You're experience in Thailand same as this one?

[dude123]

Hi everyone,

If you have a minute or two, I would love to hear your comments after reading this artlice about living in Thailand http://www.escapefromamerica.com/2010/04/living-in-thailand-thai-world/

I'm thinking of retiring here too, but have only visited for two weeks over 10 years ago. Seems like the

guy who wrote the above article is a little bitter, but on the other hand, he still chooses to live in

Thailand. What do you think after reading it. Does he make sense?

From his coments, I think he's not so happy with his Wife, so he writes this article to blow off a little

steam and feel good about himself.

Edited January 20, 2014 by dude123

[Jonathan Fairfield]

Here is the article in full:

Thai World

By Bart Walters

The self-centered pathology of Thai people is more than just individual selfishness, it’s a nationwide epidemic

What motivates the speech and actions of Thai people is a mystery not soon to be solved. Live here a while and you’ll soon learn; the smile is a mask, the genuflecting “wai” their shield and no deal is ever really “done”. When attempting to unravel it all, one should always remember, Thais are only motivated by things they think have a direct impact on them personally.

As the world watched the monster tsunami devour chunks of Southeast Asia, it witnessed the alleged caring and selfless nature of Thai people on CNN every night.

During a news interview with a nearly drowned Aussie, the tourist gushed about the fearless Thai hotel manager that risked his own life to pull him out of the churning abyss. As a long time resident of Phuket, I remember thinking “The guy probably hadn’t paid his bill yet.”

While driving to the market I witnessed an unfortunate dog that had lost his life attempting to cross 3 lanes of morning traffic. All week I passed this site, wincing a little more every day as the dog’s body succumbed to the elements.

“Why doesn’t someone take that dog away?” I asked my wife.

Incredulous, she answered, “Why I’m gonna get that dog? Not my dog”.

I had just assumed that in a Buddhist country with all that compassion and temples and monks and such, someone would take it upon themselves to take care of the poor creature. Ask ten Thai people the same question that I asked my wife and 8 of them will answer the same way; “not my dog”. The other two would say, “How much you pay me?”

While visiting a friend who runs a property development firm here in Pattaya, he closed a huge deal for 63 units in his off-plan condo project. With that deal he had the funding to break ground with confidence immediately. He danced around the office in his bare feet and sent one of the staff out for champagne.

The remaining staff members observed his antics like cows watching a train pass. None of them cared but the sales people; and they were unhappy. That would make 63 units they couldn’t sell and collect commission on. They could care less about the success of the company or financial health of the project. For them it was money out of their pocket.

The self-centered pathology of Thai people is more than just individual selfishness, it’s a nationwide epidemic. Last year, a gang of royalists clad in yellow shirts stormed the huge international airport, gumming up regional transport for days and costing the tourism, shipping and export industries dearly. The economic damage to all sectors of Thai business suffers to this day. Nobody is sure what they wanted.

For the past two years other inhabitants of the “Land of Smiles” have donned red uniforms and taken to the streets in an attempt to reinstall the leader that paid them to vote for him years ago. They impede the process of governance by blocking access to Government House, stop up major thoroughfares and most recently poured blood on the doorstep of the current Prime Minister.

Dozens of countries have put out travel advisories due to the ongoing disruptions in Bangkok. Empty airplane seats, empty hotel rooms, empty taxi cabs, empty pockets … high season just didn’t come this year.

This week, yet another gang of travel and tourism representatives are going to Bangkok to protest the protesters. Everyone will talk and no one will listen. I do not know the word for “compromise” in Thai; perhaps because I’ve never heard it.

The root of this mindset lies with the individual. Walk around in Bangkok long enough and you will be rammed, full-stride and headlong, buy a Thai that apparently could not see you. Invariably they will dust themselves off and look at you as if to say, “What the hell are you doing on my planet?”

You are not invisible, you have entered Thai World. I live in Thailand … Thais live in “Thai World”. And, apparently, Thai World ends about three inches from the surface of a Thai person’s skin. The phrase “self-absorbed” doesn’t even begin to describe it.

Perhaps the best example of this compassion vacuum was an experience I had a few years ago. I was standing on my eighth floor balcony in downtown Bangkok, drinking wine with my best friend and his Thai wife.

It was rush hour on busy Soi 16 and we could see the traffic building up to a jam. As the sun went down and the brake lights came on, we noticed a commotion several blocks away. A fire had started beyond some low-rise condos and the flames were soon licking into the air more than 7 stories high.

