Airport Rail Link (again Sorry)

[teatree]

Oh dear...terrible delays on the ARL at the moment. My wife waited about an hour at Phaya Thai to get on the train.

I wonder how many trains could have been built if the mini airport terminal of Makkasan had not been built and the money put towards trains.

Terrible planning.

Edited August 28, 2014 by teatree

[Lakegeneve]

Oh dear...terrible delays on the ARL at the moment. My wife waited about an hour at Phaya Thai to get on the train.

I wonder how many trains could have been built if the mini airport terminal of Makkasan had not been built and the money put towards trains.

Terrible planning.

Can you expand on this a little more pls? Your wife waited 1 hour when exactly? And what happened exactly, no trains were running or there was an incident at the station? What did they announce on the station PA?

[Lakegeneve]

The slow, "fastest way to Bangkok"!

[SeaVisionBurma]

Oh dear...terrible delays on the ARL at the moment. My wife waited about an hour at Phaya Thai to get on the train.

I wonder how many trains could have been built if the mini airport terminal of Makkasan had not been built and the money put towards trains.

Terrible planning.

I'm finding this a little confusing too. Do you mean your wife waited an hour and missed 2-3 City Line trains because they weren't running? Or couldn't get on the City Lines trains because they were so busy?

[teatree]

Oh dear...terrible delays on the ARL at the moment. My wife waited about an hour at Phaya Thai to get on the train.

I wonder how many trains could have been built if the mini airport terminal of Makkasan had not been built and the money put towards trains.

Terrible planning.

Can you expand on this a little more pls? Your wife waited 1 hour when exactly? And what happened exactly, no trains were running or there was an incident at the station? What did they announce on the station PA?

At Phaya Thai, 630ish yesterday and was waiting 50 mins or so. Very long queues with only a certain number of passengers being allowed up to the platform when a train arrived. She asked what was going on and they said 'dont know'.

They are using the express trains a lot if not most of the time now and they are inefficient as commuter trains due to the bulk of the space being taken up by seats. I guess that is a big cause to the delay. I have noticed the trains running way off schedule and at irregular intervals so maybe trains are running more than the usual 12 mins apart.

Edited August 29, 2014 by teatree

[Lakegeneve]

Oh dear...terrible delays on the ARL at the moment. My wife waited about an hour at Phaya Thai to get on the train.

I wonder how many trains could have been built if the mini airport terminal of Makkasan had not been built and the money put towards trains.

Terrible planning.

Can you expand on this a little more pls? Your wife waited 1 hour when exactly? And what happened exactly, no trains were running or there was an incident at the station? What did they announce on the station PA?

At Phaya Thai, 630ish yesterday and was waiting 50 mins or so. Very long queues with only a certain number of passengers being allowed up to the platform when a train arrived. She asked what was going on and they said 'dont know'.

They are using the express trains a lot if not most of the time now and they are inefficient as commuter trains due to the bulk of the space being taken up by seats. I guess that is a big cause to the delay. I have noticed the trains running way off schedule and at irregular intervals so maybe trains are running more than the usual 12 mins apart.

6:30pm right? It makes sense that only a certain number of pax are allowed onto the platform to avoid overcrowding. The MRT does this at Asoke during some afternoon peaks and previously the BTS did this at Sala Daeng when platform overcrowding was severe a few years ago.

Yes, using the Express units greatly limits the number of pax given the different internal layout with the extra seating. However, there is not too many options on that front for the foreseeable future. It seems like that it may have been a particularly bad peak period on that specific day with perhaps concurrent issues resulting in significant delays.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

My wife regularly takes the City Line to commute home in the evenings. And she ran into the same problem coming home that night.... they were announcing at her station the train would be delayed about half an hour... but no explanation of why or what happened. And it wasn't an overcrowding issue, at least not at her station.

[teatree]

Another morning of terrible delays.

People wanting to go to Phaya Thai from stations such as Hua Mak are now having to get the train all the way to the airport, stay on the train and ride all the way to Phaya Thai. The trains are leaving Suvarnabhumi full and even most people at Lat Krabang cannot get on.

Anyone have any idea this farce is likely to continue?

Edited September 8, 2014 by teatree

[Lakegeneve]

Another morning of terrible delays.

People wanting to go to Phaya Thai from stations such as Hua Mak are now having to get the train all the way to the airport, stay on the train and ride all the way to Phaya Thai. The trains are leaving Suvarnabhumi full and even most people at Lat Krabang cannot get on.

Anyone have any idea this farce is likely to continue?

Yes it will. Yesterday was really a bad day.

More pics, http://hilight.kapook.com/view/107698

The SRTET new boss stated last week that the trains will not be permitted to go over a certain mileage (actually kms but it doesn't sound as good) and that rolling stock will progressively be withdrawn from service once they reach the limit. That means that currently only 5 of the 9 sets are in service (technically 8 sets as one was being used for spare parts). The SRTET is awaiting delivery of spare parts to undertake urgent overhaul maintenance but the delivery date is 2 months away and the reality is that it won't get done until 2015.

If the other trains reach the limit the ARL may have to be shut down for a few months. Sigh....

