (Boarderline: Pete Townshend)....

( Extreme example I know. )

Is Mark Twain just wishful thinking?

I'd hesitate to classify someone's sexuality on the the basis that they had close friends of the same sex.

Haven't heard of Quentin Crisp for years, his life story was a TV classic.

I really truely don't care if Alan Turing was taking his friend up the wrong'n while he was working on code breaking, it is simply not relavent to his primary achievement.

It wasn't the fact that he was gay. It was that during the war when he was valuable his homosexuality was known about but ignored. After the war he was found guilty of gross indecency because he reported a theft by someone who he was sleeping with and was too naive to realise that he'd be prosecuted rather than the thief. At his trial he was given the choice between prison and female hormones. He chose the hormones. When he started to grow a pair of tits he decided he'd had enough and ate an apple laced with cyanide. All the people in my list suffered in one way or another simply for being gay. That's what LGBT History is about - reminding ourselves that no matter how nice the folk in Bedlam are there are people out there (often of the Establishment) who aren't nice at all.

Is Mark Twain just wishful thinking?

I'd hesitate to classify someone's sexuality on the the basis that they had close friends of the same sex.

Haven't heard of Quentin Crisp for years, his life story was a TV classic.

John Hurt has just made a sequel about his life in the USA.

I really truely don't care if Alan Turing was taking his friend up the wrong'n while he was working on code breaking, it is simply not relavent to his primary achievement.

I can't see how making a special focus on one section of a person's private life does anything positive for people that share membership of that group other than draw attention to the differances that exist between them and the average person.

And if a focus is made for one grouping within society then to ensure fairness then every sub-group should recieve such focus in turn, just to show that people might have a funny hair style but also contribute in some way.

Not wishing to be controversial but looking at the child sex offenders that pop up within the music industry is there need to acknowlege that these people (term used loosely) have zero control over abnormal sexual feelings and have uses their power/money/status to abuse children 'but hey they make great music' so let us celibrate that. Gary Glitter, Micheal Jackson, (Boarderline: Pete Townshend)....

( Extreme example I know. )

In your previous post you mentioned bestiality. In this one you mention paedophilia. Are you saying that they are in the same category (for want of a better word) as homosexuality?

In your previous post you mentioned bestiality. In this one you mention paedophilia. Are you saying that they are in the same category (for want of a better word) as homosexuality?

Completely not.

I don't care if the inventor of the cure to cancer sucks off goats or has a close friend of the same gender and has a state approved marriage in the church or the holy wombat, I simply do not consider that a person's sexual agender has anything to do with their public life unless they choose to make it so, I don't care who is gay and who is not.

I don't care who is black, brown or half Chinese - it is not important. By drawing attention to any label the result is to underline the difference not unify.

Madame Curie, do we celibrate the fact that she was Polish, a French Citizen or a women?

Each group will lay claim to famous people for their own agenda, look at the Buddhist "Beckhams kill mozzies" thread running elsewhere. Nothing to do with the machine that is killing mozzies en-mass but all about drawing attention via 'The Beckhams' so it gets picked up by the international media.

Are you saying that they are in the same category (for want of a better word) as homosexuality?

You clearly have a chip on your shoulder to establish a connection where there is none.

I don't care if a consenting quadruped of legal age is chained up being whipped with a stick of celery in a spirit of mutual naughty fun, I simply think that this is a personal area of life that should remain private.

If the laws of the country forbid things to maintain a common moral standard, in the past those laws banned gay sex - now they don't, fine, great, supper the world is a more balanced place because of this.

I saw someone with a rainbow colored umbrella today, I didn't think, "Oh that person is gay!", my reaction was it doesn't look like rain.

I fail to see how actively promoting a gay lifestyle by a national law enforcement body has to do with their primary function, preventing crime.

My examples of bestiality and paedophilia are extremes to labor the point.

...but surely the bestiality month is only celibrated in Alabama (?) where their laws allow it - good for them. I'm happy for them - but I don't consider it right that the Alabama Highway Patrol should promote the right to shag your pony.

In your previous post you mentioned bestiality. In this one you mention paedophilia. Are you saying that they are in the same category (for want of a better word) as homosexuality?

Completely not.

I don't care if the inventor of the cure to cancer sucks off goats or has a close friend of the same gender and has a state approved marriage in the church or the holy wombat, I simply do not consider that a person's sexual agender has anything to do with their public life unless they choose to make it so, I don't care who is gay and who is not.

I don't care who is black, brown or half Chinese - it is not important. By drawing attention to any label the result is to underline the difference not unify.

Madame Curie, do we celibrate the fact that she was Polish, a French Citizen or a women?

Each group will lay claim to famous people for their own agenda, look at the Buddhist "Beckhams kill mozzies" thread running elsewhere. Nothing to do with the machine that is killing mozzies en-mass but all about drawing attention via 'The Beckhams' so it gets picked up by the international media.

