smutcakes Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 The fallout of this vote buying scheme , is not only have they the PTP lost a considerable amount of money in the process ,they have lost their world markets , that in itself is a disaster, there is no proof that regular buyers will return in the short term , after Thailand tried to inflate the price to cover all their costs, import / exporters have long memories , so one must mention in closing , well done PTP for ruining the rice export industry of Thailand. Importers/exporters will buy the best value for money rice- whether that be from Thailand or anywhere else, they could not give a monkeys chaf about rice pledging/ internal politics etc etc etc 'well done PTP for ruining the rice export industry of Thailand.' hyperbole much! The pledging scheme is a mess, which needs to be resolved one way or another, but dont start implying its ruined the Thai rice export industry long term! So the Thai rice industry slipping from first to third place in a year is not a problem for you or the country? Sitting on a huge stockpile of unsold rice in storage that is degrading in quality and cannot be sold at the market price thus meaning a HUGE loss is not a problem for you or Thailand? Trying to sell rice of a much lower quality at the same price that you did two years ago at market prices then is not a problem to you and to Thailand? Lower quality means lower prices so buyers who want high quality rice at market prices won't touch the rubbish that Thailand is trying to sell now and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? The rice pledging scheme has all but ruined the Thai export market as nobody will trust the quality or quantity any more and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? If Thailand dumps the rice on the market at market or lower than market prices they will be in deep trougle with the WTO as well as incurring MASSIVE losses to Thailand and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? If they aren't problems then what do YOU call a big problem? Can you read? I quite clearly say the 'The pledging scheme is a mess' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipperx Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 The fallout of this vote buying scheme , is not only have they the PTP lost a considerable amount of money in the process ,they have lost their world markets , that in itself is a disaster, there is no proof that regular buyers will return in the short term , after Thailand tried to inflate the price to cover all their costs, import / exporters have long memories , so one must mention in closing , well done PTP for ruining the rice export industry of Thailand. Importers/exporters will buy the best value for money rice- whether that be from Thailand or anywhere else, they could not give a monkeys chaf about rice pledging/ internal politics etc etc etc 'well done PTP for ruining the rice export industry of Thailand.' hyperbole much! The pledging scheme is a mess, which needs to be resolved one way or another, but dont start implying its ruined the Thai rice export industry long term! So the Thai rice industry slipping from first to third place in a year is not a problem for you or the country? Sitting on a huge stockpile of unsold rice in storage that is degrading in quality and cannot be sold at the market price thus meaning a HUGE loss is not a problem for you or Thailand? Trying to sell rice of a much lower quality at the same price that you did two years ago at market prices then is not a problem to you and to Thailand? Lower quality means lower prices so buyers who want high quality rice at market prices won't touch the rubbish that Thailand is trying to sell now and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? The rice pledging scheme has all but ruined the Thai export market as nobody will trust the quality or quantity any more and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? If Thailand dumps the rice on the market at market or lower than market prices they will be in deep trougle with the WTO as well as incurring MASSIVE losses to Thailand and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? If they aren't problems then what do YOU call a big problem? Can you read? I quite clearly say the 'The pledging scheme is a mess' I take your point that market buyers will buy at the best rates they can find and not be interested at all in the internal politics of the exporting nation. I am not sure it is quite that simple though because the quality of rice being grown now is much worse than previous years because it is more profitable for the farmers. It will take a little while to reverse that problem. Further I would expect buyers to be rather cautious given the fact that there are huge stockpiles of rotting rice and concern that the rice being sold in the imminent future being contaminated. For these reasons I think there is an impact on the rice industry as a whole even after this ridiculous corrupt scheme is abolished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billd766 Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 The fallout of this vote buying scheme , is not only have they the PTP lost a considerable amount of money in the process ,they have lost their world markets , that in itself is a disaster, there is no proof that regular buyers will return in the short term , after Thailand tried to inflate the price to cover all their costs, import / exporters have long memories , so one must mention in closing , well done PTP for ruining the rice export industry of