Within minutes we could hear the howl of fire trucks and police sirens. As the blaze built to three-alarm status, we could see all the rescue vehicles stuck in traffic. No one pulled over to make way for the emergency team. Vehicles crept forward, nose-to-tail, as if the blaring siren and flashing lights did not exist. It took 20 minutes for them to move 100 meters.

When the fire truck and support team arrived at the fire, I used my binoculars to see what was happening. Under the billowing black smoke I could see fire suits being donned, and hoses being reeled out … but none of it in a hurry. One fireman, whose job it was to connect a big hose to the hydrant was standing there smoking a cigarette and talking to another fireman … right over the top of the hydrant … someone had to remind him to hook up the hose to the water source.

I handed my binoculars to my friend’s wife and exclaimed, “Those guys don’t seem to be in a big hurry to put out that fire”.

She looked for a moment, made a facial shrug and said, “Not their house”. It was just that simple.

The next day I went to the site of the fire. I could see that it had been what we in Thailand call a construction camp. I walked by it almost every day. When high rises and other buildings are being erected, huge teams of nomadic construction workers set up what looks like a shanty town to house themselves and their family. This particular construction camp had stood for over two years and serviced three building sites nearby.

A fire in such a ram shackled cluster of half-assed sheds and tents, complete with propane tanks, gasoline and other flammables, must have been devastating. I couldn’t help wondering if anyone died.

Stopping at a papaya salad vendor on my way home I asked the owner what happened. She explained that all three construction projects were finished. The lease the developer held on the land had expired. To evacuate the site of the construction camp more expediently the owner had torched it. They gave no warning. I still don’t know if anyone died.

When you’re a tourist, the butt-kissing reflexive smile is included in the VAT. But, when you live here, you’re just another dog in the dog-eat-dog equation. And, if you aren’t careful you’ll be perceived as the big slow dog with no teeth and a fat wallet. Even with all the smiling and bowing … it’s hardly a kinder/gentler place. Welcome to Asia.

Please don’t misunderstand me. I still choose to live here above any other spot on the planet. But, those considering a long stay in Siam should not expect to be bathed in the light of neighbor-loving Buddhism. You should expect Thais to be Thai.

Most importantly, don’t be fooled by the show. In Bangkok the Skytrain makes a slow curve right over the shrine of the four-faced Buddha in front of the Erawan Hotel. Any day of the week one can witness throngs of faithful burning joss sticks and kneeling before the giant totem. At first glance one could easily be moved by their devotion.

Most of them are asking for good luck in the lottery.

[ Editor’s note: I have corresponded with many fantastic people during my time with Escape Artist but Bart Walters is by far one of the most entertaining and genuine people I have had the pleasure to be in contact with. Bart writes about life in Thailand and permits me to use his work in exchange for a link back to the charity website that raises money for an orphanage in Thailand. Please take a moment to visit the site, donate if you can and help support a good cause. Please go to www.care4kids.info Thank you ]

For more info take a look at Escape From America http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/697998-youre-experience-in-thailand-same-as-this-one/

[CharlieH]

Quite a realistic observation. Its a beautiful place, generally nice people, but like most countries/places it has its downside and problems. If you choose to live somewhere you need to be aware of them and the "nature of the beast".

Thailand is my home, I am not wearing rose colored glasses and I know many of the pitfalls, but none the less I also continue to learn and observe. This is far from the lifestyle and nanny states many have left and it takes some awhile to understand the culture and nature of this country and its people, and it can be a rude awakening and a far cry from the two week holiday and tourist hotspots that some base their opinion and judgement of Thailand upon.

Edited January 20, 2014 by CharlieH

[dude123]

I know I was only there two weeks, but overall, the Thai people seemed quite friendly and easy going. I could imagine if you are the boistierous type, you're not going to do to well there, but I'm pretty laid back and enjoyed my stay. DIdn't like the stray dogs snarling at me though all over the place

[Old Croc]

It's a fairly accurate representation of the Thai people.

I've seen most of the same reactions to situations described. If you live here you have to understand how most of the people are, and live within the parameters they force upon you.

If you build your own insulated space here, it's a much better place to retire than back in the western world.

[thrilled]

I carry pepper spray for those wild,crazy dogs.If they get to close to me they get their eyes hurt.

