How I lost $250,000 in Phuket.

[kungpao]

No one needs a financial advisor. As warren buffet said put your money in a balance of low cost index funds like vanguard. Set and forget.

[Kasset Tak]

You can lose money everywhere and in any way!

I took most of my life savings to start my own company. I had 2 good years whit a 200,000 Euro profit the second year. Then the financial crisis came and basically I had to use all the earnings and the rest of my savings to try to save my company. One customer went bankrupt, 3 months work and about 150,000 in materials lost in one hit. My work/billing for one BIG customer went from 150,000 the first year and 200,000 the second year to 2,000 the third year. I had a 5 year service contract(50,000 a year with 24/7 assistance) with one company and I had basically spent the Christmas and new year working 16 hours a day renovating/rebuilding two machines for them under that contract when they decided that they would end the contract early... with overhead expenses and taxes it was just a disaster.

In the end I had worked like hell for 3 years to see my savings and company gone... So now I'm teaching in Thailand for 30,000 Baht a month but I teach as many hours a week as I was working a day before with my company!

Edited January 1, 2015 by Kasset Tak

[AngelsLariat]

Rule Number 1: Never ever take 'advice' from slimy b4st4rds in suits.

Nonsense. I've been living here for over a decade spending over a million baht per year and my net worth is the same as when I came - all thanks to my Financial Adviser (who wears very nice suits).

It's up to you to check out your advisor.

I agree with your core point but "been living here for over a decade spending over a million baht per year and my net worth is the same as when I came" is meaningless without knowing your net worth. Could be a very good rate of return or could be a poor return.

[spidermike007]

You can get all of your money back. Track this guy to the ends of the world. Harass him. Intimidate him and his family. Do whatever it takes to recover your money. In many cases, if enough pressure is applied, he will just use his Ponzi scheme to steal from someone else, to get you paid back. But, it requires a tremendous amount of persistence. And do not even consider using the legal system. That will not work. Use your own system!

[fishingforsquid]

Really sorry to hear yours and all the related stories....heartbreaking. I just though I'd throw in my twopence worth. What I am about to say may not mean much to anyone but i say it with all sincerity and in a spirit of support. I have lost everything through drinking, including my family. When I eventually stopped and started to build my life up.... i hit "rock bottom" all over again through gambling (quite common to substitute one addiction for another) which in turn started me drinking again. One would not be considered to far off the mark if they had viewed my life as that of a "loser". I was 53 years of age before I was free of both addictions (plus smoking). I am now going on 66 and have had a life beyond my wildest dreams for the last 13 years living in Thailand and totally free from addiction. ............It is because of the pain and suffering in my past that I have such a beautiful life today,.....Now I see the extraordinary in the most ordinary of things, in nature especially, that I never noticed before. Believe me too when I say...it gets better every day. Things many people might take for granted I count my blessings for...like the ability to get a night's sleep, not to be hungry, to be free from fear....I could go on and on.

Now you will think this is really crazy....I would not change one iota of my past if I had the ability to do so.....I had to take every step I took to get to where I am today.

"Acceptance" is the key word that will get you through the most difficult circumstances and bring you through to the other side.

You're not selling that Ibogaine stuff on Koh Phangan are you?

[jcisco]

But you know where to go get it right?

[dinga]

At this moment nobody has lost anything with the Argentum Fund.

As an interested party, what is the position with Argentum???

[fishingforsquid]

But you know where to go get it right?

Ah, Koh Phangan ?

Is Vic there?

[Straight8]

Rule Number 1: Never ever take 'advice' from slimy b4st4rds in suits.

Rule Number 2: Never forget rule No 1

[Straight8]

Ahh, another Seeking Alpha article that is predicting exactly what will happen to the markets in the future.

How about this one that came out just before Blackberry went on to lose almost 60% of its value over the next 5 months.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/1505242-blackberry-a-successful-turnaround

Take every article you see in the media with a grain of salt.

Of course a correction may be coming, but what won't happen like you're predicting is a total meltdown of world's financial system for whatever reason, including excess debt.

A portfolio that is properly allocated to an investors acceptable level of risk will be just fine during any market correction, recession, or depression.

Another good book for you to read is 'One Up on Wall Street' by Peter Lynch. He puts the doomsday scenarios and what the media reports on a daily basis into perspective.

'A Random Walk Down Wall Street' like I mentioned earlier will also put things into perspective for you.

ha ha ! You keep going on about that book but you should read Seth Klarman's book “ Margin Of Safety “ which he wrote decades ago and currently sells on Amazon for $3,600 per copy.

