California Wow

[xandreu]

So I went in California Wow in Silom this morning just to ask about their membership prices. I was handed a form and told to fill it in. I said it's ok, I just want to know the prices for membership. The lady behind the counter picked up the phone, spoke to someone, and told me someone would be along in a minute to see to me. I said it's ok, I just want to know the membership prices, and asked if they had a price list somewhere. She again told me to wait where I was until someone came along to see to me.

Soon after a lady came along and beckoned me behind the counter and made me sit at a table while placing a clipboard and a form in front of me. I said it's ok, I just want to know the membership prices and asked if she had a leaflet or something with them written on. She asked me to fill the form in while I looked a little bemused. She said ok then, just write your name and your date of birth here, while pointing to it. I shrugged my shoulders and wrote a false name and date of birth just to keep her happy. I then asked again about membership prices and she stood up while saying that she wanted to show me around. I said I don't really have much time but she said it wouldn't take long so again, just to keep her happy...

10 minutes later we were back downstairs and again I was asked about membership prices. She went away and came back with a laminated form which she placed on the table in front of me, but she also had a piece of paper over the top half of the laminate, almost as if she only wanted me to see the bottom half of it. She then insisted that they absolutely definitely do not under any circumstances charge different prices for ferang and Thais. I hadn't even mentioned it nor had it even crossed my mind but her insistance that they do not do that immediatly sounded alarm bells.

For a moment she let go of the laminate and the piece of paper and I siezed the oppertunity to brush the paper aside so I could see the whole form. This didn't actually do me any good as the top half of the form was written in Thai, which is possibly why she had it covered but I did notice that the prices were cheaper. I was quoted 3000Baht for one months membership which I thought was very steep, and looked for something in Thai in the top of the form which said 3000B but the highest price I could see was 2000B. I have no ide what it was for as again, it was all written in Thai, but nowhere was anything priced 3000B which was what I had been quoted.

I was told I could have 3 months for 5000B but I had already made my mind up that not only were the prices too steep, but I was smelling a stinking horrible racist rat here, made my excuses and left. Actually I said I had to go to the ATM and even then she was reluctant to let me go, insisting they take all kinds of credit and debit cards.

Just wondering if anyone else had had any experience with this gym. Was I being overly paranoid? Does 3000B for 1 months gym membership seem excessive or have I gotten used to paying Chiang Mai prices (typically 1000B a month, less for longer term contracts)

Peace.

[PattayaParent]

It's a while since I last checked but Ambassador in Pattaya used to be 11,000 Baht per year membership. Check out Ambassador on Sukhumvit.

[Misterwhisper]

California Wow! has been frequently in the headlines in the past owing to their aggressive marketing and double-tier pricing. Have also read countless postings from customers complaining about their impolite attitudes, badly maintained equipment, cut-throat contracts (i.e. it's very difficult to get out) and refusal to refund fees. You could call that a real "wow factor", I guess. Go someplace else and give California Wow! a wide berth.

[greggyz]

I would strongly advise against California Wow. The prices they told you are purely outrageous. Their prices depend on the way you look, that is it! It is an awful place with extremely low quality standard. The machines are hardly ever maintained, the staff is awful and ignorant and once they have sold you the 'crap deal' you are on your own. Watch out. True Fitness is very similar and their price policies. I had a 2 years membership with them, left them early as I was pissed with how they handled problems, broken machines and towel shortage. Just to give you some ground, i have been paying 1549 baht a month at True Fitness. I have plenty of friends who got deals at True Fitness for 2000-3000k a month and some of them are Thai. It is not racial, it is based on how you look and how you handle their PRs. It is possible to get a California Wow membership for as low as 500-800 baht a month and I even have a friend who bought a lifetime membership for 10k but gave up going as it was garbage. Whichever place you go, speak confidently and give them references such as: 'I have a couple of friends they pay this much and this much, I would like a similar deal'. Don't ever buy into their fake last day deal/sale and so on.1500-3000k is the top what you should pay for a decent gym.

Hope it helps,

Greg

[xandreu]

Thanks for your replies. I've since done some more research about them on the net. A lot of which came from previous posts on this website and it's almost impossible to find anyone say a good word about them. I've only just got used to haggling and bartering at markets, which I hate doing and try to avoid at all costs, but haggling for gym membership? Seriously? What an incredibly stupid way to do business. Many people are saying that they're in trouble and will soon go under and I'm not in the least surprised. Seems I had a lucky escape.

Peace.

[Canada]

good riddance to them once they are finally gone.

[maxman71]

Some history and factoids re: California WOW gyms in Thailand and Asia in general.

