FAA says Thai aviation industry lacks sufficient qualified personnel

[Lite Beer]

FAA says Thai aviation industry lacks sufficient qualified personnel

BANGKOK: -- The latest inspection of the Thai aviation safety standard by the US Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) has revealed that insufficient qualified manpower may be one of the country’s main drawbacks in delivering its aviation safety services up to international standards.

But THAI authorities say that this problem could be resolved.

Transport minister Air Chief Marshal Prajin Juntong revealed yesterday that a team of four FAA senior members arrived on July 13 to inspect aviation safety standards with particular focus on the two main Thai airlines that conduct flights into the USA namely, Thai Airways International and Bangkok Airways.

Inspection revealed that the Thai civil aviation is insufficiently staffed per FAA’s recommended industry standards and that staff were sometimes inappropriately assigned to aircraft types.

The second concern was that the operations check list is not strictly adhered to. And thirdly, safety checks were lacking mainly as a result of insufficient qualified personnel.

But ACM Prajin said Thai aviation authorities have already started to take up measures to solve the mentioned problems.

This is because the International Civil Aviation Organisation had previously inspected the safety standard which revealed similar results.

But he said full inspection report is expected to be released within 30 days where the country will be given 65 days to take corrective measures.

The minister admits that if Thailand is not able to resolve those problems highlighted by the FAA, the country’s aviation safety standard rating could be downgraded to a second class ranking which could affect the industry’s flights into the USA.

ACM Prajin also stated that he would have a clearer idea on the severity of the impact to the local industry on July 20 once he has read the full inspection report.

The FAA’s recent inspection prior to this year’s was conducted in 2008 where Thailand received a first class rating for excellence.

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/faa-says-thai-aviation-industry-lacks-sufficient-qualified-personnel

-- Thai PBS 2015-07-18

[ChrisY1]

They really have to step up to this immediately........

It would seem there are no more qualified people in Thailand to take up these roles, which simply means they must get international HR people looking now.

The great reluctance shown to engage staff internationally will be their downfall.......and a downgrade to a 2nd grade ranking would most likely kill the industry here.

[NeverSure]

I read it twice. It's all talk and no plan. How many Western guys would like to be stationed in Thailand for any of those jobs. Do the jobs and train Thais at the same time.

Thainess. Face. Procrastination. Excuses.

[geriatrickid]

When did Bangkok Airways start flying to the USA?

[Just1Voice]

Not enough qualified personnel? Hey, not a problem in Thailand. They'll just appoint their wives, kids, cousins and in-laws to fill in the necessary requirements.

[HeijoshinCool]

But ACM Prajin said Thai aviation authorities have already started to take up measures to solve the mentioned problems.

Hence Thai Airways name change to Turkish Airlines.

That'll fool 'em.

[Oil Baron]

Inspection revealed that the Thai civil aviation is insufficiently staffed per FAAs recommended industry standards and that staff were sometimes inappropriately assigned to aircraft types.

So the unskilled staff are are carrying out maintenance on airplanes that they have no knowledge of...nice. What do they do, check the tires??

The second concern was that the operations check list is not strictly adhered to.

Oh dear. The safety net that was set up to catch out the above, has got holes in it....

And thirdly, safety checks were lacking mainly as a result of insufficient qualified personnel.

Here we go. Points one and two have been ignored, why bother now???

Hmmmm. This is dreadful. There's not a lot I can say really, without being tempted to go into full rant mode....

Actually, it's appalling.

[Pib]

When did Bangkok Airways start flying to the USA?

But they do Code Share with other airlines which fly to the U.S. Therefore, they are reviewed by the FAA if they want to continue that code sharing...without being able to code share I expect they would lose a lot of international business. See below news link and partial quote

http://learningenglish.voanews.com/content/un-agency-questions-thailands-air-safety/2700345.html

A lower rating by FAA for Thailand would mean, among other things that Thai airlines could no longer have code share operations with U.S. airlines. With a code share operation,

one airline can operate the planes while another airline sells tickets and markets the flights.

[Somtamnication]

"This is because the International Civil Aviation Organisation had previously inspected the safety standard which revealed similar results."

Rhetorical question: So after how many inspections will the faults and training in qualified personnel be repaired and trained?

[smedly]

Could it be the case that there are now many more airlines operating in Thailand than in 2008 and skilled staff have been moving around leaving gaps that are not filled or cannot be filled, aircraft engineers are highly skilled and trained people and I would assume are highly paid - the latter perhaps being a significant part of the problem in Thailand, Thai Airways would rather have a well paid seriously top heavy unneeded band of executives directors and managers than spend the money where it is needed

[clockman]

But plenty of generals!