Seth Klarman is a billionaire and CEO & President of the Baupost Group. How come he and many other professional investors like Stanley Druckenmiller refunded the money to their clients, ages ago because of the impending risks. The market now mainly comprises amateurs. Like I said the stock market is now just a Ponzi and all the professional players are out.

Seth Klarmans infamous quote

“ If the economy is so fragile that the government cannot allow failure, then we are indeed close to collapse “

Seriously, $3,600 a copy. No wonder the guy is rich.!!!

I reckon it could be had for the bargain price of $0.00 if you know where to look.

[BKKdreaming]

Seriously, $3,600 a copy. No wonder the guy is rich.!!!

I reckon it could be had for the bargain price of $0.00 if you know where to look.

When you find that place please let me know

it would be nice to see what BS he is slinging ,

since he has fools paying $3600 he already has a hook in them and just needs to reel them in !

[Straight8]

kicka$$

[AngelsLariat]

Seriously, $3,600 a copy. No wonder the guy is rich.!!!

I reckon it could be had for the bargain price of $0.00 if you know where to look.

When you find that place please let me know

it would be nice to see what BS he is slinging ,

since he has fools paying $3600 he already has a hook in them and just needs to reel them in !

Copies of the book scanned to PDF format can be found by google searching. But the author is not getting $3600 per copy for the th, the book is out of print and prices like that are what second hand copies are supposedly fetching.

[TheWizardofRnR]

After 30 years of Thailand the way to make a Million $ in Phuket is to come with 2 Million $ !

Edited January 2, 2015 by TheWizardofRnR

[CapFarmer]

Sounds like a nice lad dddave. What happened to virtues like integrity, honesty and honour?

Capitalism, the glorification of "quick profits", and the "Wolf of Wall Street" did.

A crying shame.

I'm a maths teacher (ironic given this financial folly) and I like to show 16yo+ students a youtube video called "The American Dream". It's an entertaining 30minute cartoon about banking.

One part shows, rather tellingly, how cheating bankers were hung in ancient times. Now they're simply rich. They've gotten too powerful again IMO.

In USA, bankers are considered "too big to fail". I believe they are too big to fail because of the amount of money they generate for campaign funds. Personally, I think that the banking industry in the industrialized world, USA in particular, is a scam. The Federal reserve gives money to big banks which loan it back to the government at interest and the government charges the interest to the tax system. What a scam. I personally would love to see a large percent of bankers and politicians hang. I'd say you could pick a percent of them randomly and have a higher rate of criminal to innocent conviction than the US legal system produces.

[CMCMANGOMAN]

True story and this definately happened to me in Thailand. Myself and 5 other farang investors were robbed of our collective investment. This amount was around 15 million baht. Our farang investment banker was murdered by his Thai gay lover. His death sentence came delivered via cockroach poison deposited in a can of ice cold Coca Cola. The Thai police ruled it a suicide immediately of course. As a group, we hired lawyers and a private investigator. They found evidence of murder, followed the missing money. The farang bankers Thai gaylover was now in complete control of all monies, funds, assets and computer records. The Thai police were informed... alas, nothing could be done. The gay lover was related, by blood, to the highest of high connections. Sit down and shut up. Case closed. Go away farangs. Forever.

Edited to say, that up to a year prior to the bankers murder, I was receiving regular deposits in my Thai bank account of 170,000 baht per month based on my initial investment. All told, after roi, I lost approximately 400,000 baht cash on the investment. I'll survive. Others weren't as lucky.

How long were you able to ride the dragon before it threw you off? 170,000 for 400,000 is insane! That's like an ROI 40%+

3 million baht total over 2+ years invested with the banker. I personally had 3 different diversified portfolios managed by him. Two were short term, 1 year. Those paid well and I made great money. The 3rd and last deal was less money from me because I was late to sign on and the investment group slots were already filled by the other gentlemen investors. Lucky me.

In the end, I lost around 400,000 baht on that last deal. There were no warning signs for any of us. It was murder for money plain and simple. The gay Thai lover was a silent partner and most of us did not know of his involvement. Apparently, the banker had trusted him with the keys to the kingdom. A beautiful luxurious penthouse, brand new 730i BMW, numerous other assets all held by the bankers thai company. The gay Thai lover was an officer of the Thai registered company and CFO accountant. Heir apparent he was.

The story is ridiculous and unbelievable, especially to me and I lived through it! Bottom line is, there are no safe investments in Thailand. People will kill for money here just like every where else in the world. The difference here is the Thai criminals have a much better chance of getting away with it. Be it financial malfeasance or murder; it all comes down to how much money you have and how connected you are.