[Familyonthemove]

Well to generalise about an entire nation is a bit of a stretch. I also think people see what they want to see when faced the complexity of 60 million people. Perhaps the characteristics people see are reflection of their own views and prejudices on the many people they interact with. I do not see the same Thailand in most of the interactions I have with Thai people. Perhaps the author is a bit of grumpy sod and so that's what he sees.

I have seen some selfish people - especially related to politics - but most people I've met in my 6 years of living and 20 years of visiting Thailand have been decent, caring people.

Sent from my C6902 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Suradit69]

I know I was only there two weeks, but overall, the Thai people seemed quite friendly and easy going. I could imagine if you are the boistierous type, you're not going to do to well there, but I'm pretty laid back and enjoyed my stay. DIdn't like the stray dogs snarling at me though all over the place

People who are unhappy with their lives and the choices they've made, like the author of this piece, tend to strike out at those around them. All their problems are the fault of everyone else.

Didn't read the whole thing, but any adult who thinks strangers who smile at him are being anything other than polite whatever they may be thinking, is simply childish. Every culture or nationality has some set of behaviors that are deemed polite and which are employed when meeting customers or strangers in social settings. If he feels betrayed by the reality that not everyone, anywhere in the world, who smiles at him has fallen in love with him, then he ought not to be allowed to cross a street alone. They also tend to be the sort who thinks a woman who is totally out of their league really means it when she says:"You hansum man." Then they're totally stunned when it turns out ... surprise, surprise ... she didn't mean it.

A lot of people who choose to live in Thailand, especially in retirement, are trying to find some imaginary Eden that will mean a much better life for them than the sordid existence they've led so far. Usually they carry with them all the bitterness and unhappiness that they've nurtured for decades. When they realize that their misery has nothing to do with where they are, but is really all about who they are, and it finally sinks in that they can't escape from that reality, they just ramp up the bitterness and try to share it with everyone around them.

If you are a reasonably content person looking for a change and open to new experiences, Thailand can be a wonderful place, but how happy you'll be will still depend mostly on your own nature.

If you feel like you need to escape from a pathetic, unpleasant life by running to a place that will miraculous transform you into a cheery bon vivant loved by one and all without any effort on your part, it's probably better that you stay home and spend the money trying to buy happiness on familiar ground.

Most of the people here who are enjoying themselves would probably enjoy themselves wherever they chose to settle. Likewise, most of the chronic complainers will moan and whine wherever they are. If you choose to come to Thailand, try to keep your distance from the latter group. They are highly contagious.

Edited January 21, 2014 by Suradit69

[Curt1591]

I don't see the author "striking out". It's his perception, based on his observations.

Although there are many different mindsets, amongst the Thai people, many of his observations have also been experienced by most anyone who has resided here for any length of time.

[wxpwzrd]

This is a problem with society in general, but it is very obvious to see in Thailand. The "person" is caring, considerate and respectful of others and their surroundings -- "people" aren't.

[Showbags]

Very accurate and calm piece.

I was expecting a lot worse and I thought he held back, he was being polite and left out a lot.

[alex8912]

Why don't Thais move over for emergency vehicles? Haven't many people here had friends, relatives or spouses in an ambulance before and know its best to move over? If the poster has some truths I guess the Thai mentality is " It's not my wife possibly dying in the ambulance blaring in back of me". But it could be someone they know. I've traveled a lot but witness it here every week from my balcony during traffic and have not seen it in other countries.

[ingvar]

I think the observations by Bart Walters goes for all Asians, its just different from the west.

And regarding Buddhism, don't ever make the mistake to think that people actually understands or cares about the Buddhist core philosophy (just like most Christians don't have a clue about the christian philosophy, even if they read the bible every day, Former president Bush a good example). If Buddha himself could see today what people are doing in his name he would cry. Praying in front of statues of himself is exactly the kind of thing that would disgust him.

[lostmebike]

I know I was only there two weeks, but overall, the Thai people seemed quite friendly and easy going. I could imagine if you are the boistierous type, you're not going to do to well there, but I'm pretty laid back and enjoyed my stay. DIdn't like the stray dogs snarling at me though all over the place

People who are unhappy with their lives and the choices they've made, like the author of this piece, tend to strike out at those around them. All their problems are the fault of everyone else.