1) CA WOW was started by a reportedly HS dropout from either the UK or Oz. You can see his pic on "celebrity wall" at the Silom location. He's in verygood shape. CA WOW in Asia followed the US 24 Hour Fitness gym chain model in the US in terms of style/quality of their gyms, membership types, etc.

2) CA WOW opened their first clubs in Hong Kong many years ago (late 1990's/early 2000's). They began a rapid expansion throughout Asia; additional clubs in HK, Singapore, Malaysia (KL), Seoul, Thailand, Taiwan and also Shanghai. All these gyms honor the US 24 Hour Fitness membership cards for use of their gyms on a "guest" basis with no fees charged. Thailand a couple of years ago ceased honoring 24 Hour cards to use their gyms for free and charges a reduced daily fee to 24 Hour card holders.

3) Like many large chain clubs in the West, WOW offered one-time membership fees for a one or two year contract, then a very small lifetime renewal rate thereafter. This generated lots of cash when economic times were good. But cash flow during the last few years has been lousy.

4) It has been rumored that WOW is in a cash bind and has been selling off some of their clubs; most notably, they sold off all their KL clubs a couple of years ago as well as their Taipei clubs, both of which I have used while on biz travel; they were decent.

5) The Silom club has reduced their sq. footage significantly and indeed, the quality of their equipment has degenerated due to poor maintenance.

6) I joined the Sukhumvit soi 23 club about 18 months ago for one year deal ("Black Card") that cost 30K baht initially and then 100 baht per year thereafter. So I am on my 2nd renewal and when I am in BKK, I use the club often; I think I have gotten my money's worth. The soi 23 club is still in decent shape, but not quite as good as it was when I first joined. I can use any WOW gym in Thailand with my

7) Competing clubs such as Fitness First, True Fitness, etc. are very good in quality, but charge straight fees for varying lengths of time; 6 mos, 8 mos, 12 mos, etc. I have a 7 mo (6mos + 1 mo free) at a Fitness First gym in Bang Khae that cost me 15K baht. I checked out True Fitness and they were about the same in terms of cost and quality.

8) I also have a 24 Hour Fitness membership in the US that I bought 10 years ago for USD900 for two years and I pay USD 50 per year to renew. I can use any 24 Hour gym in the US, and that card also gets me into all CA WOW gyms in Asia except Thailand.

In summary I expect CA WOW in Thailand to close/sell off some of their clubs, with the Silom club a likely first suspect. The model of paying a lot up front with cheap annual renewals is on the way out, due to tough economic conditions. The cost of staying fit is going up.

[vtjforyou]

Paid 10000 Thb for lifetime 5 years ago and i'm still happy !

[Flex2791]

TMB Bank Public Company Limited and Bank of Ayudhya Public Company Limited filed lawsuits against the Company for the overdue repayments of the borrowings principal and default interests totalling Baht 183.82 million, together with the related legal and lawyer fees. Only a matter of time now before the banks move in and seize anything of value at all of their clubs. They have defaulted on ALL loans which can be confirmed on the Stock Exchange of Thailand website trading under CAW WOW. Download the PDF files for a good read about their dire financial situation. They have also been suspended from the SET for non compliance.

"CAW WOW incurred a net loss of Baht 141.84 million for the nine-month period ended 30 September 2011, and as of that date the Company’s total current liabilities exceeded its total current assets by Baht 1,019.99 million."

Just in Silom, they have closed the entire 19 floor and moved everything downstairs and put most of the gym in a hallway. A/C is always off and there are NO water fountains. Has any member on this forum ever been to a gym, let alone one that boasts to be the best in the WORLD that doesn't have a water fountain? They also close at 10:00pm now instead of midnight. Too little too late. This ship is sinking fast. Buyer beware.

[arminbkk]

I went to True Fitness today at Asok Exchange Tower.

I just walked in.

Immediately they wanted me to put my name and phonenumber on a form, and told me about

a wonderful promotion, that I could get if I have been living in Thailand for 1 year or more.

Then they sat me down.

Then a lady came with more forms.

But I just said I wanted to get information only.

But she insisted on filling in the form. It didn't say contract or anything so I filled it in.

Then she wanted to show me around the place.

I again said I just wanted to talk, get the prices.

So she got out some piece of paper, that had 3 amounts on it.

First, 8K for joining, 1800 something for processing, and 2500 something for monthly membership fee.

Then she went into this sales pitch I guess, where she, as if doing me a favour, waived the 8K joining fee.

Then cut the processing fee by half.

And finally, discounted the monthly fee to 1,799 baht/m. So initial payment would be 2,599 baht.

Of course, my credit card would be automatically charged each month for that amount.

Then I gave the wonderful news that I don't have a credit card. I like to pay cash.