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

What a sad, disgusting joke... and unfortunately, seemingly representative of the common Thai attitude toward performing preventive systems maintenance...

It's not like these kinds of mileage-repair targets suddenly crop up by surprise... The SRT had to have known of them all along. So were they DOA competency wise... Or are they going to blame the lack of a functioning government for all these past months???

Kind of makes you wonder... how are the BTS and the MRT, as separate entities from the SRT, doing on these kinds of issues? We never really hear about it on their lines too much... That could be good...or....it could be bad too!

How about the NCPO getting involving and bringing some happiness back to the train riding people?

Edited September 9, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Lakegeneve]

Finally, the TOR for the new rolling stock has been finalised and should go out for tender soonish with a view to signing a contract by Feb 2015. IF that happens (there may be further delays), that would mean an end of 1st quarter 2017 delivery date at the earliest.

One silly thing is that the TOR doesn't specify that the new rolling stock has to be compatible (ie. connectable) with the current stock. That is going to limit future options. However, whoever wins the bid will rectify that.

Some good points in the Nation Editorial, http://www.nationmultimedia.com/opinion/Airport-Rail-Link-a-model-of-failure-30243536.html

Edited September 18, 2014 by Lakegeneve

[teatree]

ARL service seems to have improved lot since the depths of a few weeks ago. Still not back to normal but much better.

Are the stories that it could be closed for a year nonsense, or is there worse yet to come?

[Lakegeneve]

ARL service seems to have improved lot since the depths of a few weeks ago. Still not back to normal but much better.

Are the stories that it could be closed for a year nonsense, or is there worse yet to come?

SRTET reduced the frequency slightly, lowered the speed (to extend the life of parts) and some pax are using alternate transport. Only 5 sets are operating though reportedly a 6th may come back into service.

The junta is not allowing the SRT to do a special tender to expedite the spare parts procurement, it has to be via normal E-auction. I'd say that there is a 30-40% chance that the line will need to be closed for a few months, possibly by early next year.

As is the norm, a crisis of potentially or actually shutting the line down in peak tourist season will cause embarrassment and be the catalyst for a quicker procurement solution. The govt does has approved a 2.4 trillion baht transport and logistics plan.....they can spare some money to find a quick remedy and fly in the parts.

[alt]

Are these delays likely to go on long term? I return to BKK in early Dec and I was actually looking forward to getting the rail link from the airport to the city. If there's delays i'll be hopping into a taxi.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

The Express trains are currently not operating.

The City Line trains, including service to the airport, are still running, but at reduced frequencies from before.

From what Lakegeneve posted earlier, it sounds like he thinks the ARL service is likely to get worse before it ends up getting better.

I'd say that there is a 30-40% chance that the line will need to be closed for a few months, possibly by early next year.

[wpcoe]

The Express trains are currently not operating.

The City Line trains, including service to the airport, are still running, but at reduced frequencies from before.

I snapped this with my camera phone when I was killing time at the airport last Tuesday:

Is that the old, full schedule, or is that the reduced-service schedule?

[teatree]

The Express trains are currently not operating.

The City Line trains, including service to the airport, are still running, but at reduced frequencies from before.

I snapped this with my camera phone when I was killing time at the airport last Tuesday:

ARL-skj.jpg

Is that the old, full schedule, or is that the reduced-service schedule?

Pretty sure it's the old one.

[josephbloggs]

Looks like the "Express" has been officially scrapped. On the trains, above the doors, where they have the map of stations there used to be a blue line showing the City stations and a red line between Makkasan and Suvarnabhumi showing the express. These have now been replaced and no there is no sign of the express line at all. I just got the train from Suvarnabhumi tonight and the Express area was completely roped off and shut down. I think they have given up. Whether or not this will change when they have done their maintenance and all the trains are back in service I don't know, but changing the station map on the trains would indicate it is permanent to me.

Edited October 24, 2014 by josephbloggs

[teatree]

Looks like the "Express" has been officially scrapped. On the trains, above the doors, where they have the map of stations there used to be a blue line showing the City stations and a red line between Makkasan and Suvarnabhumi showing the express. These have now been replaced and no there is no sign of the express line at all. I just got the train from Suvarnabhumi tonight and the Express area was completely roped off and shut down. I think they have given up. Whether or not this will change when they have done their maintenance and all the trains are back in service I don't know, but changing the station map on the trains would indicate it is permanent to me.

Let's hope so. The express is not needed and has been a farce from day one.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Be interested to know what's become now of the former Express trains?

Have they been re-purposed to the City Line, or have they disappeared from service, presumably to be cannibalized for needed parts?

[SeaVisionBurma]

Be interested to know what's become now of the former Express trains?

Have they been re-purposed to the City Line, or have they disappeared from service, presumably to be cannibalized for needed parts?

You'd have to go back a few pages in this thread - but you are right in guessing they are being used on the City Line.

I snapped a few photos on an earlier trip to Bangkok, when I got on a re-purposed Express train at Ramkhamhaeng.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Yes... but I meant... now lately...with the apparent total demise of the Express service...as posted above.