Thailand. Importers/exporters will buy the best value for money rice- whether that be from Thailand or anywhere else, they could not give a monkeys chaf about rice pledging/ internal politics etc etc etc 'well done PTP for ruining the rice export industry of Thailand.' hyperbole much! The pledging scheme is a mess, which needs to be resolved one way or another, but dont start implying its ruined the Thai rice export industry long term! So the Thai rice industry slipping from first to third place in a year is not a problem for you or the country? Sitting on a huge stockpile of unsold rice in storage that is degrading in quality and cannot be sold at the market price thus meaning a HUGE loss is not a problem for you or Thailand? Trying to sell rice of a much lower quality at the same price that you did two years ago at market prices then is not a problem to you and to Thailand? Lower quality means lower prices so buyers who want high quality rice at market prices won't touch the rubbish that Thailand is trying to sell now and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? The rice pledging scheme has all but ruined the Thai export market as nobody will trust the quality or quantity any more and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? If Thailand dumps the rice on the market at market or lower than market prices they will be in deep trougle with the WTO as well as incurring MASSIVE losses to Thailand and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? If they aren't problems then what do YOU call a big problem? Can you read? I quite clearly say the 'The pledging scheme is a mess' Yes I can read, write and understand English very well thank you. The way I understand that "although pledging scheme is a mess, which needs to be resolved one way or another, but dont start implying its ruined the Thai rice export industry long term!" You imply that it has not ruined the Thai rice export industry long term/ To drop from first place to third place in a year smacks of sheer incompetence and from what I can understand the government intends to keep on pledging the rice for yet another year to put into storage facilities that have not yet been built and then be unable to sell that rice too. If that isn't ruining the rice export industry please tell us all what in your honest opinion WILL ruin the industry? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khunken Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 They have created a rice mountain which, if the history of EU mountains of foodstuff is any guide, much of it will have to be given away to feed the starving, used as animal food or just destroyed. Credibility has been lost in at least one of the real G-t-G sales by the customer discovering some of the rice was inedible. This will have an impact on Thailand's future efforts to sell rice and, until the government finally puts a stop to the scam, they can only sell small amounts & have to take a loss. The new PTP motto should be: Thaksin thinks, Thailand sinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose Edited June 9, 2013 by 473geo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzMick Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose Back in the real world, we don't have any of it, except for huge losses to the people of Thailand - oh, and a nice little payout to farang's whose wife grows rice, eh? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waza Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Politics aside can anyone find fault with much of what Abhisit is saying because I can't. Especially sensible seems to be the Dems policy of paying direct to the farmer. Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Perhaps the Dems should have taken their own advice, previously they subsidised a price increase of fertiliser,(corruption free?) rather than give direct to the farmer. Good for the fertiliser manufacturers, usage wouldn't fall away profits rise, but the farmer who used little or no fertiliser saw no increase in revenue as the rice price remained poor. I guess the subsidy was good for the larger farmers as it would maintain their profit levels too. Supporting the end product price is the way to go (in my opinion) if it can be maintained at reasonable cost, and the pricing levels are constant through the system with benefit filtering down to the lowest levels i.e the small producer. I am also interested to know where the corruption is supposed to be for example in the BAAC purchases. Don't see any proof. "What about Abhist" and the dems, Is this the only defence you can ever make? Edited June 9, 2013 by waza 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waza Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose They tried that already......... A trial donation last last month of 40 tonnes as humanitarian aid to poor villagers in Phitsanulok province, which a commerce ministry official said would be followed by a few millions of tonnes more, drew complaints it had been stored too long. "I don't know why the government gave it to us as no one can eat this rice," said Chaew Malila, 60, in Beung Phra district in Phitsanulok, almost 400 km north of Bangkok. http://www.trust.org/item/20130513133928-qs0rf But back on topic, I applaud Abhist for taking the lead in condemning this criminally corrupt and morally bankrupt scam by Thaksin and his government of puppets and lickspittles and hopefully they will be embarrassed enough to cancel its continuation. The sooner this government is gone the sooner Thailand can start to rebuild and stop looking like a buffoon failed state. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Politics aside can anyone find fault with much of what Abhisit is saying because I can't. Especially sensible seems to be the Dems policy of paying direct to the farmer. Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Perhaps the Dems should have taken their own advice, previously they subsidised a price increase of fertiliser,(corruption free?) rather than give direct to the farmer. Good for the fertiliser manufacturers, usage wouldn't fall away profits rise, but the farmer who used little or no fertiliser saw no increase in revenue as the rice price remained poor. I guess the subsidy was good for the larger farmers as it would maintain their profit levels too. Supporting the end product price is the way to go (in my opinion) if it can be maintained at reasonable cost, and the pricing levels are constant through the system with benefit filtering down to the lowest levels i.e the small producer. I am also interested to know where the corruption is supposed to be for example in the BAAC purchases. Don't see any proof. "What about Abhist" and the dems, Is this the only defence you can ever make? You can think of another way to highlight hypocrisy?...........and it beats your tedious accusations when you can find no other response Edited June 9, 2013 by 473geo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khunken Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose I see Ozmick has already replied & I agree with his response. Rather than see the rice sit deteriorating in warehouses, yes it would be better given away to the needy. But the PTP is unlikely to do that as it would a total admission of failure of the scam. Whether 'the farmers' have benefitted is far from clear and most likely the large growers (& middlemen & cronies) have been the main beneficiaries. The small number of Farangs whose taxes have been wasted is small potatoes (or rice grains) compared to the rip off of ordinary Thais. It's a real financial disaster & you have to be really desensitised to defend it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose They tried that already......... A trial donation last last month of 40 tonnes as humanitarian aid to poor villagers in Phitsanulok province, which a commerce ministry official said would be followed by a few millions of tonnes more, drew complaints it had been stored too long. "I don't know why the government gave it to us as no one can eat this rice," said Chaew Malila, 60, in Beung Phra district in Phitsanulok, almost 400 km north of Bangkok. http://www.trust.org/item/20130513133928-qs0rf But back on topic, I applaud Abhist for taking the lead in condemning this criminally corrupt and morally bankrupt scam by Thaksin and his government of puppets and lickspittles and hopefully they will be embarrassed enough to cancel its continuation. The sooner this government is gone the sooner Thailand can start to rebuild and stop looking like a buffoon failed state. Funny Moody brings up a question about losses in the rice scheme and Thailand is a 'failed state'.........am I allowed to mention a few other economies that are under the cosh and in a much worse situation than your 'failed state' Thailand...... Edited June 9, 2013 by 473geo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose Back in the real world, we don't have any of it, except for huge losses to the people of Thailand - oh, and a nice little payout to farang's whose wife grows rice, eh? Sure Mick...it seems that increased revenue is getting through.....to some.....by the way did you ever meet a farmer who stated he was making enough.....I worked in agriculture for years and ever met one yet!!....some nice new vehicles on the farms though.....funny that eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose I see Ozmick has already replied & I agree with his response. Rather than see the rice sit deteriorating in warehouses, yes it would be better given away to the needy. But the PTP is unlikely to do that as it would a total admission of failure of the scam. Whether 'the farmers' have benefitted is far from clear and most likely the large growers (& middlemen & cronies) have been the main beneficiaries. The small number of Farangs whose taxes have been wasted is small potatoes (or rice grains) compared to the rip off of ordinary Thais. It's a real financial disaster & you have to be really desensitised to defend it. No you have to be out in the coutryside to view the changes to understand how the additional funding is makig a difference to Thai agriculture and the Thai economy in General Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waza Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Politics aside can anyone find fault with much of what Abhisit is saying because I can't. Especially sensible seems to be the Dems policy of paying direct to the farmer. Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Perhaps the Dems should have taken their own advice, previously they subsidised a price increase of fertiliser,(corruption free?) rather than give direct to the farmer. Good for the fertiliser manufacturers, usage wouldn't fall away profits rise, but the farmer who used little or no fertiliser saw no increase in revenue as the rice price remained poor. I guess the subsidy was good for the larger farmers as it would maintain their profit levels too. Supporting the end product price is the way to go (in my opinion) if it can be maintained at reasonable cost, and the pricing levels are constant through the system with benefit filtering down to the lowest levels i.e the small producer. I am also interested to know where the corruption is supposed to be for example in the BAAC purchases. Don't see any proof. "What about Abhist" and the dems, Is this the only defence you can ever make? You can think of another way to highlight hypocrisy?...........and it beats your tedious accusations when you can find no other respose Speaking of hypocrisy, obviously my post pointing wasn't tedious enough to ignore. Edited June 9, 2013 by waza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smutcakes Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 The fallout of this vote buying scheme , is not only have they the PTP lost a considerable amount of money in the process ,they have lost their world markets , that in itself is a disaster, there is no proof that regular buyers will return in the short term , after Thailand tried to inflate the price to cover all their costs, import / exporters have long memories , so one must mention in closing , well done PTP for ruining the rice export industry of Thailand. Importers/exporters will buy the best value for money rice- whether that be from Thailand or anywhere else, they could not give a monkeys chaf about rice pledging/ internal politics etc etc etc 'well done PTP for ruining the rice export industry of Thailand.' hyperbole much! The pledging scheme is a mess, which needs to be resolved one way or another, but dont start implying its ruined the Thai rice export industry long term! So the Thai rice industry slipping from first to third place in a year is not a problem for you or the country? Sitting on a huge stockpile of unsold rice in storage that is degrading in quality and cannot be sold at the market price thus meaning a HUGE loss is not a problem for you or Thailand? Trying to sell rice of a much lower quality at the same price that you did two years ago at market prices then is not a problem to you and to Thailand? Lower quality means lower prices so buyers who want high quality rice at market prices won't touch the rubbish that Thailand is trying to sell now and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? The rice pledging scheme has all but ruined the Thai export market as nobody will trust the quality or quantity any more and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? If Thailand dumps the rice on the market at market or lower than market prices they will be in deep trougle with the WTO as well as incurring MASSIVE losses to Thailand and that is not a problem to you and Thailand? If they aren't problems then what do YOU call a big problem? Can you read? I quite clearly say the 'The pledging scheme is a mess' Yes I can read, write and understand English very well thank you. The way I understand that "although pledging scheme is a mess, which needs to be resolved one way or another, but dont start implying its ruined the Thai rice export industry long term!" You imply that it has not ruined the Thai rice export industry long term/ To drop from first place to third place in a year smacks of sheer incompetence and from what I can understand the government intends to keep on pledging the rice for yet another year to put into storage facilities that have not yet been built and then be unable to sell that rice too. If that isn't ruining the rice export industry please tell us all what in your honest opinion WILL ruin the industry? Okay you are probably correct if you mean long term is next year- I was meaning long term, as in long term- 5- 10 years down the line. Obviously it is all conjecture at this point and I would be surprised if they keep doing this without in some way rethinking the way the scheme works. Slipperx- I would expect importers from other countries would be cautious, but I am sure they know what they are doing- and know the difference between old/contaminated rice and proper grade rice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubl Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Rice Losses? Two years of THB 300 billion and already recovered a bit by selling some, THB 120 billion it's said. The rest of the handful of Baht is still safely stored away in the form of rice (mountains). Why worry?Obviously k. Abhisit doesn't know what he's talking about as last year we had k. Thaksin telling the rice pledge program was good and should continue for a few more years. Why believe the opposition leader when you have the choice to believe a criminal fugitive? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Speaking of hypocrisy, obviously my post pointing wasn't tedious enough to ignore. You are correct it was not really worthy of response, but in a moment of inquistive demeanor I wondered if you would follow up with a comment not about Thai politics, but the more interesting 473geo......you did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluespunk Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Blood is in the water and the sharks are circling. This particularly moronic and chronically inept policy has truly hit the fan and the brown stuff is covering everyone involved. I am still stunned at the sheer stupidity of it, surely at some point someone must have thought, " hang on a minute the numbers just don't add up". Even allowing for corruption, greed and political chicanery it was obvious this crass idea could only end in failure. Or are PT just that stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khunken Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose I see Ozmick has already replied & I agree with his response. Rather than see the rice sit deteriorating in warehouses, yes it would be