Thai Airways – a parallel with Malaysia Airlines

[ginjag]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

Perhaps they should take you on as a consultant, you seem to know the answer to it's problems and how easy they are to solve.

Mango Bob hit the nail on the head, there are many problems with Thai air the main one being the senior management.

I used to fly Thai air regularly but now i cannot justify the price when other airlines are cheaper flying the same routes. It has become abundantly clear every time Thai airlines are in trouble the first thing they do is up the price, loose more customers up the price again and there you have it recipe for disaster.

I wont go into the free flight for family, friends and officials as I’m sure it’s be beaten to death on other threads

Isn't that the truth - after the coup, when Thailand's tourist arrivals plummeted and the planes were 80% empty, they raised their prices to make up for it. I agree too, putting an airforce general in charge is beyond hopeless. Just a new nose in the trough.

Bangkok Airways on the other hand, I really like. Great service, efficient and priced competitively. Put them in charge ... They've just got Skytrax's “best regional airline in the world" and in Asia awards. http://www.bangkokpost.com/business/aviation/420898/bangkok-airways-flies-high

Completely biased statement that , quote "after the coup". Thailands tourist were plummeting well before this, and as was Thai airways.

You are completely wrong in saying they only had 20% capacity--they were bad and over priced yes, and now I rarely travel with them because of so many things wrong there.

Thai prices were raised years ago hence the reason they have been going down hill for years

Your post is just full of anti army--and the new CEO from the airforce. I agree there should be a westerner with experience brought in.

Bangkok Airways is good but not competitive, where are it's rivals to Samui ?? it would have some difficulties if it didn't have the monopoly on some routes. I priced to Samui about 5,000 baht last year from BKK. competitive ???

[surinderek]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

the best thing that could happen

[harryfrompattaya]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

Thank you I am ready and able to do the Job if they want me. I am glad that you were thinking of me

[ginjag]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

Thank you I am ready and able to do the Job if they want me. I am glad that you were thinking of me

Maybe a jet ski operator, they never seem to lose money, or a taxi mafia boss, or a top TAT official as they are always on the -UP.

Pricing for what you get is the biggest downfall for ages. Never mind those few who swear by them or those who get freebies, or those who get their seat via a company pre paid, or any other hangers on.

I posted on another thread.

Last month booked with Lufthansa-BKK-LHR. 31,000 baht return. Thai on promotion 46,000 baht and that was restricted to 2 weeks. get the drift.

[Thai at Heart]

At the end of the day, much like many other organisations in Thailand, what started off as a small "mai bpen arai", has now become a serious malaise. It seems that Thai companies only flourish when they face virtual monopoly position. They really don't do well when faced with any type of competition.

They need to unravel the entire business plan. It is a govt entity. The employees are unionised. They are given quite considerable perks in place of massive salaries. They are guaranteed a long term stay in job. The senior positions are plagued with nepotism. The board is filled with air force wings.

So, it needs a complete and utter overhaul and to be honest, Piyasvasti was getting there, but he faced enormous competition. Maybe they should just change the law completely, and allow foreign companies to own airlines in Thailand. The MOF can sell 2% to a foreign entity and then the foreign entity can buy up all the privately held shares. Turn it into a 49:51 venture. Then watch the sparks fly.

[whiteman]

The only reason I fly Thai Air is because it has a direct flight Bangkok to Auckland New Zealand and I just have to just suck the bullet re there over priced flight

[tso310]

As far as the LHR routes are concerned. They took to long to refurbish their B747s with an IFE system. Failed to deal with the competition from Emirates and now Etihad and Qatar. Just look at how many Thais use EVA on the LHR-BKK route. Always has been cheaper than Thai but the price gap has widened significantly over the last few years.

[ratcatcher]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

the best thing that could happen

How about this old guy? No university degree, poor prospects. Might have done something with

THAIED UP IN KNOTS AIRLINES.

Branson was educated at Scaitcliffe School until the age of thirteen. He then attended Stowe School until the age of sixteen. Branson has dyslexia and had poor academic performance as a student, but later discovered his ability to connect with others. On one of Branson's last days at school, his headmaster, Robert Drayson, told him he would either end up in prison or become a millionaire.

Wikipedia

edit to add

Only problem is Branson doesn't like Ties.

Edited July 22, 2014 by ratcatcher

[monkeycountry]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

A Thai may eventually turn out to be the best candidate for the job, but if being Thai is a criteria, you are automatically disqualifying 99% of the potential candidates, which all things being equal means there is 99% chance you will not get the best possible candidate for the job.

Pretty much all multinational companies today, especially the successfull ones, consider CEO candidates irrespective of nationality. Thai companies will eventually be forced to do the same, or lose to the competition.

[Suradit69]

...that they would reign into the mess...

Wow. That phrase suggests the journalism industry may not be in a position to throw stones at the airlines.