Didn't read the whole thing, but any adult who thinks strangers who smile at him are being anything other than polite whatever they may be thinking, is simply childish. Every culture or nationality has some set of behaviors that are deemed polite and which are employed when meeting customers or strangers in social settings. If he feels betrayed by the reality that not everyone, anywhere in the world, who smiles at him has fallen in love with him, then he ought not to be allowed to cross a street alone. They also tend to be the sort who thinks a woman who is totally out of their league really means it when she says:"You hansum man." Then they're totally stunned when it turns out ... surprise, surprise ... she didn't mean it.

A lot of people who choose to live in Thailand, especially in retirement, are trying to find some imaginary Eden that will mean a much better life for them than the sordid existence they've led so far. Usually they carry with them all the bitterness and unhappiness that they've nurtured for decades. When they realize that their misery has nothing to do with where they are, but is really all about who they are, and it finally sinks in that they can't escape from that reality, they just ramp up the bitterness and try to share it with everyone around them.

If you are a reasonably content person looking for a change and open to new experiences, Thailand can be a wonderful place, but how happy you'll be will still depend mostly on your own nature.

If you feel like you need to escape from a pathetic, unpleasant life by running to a place that will miraculous transform you into a cheery bon vivant loved by one and all without any effort on your part, it's probably better that you stay home and spend the money trying to buy happiness on familiar ground.

Most of the people here who are enjoying themselves would probably enjoy themselves wherever they chose to settle. Likewise, most of the chronic complainers will moan and whine wherever they are. If you choose to come to Thailand, try to keep your distance from the latter group. They are highly contagious.

Yes and this place is full of self-appointed experts, in every soi, on every street, they are always around, there to pass comment on everything under the sun.

Again, first laugh then ignore them. They don't need encouraging, they thrive on their own BS and will continue attempting to tell others that they really do have a point here on planet earth and that we should happily share our oxygen with them

[BradinAsia]

Well to generalise about an entire nation is a bit of a stretch. I also think people see what they want to see when faced the complexity of 60 million people. Perhaps the characteristics people see are reflection of their own views and prejudices on the many people they interact with. I do not see the same Thailand in most of the interactions I have with Thai people. Perhaps the author is a bit of grumpy sod and so that's what he sees. I have seen some selfish people - especially related to politics - but most people I've met in my 6 years of living and 20 years of visiting Thailand have been decent, caring people. Sent from my C6902 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Excellent, fair-minded post.

A large percentage of Westerners seem to become confused and perplexed when they come to live here and find themselves faced with a culture different from their own.

Folks don't like to be confused and perplexed -- it makes them feel insecure. But, instead of taking their time to understand the history, language and culture of their new

place of residence, they take the easy-way-out. They look for quick and simplistic explanations. When someone writes a biased article like the one cited here -- Aha! They

jump on those simplistic views as a quick solution to their insecurity. I have witnessed this pattern of intellectually lazy behavior in many of my fellow expats since I first

went to live overseas in Dec 1960.

This pattern of is still prevalent today.

As Western expats, we would do well to analyze our own problematic patterns of intellectual laziness before we attempt to make sweeping generalizations about a culture

most of us know far less about.

[dcduffy]

I sometimes just cannot stand the constant whining of these moral inventory takers who constantly comment negatively on the quality of Thai civilization, morals, food, manners, whatever, just as long as it is negative.
The bottom line is and always will be…..It is none of your business , you are GUESTS in this country, don’t like it then please go home and take your mean spirited, unwanted and often jaded opinions with you. I doubt you will be any happier where you came from.
I happen to like Thailand, I like most Thais, I have been married to one for 25 years, I have Thai children, I speak Thai, I eat Thai food that I don’t really like because my Thai wife cooks it for me because she cares about me. I go to a Buddhist temple and try to get my own PERSONAL life in order, I don’t try and fix SOMEONE else’s’ life, it is not my job.
I would love to just once in awhile read something positive about the experiences of these often seemingly morally dissolute people who can only criticize Thailand.
Sorry but it gets boring listening to the children complain.

[Steiner]

Well to generalise about an entire nation is a bit of a stretch. I also think people see what they want to see when faced the complexity of 60 million people. Perhaps the characteristics people see are reflection of their own views and prejudices on the many people they interact with. I do not see the same Thailand in most of the interactions I have with Thai people. Perhaps the author is a bit of grumpy sod and so that's what he sees. I have seen some selfish people - especially related to politics - but most people I've met in my 6 years of living and 20 years of visiting Thailand have been decent, caring people. Sent from my C6902 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Generalising?

I have lived here for years, drive many miles on the roads each day, in all that time I have never seen a Thai person pull over to let an ambulance past, they simply don't care about anything that does not have an immediate effect on them.

