A first for Thailand: Buying property with a 20-year visa

[timewilltell]

It's an interesting option and could be a real draw for foreigners.

However, 20 years is a long time, what guarantees will you have that the arrangement will be honoured 5 or 10 years down the line, let alone 20. Could this not all be null and void if there was ever a change in govt?

Interesting too that the article mentions the scheme in Malaysia, maybe with ASEAN AEC around the corner, Thailand will be loosening it's property laws a little?

Would a 20 year visa be enough for you to buy a condo?

There have been multiple government changes since the original TE program was put in place and to date they haven't reneged on the visa side of things

The thing is you don't need any property developer to facilitate the TE program, you can do it yourself any way and don't need to buy a condo

They might be onto something if for example, by buying the condo, you get the full blown TE program for say half the price you would normally pay, but one suspects that's not going to happen as everyone wants their bit of the pie

You're right they haven't reneagued on the visa side of things but have on just about every other benefit.

[micmichd]

Hmm, you're right.

It makes a difference whether I'm free to travel or forced to travel.

[micmichd]

Guess you mean Farang ownership of land when you speculate about Thailand loosening its property laws.

I hope they don't sell out the country to Farangs. Letting foreign investors take the control over land would be the beginning of the end.

[kovaltech]

well, i have read all of the current posts, what has me a bit concerned is that all of you are very negative on this scheme. Have anyone of you actually checked out what the real story is?

With all due respect, these experienced Thai expats know what the story is because there is no 20 year visa available to expats. That would require a sea-change in Thai visa policy which would have been all over the news and the grapevine.

What there is that you can get without buying a condo is an elite visa good for five years and renewable. It costs 500,000 baht for each five years at purchase and at each renewal. 20 years would cost you 2 million baht or about 60,000 USD. That's IF Thailand continues to offer it and at the same price each time.

There is no such thing as a free lunch meaning this thing can't be free. It's either included in an inflated price for the condo or they simply help you buy it, which help you don't need.

If you want a "20 year visa for Thailand" rock up and pay 500,000 baht (15,000 USD) for the first five years for an elite visa and then keep renewing it. Then buy the condo of your choice or better yet IMHO rent.

Cheers

Yes there is ; http://www.thailandelite.com/glimpse.php

@ Neversure, i am pretty sure that some people don't read...

so i include the picture...

Whatever some people think about the OP, let them think, but what some people write... after they did not read...

TE has its price, but TE Rocks...

[gerry1011]

In any case, I think that this offer is a great advertisement for their project.

"Buy our condos and get a 20 year visa" is very catchy. It attracts the attention of all foreigners who want to stay long term. Even the ones who cannot afford the Thailand Elite card, and the ones who cannot afford a larger condo and go for the cheapest units.

It is just about advertisement. Very clever.

Except, it's NOT a 20-year visa, despite whatever the developer is saying on their website or other PR activities.

It's a series of 5-year TE visas that can be renewed up to 4 times for a total of 20 years -- if the TE program survives that long.

Even the OP article clarifies that by saying: "five-year multiple-entry visa that is renewable every four years."

Also, you can pretty much bet that the developer is NOT including the visa benefit in his condo sales "for free". Almost certainly, the cost of their participation in the TE program is being passed along via higher purchase prices for the units, or at least, whatever units include the TE visa package.

Of course it is not a 20 years visa.

It is a 20 years Thailand Elite membership, which provides renewable 5 years visa for 20 years. We all understand that.

Of course... "if the program survives".

But we hear that very same argument since 13 (!) years now. And, even if some posters here find it really annoying, the program is running well and more members join each day. I can only say that I was very well inspired when I joined Thailand Elite 12 years ago. I enjoyed already over a decade of easy long term visas, while some on here are still wondering if "the program will survive"... They should be better buy a card and stop worrying about their immigration headaches.

Of course the card is not offered "for free" by the developer. It's a promotion. It's advertisement.

Same as free furniture, guaranteed return, free cars, etc...

But speaking about advertisement, it is a genius idea.

