Best Value Hospital?

[brotherother]

I wasn't sure whether to put this in the Health, Body and Medicine forum but as it's specific to Bangkok I thought I'd try here.

Anyway I was hoping somebody experienced in using Bangkok's various hospitals could suggest which they feel offer the best value for money, and I suppose conversely which in your opinion are overpriced / hyped. I'm not looking for the cheapest but those where you feel your money been best spent.

I have to say that generally speaking, all things considered, I've never been overly impressed with the hospitals here, and that primarily they're all just a business looking to take your money (should say that I'm used to the NHS in the UK).

Thanks for any replies.

[JSixpack]

St Louis among the private hsps.

Chula among the publics, best reputation in general, but some others have areas of specialty. However, you need to speak some Thai or have a Thai speaker w/ you to negotiate the bureaucracy. The docs speak fair English. Also, you'll have long waits. .

As for the "overhyped," say, Bumrungrad, Samitivej, or Bangkok Hsp, you'll have opinions all over map. Best to choose the doctor, not the hospital--and you can do so via their websites. They have some excellent docs, no question. Had a great experience in Bumrungrad years ago.

[McMagus]

After yonks of hand pain I went to BNH and had some tests ...18 000 Baht worth, to be told I had severe Carpal Tunnel Syndrome in my L hand and would need surgery. Their quote was 40 000 Baht. The surgery is very simple and straightforward, local anaesthetic and about 15 minutes. A friend suggested I go to Srinakarin in Khon Kaen, which I did. Public Thai hospital, crowded, little spoken English. I had the op there, surgeon spoke perfect English and the results are great... total cost ... 3500 Baht. I think they charged me 500 extra cos I'm a farang. So the message is... shop around. I for one won't be looking at the expensive private ones especially if the procedure is relatively straight forward.

[howzat]

any reports on Promitr off Soi 39. heard its good and also Govt. Hospital..

[allane]

Mahaesak Hospital - a small hospital on the road of the same name (off Silom, towards its west end). A smaller place, so may not provide the most complex services, but good value.

[borabora1]

Also to consider, Srikarinm hospital in Bangna, after Central City, and then on the way to Samut Prakarn.

Very good standard and used to be affordable, with an excellent pharmacy product.

Both generalist and specialized doctors are very good even compared to western standards.

Website is easy to find.

[tinfoilhat]

St Louis among the private hsps.

Chula among the publics, best reputation in general, but some others have areas of specialty. However, you need to speak some Thai or have a Thai speaker w/ you to negotiate the bureaucracy. The docs speak fair English. Also, you'll have long waits. .

As for the "overhyped," say, Bumrungrad, Samitivej, or Bangkok Hsp, you'll have opinions all over map. Best to choose the doctor, not the hospital--and you can do so via their websites. They have some excellent docs, no question. Had a great experience in Bumrungrad years ago.

St Louis is my call

[brotherother]

Thanks for all the replies people.

Hopefully this thread will help any others who come across it

[dblaisde]

A few unflattering stories about St. Louis:

I went in a year ago for a fractured collarbone from a motorbike accident. I had 3 visits to the orthopedist, a nice old guy, over the 3 months of healing (just a sling). At the end, he said I was fine and didn't need a return visit. I kept asking him, during the 3 months about the fact that the space between the break (as seen on the xrays) didn't seem to be filling in with bone: there was just a dark blank of 5 mm or so between the two bones. He said: "New bone never shows on an X-ray. It's OK." After the 3 months, I went to Bumrungrad, just to make sure I really was "OK". The doctor there took an X-ray and said the arm would be pretty much useless, because the bones never connected, a "non union". In addition, both supporting ligaments had been severed. I'd need surgery, a bone graft (to fill the gap), wire scaffolding for the ligaments, and a metal plate to hold to all together while it healed. The Doc said that the probability of success was diminished because I'd waited 3 months to get the operation done. After a year (now), the bone is mostly healed (the gap has been bridged with bone that's visible on the xray. (BTW, I confirmed the Bumrungrad diagnosis at Bangkok hospital, and at Lerdsin, a Bangkok public hospital specializing in Orthepedics before getting the surgery.)


One more: A few days ago, I was diagnosed at Bumrungrad with osteoporosis. The treatment I chose is a single 15 minute outpatient IV of a very expensive medication (Reclast) that's good for a year. Bumrungrad estimated 30-35,000 for the treatment. (baht). I went to St. Louis yesterday, and asked an orthopedist how much it would cost there. First he said that the medicine might not even be available there because it was "too expensive for Thai people", so he had to look it up. He found it: 23,000B for the medication. "OK, and how much for the IV?" "7000 B". So, 30000 B total. I asked him: "So 7000 Baht just for an IV?", he smiled, shrugged, and refered me to a government hospital, where he said I could get the job done for 25,000 B.