[chainarong]

One area that requires attention is the mindset that everything can run on the smell of an oily rag syndrome , you do this within the education sphere and looks like you do it in the Aviation industry also , the saying , if you pay peanuts you get monkeys could be interpreted as correct , unless the DCA is prepared to pay top money for qualified personal the only ones interested will those that either are unemployable or looking at holidaying type work , that starts the revolving door employment cycle, not what you want in the aviation industry , in other words, pay well and the people will come to you, this is also a lesson the education department might want to start to think about , paying 25 thousand BAHT a month might appear to be good wages but try 8 grand USD per month ballpark figure and you might recruit someone, of course you could always recruit from Quality China however leading interviews from U.K. , Singapore, US or OZ would be more to the point

[Skywalker69]

But plenty of generals!

Sigh!

[smedly]

One area that requires attention is the mindset that everything can run on the smell of an oily rag syndrome , you do this within the education sphere and looks like you do it in the Aviation industry also , the saying , if you pay peanuts you get monkeys could be interpreted as correct , unless the DCA is prepared to pay top money for qualified personal the only ones interested will those that either are unemployable or looking at holidaying type work , that starts the revolving door employment cycle, not what you want in the aviation industry , in other words, pay well and the people will come to you, this is also a lesson the education department might want to start to think about , paying 25 thousand BAHT a month might appear to be good wages but try 8 grand USD per month ballpark figure and you might recruit someone, of course you could always recruit from Quality China however leading interviews from U.K. , Singapore, US or OZ would be more to the point

I believe that this sort of work could and is contracted out to 3rd party companies that specialise in aircraft maintenance but again not cheap, it is something I am not too familiar with

https://www.google.co.th/search?q=aircraft+maintenance+contractors&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-GB:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&gws_rd=cr,ssl&ei=C-epVab6HdifugT0r5aYCg

Edited July 18, 2015 by smedly

[bamnutsak]

Probably best to wait for the release of the official report rather than relying on Thai officials, who have only been very generally orally briefed by the FAA officials as they were departing.

If Thailand is downgraded by the FAA, the follow-on effects will be challenging.

I'm not even sure what Cat. (I , II, III) the FAA has Thailand currently ranked? I thought it was Cat. I?

US authority downgrades Thai aviation, cites 3 problems

THE NATION July 18, 2015 1:00 am

THE US Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) has downgraded Thai aviation after discovering three major problems.

According to Prajin, Thailand was downgraded to second tier, which will affect flights to the US. However, the ministry will monitor the impact of the move.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/business/US-authority-downgrades-Thai-aviation-cites-3-prob-30264711.html

According to this list, Thailand is (was?) Category I, as of 8 April 2015.

https://www.faa.gov/about/initiatives/iasa/

Edited July 18, 2015 by bamnutsak

[NongKhaiKid]

Everything is in hand already but isn't it always until called out then it's a plea for an extension.

Look how the PM handled the fishing boat issue, doesn't inspire confidence of things actually getting done.

If red cards are produced on several issues there will be howls of protest and it will be everybody else's fault.

[ramrod711]

Inspection revealed that the Thai civil aviation is insufficiently staffed per FAAs recommended industry standards and that staff were sometimes inappropriately assigned to aircraft types.

So the unskilled staff are are carrying out maintenance on airplanes that they have no knowledge of...nice. What do they do, check the tires??

The second concern was that the operations check list is not strictly adhered to.

Oh dear. The safety net that was set up to catch out the above, has got holes in it....

And thirdly, safety checks were lacking mainly as a result of insufficient qualified personnel.

Here we go. Points one and two have been ignored, why bother now???

Hmmmm. This is dreadful. There's not a lot I can say really, without being tempted to go into full rant mode....

Actually, it's appalling.

I can see that you are upset, but consider that a little while back a new Buddha was installed at Suvarnabhumi to ward off evil spirits, and secondly the operations check list is covered by mai bpen rai, so all is well.

[thesetat2013]

I will wait to see if they import new workers who are actually trained to do those jobs that are lacking. Buddha knows if they hire recent grads to fill positions that they will fail the next inspection as well.

[GiantFan]

8 years between inspections seem too long.

[tso310]

When did Bangkok Airways start flying to the USA?

Guam would come under FAA jurisdiction. Bangkok Airways has probably filed for a licence to fly into US Territory for one off charters. Orient Thai were and probably are still banned.

[Oil Baron]

Inspection revealed that the Thai civil aviation is insufficiently staffed per FAAs recommended industry standards and that staff were sometimes inappropriately assigned to aircraft types.

So the unskilled staff are are carrying out maintenance on airplanes that they have no knowledge of...nice. What do they do, check the tires??

The second concern was that the operations check list is not strictly adhered to.

Oh dear. The safety net that was set up to catch out the above, has got holes in it....

And thirdly, safety checks were lacking mainly as a result of insufficient qualified personnel.

Here we go. Points one and two have been ignored, why bother now???

Hmmmm. This is dreadful. There's not a lot I can say really, without being tempted to go into full rant mode....

Actually, it's appalling.