I have however lost count of the times I have seen Thai's block the path of an ambulance answering a call.

That is not generalising, that is pure fact!

Edited January 21, 2014 by Steiner

[Steiner]

As Western expats, we would do well to analyze our own problematic patterns of intellectual laziness before we attempt to make sweeping generalizations about a culture

most of us know far less about.

So not caring enough to move over and let an ambulance pass to help someone who is injured is a cultural thing that you think should be accepted?

Not caring about conservation of life in any country is heinous.

You should stop being a Thai apologist and live by the rules of common human decency.

[Frito]

The author gives accounts of his own personal experiences from which you can draw your own conclusions. These observations, I can tell you, are not anomalous. More than self centered, I believe the Thais are somewhat childlike. There is no foresight in their mentality. The rice farmers have borrowed far more than any of them can ever repay, huge sums are dumped into the education system - who knows how much really makes it to the schools, wit no assessment of the school systems.

Appearances or "face" is of supreme importance, all else must take a back seat. If you understand the rules, it is easier to play the game and function within society. You must take the good with the bad.

To my advantage, I could care less about my "face". I have no problem deferring to others. This alone has brought me countless benefits. Even if the society around me seems to be suffering from a "self centered epidemic", I don't have to fall prey to the same disease.

After all, I'm the one who has to live with myself.

[johninbkk]

Here is the article in full:

Thai World

By Bart Walters

The self-centered pathology of Thai people is more than just individual selfishness, it’s a nationwide epidemic

What motivates the speech and actions of Thai people is a mystery not soon to be solved. Live here a while and you’ll soon learn; the smile is a mask, the genuflecting “wai” their shield and no deal is ever really “done”. When attempting to unravel it all, one should always remember, Thais are only motivated by things they think have a direct impact on them personally.

As the world watched the monster tsunami devour chunks of Southeast Asia, it witnessed the alleged caring and selfless nature of Thai people on CNN every night.

During a news interview with a nearly drowned Aussie, the tourist gushed about the fearless Thai hotel manager that risked his own life to pull him out of the churning abyss. As a long time resident of Phuket, I remember thinking “The guy probably hadn’t paid his bill yet.”

While driving to the market I witnessed an unfortunate dog that had lost his life attempting to cross 3 lanes of morning traffic. All week I passed this site, wincing a little more every day as the dog’s body succumbed to the elements.

“Why doesn’t someone take that dog away?” I asked my wife.

Incredulous, she answered, “Why I’m gonna get that dog? Not my dog”.

I had just assumed that in a Buddhist country with all that compassion and temples and monks and such, someone would take it upon themselves to take care of the poor creature. Ask ten Thai people the same question that I asked my wife and 8 of them will answer the same way; “not my dog”. The other two would say, “How much you pay me?”

While visiting a friend who runs a property development firm here in Pattaya, he closed a huge deal for 63 units in his off-plan condo project. With that deal he had the funding to break ground with confidence immediately. He danced around the office in his bare feet and sent one of the staff out for champagne.

The remaining staff members observed his antics like cows watching a train pass. None of them cared but the sales people; and they were unhappy. That would make 63 units they couldn’t sell and collect commission on. They could care less about the success of the company or financial health of the project. For them it was money out of their pocket.

The self-centered pathology of Thai people is more than just individual selfishness, it’s a nationwide epidemic. Last year, a gang of royalists clad in yellow shirts stormed the huge international airport, gumming up regional transport for days and costing the tourism, shipping and export industries dearly. The economic damage to all sectors of Thai business suffers to this day. Nobody is sure what they wanted.

For the past two years other inhabitants of the “Land of Smiles” have donned red uniforms and taken to the streets in an attempt to reinstall the leader that paid them to vote for him years ago. They impede the process of governance by blocking access to Government House, stop up major thoroughfares and most recently poured blood on the doorstep of the current Prime Minister.

Dozens of countries have put out travel advisories due to the ongoing disruptions in Bangkok. Empty airplane seats, empty hotel rooms, empty taxi cabs, empty pockets … high season just didn’t come this year.

This week, yet another gang of travel and tourism representatives are going to Bangkok to protest the protesters. Everyone will talk and no one will listen. I do not know the word for “compromise” in Thai; perhaps because I’ve never heard it.

