A council has triggered a backlash among parents and animal welfare groups after introducing halal-only menus at state schools.

Only meat from animals killed in line with Islamic teaching will be offered at 52 primary schools in Harrow, following a switch by ten secondaries to halal menus.

But parents have voiced concern over the methods used to slaughter animals in this way and say they haven't been properly consulted over the changes.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1300589/Parents-fury-town-hall-plans-halal-menus-schools.html#ixzz0vn8mAxPp

Could the UK be inching closer and closer to Shariah?

Could the UK be inching closer and closer to Shariah?

bloody hope not

Could the UK be inching closer and closer to Shariah?

bloody hope not

But it certainly looks that way

How bloody stupid. Are there not Muslim schools that they can send their kids to already? If I had children at those schools I'd be tempted to give them bacon sandwiches for lunch.

This is exactly the kind of thing that gives groups like the BNP more support.

How bloody stupid. Are there not Muslim schools that they can send their kids to already?

But then you'd complain that they're refusing to integrate with the rest of the community.

How bloody stupid. Are there not Muslim schools that they can send their kids to already?

But then you'd complain that they're refusing to integrate with the rest of the community.

Does non-muslim schools being forced into pandering to their whims mean that they are integrating into society?

Yet more anti-Muslim hype.

Heaven knows why animal welfare groups are involved!

Having worked as a meat inspector, I know very well what halal killing involves. The ONLY difference between normal slaughter and halal slaughter is the orientation of the animal when it's throat is slit.

The animal is stunned electrically and has it's throat slit no matter if it is halal or not.

Effectively, what these outraged parents are objecting to is that the animal is faced Eastwards instead of in no direction in particular, and a few words muttered as the knife is drawn. Silly and ignorant, as most of the anti-Muslim rhetoric and propaganda.

If little Billy and Ahmed Jr are to be fed lamb stew for lunch, does it make any difference to Billy or his parents that the lamb in his stew was turned to the East before it was killed?

Does anyone here resent eating kosher-slaughtered meat products if the unkosher product is exactly the same except for religious rites? Does it taste different?

In fact kosher slaughter prohibits the animal being stunned first, so perhaps animal welfare groups should look at Israel first?

I have eaten halal prepared food for years and it has had no ill affect on me, other than I now have no tolerance for sheep shaggers.

What I object to is that a school menu must be changed for the sake of political correctness. If Muslims want their children to have a special diet, they should provide the means for that diet to be offered.

Not the government.

My main objections to halal meat are that it is not hung to mature as is normal in the West, and that with the blood drained from the carcass one cannot have a nice, rare, juicy steak.

The meat is tough (not being hung) and has to be cubed/stewed for effective cooking. Probably OK for kids, but not to a dedicated meat eater.

So anyway, why not pander to Hindu sensibilities and have no meat at all?

Or Jewish sensibilities and cut out seafood as well as special slaughter meat.

What about Korean sensbilities? Many households in Kores keep a pig in a pit in the garden and feed it the scraps from their table. Then kill it and eat it. So let's have pork days for the Koreans.

Why this has turned into a big thing is because - as always in Britain - it is the Muslim community that kicks up about the insensitive treatment they receive.

You don't hear this from the Jews, nor the Bhuddists, Hindus, Vegetarians, Vegans, Zoroastrians, Bahai, or other sects, religions, faiths or beliefs. Only the ... Muslims.

Yet more anti-Muslim hype.

Heaven knows why animal welfare groups are involved!

Having worked as a meat inspector, I know very well what halal killing involves. The ONLY difference between normal slaughter and halal slaughter is the orientation of the animal when it's throat is slit.

The animal is stunned electrically and has it's throat slit no matter if it is halal or not.

Effectively, what these outraged parents are objecting to is that the animal is faced Eastwards instead of in no direction in particular, and a few words muttered as the knife is drawn. Silly and ignorant, as most of the anti-Muslim rhetoric and propaganda.

If little Billy and Ahmed Jr are to be fed lamb stew for lunch, does it make any difference to Billy or his parents that the lamb in his stew was turned to the East before it was killed?