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

Yes, there's a wealth of superb farang management styles to choose from. Gee if only Thailand hired a "qualified" farang everything would be wonderful.

EUROPE'S sovereign debt crisis is having an increasingly negative impact on its airline industry. In March the International Air Transport Association (IATA), the industry's lobby group, forecast a $600m loss for European airlines in 2012. Now, with the continent's prospects for economic growth looking ever shakier, IATA expects the industry to lose $1.1 billion. It also cites the "rising tax regimes, inefficiencies in air traffic management, and the high cost of complying with poorly thought-out regulations" as reasons for the continent's woes.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2012/06/airline-profitability

In the decade from 2002 to 2011, the 3 largest legacy airlines – American [Nasdaq:AAL], United [NYSE:UAL] and Delta [NYSE:DAL] – each filed for bankruptcy. Not only that, but each has or had merged with another large carrier – US Airways, Continental and Northwest respectively – that had also sought legal protection from creditors. The official reasons given ranged from the dubious (increased fuel prices, which would seem to affect every player in the industry equally) to the more candid (competition from low-fare rivals.)

If you bought into the airline index of superbly run farang companies around 1995, you'd really be doing well ... well lmost back to even. If you got in after 1995, not so much. Maybe US airlines need to hire a Thai. There should be a lot of former farang airline execs looking for work. Maybe teaching English in Isaan.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Suradit69

[Greenhill]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

Simply considering that idea would be a public acknowledgment of Thailands failure - never gonna happen.

A major loss of face impossible with the National airline!!!

[Eric Loh]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

Hiring external is not the panacea. Just need local qualified and appointment base on meritocracy. Good example is Singapore Airlines been helmed by locals. Then there are other factors like operational efficiency, branding, young fleet and unions that don't play politics.

[shaurene]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

Perhaps they should take you on as a consultant, you seem to know the answer to it's problems and how easy they are to solve.

Mango Bob is correct I have been saying it for years. Most of the Middle East airlines have outside CEO's and they are racing away.

[Paulzed]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

First thing I thought myself, and not the first time either.

How bizarre that one of the most popular tourism countries in the world's national airline can not make a profit.

That's a bit like a guy with a full water truck of nice chilled Evian in the middle of the Sahara dessert can't make money from a captive audience of 1000 multi-billionaires dying of thirst.

Corruption comes to mind.

Just a personal observation

[peecee]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

Perhaps they should take you on as a consultant, you seem to know the answer to it's problems and how easy they are to solve.

I missed the link to Zeegators CV, who did he do consultancy work for?

[Mango Bob]

People here need to put on their glasses and read what I wrote. I never said a Farang. I said someone outside of Thailand. So before you open your mouth and insert your foot learn to read.

[Briggsy]

No need to worry, since the beneficiaries of Thai's long-standing mismanagement hail from the privileged classes, air force, politicians, families of THAI employees, senior civil servants then although there may be minor changes, normal service will be continued and the taxpayer will continue to subsidise their free business class travel, generous salary package for people who do nothing, etc.

It has also been tried to bring in foreign management to state enterprise - business corrupt nexi to try to defeat the entrenched workings of patronage networks. Think TPI or Michael Wansley. It generally doesn't work out well.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Briggsy

[laobali]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

If you know anything about Thailand you'd know that could never work - unless he happened to be Thai – as well as qualified!

[tso310]

Thai Airways International reports (16-Jul-2014) the following traffic highlights in Jun-2014:

• Passenger numbers: 1.1 million, -31.3% year-on-year;
• Passenger traffic (RPKs): -22.9%;
• Passenger load factor: 59.2%, -10 ppts;
• • Domestic: 60.5%, -5.0 ppts;
  • Regional: 60.2%, -13.0 ppts;
  • Australia: 61.5%, -8.2 ppts;
  • Europe: 56.3%, -7.7 ppts;
  • North Pacific: 74.9%, -6.1 ppts;
  • Africa: 48.4%, -10.8 ppts;
• Cargo volume: 50,548 tons, -1.2%;
• Cargo load factor: 54.3%, +4.1 ppts.

[Benmart]

I used to fly Thai Airways even if it was $300-400 MORE BECAUSE THEY HAD THE ONLY DIRECT ROUTE TO BANGKOK OUT OF LA, 7 DAYS A WEEK.

My understanding of CAPS is that it denotes shouting. I understand the point without the caps.

[anselpixel]

I flew Thai once.

I'm not sure why anyone, even all those "connected" people who use it for free, would elect to use them.

Expensive and shabby.

[arisaje]

I like Thai once I'm on the aircraft but dealing with them before the flight is an archaic nightmare. Communications skills are zero, waiting times in the office and on the phones are interminable, their website won't load half the time, you get shuffled for person to person when you have a question and most are clueless - plus they are no longer financially competitive. Their prices can be insanely high at times. I do a lot of international long haul travel, maybe 30-40 flights a year, and I avoid them where possible. Whilst I mostly travel economy, their business class is shocking too - a selection of bad wines and dreadful food.