The root of this mindset lies with the individual. Walk around in Bangkok long enough and you will be rammed, full-stride and headlong, buy a Thai that apparently could not see you. Invariably they will dust themselves off and look at you as if to say, “What the hell are you doing on my planet?”

You are not invisible, you have entered Thai World. I live in Thailand … Thais live in “Thai World”. And, apparently, Thai World ends about three inches from the surface of a Thai person’s skin. The phrase “self-absorbed” doesn’t even begin to describe it.

Perhaps the best example of this compassion vacuum was an experience I had a few years ago. I was standing on my eighth floor balcony in downtown Bangkok, drinking wine with my best friend and his Thai wife.

It was rush hour on busy Soi 16 and we could see the traffic building up to a jam. As the sun went down and the brake lights came on, we noticed a commotion several blocks away. A fire had started beyond some low-rise condos and the flames were soon licking into the air more than 7 stories high.

Within minutes we could hear the howl of fire trucks and police sirens. As the blaze built to three-alarm status, we could see all the rescue vehicles stuck in traffic. No one pulled over to make way for the emergency team. Vehicles crept forward, nose-to-tail, as if the blaring siren and flashing lights did not exist. It took 20 minutes for them to move 100 meters.

When the fire truck and support team arrived at the fire, I used my binoculars to see what was happening. Under the billowing black smoke I could see fire suits being donned, and hoses being reeled out … but none of it in a hurry. One fireman, whose job it was to connect a big hose to the hydrant was standing there smoking a cigarette and talking to another fireman … right over the top of the hydrant … someone had to remind him to hook up the hose to the water source.

I handed my binoculars to my friend’s wife and exclaimed, “Those guys don’t seem to be in a big hurry to put out that fire”.

She looked for a moment, made a facial shrug and said, “Not their house”. It was just that simple.

The next day I went to the site of the fire. I could see that it had been what we in Thailand call a construction camp. I walked by it almost every day. When high rises and other buildings are being erected, huge teams of nomadic construction workers set up what looks like a shanty town to house themselves and their family. This particular construction camp had stood for over two years and serviced three building sites nearby.

A fire in such a ram shackled cluster of half-assed sheds and tents, complete with propane tanks, gasoline and other flammables, must have been devastating. I couldn’t help wondering if anyone died.

Stopping at a papaya salad vendor on my way home I asked the owner what happened. She explained that all three construction projects were finished. The lease the developer held on the land had expired. To evacuate the site of the construction camp more expediently the owner had torched it. They gave no warning. I still don’t know if anyone died.

When you’re a tourist, the butt-kissing reflexive smile is included in the VAT. But, when you live here, you’re just another dog in the dog-eat-dog equation. And, if you aren’t careful you’ll be perceived as the big slow dog with no teeth and a fat wallet. Even with all the smiling and bowing … it’s hardly a kinder/gentler place. Welcome to Asia.

Please don’t misunderstand me. I still choose to live here above any other spot on the planet. But, those considering a long stay in Siam should not expect to be bathed in the light of neighbor-loving Buddhism. You should expect Thais to be Thai.

Most importantly, don’t be fooled by the show. In Bangkok the Skytrain makes a slow curve right over the shrine of the four-faced Buddha in front of the Erawan Hotel. Any day of the week one can witness throngs of faithful burning joss sticks and kneeling before the giant totem. At first glance one could easily be moved by their devotion.

Most of them are asking for good luck in the lottery.

[ Editor’s note: I have corresponded with many fantastic people during my time with Escape Artist but Bart Walters is by far one of the most entertaining and genuine people I have had the pleasure to be in contact with. Bart writes about life in Thailand and permits me to use his work in exchange for a link back to the charity website that raises money for an orphanage in Thailand. Please take a moment to visit the site, donate if you can and help support a good cause. Please go to www.care4kids.info Thank you ]

For more info take a look at Escape From America http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/697998-youre-experience-in-thailand-same-as-this-one/

*************************

I have lived in Thailand for 18 years. 10 years in Bkk working and 8 years in Pattaya/Jomtien trying to make my way in this world. I can 10000000000% understand the Editor's conclusions and have experienced his delights as well. He is NOT trying to insult or paint a poor picture of Thai's, he is just telling it as it is. (by the way, well written).

Often I speak to foreigners who have recently arrived and believe they have just set foot into utopia. I never, never comment as to their perception of Thai's, just listen with a smile. Like the poster of this article they always make the assumption you hate every Thai and Thailand if you make comments as above..

Love to read some more entertaining experiences.