Are you saying that they are in the same category (for want of a better word) as homosexuality?

You clearly have a chip on your shoulder to establish a connection where there is none.

It was you who mentioned both of them in a thread about homosexuality. I just asked what I considered to be an appropriate question.

Cuban --- in MANY places in this world. I could live with my partner for years, not ever be allowed to have out relationship officially recognized, not have the right to inherit, not have 'next-of-kin' status with hospitals etc etc etc

So yeah, an awareness/history/pride month week or day DOES in fact matter.

Str8 people in most places can claim next of kin status through common-law or cohabitation .. not so for same gender couples.

(and yes your bestiality and pedo remarks were nasty and used just to enflame)

Is Mark Twain just wishful thinking?

I'd hesitate to classify someone's sexuality on the the basis that they had close friends of the same sex.

Haven't heard of Quentin Crisp for years, his life story was a TV classic.

Twain's not proven, true- but it was common in the 19th century in the states for unmarried males to have male lovers, especially before the civil war- many letters have come to light showing this- and Twain lived with his best male friend in a single apartment in San Francisco for many years; they even took out a joke wedding advertisement in the newspaper (but how much of a joke was it?)

-and if people don't know these kinds of things, even more reason for there to be a 'gay history' effort, so that people don't think that we just somehow appeared from nowhere out of the civil rights movement.

Further comparison of criminal or mentally ill behaviour with homosexuality will not be tolerated in this or any other area of the forum.

Further comparison of criminal or mentally ill behaviour with homosexuality will not be tolerated in this or any other area of the forum.

Yes, it's unfortunate the way that tends to happen, but I honestly don't think Cuban meant anything by it, and he makes some good points in the rest of his posts.

Perhaps a less "extreme" and better judged comparison would have been to say why not have "left-handed awareness month" or "ginger hair history month": both of which are minority groups of people, just as homosexuals are; and both of which aren't doing anyone any harm by their left-handedness or ginger-hairdness, just as gay people aren't doing anyone harm by their gayness.

But, the reason is, as JDinaisa points out, that neither of these groups have had years of persecution, nor are still persecuted and criminalised in many cultures in the world, as homosexuals have unfortunately had to endure.

Is Mark Twain just wishful thinking?

I'd hesitate to classify someone's sexuality on the the basis that they had close friends of the same sex.

Haven't heard of Quentin Crisp for years, his life story was a TV classic.

Twain's not proven, true- but it was common in the 19th century in the states for unmarried males to have male lovers, especially before the civil war- many letters have come to light showing this- and Twain lived with his best male friend in a single apartment in San Francisco for many years; they even took out a joke wedding advertisement in the newspaper (but how much of a joke was it?)

-and if people don't know these kinds of things, even more reason for there to be a 'gay history' effort, so that people don't think that we just somehow appeared from nowhere out of the civil rights movement.

In a way, I am torn about this.  I have to admit that I tend to roll my eyes now at all the fill-in-the-blank History Week, Month, or Whatevers we now have.  I don't care if Benjamin Franklin was white, is George Washington Carver was black, if Rufus Wainwright is gay.  To me, those things have little to do with what they have given society. so I am not one to go around codifying their accomplishments as that of any particular group.

On the other hand, when the fact of their grouping had an effect on them, well, that is different.  Oscar Wilde's treatment was scandalous, and even men such as Garret Morgan, who used his respirator hood to rescue trapped miners under Lake Erie, yet was largely ignored by the public because he was black and credit for the rescue was given to the white miners (who were shamed into assisting Morgan after he made one successful trip bringing back one of the trapped men). When an injustice has been done due to race or any other grouping, yes, then, I think it is important for those facts to be actively taught.  But to trumpet Neil Patrick Harris, as I saw on one gay pride site (look at that, a man who acts--sort of--and he is gay!!!! Aren't we all proud of Neil!!!), well, that is digging pretty deep in the barrel.

Further comparison of criminal or mentally ill behaviour with homosexuality will not be tolerated in this or any other area of the forum.

Yes, it's unfortunate the way that tends to happen, but I honestly don't think Cuban meant anything by it, and he makes some good points in the rest of his posts.

Perhaps a less "extreme" and better judged comparison would have been to say why not have "left-handed awareness month" or "ginger hair history month": both of which are minority groups of people, just as homosexuals are; and both of which aren't doing anyone any harm by their left-handedness or ginger-hairdness, just as gay people aren't doing anyone harm by their gayness.

But, the reason is, as JDinaisa points out, that neither of these groups have had years of persecution, nor are still persecuted and criminalised in many cultures in the world, as homosexuals have unfortunately had to endure.