She then went to talk to her boss. Somewhere out of sight.

Then she returned and didn't really say how or why., but it was still possible even with cash payments only.

Then a guy came, they spoke Thai, which oddly didn't sound like Thai, I couldn't get any of it.

Then they asked if I have a driving license. I do.

Well, then I could go to a bank and get a credit card.

Then I said, I don't want to have a credit card.

That required a moment of thought.

Then the two spoke again, probably nothing flattering.

But it did result in making an exception for me, and do with cash payments.

Again she showed what I would have to pay now.

Then I said, I didn't intend to join or pay now, but I would come back Saturday.

That required another moment for thought, brief deliberation between the two.

Ok, what time would I come? In the morning.

Ok, but maybe the promotion is not valid anymore then.

So I said, that would be my loss.

Ok, ok.

Then she got out a business card, wrote down her name and mobile number, and

BV (whatever that may mean) and the agreed price.

And to come back Saturday.

Then she got up and left.

My mistake of course is that I did not check out the gym, but I can still do that later.

Well, the price is reasonable.

They probably waive the fees for everybody, not especially for me, but ok.

Sales tricks.

I'm actually looking for a normal good gym. Not a place where 'hip' and 'trendy' is the main image.

What I just didn't like was the attitude of the staff.

No friendly faces, the lady never smiled. In fact, she gave the expression she would rather be talking to someone else.

No nice friendly greeting.

No nice friendly goodbye.

It was like being at McDonalds.....the pace of it: order - exchange - move - next.

Years ago I went to Balance Fitness, in CMIC Tower (now KTower) but it isn't there anymore.............that was a good nice place....where did they go???

[Soboringtochooseaname]

True fitness is worst than Cwow...

[nocturn]

try JWs at the Marriot soi 2. you will not encounter this crap.

[ETatBKK]

California Wow in Silom, guys jogging pants are smaller than my underpant !

not my cup of tea, avoid it . . .

[trajan]

I went to True Fitness today at Asok Exchange Tower.

I just walked in.

And finally, discounted the monthly fee to 1,799 baht/m. So initial payment would be 2,599 baht.

Of course, my credit card would be automatically charged each month for that amount.

Then I gave the wonderful news that I don't have a credit card. I like to pay cash.

I understand from great advice given in the "Health" thread that 28 months True Fitness membership (with access to the 3 locations in Bangkok) would be given for a cash upfront payment of Baht21,000 (which results in a Baht750 per month fee) with no processing fees etc.

this sounds fair to me (and a lot more attractive than B1,799 per month--month to month)...

did you ask about a two year or three year contract? Im thinking of joining.

thanks!

[Pseudolus]

go to WOW, First, and True in a circular motion and batter their prices down. this is not racism, this is standard with every Gym in the world. The prices represent Price + 100% (or there about) for the seller to get commission on. You can negotiate that part down. Right it all down on a piece of paper. it is the same for Thais although they do not have to fight quite so hard. I went with True which although is more expensive, is nicer.

[arminbkk]

@trajan

I didn't ask about 2 or 3 years membership, or pay an annual fee upfront.

The offer I got is for monthly cash payments.

Thats ok, because I don't want to be tied down.

I like flexible, so I can walk away from it anytime.

I would never pay an annual fee at once upfront.

I think the whole 'I will waive you the 8,000 baht joining fee...' is just a sales pitch, to make it look good.

Probably offered to everybody.

It is obvious they are driven by commission, seal the deal as quickly as possible.

I am a number, not a guest.

But that seems to be common place everywhere nowadays. Gone are the days of 'customer is king'.

Having said that, at the end of the day, you go there to exercise, not chit chat with the staff.

I cannot comment yet on the actual gym/equipment.

[CarlBkk]

The American owner (early 40s I think) is stinking rich. He's now married to one of the "hi-so actresses" and lives in Bangkok. Probably deserve each other.

[trajan]

@trajan

I didn't ask about 2 or 3 years membership, or pay an annual fee upfront.

The offer I got is for monthly cash payments.

Thats ok, because I don't want to be tied down.

I like flexible, so I can walk away from it anytime.

I would never pay an annual fee at once upfront.

thanks...for me signing up for 2 or 3 years is fine (if I can get and lock in a monthly rate of B750)....Im living here permanently (with a few properties and PR) and really need to exercise....

for cities where I briefly but regularly visit (or where Im not sure I will stay for significant amounts of time) I agree with your approach....I am going to do that for the World Gym chain in Taipei....