Does anyone here resent eating kosher-slaughtered meat products if the unkosher product is exactly the same except for religious rites? Does it taste different?

In fact kosher slaughter prohibits the animal being stunned first, so perhaps animal welfare groups should look at Israel first?

So now we can add "meat inspector" to your long list of occupations. Have trouble keeping a job?

Now for the serious question, I'm not sure I follow your statement above. Are you saying that there is little difference in the way the animals slaughtered (just the direction they are pointing) so no one should complain about making it Hilalon-only? Or are you saying that there is little difference so why bother changing at all since it is just to appease some crazy religous belief? Or is it only "crazy" when it's about Christianity or Judaism and if it's a Muslim thing then everyone should respect it?

Couldn't these schools not just do a survey and find out how many halal meals should be there so people could have a choice? That's how it works in some airliners you can indicate the type of food you want to be served.

And HC is correct as when I was young I worked a couple of months in a slaughterhouse and have seen this as well(Cutting the throat). Also a different way was used in my time where they shoot a long metal pin in the head of the animal. Those animals that did not die directly (or the pin missed) the throat was cut anyway. (Non Halal way)

Couldn't these schools not just do a survey and find out how many halal meals should be there so people could have a choice? That's how it works in some airliners you can indicate the type of food you want to be served.

I agree. Give them a choice.

Couldn't these schools not just do a survey and find out how many halal meals should be there so people could have a choice? That's how it works in some airliners you can indicate the type of food you want to be served.

I agree. Give them a choice.

To be fair to the muslims they seem to be saying the same thing in the article.

It seems to be more of a case of fuc_kwittery from some leftie council types than something more sinister.

You know, real Halal food is raised in some kind of freedom/in the wild and not fed some animal scrap filled by anti biotic.

Therefore ensuring the food/meat is without any chemical pollutants.

Ask yourself if you would rather eat some meat that is raised in farms using anti biotic and growth hormones or have some meat that just was raised in "The wild" eating natural stuff available?

People (Muslims) are asking , can we please eat meat that is raised with natural food and slaughtered in the less painful way.

I bet Boater does not even know what Halal means, just a knee jerk reaction on any article that mentions Islam or Muslim.

If you get a class of kids and you don't tell them what they are, they will all play happily together and will not give a jot or tickle what they eat, or that the colour of their skin is different.

When you take them away for separate assemblies, and spend the limited funds on ethnic education instead of computers, you dumb down the class and instil in them that little Billy is different from little Muhammed.

Try supporting this " treat everyone the same " mantra to any education authority and you will be branded a racist.

Moonraker has pointed out to me that the decision probably means that pork will be excluded. I therefore must change my stance somewhat and say that it is a silly and unfair decision.....I maintain, though that IF all the decision was about was to make sure that the lamb and beef were halal, and that IF pork was still on the menu as an option, then there is alot of fuss over nothing.

Mind you.....if pork was to be excluded...would that hurt anyone? Do Christian and atheist children require pork in their diet?

If nobody needs it, and if only a minority have a particular penchant for it, and it is forbidden for some of the group, isn't it the reasonable thing to not include it?

There's another aspect too.....pork is more expensive than beef, and schools are very budget conscious.....so was there much pork on the menu in the first place?

If pork was off the menu because of budget concerns anyway, and only beef, chicken or lamb were ever on the menu......this would certainly be a storm in a teacup.

Moonraker has pointed out to me that the decision probably means that pork will be excluded. I therefore must change my stance somewhat and say that it is a silly and unfair decision.....I maintain, though that IF all the decision was about was to make sure that the lamb and beef were halal, and that IF pork was still on the menu as an option, then there is alot of fuss over nothing.

Mind you.....if pork was to be excluded...would that hurt anyone? Do Christian and atheist children require pork in their diet?

If nobody needs it, and if only a minority have a particular penchant for it, and it is forbidden for some of the group, isn't it the reasonable thing to not include it?

There's another aspect too.....pork is more expensive than beef, and schools are very budget conscious.....so was there much pork on the menu in the first place?

If pork was off the menu because of budget concerns anyway, and only beef, chicken or lamb were ever on the menu......this would certainly be a storm in a teacup.