Infer what you like from this. These are my only experiences with St. Louis. I'm not trying to disparage the positive posts on St. Louis. No doubt there are things I don't understand, but suffice to say that St. Louis won't be my first choice.

[candypants]

St Louis among the private hsps.

Chula among the publics, best reputation in general, but some others have areas of specialty. However, you need to speak some Thai or have a Thai speaker w/ you to negotiate the bureaucracy. The docs speak fair English. Also, you'll have long waits. .

As for the "overhyped," say, Bumrungrad, Samitivej, or Bangkok Hsp, you'll have opinions all over map. Best to choose the doctor, not the hospital--and you can do so via their websites. They have some excellent docs, no question. Had a great experience in Bumrungrad years ago.

St Louis.

In my experience of 17 years, Bumrungrad is by no means over-hyped. The care i have received there has always been excellent, without exception. It is my hospital of choice as it is less than 5 minutes away from my house.

it can be expensive though.

[candypants]

^^^ re the above criticism of St Louis.

Healthcare being what it is, an inexact science dealing with already sick and unhappy people, it is possible to find such stories about ANY hospital in the world.

Doctors and hospitals are unfortunately human and as such infinitely fallible.

Patients are dissatisfied by nature and often have complaints, shooting the messenger as it were.

research and taking responsibility for your own healthcare decisions and education where possible are necessary anywhere you seek treatment, but perhaps more so in Thailand where the culture tends to afford doctors more deference than perhaps they deserve.

[JusMe]

I've been impressed and pleased with care from Siriraj. It's a teaching hospital affiliated with Mahidol University.

Lower level workers speak little English but have always been very helpful and patient. Doctors speak excellent English.

Perhaps slow initially as you work your way around the bureaucracy, but as long as you are patient, you can get excellent care (including surgery) at an excellent cost.

[isawasnake]

This is a good topic.

I have found Bangkok Christian hospital to be the best for the money. I think St. Louis is pretty good too, only been there once though.

I honestly think all the Thai doctors (meaning docs in Thailand) are pretty comparable, so going to a place like Bangkok Christian makes sense. There is no overhead for facilities like at a place like Bumrungrad. At Bangkok Christian, you are essentially getting the same quality, at a drastically reduced price. Bumrungrad and BNH are fine if you have something minor and have health insurance, otherwise I would stay WELL away. Bumrungrad et al is genius at giving the IMPRESSION of good, clean, quality health care, but a place is only as good as its doctors in my opinion. That puts Bumrungrad on par with these much cheaper places in my opinion.

[mooro_uk]

I've found Thai Nakarin Hospital near Central Bang Na to be not too cheap but not too expensive. Usually pretty good service, doctors etc. Camillian hospital in Thonglor is in a similar vein (excuse the medical pun).

My experiences of Bumrungrad and Samitivej in Phrom Pong have been excellent facilities, doctors etc but very expensive!

[Amusements]

I tried the Bangkok Adventist (Mormon) hospital once. It was 20k for 3 nights stay in a private room, and treatment for infection of the intestine (food poisoning).

Not sure if it was good value or not? I have never stayed in a hospital before.

[kidcosmique]

On 3/19/2013 at 12:46 PM, JusMe said:

I've been impressed and pleased with care from Siriraj. It's a teaching hospital affiliated with Mahidol University.

Lower level workers speak little English but have always been very helpful and patient. Doctors speak excellent English.

Perhaps slow initially as you work your way around the bureaucracy, but as long as you are patient, you can get excellent care (including surgery) at an excellent cost.

+1 from for Siriraj. I can't speak highly enough about it and your impression is the same as mine - once you get to the doctors it's plain sailing.

 

Worth adding that it's the oldest and largest hospital in Thailand and where the royal family gets its treatment.

 

There is also a private affiliated hospital next to it which doesn't that much more expensive, if you care about the luxury. I've been fine with the government building.

[jumbo]

On 9/12/2012 at 9:10 AM, borabora1 said:

Also to consider, Srikarinm hospital in Bangna, after Central City, and then on the way to Samut Prakarn.

Very good standard and used to be affordable, with an excellent pharmacy product.

Both generalist and specialized doctors are very good even compared to western standards.

Website is easy to find.

+ 1

[Thainess]

Do you have chronic health problems? Then you really need to go home to the UK and avail yourself of the NHS. I wouldn't want to be seriously sick and at the mercy of the sketch standard of care available in Thailand, or fall victim to their huge fees and bill padding. Go back to the UK and return to Thailand again once you've recovered. If you remain chronically ill, the best place for you is the UK. Thailand puts your life at risk every single day in a multitude of different ways - even for people who are relatively healthy.