[rjenman]

The funny thing is, the savage peopl of Thailand respect Buddhism, so as long as time have infinite patience and are Never greedy or impose yourself other fight, you win. They have a metaphorical bomb waiting for anyone who dares act in an unbuddhist way, and that includes pointing the finger, full of anger. It takes insane delete discipline to keep good western values without HTML being linked to becoming angry and racist, but it's possible. Thailand is full of totally evil people, but the difference is in how they are dealt with by the good people. You need tolerance and a tight friend and family unit, you rely on others to make you happy here you get shat on. It's an oyster for those with balls and cultural understanding, and a rat trap or fish hook for those wishing to be evil. I think that extends to Thais. Thailand is not yet civilized, and they are a very interesting country with impossible contrasts and huge variety of situations. It's what you make it, and treat it like a western country and it will show that it is worth what you pay and the tiny amount of actual respect Thais get for attempting to abuse power, Here and overseas. They continue to break the laws of Buddhism and in a strange twist, respect the outcome of their failure. It makes me sad that I often profit off this failure.

[NBD]

Anyone else see a little irony in an article about selfishness that describes him watching a burning building through a set of binoculars with a glass of wine in his hand?

I know there's not much he could practically do about it, but still...

[Familyonthemove]

Well to generalise about an entire nation is a bit of a stretch. I also think people see what they want to see when faced the complexity of 60 million people. Perhaps the characteristics people see are reflection of their own views and prejudices on the many people they interact with. I do not see the same Thailand in most of the interactions I have with Thai people. Perhaps the author is a bit of grumpy sod and so that's what he sees. I have seen some selfish people - especially related to politics - but most people I've met in my 6 years of living and 20 years of visiting Thailand have been decent, caring people. Sent from my C6902 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Generalising?

I have lived here for years, drive many miles on the roads each day, in all that time I have never seen a Thai person pull over to let an ambulance past, they simply don't care about anything that does not have an immediate effect on them.

I have however lost count of the times I have seen Thai's block the path of an ambulance answering a call.

That is not generalising, that is pure fact!

You've made this point twice in this thread - and I believe that it's an example of trying to apply your experiences from home to a different situation.

In many countries the ambulance service is provided by the state and the ambulances are staffed by skilled paramedics who have either been dispatched by a central controller to an emergency or who are on their back to the hospital with the injured/sick person.

This is not the case in Thailand.

The 'ambulances' here are nothing more than private taxis with red flashing lights and a siren. They work on commission and they all monitor the news, police and fire service radio waiting to here of an incident - then they all rush to the scene as they get a commission from the hospital if they bring in the injured person.

In 99% of cases the siren and lights is part of the race to get to the scene first to claim their 'prize'. There's no injured person in the back.

Thai's know this - so why move out of the way?

I was near the scene of a major fire a while ago. I saw Thai's move out of the way of the fire service vehicles (who are a public service) but they did not move for the 'Blood Wagons". When I got to the scene on foot I counted 27 Blood Wagons blocking the road and they were preventing the fire service from reaching the scene as they had created their own traffic jam.

In the end there was, thankfully, only one casualty. One person died of smoke inhalation at the scene. No other injuries. 27 'ambulances'.

Edited January 21, 2014 by Familyonthemove

[ChoakMyDee]

Very good article and very accurate. I remember when I was new and completely enamoured with everything Thai and the people were so nice. Then reality began to settle in and I began to realize that all my Thai "friends" were only there when they were getting something from me...as soon as I served no purpose in their life they were gone, every single one of them! I still like it here but the rose coloured glasses have shattered. I am no longer interested in having any Thai friends. I have a good Thai wife and enjoy her extended family; that's all I need.

The people saying the article is too negative are just afraid of reality, stubbornly refusing to removed the rose coloured glasses. Just keep fooling yourselves!

[jinners]

Well you can only draw from personal experience and it sounds to me like this guy is surrounded by selfish numpty's with a severe cynical streak. I seriously think Thai Visa should be renamed Thai whinger. I read many things which are pertinent to me or seem interesting. The level of sarcasm, dissatisfaction and cynicism I encounter in the replies is breath taking. I wonder why on earth this guy stays here because if I had the same jaundiced view of Thailand, I'd get the <deleted> out.