Mr. Harcourt:

You now seem to be arguing with yourself. If I am incorrect, please let me know, but in the kindest possible manner. :jap:

You don't hear this from the Jews, nor the Bhuddists, Hindus, Vegetarians, Vegans, Zoroastrians, Bahai, or other sects, religions, faiths or beliefs. Only the ... Muslims.

Nail on the head.

Moonraker has pointed out to me that the decision probably means that pork will be excluded. I therefore must change my stance somewhat and say that it is a silly and unfair decision.....I maintain, though that IF all the decision was about was to make sure that the lamb and beef were halal, and that IF pork was still on the menu as an option, then there is alot of fuss over nothing.

Mind you.....if pork was to be excluded...would that hurt anyone? Do Christian and atheist children require pork in their diet?

If nobody needs it, and if only a minority have a particular penchant for it, and it is forbidden for some of the group, isn't it the reasonable thing to not include it?

There's another aspect too.....pork is more expensive than beef, and schools are very budget conscious.....so was there much pork on the menu in the first place?

If pork was off the menu because of budget concerns anyway, and only beef, chicken or lamb were ever on the menu......this would certainly be a storm in a teacup.

1) It's the Muslims in the minority there.

2) Pork isn't more expensive than beef.

3) I'd be surprised if Hilal meat wasn't more expensive since it has gone through a "special procedure".

let's for a second leave out the whole religion thing.

Would you as a parent or consumer choose Halal food knowing it had been raised in relative freedom, fed natural food and killed in the less painful way as possible without contaminating the animal prior to it's death?

Or would you prefer eating a part of a dead animal that had been fed (partly) dead animal scraps and dry food stuffed with anti biotic and injected with growth hormones?

Would it not be good to explain to these opposing parents (and some forum members here) what Halal means?

let's for a second leave out the whole religion thing.

Would you as a parent or consumer choose Halal food knowing it had been raised in relative freedom, fed natural food and killed in the less painful way as possible without contaminating the animal prior to it's death?

Or would you prefer eating a part of a dead animal that had been fed (partly) dead animal scraps and dry food stuffed with anti biotic and injected with growth hormones?

Would it not be good to explain to these opposing parents (and some forum members here) what Halal means?

Wouldn't it simply be better not to impose the minorities wishes, needs and desires on the majority?

let's for a second leave out the whole religion thing.

Would you as a parent or consumer choose Halal food knowing it had been raised in relative freedom, fed natural food and killed in the less painful way as possible without contaminating the animal prior to it's death?

Or would you prefer eating a part of a dead animal that had been fed (partly) dead animal scraps and dry food stuffed with anti biotic and injected with growth hormones?

Would it not be good to explain to these opposing parents (and some forum members here) what Halal means?

I think that the animal welfare argument was a weak one and not really relevant, those making the argument are likely being hypocritical and give little thought to the welfare of the cow that their beef joint from tesco's came from anyway The relevant argument is that the majority have been neglected in favour of the minority.

Personally I'd be unlikely to care either way whether meat was halal or not provided it tasted ok, I'd be a bit pissed of if I was told that I could no longer have pork sausages or bacon though.

let's for a second leave out the whole religion thing.

Would you as a parent or consumer choose Halal food knowing it had been raised in relative freedom, fed natural food and killed in the less painful way as possible without contaminating the animal prior to it's death?

Or would you prefer eating a part of a dead animal that had been fed (partly) dead animal scraps and dry food stuffed with anti biotic and injected with growth hormones?

Would it not be good to explain to these opposing parents (and some forum members here) what Halal means?

I'd make them a deal, the schools agree to accept Hilal-only meat, and the Muslims agree to stop honor killings of their daughters, force any of them to cover up against their wishes, agree to obey the laws of land and not Shriah, and stop marrying off their female children to old men in pre-arranged marriages.

I always find it annoying how everyone always has to be sensitive to Muslims, but they don't have to be concerned about being sensitive to anyone. Whether it's Hilal-meat in school, building a mosque near Ground Zero, or any of what I listed above.