Look at how many people speak about this development and Thailand Elite only on this farang forum. It's a marketing success for sure

Edited June 13, 2015 by gerry1011

[kiwikeith]

Do the 30sqm studio's come with the visa?

Anyone with the smarts & money already know they could get the visa independently and pick a nicer property of their choice?

In ten years time Chinese will own the lot and occupy the beaches.

[micmichd]

Do the 30sqm studio's come with the visa?

Anyone with the smarts & money already know they could get the visa independently and pick a nicer property of their choice?

In ten years time Chinese will own the lot and occupy the beaches.

Are you talking about Thailand or North America?

[mike324]

This is the price list that I found from 2013.

However, it isn't from the condo developer itself, so I'm not entirely sure if there is extra mark-up on it or not.

Those are seriously over-priced units. You would have to be quite wealthy and not care about your money to pay those prices.

Furthermore, I often tell friends who ask - never buy property in Thailand. It is a mistake. Rent is cheap, freedom is expensive. I have seen a friend buy a condo here in Bangkok with a beautiful view, only to watch in horror as two years later a giant ugly building was erected directly in front of his balcony. Lost the view and the value of his condo dropped by 40%. Another friend bought into a building that was nice, but after three years the building became full of drug dealers and other shady sorts, and now he is afraid to stay there. Another bought into a 10th floor condo, only to have the elevator fail in the second year, and it has not been fixed for 7 months. 10 flights of stairs many times a day in the heat.

If they had rented, they could easily move. If they get bored of their location, they can easily move. If the government goes off the rails, they can move.

Rent is cheap, freedom is not.

Wonder whats the condo that dropped by 40% ? I have yet to see any new condo with such drastic drop in price, let alone old ones or even in Bangkok!

[mike324]

Gerry 1011 wrote:

>>To come back to the subject, I don't think that any Thailand Elite member on this forum has ever said anything negative about the program.

Great program and interesting offer from the developer... <<

In the post you replied to, this Elite Card member wrote: A complete waste of money............

Just a little negative ?? Or ??

If you leave 800 kb in a Thai bank and get a new visa (or extension of stay) every year, you could save lots of THB. Up to everyone if he prefers to get around the lazy way.

All too aware of that!!

But this sucker bought one of the very first cards, where you according to Thailand Elite was able to buy 10 rai of land in your own name.

2 months after paying 1 million baht into an account in Singapore (probably Mr T's private account) the goalposts were moved, so the right to buy land "disappeared" .

All the other privileges connected with the card were more or less useless to me, so it was a waste of money!!

Lesson learned: Never trust Thai officialdom........................

Just to chime in on the TE subject. My family was the first wave of Thai Elite member as well. We feel that it was worth the 1 million spent, along with the supplementary membership which cost 300,000 baht with full benefits including rountrip business class ticket from home country. Since we were the first wave, there are no restrictions on the number times for golf, spa, etc. I don't ever recall them advertising how much land you can buy, but they did say you can buy land but if you ever read the fine print they say it will be under the TE's company name etc. So there were no surprises, for those who found there were, they simply didn't read carefully.

For people who think its a waste of money, they probably bought it for visa purpose only, hence they see no value in it. Or that they were the 2nd wave of buyers that had restrictions imposed on the number of times for spa and golf which sucks and their complaint is understandable.

[gerry1011]

Gerry 1011 wrote:

>>To come back to the subject, I don't think that any Thailand Elite member on this forum has ever said anything negative about the program.

Great program and interesting offer from the developer... <<

In the post you replied to, this Elite Card member wrote: A complete waste of money............

Just a little negative ?? Or ??

If you leave 800 kb in a Thai bank and get a new visa (or extension of stay) every year, you could save lots of THB. Up to everyone if he prefers to get around the lazy way.

All too aware of that!!

But this sucker bought one of the very first cards, where you according to Thailand Elite was able to buy 10 rai of land in your own name.

2 months after paying 1 million baht into an account in Singapore (probably Mr T's private account) the goalposts were moved, so the right to buy land "disappeared" .

All the other privileges connected with the card were more or less useless to me, so it was a waste of money!!