[asanee]

And for those always knowing better for the Thai as to how to:

the fact was that the essential spare parts, very costly, from Germany, lasted much shorter as promised/expected, which also played a role some time ago in a less severe crisis. Lower speeds partly seems to extend the lifespan, but then the 1 hr turnaround for sets cannot be made-thus frequency has to go down.

[lomatopo]

I rode the SARL this week: City Line (obviously) from Phaya Thai to Suvaranbahumi. We used a City Line set. The train goes quite bit more slowly, and encounters additional delays at each station as it takes a bit longer for people to wedge on/off. Going in to the airport the train creeps along the curve, presumably so it won't encounter any issues. We left quite a few passengers standing on the platforms as there was no room.

Coming back we used an Express Set, these appear to accommodate a lot fewer passengers, especially when most have a lot of luggage. We left a ton of passengers on the platforms from Hua Mak in bound.

I honestly do not know how many, and of which types, sets they are able to use now. I've seen some reports of four or five sets, so a mix of City and Express. Not sure how much longer they can keep limping along until they have to cease service, or risk a major issue.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

And for those always knowing better for the Thai as to how to:

the fact was that the essential spare parts, very costly, from Germany, lasted much shorter as promised/expected, which also played a role some time ago in a less severe crisis. Lower speeds partly seems to extend the lifespan, but then the 1 hr turnaround for sets cannot be made-thus frequency has to go down.

I don't know who's to blame for ARL's part's problems... But clearly, ARL is the system operator and as such, is ultimately responsible for maintaining and operating the service.

I do recall though, that in the prior go-round of parts issues for ARL, what was getting the blame for the rail car's brushes wearing out prematurely supposedly was, if I remember right, some kind of issue with the track design/construction near where the trains pull into the airport. But that was just related to the prematurely wearing brushes, not all the various other railcar parts that would be in need of routine service/replacement.

I don't recall it ever being clearly explained, at least in public, whether that was a faulty construction or faulty design issue for the rail tracks there.

[teatree]

Could trains be borrowed from BTS or MRT?

[Lakegeneve]

Looks like the "Express" has been officially scrapped. On the trains, above the doors, where they have the map of stations there used to be a blue line showing the City stations and a red line between Makkasan and Suvarnabhumi showing the express. These have now been replaced and no there is no sign of the express line at all. I just got the train from Suvarnabhumi tonight and the Express area was completely roped off and shut down. I think they have given up. Whether or not this will change when they have done their maintenance and all the trains are back in service I don't know, but changing the station map on the trains would indicate it is permanent to me.

There is no SRTET policy to scrap the Express in the medium or long term. That can of course change

Given that the PT Express ceased back in May and the Mak Express last month, and that we don't expect to see an Express service for at least 6 months you may be reading more into a new sign change.

[Lakegeneve]

I rode the SARL this week: City Line (obviously) from Phaya Thai to Suvaranbahumi. We used a City Line set. The train goes quite bit more slowly, and encounters additional delays at each station as it takes a bit longer for people to wedge on/off. Going in to the airport the train creeps along the curve, presumably so it won't encounter any issues. We left quite a few passengers standing on the platforms as there was no room.

Coming back we used an Express Set, these appear to accommodate a lot fewer passengers, especially when most have a lot of luggage. We left a ton of passengers on the platforms from Hua Mak in bound.

I honestly do not know how many, and of which types, sets they are able to use now. I've seen some reports of four or five sets, so a mix of City and Express. Not sure how much longer they can keep limping along until they have to cease service, or risk a major issue.

The Express sets obviously accomodate far fewer pax given the seating configuration. They are not designed for peak hour commuter configuration as the Cityline trains are. More seats mean much less pax standing space overall.

Currently, 5 sets are operational of the 9 in total. In reality 5 out of 8 as one set has been used for spare parts for a long time. 1 more is about to be taken out of service in the next few weeks from what I understand.

As I said at the end of last month, "I'd say that there is a 30-40% chance that the line will need to be closed for a few months, possibly by early next year."

Tender for the new 7 sets of rolling stock is about to go out.

The 10 new escalators have been installed at HM, BTC & LK stations. Next task on station improvements is extra elevators between platform and concourse level by mid 2015 to ensure compliance with disability obligations.

[Lakegeneve]

Could trains be borrowed from BTS or MRT?

Apart from the fact that neither the BTSC nor BMCL would allow it and that they cannot spare any sets (esp the BMCL), it is not possible at all.

BTS and MRT trains are third rail powered. ARL trains are overhead (catenary) powered. Completely different power configurations as well.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

it is not possible at all.

BTS and MRT trains are third rail powered. ARL trains are overhead (catenary) powered. Completely different power configurations as well.

And if I've been reading LG's very informative posts correctly, it seems that's largely the future of BKK rail transit as all the new lines get built -- very low levels of interoperability between the technologies/designs used on the different lines.

Heck, still don't have a joint ticketing system between BTS and MRT, much less between BTS, MRT and ARL. Of course, that won't matter so much if LG ends up being right and the ARL line is shut down, temporarily, at some point.

Somebodies are going to lose a whole lot of FACE if and when that sorry day arrives. And it won't just be farangs thinking so.