THIS IS THAILAND !!!

[rocketron57]

At this moment nobody has lost anything with the Argentum Fund.

As an interested party, what is the position with Argentum???

The position with Argentum is that the company is in provisional liquidation. There are a couple of people looking into ways of recapitalising the company but unless they come up with a plan very quickly that the liquidator will sign off on the company will be wound up.

There is no word yet on the whereabouts or what action is being taken to locate the 3 "directors" that did a runner with £13,000,000 of investors money.

[expatdreamer]

AWOL G

Count me as another one who has appreciated your honesty in detailing your story, and one who will most certainly learn from it as a future expat / frequent visitor to LOS.

It shows you that you really cant trust anyone with your hard earned - my life savings invested and being added to are presently in excess of what you have lost so it is a lesson I will take to heart.

I don't even trust the so called financial advisors here in Oz and most certainly now wont trust anyone in the LOS.

Thanks again, my sincere sympathy for your situation. As others have said, you are not old, and you also look to have some qualifications and experience to at least allow you to earn a living wage.

Edited January 2, 2015 by expatdreamer

[Tomtomtom69]

This is kinda like the Thailand-based, westerners as actors version of the old Nigerian scam. More sophisticated of course, but with just as many cracks for most reasonable people to dismiss it as a realistic way of making money. But once you're hooked, the outcomes are much the same - they will take your money and they don't give a shxx about what you have lost. All they care about is scamming you and getting a hold of your money.

As the old adage says: "if it's too good to be true, it usually is".

I feel for you OP, and anyone else who has lost money to scams like this, but really, as boring as it may sound, if you don't know what to do with $250,000 or Euros or whatever, just put it into the bank, into a high-interest account. You might only get 2.5% or so, but that's a realistic return.

[dinga]

At this moment nobody has lost anything with the Argentum Fund.

As an interested party, what is the position with Argentum???

The position with Argentum is that the company is in provisional liquidation. There are a couple of people looking into ways of recapitalising the company but unless they come up with a plan very quickly that the liquidator will sign off on the company will be wound up.

There is no word yet on the whereabouts or what action is being taken to locate the 3 "directors" that did a runner with £13,000,000 of investors money.

Not so - Grant Thornton Cayman/HK/Australia are the Joint Provisional Liquidators of the following companies:

- Centaur Litigation Limited;

- Centaur Litigation SPC; and

- Centaur Litigation Unit Series 1 Limited.

Haven't heard anything in relation to the status Argentum, except that Buttonwood has to resolve the Centaur issues before addressing Argentum. Delighted if anyone has anything of substance re. Argentum

[JetsetBkk]

Rule Number 1: Never ever take 'advice' from slimy b4st4rds in suits.

Nonsense. I've been living here for over a decade spending over a million baht per year and my net worth is the same as when I came - all thanks to my Financial Adviser (who wears very nice suits).

It's up to you to check out your advisor.

I agree with your core point but "been living here for over a decade spending over a million baht per year and my net worth is the same as when I came" is meaningless without knowing your net worth. Could be a very good rate of return or could be a poor return.

It's not meant to indicate my rate of return, otherwise I may as well show you my yearly valuations.

But the main point is that there are very professional financial advisers who take good care of your money because the more it makes, the more they make.

[SheungWan]

Rule Number 1: Never ever take 'advice' from slimy b4st4rds in suits.

Nonsense. I've been living here for over a decade spending over a million baht per year and my net worth is the same as when I came - all thanks to my Financial Adviser (who wears very nice suits).

It's up to you to check out your advisor.

I agree with your core point but "been living here for over a decade spending over a million baht per year and my net worth is the same as when I came" is meaningless without knowing your net worth. Could be a very good rate of return or could be a poor return.

It's not meant to indicate my rate of return, otherwise I may as well show you my yearly valuations.

But the main point is that there are very professional financial advisers who take good care of your money because the more it makes, the more they make.

If it doesn't indicate your rate of return then it might indicate that you are becoming progressively asset rich, cash poor for all we know, in which case the original statement is not illuminating other than in the FA seeking business sense. As for the 'they make money if you you make money', well yes, but the downside risk is yours and you are liable to be led into higher risk schemes whereas you are really expecting low risk involvement.

[JetsetBkk]

I agree with your core point but "been living here for over a decade spending over a million baht per year and my net worth is the same as when I came" is meaningless without knowing your net worth. Could be a very good rate of return or could be a poor return.

It's not meant to indicate my rate of return, otherwise I may as well show you my yearly valuations.

But the main point is that there are very professional financial advisers who take good care of your money because the more it makes, the more they make.