[kblaze]

I signed up with Ca Wow about 4 years ago for 22000 baht and have only paid 100 baht yearly renewals. You can get your moneys worth if you haggle the sales rep hardcore and then use the gym frequently. Look at the gym before. Yes there is equipment that is sub par or poorly maintained but if the equipment you n eed, be it weights or running machines, works, then go for it. The sales reps are under a lot of pressure to sell hard, they have to meet quotas. Financially the company is in terrible shape,but a major investor is Major and they have the cash flow to keep them in business for a while, though they will not be making money off of them. I suspect they will downsize considerably and try to turn assets into cash to help the debt situation. GF works for them so i hear the horror stories

[edwardandtubs]

A few Thais have told me about local gyms with good equipment and aircon for 100 baht a month or less. Apparently, they're government run or subsidised. I've yet to see one for myself though. Presumably they're all in the residential suburbs.

[ashacat]

The owner is Canadian and you can google him and see his ridiculously large Phuket mansion on a website called; Homes of the Rich.

[HappyInCM]

TMB Bank Public Company Limited and Bank of Ayudhya Public Company Limited filed lawsuits against the Company for the overdue repayments of the borrowings principal and default interests totalling Baht 183.82 million, together with the related legal and lawyer fees. Only a matter of time now before the banks move in and seize anything of value at all of their clubs. They have defaulted on ALL loans which can be confirmed on the Stock Exchange of Thailand website trading under CAW WOW. Download the PDF files for a good read about their dire financial situation. They have also been suspended from the SET for non compliance.

"CAW WOW incurred a net loss of Baht 141.84 million for the nine-month period ended 30 September 2011, and as of that date the Company’s total current liabilities exceeded its total current assets by Baht 1,019.99 million."

Just in Silom, they have closed the entire 19 floor and moved everything downstairs and put most of the gym in a hallway. A/C is always off and there are NO water fountains. Has any member on this forum ever been to a gym, let alone one that boasts to be the best in the WORLD that doesn't have a water fountain? They also close at 10:00pm now instead of midnight. Too little too late. This ship is sinking fast. Buyer beware.

Isn't this from a year ago - http://www.set.or.th/set/newsdetails.do;jsessionid=E4D2DAB3D3B2B53F0464AF2CD4DC9B55?type=H&time=1295345820000&pdf=dat%2Fnews%2F201101%2F11001491.pdf&filename=dat%2Fnews%2F201101%2F11001491.e11&source=CAWOW&headline=Explanation+on+financial+situation+and+Q3+of+Financial+Statements+as+at+30+September+2010&symbol=CAWOW&language=en&country=US ? you might at least want to mention that ...

[IsaanUSA]

I didn't read all the replies, but as you learned, there is no set price. You should have just asked people as they walked out how much they were paying. I bet you would get 9 different answers.

[DLock]

The owner is Canadian and you can google him and see his ridiculously large Phuket mansion on a website called; Homes of the Rich.

His Villa was named "Beyond" and was located off Phuket in Phang Nga.

I think he sold it for around $24million...but the next guy turned it and sold it for $35million.

I don't think he'll be to concerned with anyones opinion of him.

[AlexDorneles]

I recently got a 6 month membership at Cal WOW. I checked out True Fitness and Fitness First and Cal Wow was the cheapest. True Fitness was the nicest of the 3 but it was expensive (close to nana station if not mistaken).

I went to 3 diferent locations of Cali Wow, all 3 times was just to look and check prices. As they gave me prices I said "OK thanks, I will let you know" and that's when the prices started to go down. Since I went to 3 locations I had a pretty good idea of how low the prices can get. 2 weeks later I was ready to start and went to the location I wanted to join. Off course they didn't remember me anymore and the lowest price they offered me was 14,000 for 6 months and she said there was no way she could go lower. So I pulled my secret weapon out and showed her a quote from another location for 7,500 for 6 months, almost half off her final price. She was not happy about and after going to talk to her manager she agreed on 7500 for 6 months.

[IsaanUSA]

Well played Alex. And did you feel any racism during this process or price shopping?

[HardenedSoul]

I'm a member at Sukhumvit 23 CAWOW and I'm satisfied with the service and the equipment. Couple of annoyances like people hogging the machines while f***ing about on their smartphones. It's really down to the staff to enforce the rules governing this sort of thing.

As far as racist pricing in concerned, that's nonsense. I'm an Afro-Caribbean Brit and there was nothing beyond the usual haggling with the sales girl to deal with. I don't like haggling but if it results in more than 50% off the starting price, I can live with 5 or 10 minutes of it. Walked out with 7 months for 7500THB

[trajan]

Walked out with 7 months for 7500THB

sounds great! is the membership good at only one location or can you use it at all locations?

[HardenedSoul]

just the one .

[trajan]

just the one .

still, good deal...just B1070 per month (and you only commit to 7 months)