Lesson learned: Never trust Thai officialdom........................

Just to chime in on the TE subject. My family was the first wave of Thai Elite member as well. We feel that it was worth the 1 million spent, along with the supplementary membership which cost 300,000 baht with full benefits including rountrip business class ticket from home country. Since we were the first wave, there are no restrictions on the number times for golf, spa, etc. I don't ever recall them advertising how much land you can buy, but they did say you can buy land but if you ever read the fine print they say it will be under the TE's company name etc. So there were no surprises, for those who found there were, they simply didn't read carefully.

For people who think its a waste of money, they probably bought it for visa purpose only, hence they see no value in it. Or that they were the 2nd wave of buyers that had restrictions imposed on the number of times for spa and golf which sucks and their complaint is understandable.

Thank you for your perspective about the Elite card.

We rarely read posts of Thailand Elite members who actually put value on the other perks (golf, spa, etc...). These are nice privileges indeed.

Personally I never used any of these privileges, and put most of the value of the membership on the visa and the assistance at the airport.

In fact I should try one of these complementary spas... Cannot be bad, after all

[Puccini]

can't believe so many folks just read the headline and become a keyboard warrior on "there is no 20 year visa". Read the damn article and it clearly says

" entitled to a 20-year visa, which amounts to five-year multiple-entry visa that is renewable every four years."

So its a 5 year visa, and they allow you to extend it 4 consecutive times with no extra charge (unless the extra charge is in the fine print). I really don't see whats so shady about this, its written clearly, all you need to figure out yourself is if its any cheaper to purchase this as a package deal or separate.

I am trying to find, either in the news article or on the website of Kingdom Property, a statement saying that the cost of the 20-year visa is included in the purchase price of the condo, because one way of looking at this marketing spiel could be as follows:

entitled to a 20-year visa = the buyer qualifies for this visa

--> Comment: he qualifies for it also without buying a condo.

The visa will come as part of the purchase of a unit at Southpoint = approval of the visa application is guaranteed.

--> Comment: but who pays for the visa?

Edited June 13, 2015 by Puccini

[MobileContent]

I think it is a scum. Just a one page landing page without any details about the property.

Kingdom is normally reserved and very difficult to setup in Thailand.

No,pictures of what properties. I would stay away from this rubbish and just go with a normal elite visa.

[micmichd]

This is the price list that I found from 2013.

However, it isn't from the condo developer itself, so I'm not entirely sure if there is extra mark-up on it or not.

Those are seriously over-priced units. You would have to be quite wealthy and not care about your money to pay those prices.

Furthermore, I often tell friends who ask - never buy property in Thailand. It is a mistake. Rent is cheap, freedom is expensive. I have seen a friend buy a condo here in Bangkok with a beautiful view, only to watch in horror as two years later a giant ugly building was erected directly in front of his balcony. Lost the view and the value of his condo dropped by 40%. Another friend bought into a building that was nice, but after three years the building became full of drug dealers and other shady sorts, and now he is afraid to stay there. Another bought into a 10th floor condo, only to have the elevator fail in the second year, and it has not been fixed for 7 months. 10 flights of stairs many times a day in the heat.

If they had rented, they could easily move. If they get bored of their location, they can easily move. If the government goes off the rails, they can move.

Rent is cheap, freedom is not.

Then why is property freedom?

You're not really free if you're committed to stay in a condo just because you bought it.

Freedom is also the freedom to leave without many circumstances in case you don't like it anymore. If you just rent a condo you have this freedom.

[eriksen]

its crap

[JOC]

A first for Thailand: Buying property with a 20-year visa

Not even true!!

Black Mountain Golf course (Hua Hin) offered a "free" Elite Card to potential buyers of their villas

11 years ago!!

http://www.huahin-property.net/articles/black-mountain-huahin-villas.htm

[Bellacissa]

I think it is a scum. Just a one page landing page without any details about the property.

Kingdom is normally reserved and very difficult to setup in Thailand.

No,pictures of what properties. I would stay away from this rubbish and just go with a normal elite visa.