Chuck, you are avoiding my question. Moonraker doesn't give a sh1t how the animal is killed or raised it seems.

Moonraker please visit a slaughterhouse and see for yourself how an animal is killed in order to get you a nice juicy steak.

It is not funny.

I repeat my question:

Would you as a parent or consumer choose Halal food knowing it had been raised in relative freedom, fed natural food and killed in the less painful way as possible without contaminating the animal prior to it's death?

Or would you prefer eating a part of a dead animal that had been fed (partly) dead animal scraps and dry food stuffed with anti biotic and injected with growth hormones?

Chuck, you are avoiding my question. Moonraker doesn't give a sh1t how the animal is killed or raised it seems.

Moonraker please visit a slaughterhouse and see for yourself how an animal is killed in order to get you a nice juicy steak.

It is not funny.

I repeat my question:

Would you as a parent or consumer choose Halal food knowing it had been raised in relative freedom, fed natural food and killed in the less painful way as possible without contaminating the animal prior to it's death?

Or would you prefer eating a part of a dead animal that had been fed (partly) dead animal scraps and dry food stuffed with anti biotic and injected with growth hormones?

Hey, I love animals and would not want to see then treated badly where possible. However, I am not a hypocrite and I like meat. I will never eat dog because of the cruel manner in which they are killed and I do opt for free range chicken wherever I am given the option. I will always go for the kinder option if it is presented to me.

However, I am not going to start screaming 'cruelty' when I have given little or no consideration to how the animal was killed before I tuck into my steak. My answer to the question is that I'd prefer to get stuck into whatever animal tastes the best, plain and simple. If I can do so knowing that the animal was treated as humanely as possible then fantastic, that's a worthy bonus. But if I am limited to eating something that has the texture of a rubber boot because of the minorities belief in fairy tales then I'll have something to say about it.

Chuck, you are avoiding my question. Moonraker doesn't give a sh1t how the animal is killed or raised it seems.

Moonraker please visit a slaughterhouse and see for yourself how an animal is killed in order to get you a nice juicy steak.

It is not funny.

I repeat my question:

Would you as a parent or consumer choose Halal food knowing it had been raised in relative freedom, fed natural food and killed in the less painful way as possible without contaminating the animal prior to it's death?

Or would you prefer eating a part of a dead animal that had been fed (partly) dead animal scraps and dry food stuffed with anti biotic and injected with growth hormones?

Amazing. These people care more about the animal they are about to eat than their own daughters.

Chuck, you are avoiding my question. Moonraker doesn't give a sh1t how the animal is killed or raised it seems.

Moonraker please visit a slaughterhouse and see for yourself how an animal is killed in order to get you a nice juicy steak.

It is not funny.

I repeat my question:

Would you as a parent or consumer choose Halal food knowing it had been raised in relative freedom, fed natural food and killed in the less painful way as possible without contaminating the animal prior to it's death?

Or would you prefer eating a part of a dead animal that had been fed (partly) dead animal scraps and dry food stuffed with anti biotic and injected with growth hormones?

I'm with Moonraker on this one. I prefer corn fed beef raised in Texas. Unfortunately it isn't available in Isaan.

By the way, I will repeat my post #9 on this thread so you don't think I am not answering your question.

______________________________________________________

I have eaten halal prepared food for years and it has had no ill affect on me, other than I now have no tolerance for sheep shaggers.

What I object to is that a school menu must be changed for the sake of political correctness. If Muslims want their children to have a special diet, they should provide the means for that diet to be offered.

Not the government.

_______________________________________________________

Clear enough, Alex?

Clear Chuck,

And that is why I said people should have a choice.

Are the people informed about what Halal really is (or should be) or are they just being hyped up?

We really should think if this decision was made to please a minority or was that the management is dedicated to bring some relatively healthy food (meat) on the table.

In the media the connection is made between Halal and Islam. Most Americans and others despise anything Islam labeled.

We have to ask ourselves why that is.

So, why is that?

And Moonraker and Chuck, if you are looking for a real juicy and tasty steak, don't go for corn fed.

I guess you guys never ate a real natural grown piece of meat in a side by side comparison.