better given away to the needy. But the PTP is unlikely to do that as it would a total admission of failure of the scam. Whether 'the farmers' have benefitted is far from clear and most likely the large growers (& middlemen & cronies) have been the main beneficiaries. The small number of Farangs whose taxes have been wasted is small potatoes (or rice grains) compared to the rip off of ordinary Thais. It's a real financial disaster & you have to be really desensitised to defend it. No you have to be out in the coutryside to view the changes to understand how the additional funding is makig a difference to Thai agriculture and the Thai economy in General So, have you toured the whole country & seen the evidence? I'd believe you if you can prove your assertions. Even if some of what you say is true - which I doubt - populist policies are a short-term fix to put money in some people's pockets at the expense of sustainability (& the general population). Getting local or foreign expertise in improving Thailands woeful rice yields would be money far better spent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose I see Ozmick has already replied & I agree with his response. Rather than see the rice sit deteriorating in warehouses, yes it would be better given away to the needy. But the PTP is unlikely to do that as it would a total admission of failure of the scam. Whether 'the farmers' have benefitted is far from clear and most likely the large growers (& middlemen & cronies) have been the main beneficiaries. The small number of Farangs whose taxes have been wasted is small potatoes (or rice grains) compared to the rip off of ordinary Thais. It's a real financial disaster & you have to be really desensitised to defend it. No you have to be out in the coutryside to view the changes to understand how the additional funding is makig a difference to Thai agriculture and the Thai economy in General So, have you toured the whole country & seen the evidence? I'd believe you if you can prove your assertions. Even if some of what you say is true - which I doubt - populist policies are a short-term fix to put money in some people's pockets at the expense of sustainability (& the general population). Getting local or foreign expertise in improving Thailands woeful rice yields would be money far better spent. Have you any idea how much of the general population derive part or whole of their income from agriculture or associated business? So they pay tax and a part is returned to sustain the business.......not flawed as far as I see it..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post rubl Posted June 9, 2013 Popular Post Share Posted June 9, 2013 "No you have to be out in the coutryside to view the changes to understand how the additional funding is makig a difference to Thai agriculture and the Thai economy in General"With some ministry last week revealing a 7.7% income drop for farmers, the additional funding of 2 times THB 300 billion must surely make a difference to some, I hope. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khunken Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Have you any idea how much of the general population derive part or whole of their income from agriculture or associated business? So they pay tax and a part is returned to sustain the business.......not flawed as far as I see it..... Look, you made some assertions that you haven't backed up. Now you're obfuscating. You haven't made any attempt to answer many questions raised by myself & others. Smoke & mirrors seems to be your methodology which is exactly in tune with the PTP's utterances on their failure to account for massive amounts of Thai people's money lost. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai at Heart Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 They have created a rice mountain which, if the history of EU mountains of foodstuff is any guide, much of it will have to be given away to feed the starving, used as animal food or just destroyed. Credibility has been lost in at least one of the real G-t-G sales by the customer discovering some of the rice was inedible. This will have an impact on Thailand's future efforts to sell rice and, until the government finally puts a stop to the scam, they can only sell small amounts & have to take a loss. The new PTP motto should be: Thaksin thinks, Thailand sinks. I found an article that describes how shops on China are selling Thai rice blended 25% with other types because they can't sell it at these prices. No one complains. Once that starts, it's very difficult to get business back. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Have you any idea how much of the general population derive part or whole of their income from agriculture or associated business? So they pay tax and a part is returned to sustain the business.......not flawed as far as I see it..... Look, you made some assertions that you haven't backed up. Now you're obfuscating. You haven't made any attempt to answer many questions raised by myself & others. Smoke & mirrors seems to be your methodology which is exactly in tune with the PTP's utterances on their failure to account for massive amounts of Thai people's money lost. I'll take that as a you don't know then Ken, like a yes to you have no idea, do some research if you wish to question my statements otherwise you are just in lazy denial.....find out Ken, go look. How many of the general population derive part or whole of their income from agriculture or associated business...Knowledge is your friend....then you can come back in a few days and tell me you do not belive what I say Ken.....and more importantly....why! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) "No you have to be out in the coutryside to view the changes to understand how the additional funding is makig a difference to Thai agriculture and the Thai economy in General" With some ministry last week revealing a 7.7% income drop for farmers, the additional funding of 2 times THB 300 billion must surely make a difference to some, I hope. Can we partly attribute that to the empty fuel reserve fund and the government allowing diesel to find a more 'natural' level, heaven help us if rice is dropped to 9 - 10 baht a kg......a 15% reduction in revenue......reduction in internal demand for consumer goods, exports suffering because of the strong baht......have you guys even thought this through? Edited June 9, 2013 by 473geo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khunken Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Have you any idea how much of the general population derive part or whole of their income from agriculture or associated business? So they pay tax and a part is returned to sustain the business.......not flawed as far as I see it..... Look, you made some assertions that you haven't backed up. Now you're obfuscating. You haven't made any attempt to answer many questions raised by myself & others. Smoke & mirrors seems to be your methodology which is exactly in tune with the PTP's utterances on their failure to account for massive amounts of Thai people's money lost. I'll take that as a you don't know then Ken, like a yes to you have no idea, do some research if you wish to question my statements otherwise you are just in lazy denial.....find out Ken, go look. How many of the general population derive part or whole of their income from agriculture or associated business...Knowledge is your friend....then you can come back in a few days and tell me you do not belive what I say Ken.....and more importantly....why! What rubbish & what arrogance. You made the statements. Back them up or they are just economical 'truths'. I have no intention in researching anything that you have written. Don't you be so lazy & do your own research & come back with some proof of your assertions, otherwise they are not worth a grain of rice. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iancnx Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Oh dear .......more hot air is attempting to hijack this open, frank and informative thread! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Arrogant...no doubt.... compliments my knowledge and considered opinions..... ....a confidence that sets me apart from the average humble man... .....but enough about the more interesting 473geo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
473geo Posted June 9, 2013 Share Posted June 9, 2013 Oh dear .......more hot air is attempting to hijack this open, frank and informative thread! I guess somebody had to bring the military balloon into the equation.....go on then how much did that fiasco cost the tax payer.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post OzMick Posted June 9, 2013 Popular Post Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) I for one would love to see the rice mountain used to benefit the starving in the world, I'm sure you would too Ken.......so you see not all doom and gloom there is always a good side in any situation.....you just have to look hard enough Thai farmers benefit, the starving millions benefit, Thailand gains a reputation for being a caring country.......and the expats continue to moan about their taxes being wasted...oh well can't have it all I suppose I see Ozmick has already replied & I agree with his response. Rather than see the rice sit deteriorating in warehouses, yes it would be better given away to the needy. But the PTP is unlikely to do that as it would a total admission of failure of the scam. Whether 'the farmers' have benefitted is far from clear and most likely the large growers (& middlemen & cronies) have been the main beneficiaries. The small number of Farangs whose taxes have been wasted is small potatoes (or rice grains) compared to the rip off of ordinary Thais. It's a real financial disaster & you have to be really desensitised to defend it. No you have to be out in the coutryside to view the changes to understand how the additional funding is makig a difference to Thai agriculture and the Thai economy in General You obviously didn't see yesterday's quote from the President of the Rice Farmer's Association. OTOH what would he know, in comparison to your vast knowledge and experience. "Meanwhile, the Thai Rice Farmers Association acknowledged the huge losses incurred by the government under the rice-pledging scheme, and expressed worries about the future and the lower rice quality." Association president Prasith Boonchuey said......."Despite the high pledging price, farmers have never got high returns and still faced a high debt burden after the higher cost of production. Farmers do not want this unstable pledging at a high price as the government will finally need to review the policy because of huge losses and financial liquidity problems. Farmers have ignored development of rice quality because the government has focused only on price, while they have no plan to promote sustainable growth of rice plantations." Prasith said the pledging policy had not helped farmers to improve their living standards. Edited June 9, 2013 by OzMick 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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