If it doesn't indicate your rate of return then it might indicate that you are becoming progressively asset rich, cash poor for all we know, in which case the original statement is not illuminating other than in the FA seeking business sense. As for the 'they make money if you you make money', well yes, but the downside risk is yours and you are liable to be led into higher risk schemes whereas you are really expecting low risk involvement.

As I already said, the "original statement" is not meant to be illuminating in terms of the returns I get on my investments. I am simply refuting the statement: "don't take financial advice from slimy b4st4rds in suits". Maybe the poster of that comment meant to add "... that you've just met in a bar."

There is no way I am "led into higher risk schemes" as any portfolio or investment changes are discussed well in advance of any changes being made. I have the last say.

[tookwan cottage]

You found out the hard way not to trust anyone in Thailand,

especially when money or property is involved,just hope you

are able to get back on your feet again,it would also be nice

if you could get some justice,but that rarely happens.

regards Worgeordie

Then why does my landlord treat me so well and fairly in money-related concerns?? I had a difficult period last year, and he has only been kind. Oh, I see, you have a massive tar brush in your hand. Gotcha!

[tookwan cottage]

I guess it's too late to recommend working hard and living simply?

[AWOL Geordie]

I guess it's too late to recommend working hard and living simply?

555. Been doing that my whole life. Looks like nothing's going to change.

Perhaps this is a working class lad's destiny despite his best efforts.

Probably something to do with Karma. It was my destiny to invest in a 100% capital guarantee scam.

[JetsetBkk]

I guess it's too late to recommend working hard and living simply?

Bingo!

[poweratradio]

One infallible rule, if any investment promotion says "Risk Free", don't listen to another word!

Turn and run.

There is no such thing as "Risk Free".

An acquaintance of mine who was teaching in Thailand pretty much went bust. The usual reasons: too many girlfriends, too much booze, living outside his income.

He's a glib talker...can be very convincing when pressing his views on things.

Last year, he returned to Australia and landed a job selling "Retirement Plans" to elderly citizens, his commissions are huge and he's making a bundle. He returned to Thailand not too long ago for a 2 month "holiday", living large and tossing money all over the place.

"I'll make it all back in a few weeks!" He told us.

I can't help thinking of all the poor retirees who invested in his product and are funding his happy lifestyle out of their pockets. Any plan that pays commissions as outlandish as what he gets has got to be as dodgy as a game of "Three Card Monte".

When I asked him about it, his reply was simple: "Not my problem."

Prepaying for LNG contracts is a goldmine for sales people too. Stick with pay as you go and avoid these contracts because the fluctuates so much and you should never lock in.

[puukao]

I think we can ALL be scammed at some point......Mostly little things like "drink this, your metabolism will speed up!!" $4 gone. times whatever. Or "join this gym and get a 6-pack in 2-weeks...." Look, life is MARKETING and we see movies, buy books, do whatever based on all this.....we think we are educating ourselves, but most of the time we don't mind a few dollars gone....then it adds up.

then we have women....not really a scam, but an "investment" than has risks.

then we have education.....i have a master's degree and wouldn't recommend college now to some based on costs in USA

then we have the stock market.....filled with used car salesman....

i am very lucky to have been "scammed" when younger and learned to be super cynical....growing up near New York can give you common sense that can be pretty helpful at times.....But sometimes I feel scammed when I spend 1,000 on a suit and 200 on a tie and 300 on shoes and realize i don't need these things.....a different thing i guess.

Note: I have quit 2 jobs because it felt like we were scamming people....and both were big firms that are totally "legit" in the eyes of regulators.

one thing i know for sure......overall, i'm definitely on the plus side.

Edited January 3, 2015 by puukao

[puukao]

One small story I would like to add:

A close friend in her 70's......frugal all her life, complains about money every day......then buys a car and i'm actually there (i see her once a year if that).......they guy says "2500 USD (we are in America) for key replacement warranty". I laugh and say NO WAY, scam. She looks at me, and pretty sternly says "Look, this is my car and I want this. we won't argue about this." So she spent the money. Yes, she could easily afford it....not something she ever thinks about....but that 35k car turned into a 40k+ car with tons of up sells. my point is, when we get older, i guess things change.....luckily she doesn't answer the phone and hates signing up for stuff sent via mail. but i do know for sure the elderly is very much at risk. which is a shame considering how a lot of them lived their lives......luckily i have an older sister that is a hawk on her account.....for better or worse. i am convinced in the last 3-4 years she has spent 50k on stuff that would never have been bought 20 years ago. good thing about her age....house bought for 30k now worth over 300k. so i guess she is up as well.....