This is NOT paradise or utopia and it has its faults, as does everywhere of course. As do the people. If there is a ruthless streak, it's no different to other "poorer, less developed" places I have been/lived before. There is no social security safety net, and there has to be a dog eat dog nature to a degree otherwise you'll get trampled under foot. I still accept the smiles and wai I receive as genuine, I pray I never become so filled with despair doubt and cynicism living here, that I end up taking the time to write an article that he did. I'd leave first.

So yes, Thailand has its faults, not everyone is perfect, but it's a hell of a lot nicer place to be than most other places I have been or lived. That's why, for now at least, I choose to live here.

[jinners]

Very good article and very accurate. I remember when I was new and completely enamoured with everything Thai and the people were so nice. Then reality began to settle in and I began to realize that all my Thai "friends" were only there when they were getting something from me...as soon as I served no purpose in their life they were gone, every single one of them! I still like it here but the rose coloured glasses have shattered. I am no longer interested in having any Thai friends. I have a good Thai wife and enjoy her extended family; that's all I need.

The people saying the article is too negative are just afraid of reality, stubbornly refusing to removed the rose coloured glasses. Just keep fooling yourselves!

prime example of my post, where else have you lived, apart from the UK?

[kjun12]

The writer is very correct even though the piece is several years old. That does not change what he has said and It is correct today as it was when he wrote it. Many if not most Thais are hypocrites, insincere and above all inconsiderate of anyone but themselves.

Edited January 21, 2014 by kjun12

[ChoakMyDee]

Very good article and very accurate. I remember when I was new and completely enamoured with everything Thai and the people were so nice. Then reality began to settle in and I began to realize that all my Thai "friends" were only there when they were getting something from me...as soon as I served no purpose in their life they were gone, every single one of them! I still like it here but the rose coloured glasses have shattered. I am no longer interested in having any Thai friends. I have a good Thai wife and enjoy her extended family; that's all I need.

The people saying the article is too negative are just afraid of reality, stubbornly refusing to removed the rose coloured glasses. Just keep fooling yourselves!

prime example of my post, where else have you lived, apart from the UK?

I don't understand how you can take issue with my post. I am simply reporting my experience in Thailand. You don't have to like it but it's true.

[Showbags]

Very good article and very accurate. I remember when I was new and completely enamoured with everything Thai and the people were so nice. Then reality began to settle in and I began to realize that all my Thai "friends" were only there when they were getting something from me...as soon as I served no purpose in their life they were gone, every single one of them! I still like it here but the rose coloured glasses have shattered. I am no longer interested in having any Thai friends. I have a good Thai wife and enjoy her extended family; that's all I need.

The people saying the article is too negative are just afraid of reality, stubbornly refusing to removed the rose coloured glasses. Just keep fooling yourselves!

prime example of my post, where else have you lived, apart from the UK?

I don't understand how you can take issue with my post. I am simply reporting my experience in Thailand. You don't have to like it but it's true.

Its not just your experience...one has to wonder about the truths in these rumors when you hear it all so often.

I hear it often from several expats with anything from 10 to 30 years here, experience with business of their own and working for others, speak thai fluently, some read and write fluently and I mean fluent, not just good every day conversational thai.

They all have the same complaints and this cannot be coincidence.

[dontoearth]

Well I am American living in Chicago and I have never seen disdainful uncaring civil servants running our police department or fire engines. It isn't like we have 100's of deaths a year and weekend killing sprees! We don't have self-centered righteous appointed nuts demanding they have guns all over the country. Oh wait we do! One of the big problems with Ex-Pat's is the old saying, "Absence makes the heart grow fonder!" Thank God all of our big cities have excellent schools and lots of assessment to make sure our young people get decent educations. Our money isn't being thrown away. And of course all of our citizens are totally financially responsible. We didn't have millions of people taking loans on houses they couldn't afford and wouldn't be able to pay for without winning the lotto. And our businesses engage in the highest moral standards. They wouldn't cheat their workers out of wages and make them collect food stamps to eat. Well except for McDonald's and Walmart. Well that is the way it is in Chicago. I am sure! So before you go solving the problems of the world or the problems of Thailand have quite a look at your own backyard. No only does absence make the heart grow fonder of an idealized country with no problems at all, your memory of the real country fades pretty fast. Doesn't it? Nope. Nothing to see here! Move on! It makes your memory and analysis of your own country very weak. I hope this rant gives u something to chew on. I was in the same boat years ago as I was living in Bangkok for a year. Thank goodness some ex-Pat's pointed out the short comings of my country and told me to shut UP. I am now telling you.....