Incorrect. In the middle of the landing page is a button that says "SKIP TO MAIN SITE". Clicking through will take you to the full property site.

[micmichd]

Southpeel, you're right.

I tried to get my Thai gf to Europe 2 years ago, not married. Only for a short visit. She needed a tourist visa, whereas I could have travelled to Thailand with no visa at all.

Not so easy to get a Schengen visa. A Thai woman needs an invitation.

They came up with a questionnaire, wanted to know how big my flat is, and how much money I make. They also wanted to know where my gf works, and they wanted to see a contract from her. Not so easy if the gf is self-employed.

Then I should sign a guarantee, guarantee that I will pay for any costs she could possibly cause to Europe. Up to 20 mio. EUR, including case of a terrorist attack from her. No joke, this is part of the standard form you have to sign if you invite a Thai citizen to Europe.

It all failed because of her working contract. They questioned me again about her job. When I told them "gastronomy" they ran completely crazy. Now they came up and asked me if I have a second bed in my flat, preferably in a separate room. Because...

That's when I started to riot.

What do Farang authorities have to care about my sex life?

Edited June 14, 2015 by micmichd

[useronthenet]

The laws change in Thailand like the weather, therefore any guarantee now could be easily be made null and void down the road.

[Soutpeel]

They should liberalize their visa program already. I've friends with multiple properties here having their tourist visas rejected here so they have to go for ED visas. I've a friend on a spouse visa and it took a ridiculous amount of paperwork, time and a person to come vouch for them, but when said witness ID card was expired they had to come back with someone else.

I'm on a multi entry spouse visa but because I paid 3x the amount of a single entry I must by Thai law leave the country every 90 days no exceptions, even though I paid MORE than a single entry (who don't have to leave the country.)

What ever your smoking I want some

Thailand has some of the easiest and most liberal visa rules on the planet, and that's a fact

lets put it this way, if Thailand brought their visa's on par with most countries in farangistan, most of the people complaining about Thailands "restrictive" visa rules, would have a problem, simply because they wouldn't qualify to stay long term in Thailand anyway

and if your on a spouse visa, you don't have to leave the country every 90 days if you qualify for the extension, so stop citing Thai law, as quite obvious you don't understand what your quoting or the rules/laws

Ugh the masses... Go google the law changes. Then go check on a multi entry visa. Forget it. Too tired today to deal with morons.

don't need to google the laws, but would suggest you do....if your on a spousal extension, you not compelled to leave the country every 90 days, you report in country every 90 days,

if your on a multi-entry, either 1. you got the wrong "visa" or you don't qualify for extension as you don't qualify on the monthly or 400k in the bank requirement

so please go and consult google and lets discuss who is the moron shall we ?

but back to the premise of your hissy fit....Thailand has some of the easiest visa rules on the planet, that's a fact..

Edited June 14, 2015 by Soutpeel

[micmichd]

The laws change in Thailand like the weather, therefore any guarantee now could be easily be made null and void down the road.

Thailand is not the only country with "positive (ie changeable) law".

There should be a constitutional frame though which cannot be changed so easily.

[arfurcrown]

Reminds me of those''Lifetime guarantees'' on products.

What product or service is the lifetime guarantee for?

Change the company name, transfer assets, original company dead.

No legal obligations, no twenty year visa.

A new administration changes the rules oh so many pitfalls on the road to nowhere.

Perhaps best described as a creative advertising sales gimmick setting.

[gerry1011]

Reminds me of those''Lifetime guarantees'' on products.

What product or service is the lifetime guarantee for?

Change the company name, transfer assets, original company dead.

No legal obligations, no twenty year visa.

A new administration changes the rules oh so many pitfalls on the road to nowhere.

Perhaps best described as a creative advertising sales gimmick setting.

It is creative advertising sales gimmick indeed.

And it works !