I found out too, recently, that they are no longer linked to my credit card for points - I was told by the card people they were a nightmare to deal with.

You sum it all up very well. Quite how they are ever going to resolve these problems when they insist on 'Thainess' running the company instead of real business brains i really do not know.

Look who runs Cathay Pacific Airlines. Not Chinese.

Swire's are the parent company of CPA, a British Company......although being a registered HK business the Chinese had the union jack removed from the plane's tails back in the mid-1990's

[baboon]

I flew Thai once.

I'm not sure why anyone, even all those "connected" people who use it for free, would elect to use them.

Expensive and shabby.

Because for the connected it is free and shabby, with plenty of complimentary a$$ kissing thrown in for good measure?

Edited July 22, 2014 by baboon

[paz]

They just need a business model that allows them to compete. International fares are hugely non-competitive. Do you not suspect that they could reduce the workforce by a very significant%

Not always. I've seen very competitive fares from Europe in July and August. Thai files direct while most others have a stop, making at least 5 hours difference total journey time.

[thaibry]

I have flown with Thai or Thai Smile on most of their domestic routes and have found them to be competivly priced, comfortable and efficient.

posted from my Samsung using Tapatalk 2.

[kerrysum]

They just need a business model that allows them to compete. International fares are hugely non-competitive. Do you not suspect that they could reduce the workforce by a very significant%

I agree, Thai Airways is a disgrace, too much cronyism going on. Especially in the International flight zone. Thai rak Thai mentality.... They need some competition, and maybe some outside ingenuity? Just a thought.

kilosierra

[paymaster]

The problem is they are always looking for a Thai to fill the position. They need to look outside of Thailand for someone who is qualified.

Thank you I am ready and able to do the Job if they want me. I am glad that you were thinking of me

Harry I know its great there in Pattaya but it is still in Thailand last time I looked. The brief said "look outside of Thailand".

[paymaster]

Airlines around the world are struggling in a highly competitive industry, major cultural changes are needed to save the airlines of some countries. Qantas are going through this now and needed to as they were /are a sht product loosing money and hoping / expecting the Australian government to bail them out. Thankfully that didn't happen, I think the public is tired of private profits and public losses, from poorly managed corporations.

Thai will need to bite the bullet with austerity measures like Qantas and if an effective CEO cannot be found locally then they have to look elsewhere.

This is the post of the day. Please bite the bullit like QANTAS. The best way to do that is with little Irish leprechaun. Please come and get the one running QANTAS. No none here will miss him.

[spidermike007]

I think they need an experienced European airline executive to run this company. While I'm an American, the on board service has been degraded so much in America that most of our airline leaders are just cost cutters without thought to passenger comfort. I suspect there is at least one German out there with the experience to turn this airline around while improving their service too.

Yes, American Airlines have become some of the worst around, in terms of service. But, I flew Delta recently, Los Angeles, to Atlanta, and was surprised at how much effort they were making. It is as if they were told they were terrible, and asked to improve. The attendants really did a great job, with a superb attitude. Very friendly, and outgoing. It surprised the hell out of me. Perhaps a similar strategy for Thai? Just try harder, you are doing a poor job, your attitudes need improving, the food needs to be better, the attendants need to be friendlier, etc, etc. They can do better, the pricing could be more in line with the rest of the planet, the domestic fares could be lowered, and the entire service apparatus could be improved. Just try harder. Care about what you are doing. Show some pride. Real pride. Not false pride.

[Briggsy]

Airlines around the world are struggling in a highly competitive industry, major cultural changes are needed to save the airlines of some countries. Qantas are going through this now and needed to as they were /are a sht product loosing money and hoping / expecting the Australian government to bail them out. Thankfully that didn't happen, I think the public is tired of private profits and public losses, from poorly managed corporations.

Thai will need to bite the bullet with austerity measures like Qantas and if an effective CEO cannot be found locally then they have to look elsewhere.

This is the post of the day. Please bite the bullit like QANTAS. The best way to do that is with little Irish leprechaun. Please come and get the one running QANTAS. No none here will miss him.

THAI will not "bite the bullet". The taxpayer will continue to subsidise THAI and its employees. The reason? Too much in the way of heavily entrenched patronage networks with strong lobbying and arm-twisting capability to the heart of government, military or not. The same applies to all other state enterprises, all rife with nepotism and cronyism. The difference is that THAI has to compete in some of its markets with foreign competition so instead of loading the "margin of inefficiency" into the price, like, say, TOT, it comes from state bail-outs and soft loans, etc.

Either way, the gravy train has not even started to slow yet.