[Why Me]

4 hours ago, Thainess said:

I wouldn't want to be seriously sick and at the mercy of the sketch standard of care available in Thailand, or fall victim to their huge fees and bill padding.

I assume you talk about low-end places like some public hospitals where patients are left lying in the corridors because rooms are full. Not sure why you would want to go there as a foreigner. That was your mistake.

 

Top hospitals in Thailand rank among the world's best. But you still have to be able to afford them. If you have good insurance then fees are not your concern either. That's between the hospital and your insurer.

 

You need to qualify your statement to say that if you are unfortunately impecunious then go back to the UK for free care.

[uhuh]

59 minutes ago, Why Me said:

 

Top hospitals in Thailand rank among the world's best. 

No, they don't. 

If you think they do you have no idea about medicine. 

(They are good,  but by far not among the world's best. Those are in the rich countries of the West,  in Singapore and maybe Hong Kong.)

Sketch care describes very well what you get here.

[uhuh]

Good value: St Louis, Camillian, have also heard good things about Sikarin.

I am a bit wary of Adventist and Christian,  some not so good experiences.

But I also had a bad experience at St Louis and later it turned out that the same doctor also worked at Bumrungrad.

So it really depends a lot on the doctor. 

 

Best value are the night clinics of Chula and the other university hospitals. For inpatient care,  they are good value - because they are cheap,  so you get quite a lot for your money. Not because they are very good. They aren't. It's a mixed bag. 

The private hospital of Siriraj is not cheap,  BTW.

[uhuh]

On 9/11/2012 at 8:57 AM, howzat said:

any reports on Promitr off Soi 39. heard its good and also Govt. Hospital..

Only good for simple things

[Why Me]

18 minutes ago, uhuh said:

No, they are not. 

If you think they are you have no idea about medicine. 

(They are good,  but by far not among the world's best. Those are in the rich countries of the West,  in Singapore and maybe Hong Kong.)

Sketch care describes very well what you get here.

Like I said youse gets whats youse pays for. If you have the dough you can get world class care here.

 

Bumrungrud makes it into at least one list of top 10 in the world: https://www.advisoryhq.com/articles/best-hospitals-in-the-world/

[uhuh]

No it's not world class medicine what you get here. 

This is the kingdom of make-believe and Bumrungrad is as good at it as every Thai. 

What you get at Bumrungrad is good. And what you get at Siriraj is so good that the king didn't go abroad for treatment. 

But as I said,  if you think Thailand has hospitals that rank among the world's best you don't work in medicine. 

 

I give you an example.  You look up Bumrungrad's spine specialists on their website and you see that many of them trained in Germany, mostly with the same German guy from Herne. Now, don't you think the guy who trained them is probably the master in his field? 

Another example: try to get Shingrix here  (zoster vaccine). It is routine in the west, does not exist in Thailand.

Another example: pain management in Thailand is not good. There are many threads about it, look at the 10 years old thread about BNH. Things have not improved since 2009, because Thai doctors still are very reluctant to give good pain killers (because of the drug trade in Thailand) and because some routine painkillers of the west do not exist here. I was in Bumrungrad, and I was in pain. They gave me Tramadol iv, as a shot. So I vomited (that's normal,  if someone gets Tramadol iv). The whole emergency room looked aghast that this foreigner dared to vomit in their beautiful emergency room. Nobody had the idea to give me a bucket, they didn't even have one. It was the cleaning lady who finally did this. It went on like this for a week (2 more Tramadol iv... :)). The operation was very good. Pre- and post-operative pain management was third world. 

 

 

[Why Me]

11 minutes ago, uhuh said:

No it's not world class medicine what you get here. 

This is the kingdom of make-believe and Bumrungrad is as good at it as every Thai. 

What you get at Bumrungrad is good. And what you get at Siriraj is so good that the king didn't go abroad for treatment. 

But as I said,  if you think Thailand has hospitals that rank among the world's best you don't work in medicine. 

 

I give you an example.  You look up Bumrungrad's spine specialists on their website and you see that many of them trained in Germany, mostly with the same German guy from Herne. Now, don't you think the guy who trained them is probably the master in his field? 

Another example: try to get Shingrix here  (zoster vaccine). It is routine in the west, does not exist in Thailand.

Another example: pain management in Thailand is not good. There are many threads about it, look at the 10 years old thread about BNH. Things have not improved since 2009, because Thai doctors still are very reluctant to give good pain killers (because of the drug trade in Thailand) and because some routine painkillers of the west do not exist here. I was in Bumrungrad, and I was in pain. They gave me Tramadol iv, as a shot. So I vomited (that's normal,  if someone gets Tramadol iv). The whole emergency room looked aghast that this foreigner dared to vomit in their beautiful emergency room. Nobody had the idea to give me a bucket, they didn't even have one. It was the cleaning lady who finally did this. It went on like this for a week (2 more Tramadol iv... :)). The operation was very good. Pre- and post-operative pain management was third world. 