I get your point, but I have to point out that being left-handed has been persecuted and even criminalized in history.  The very word "sinister" comes from the Latin word for "left hand."  Kids were beaten in school as late as the last century for trying to use their left hands to write.

I get your point, but I have to point out that being left-handed has been persecuted and even criminalized in history.  The very word "sinister" comes from the Latin word for "left hand."  Kids were beaten in school as late as the last century for trying to use their left hands to write.

Well, yes, actually I was aware of that - however it's so far in the past now that it's no longer an issue. Hopefully the same will said about homosexuality eventually also.

Turing is really one of the most shameful cases- never mind his brilliant work in mathematics- never mind his seminal work in the now-important fields of computing and artificial intelligence- Churchill (who himself admitted to having slept with a man) called him the single man most deserving of credit for the ending of the war (enigma machine, anyone?). Yet he was entrapped by the intelligence services after being arrested for admitting to homosexual activity, and since he demonstrated (by agreeing to work with them again) that he could be blackmailed, they tormented him with a bizarre 'curative' regime which culminated in forced administration of female hormones, resulting in his growing female breasts. He later committed suicide.

THAT needs to be taught.

Further comparison of criminal or mentally ill behaviour with homosexuality will not be tolerated in this or any other area of the forum.

Yes, it's unfortunate the way that tends to happen, but I honestly don't think Cuban meant anything by it, and he makes some good points in the rest of his posts.

Perhaps a less "extreme" and better judged comparison would have been to say why not have "left-handed awareness month" or "ginger hair history month": both of which are minority groups of people, just as homosexuals are; and both of which aren't doing anyone any harm by their left-handedness or ginger-hairdness, just as gay people aren't doing anyone harm by their gayness.

But, the reason is, as JDinaisa points out, that neither of these groups have had years of persecution, nor are still persecuted and criminalised in many cultures in the world, as homosexuals have unfortunately had to endure.

I don't have anything against Cuban, but the whole grouping together of criminal/mentally ill behaviours with homosexuality is a legacy of past persecution and is another form of intolerance, persecution, and abuse- and whether or not he may personally believe it, it perpetuates hatred among those who do- that's why we have rules to protect minorities on the forum. Those who are his friends might have a word with him about it.

Sadly, many of our worst detractors are those who may themselves have had- well, experiences, if not tendencies of the same sort- and they especially feel the need to attack gay people whenever possible to 'prove' their straight status to themselves and others.

The words of Pierre Seel (who died in 1985). Both he and Jo were 18 when they were arrested and taken to a concentration camp. This happened 68 years ago so it's modern LGBT history I suppose:

"Days, weeks, months wore by. I spent six months, from May to November 1941, in that place where horror and savagery were the law. But I've put off describing the worst ordeal I suffered. It happened during my earliest weeks in the camp and contributed more than anything else to making me a silent, obedient shadow among the others.

"One day the loudspeakers order us to report immediately to the roll-call. Shouts and yells urged us to get there without delay. Surrounded by SS men, we had to form a square and stand at attention, as we did for the morning roll call. The commandant appeared with his entire general staff. I assumed he was going to bludgeon us once again with his blind faith in the Reich, together with a list of orders, insults and threats - emulating the infamous outpourings of his master, Adolf Hitler. But the actual ordeal was worse: an execution. Two SS men brought a young man to the center of our square. Horrified, I recognized Jo, my loving friend, who was only eighteen years old. I hadn't previously spotted him in the camp. Had he arrived before or after me? We hadn't seen each other during the days before I was summoned by the Gestapo.

"Now I froze in terror. I had prayed that he would escape their lists, their roundups, their humiliations. And there he was before my powerless eyes, which filled with tears. Unlike me, he had not carried dangerous letters, torn down posters, or signed any statements. And yet he had been caught and was about to die. What had happened? What had the monsters accused him of? Because of my anguish I have completely forgotten the wording of the death sentence.

"The the loudspeakers broadcast some noisy classical music while the SS stripped him naked and shoved tin pail over his head. Next they sicced their ferocious German Shepherds on him: the guard dogs first bit into his groin and thighs, then devoured him right in front of us. His shrieks of pain were distorted and amplified by the pail in which his head was trapped. My rigid body reeled, my eyes gaped at so much horror, tears poured down my cheeks, I fervently prayed that he would black out quickly.

"Since then I sometimes wake up howling in the middle of the night. For fifty years now that scene has kept ceaselessly passing and re-passing though my mind. I will never forget the barbaric murder of my love - before my very eyes, before our eyes, for there were hundreds of witnesses. Why are they still silent today? Have they all died? It's true that we were among the youngest in the camp and that a lot of time has gone by. But I suspect that some people prefer to remain silent forever, afraid to stir up memories, like that one among so many others.

"As for myself, after decades of silence I have made up my mind to speak, to accuse, to bear witness."

That's why LGBT History is important. To remind us of what can happen if we let it.