Look at all the reactions. Incredible

I would even say that, unintentionally, this project brings even more attention on Thailand Elite than on itself

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Interesting...I was looking back thru some old posts for a different reason and came across this one by chance... I had forgotten about this TE news back from last November.. Wonder what's become of their proposal to hike the TE 20 year membership to 3 million baht instead of the current 2 million.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/778081-experience-with-thai-elite-easy-access/page-3#entry8727421

Posted by TallGuyJohninBKK on 2014-11-27 10:29:17 in Thai visas, residency and work permits

There's an interesting article in the BKK Post today on the Thailand Elite card and program continuing to face hard financial times, lagging membership sales and a plan to increase the individual membership fee to 3 million baht.

I can't link to it here under forum rules, but it was posted today in their business section. And I don't see any comparable article posted anywhere here in the TV forum coming from The Nation or anywhere else.

The last line of the article says they're planning to increase the 20-year individual membership fee from the current 2 million to 3 million because, of course, they're not selling enough cards/memberships.

According to the article, TPC got 94 million baht in revenue (not profits) from 152 memberships sold in fiscal 2014. And yet, they have goals of 324 million revenue and 520 memberships in f2015, and then 414 million in f2016 and 550 million in f2017.

[gerry1011]

Interesting...I was looking back thru some old posts for a different reason and came across this one by chance... I had forgotten about this TE news back from last November.. Wonder what's become of their proposal to hike the TE 20 year membership to 3 million baht instead of the current 2 million.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/778081-experience-with-thai-elite-easy-access/page-3#entry8727421

Posted by TallGuyJohninBKK on 2014-11-27 10:29:17 in Thai visas, residency and work permits

There's an interesting article in the BKK Post today on the Thailand Elite card and program continuing to face hard financial times, lagging membership sales and a plan to increase the individual membership fee to 3 million baht.

I can't link to it here under forum rules, but it was posted today in their business section. And I don't see any comparable article posted anywhere here in the TV forum coming from The Nation or anywhere else.

The last line of the article says they're planning to increase the 20-year individual membership fee from the current 2 million to 3 million because, of course, they're not selling enough cards/memberships.

According to the article, TPC got 94 million baht in revenue (not profits) from 152 memberships sold in fiscal 2014. And yet, they have goals of 324 million revenue and 520 memberships in f2015, and then 414 million in f2016 and 550 million in f2017.

Eventually the price will go up.

That is for sure.

At this time it is still a bargain, compared to the comfort that the PE visa provides, not even mentioning the other services.

[FritsSikkink]

It is an misleading sales pitch, there is no 20 year visa and for the elitecard you don't need to buy property.

[VIPinthailand]

it s the carrot.

anyway what you do at 30 yo and 20 years in Thailand? . you will be bored after 6 months.

keep your money, travel, and come back at 50.

dont f. yourself with these condos and elite scams!

get a life!

Edited June 14, 2015 by VIPinthailand

[DrTuner]

That makes 1,950,000 for a small studio, and is very cheap indeed.

For 30m^2 box it's about double price. So, lemme guess, a 1br 55m^2 will go for 5M, for which you get 2M worth of membership in TE, leaving the price of the 55 m^2 unit at 3M. Which is at least 500k up from market price.

Sweet deal, yeah. For those who get a cut from TE and condo sales.

[dickyknee]

it s the carrot.

anyway what you do at 30 yo and 20 years in Thailand? . you will be bored after 6 months.

keep your money, travel, and come back at 50.

dont f. yourself with these condos and elite scams!

get a life!

some people can afford the condos, elite visas and *gasp* to travel also, without thinking that anything that involves spending money is a scam.

And they have a very funking awesome life with their fun coupons.

Edited June 14, 2015 by dickyknee

[mmh8]

just want to check the conclusion, to spell it out for the slower amongst us, such as myself, is the whole 20 year visa thing a scam?

[Soutpeel]

it s the carrot.

anyway what you do at 30 yo and 20 years in Thailand? . you will be bored after 6 months.

keep your money, travel, and come back at 50.

dont f. yourself with these condos and elite scams!

get a life!

and do what at 50 ?....jump off a balcony at 55, cos you have run out of money as a 21 year splay toed hooker from Isaan, who said she will love you always, has run off with all your money ?

the prices they are charging dear boy is hardly "elite"