 

 

I am deeply saddened by your experience at Bumrungrud. Nevertheless, anecdotal evidence of a single patient does not make a ranking. Their reputation is built on treating millions.

 

But as I said,  if you think Thailand has hospitals that rank among the world's best you don't work in medicine. 

Jeez, I just gave you an external reference ranking Bumrungrud. And there are others if you google. Please do not take your pain situation out on Thai med care as a whole. If you can get your problems fixed in your home country then fine, but even that seems beyond your reach. Yet you keep whining.

[impulse]

Not long ago, there was a study published extolling on Thailand's high marks in the world for medical treatment.  They got excellent marks for facilities, for government support, affordability, and most things having to do with the physical plants.  But they scored 17% on doctor skillset.  It was a thread on TVF here- you can search for it.

 

I had a friend treated for leukemia at Siriraj.  She passed away at age 24.  It was part of the huge Siraraj complex, but not the same facility that treated the Royal Family.  Not even in the same ballpark with respect to quality.  Do your diligence before making such an important decision. 

 

I had some excellent doctors, and some that I wouldn't go back to a second time.  And most long stay guys will tell you to pick your doctor, as opposed to picking your hospital.  Get input from people who have had the same treatments.  They'll tell you who the good doctors are and who to avoid.  But they can't tell you online here without fear of a defamation suit.

 

Edit:  I'd add that I found out that if you let the hospital assign you a doctor, they'll assign you one that isn't so busy.  Which isn't necessarily a good sign.

 

[DogNo1]

Do you work for Bumrungrad?   Anecdotal evidence is not equal to a statistical ranking but it is not unimportant.  I patronized Bumrungrad for twelve years and had both good experiences and bad.  They were all quite expensive.  I have switched to St. Louis.  The staff are not as well-trained and sophisticated but they are not proud.  If you complain about things, they will try to fix it.  Mistakes can happen.  I had a similar experience to that of another poster at McCormack Hospital in Chiang Mai.  I went in with a broken collar bone from a motorcycle accident.  A doctor bandaged the shoulder, put my arm in a sling and sent me home.  The result was a non-union.  I had to pay a specialist from another hospital to splice a piece of bone from my hip into the collar bone.  I still have the plate and screws in my collar bone.

 

In Thailand you must be alert for medical mistakes.  I've suffered quite a few.  At St. Louis, you can have a procedure redone and still pay less than at Bumrungrad.  If you are well enough to choose, it is good to select a doctor recommended by Sherl.  If it's an emergency, you have to take who you get.

[impulse]

4 minutes ago, DogNo1 said:

In Thailand you must be alert for medical mistakes.  I've suffered quite a few.  At St. Louis, you can have a procedure redone and still pay less than at Bumrungrad.  If you are well enough to choose, it is good to select a doctor recommended by Sherl.  If it's an emergency, you have to take who you get.

 

Back home, it was customary to get a second opinion only if you got bad news and needed treatment.  In Thailand, I'd recommend getting a 2nd opinion AT A DIFFERENT HOSPITAL for anything serious, regardless of whether the news is good or bad.  Thai culture makes it difficult for one doctor to disagree with another from the same hospital.

 

[lopburi3]

11 hours ago, uhuh said:

Another example: try to get Shingrix here  (zoster vaccine). It is routine in the west, does not exist in Thailand.

Actually it is new and not routine in most of the world yet - it is not available because they can not make fast enough to even fully supply US demand and are not shipping to new countries until they can do so.  The previous used Zostavax has been available in Thailand for years. 

 

[tjo o tjim]

On 1/9/2020 at 4:30 AM, uhuh said:

I give you an example.  You look up Bumrungrad's spine specialists on their website and you see that many of them trained in Germany, mostly with the same German guy from Herne. Now, don't you think the guy who trained them is probably the master in his field? 

Having met with the spine specialists at Bumrungrad, I would say they offer a standardized set of solutions for patients and really aren’t that fantastic in the scheme of things.  Cash price for a spinal fusion was around USD$30k.  

 

In the US, a surgeon provided five surgical options for the same condition, and the price with insurance was $10k (Insurance policy costs ~$12k/year).  After talking to different professionals, I get the games: Bumrungrad wants you to spend time in the hospital to hit you with other charges; the doctors in the US want to do the same surgery as an outpatient so they maximize their own practice’s compensation.  

 

But, my wife was clear... despite being a big fan of Bumrungrad (unlike myself), there is no way in hell she would do the surgery there.