I can see that you are upset, but consider that a little while back a new Buddha was installed at Suvarnabhumi to ward off evil spirits, and secondly the operations check list is covered by mai bpen rai, so all is well.

I bet if you got access to the cockpit, it would look like the inside of a minivan. Pictures of revered monks, a dozen or so amulets and the obligatory white spiritual inscriptions!

Makes me feel a lot safer just thinking about it....

[deckape]

How many Western guys would like to be stationed in Thailand for any of those jobs?

I imagine a certain kind of guy would only need a 'short time' to be convinced.

[realenglish1]

This is so typical of Thai management Business as usual but it does not cut it on the international stage.

Again you can see why Thai airways is failing. They cut back to try and churn a profit and fall short of international standards

This is not the way to run a business. My opinion is Thai airways will eventually go bankrupt do to very very poor management.

[SOTIRIOS]

...my wife got her job through her uncle...someone that owed him a favor....

...she was passed on promotion for several years due to poor performance...

...then she got transferred to Bangkok and her 'friendlies'....

...she shot up the ranks.....

...but you are lucky if she works 1-2 hours on any given day....

...then we get to the competence issue.....

...she will still get her salary increase...and annual perverse bonus....

...and 'she can never be fired'.....

...and she can look forward to an immoral retirement bonus...at the end of it all as well....

....tourism....and related industries do not seem to strive for excellence.....they will thrive no matter what....

...they are 'a field day' for those that have 'gotten in'.....

...(like the day of the civil servants 20-30 years ago in the west)...

...so....no reason to improve....

.....bosses were reported to have been caught in corruption scandals....

...only to end up getting raises and promotions....

...so what do you expect....

[Oil Baron]

...my wife got her job through her uncle...someone that owed him a favor....

...she was passed on promotion for several years due to poor performance...

...then she got transferred to Bangkok and her 'friendlies'....

...she shot up the ranks.....

...but you are lucky if she works 1-2 hours on any given day....

...then we get to the competence issue.....

...she will still get her salary increase...and annual perverse bonus....

...and 'she can never be fired'.....

...and she can look forward to an immoral retirement bonus...at the end of it all as well....

....tourism....and related industries do not seem to strive for excellence.....they will thrive no matter what....

...they are 'a field day' for those that have 'gotten in'.....

...(like the day of the civil servants 20-30 years ago in the west)...

...so....no reason to improve....

.....bosses were reported to have been caught in corruption scandals....

...only to end up getting raises and promotions....

...so what do you expect....

She sounds like a keeper!

[gudtymchuk]

All this is so typical of the Thai Hi-So insulated mentality. How can the international community place their standards on Thainess?

[Cuchulainn]

But ACM Prajin said Thai aviation authorities have already started to take up measures to solve the mentioned problems.

Hence Thai Airways name change to Turkish Airlines.

That'll fool 'em.

Or paint over the tail end!! That'll really confuse those darned Yankees!!

[scorecard]

Not enough qualified personnel? Hey, not a problem in Thailand. They'll just appoint their wives, kids, cousins and in-laws to fill in the necessary requirements.

Chalerm could guide them on nepotism, he's a world expert with track record to boot.

[Mudcrab]

In my opinion all this is so typical of the holier than thou farang mentality.

If the standards were so low, in comparable terms to other aviation sectors, they would be banned now.

Simple as that.

I think most posters are from the era where you had to check the oil and brake fluid on the "motor" weekly before risking taking the family for a drive into the country for the day.

Things have changed and changed dramatically. The modern turbojet and airframe is something completely different to what your conceptions may have been. They simply do not need the maintenance regime that was demanded in the past.

Granted they still need the ego massage of the pilots but that will change as the paying public wakes up to the fact that a computer can do a better, safer, more predictable job than a human can.

Howls of derision no doubt will be forthcoming.

Why does the pilot actually have to be in the aircraft? It's only a flying computer. Something goes wrong....control it from a position of safety.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Transport minister Air Chief Marshal Prajin Juntong revealed yesterday that a team of four FAA senior members arrived on July 13 to inspect aviation safety standards with particular focus on the two main Thai airlines that conduct flights into the USA namely, Thai Airways International and Bangkok Airways.

Inspection revealed that the Thai civil aviation is insufficiently staffed per FAA’s recommended industry standards and that staff were sometimes inappropriately assigned to aircraft types.

The second concern was that the operations check list is not strictly adhered to. And thirdly, safety checks were lacking mainly as a result of insufficient qualified personnel.

Sadly, this pretty much confirmed what everyone here had already been talking about. And, worse, highlights the some of the same kinds of failings that go back all the way to the One-Two-Go crash at Phuket in 2007 and all the shoddy aviation antics that the post-crash investigation revealed.

BTW, hasn't Thai Air been insisting throughout the latest ruckus in the wake of the ICAO findings that they're clean and everything is fine. I'm wondering how that's possible if operations check lists are not adhered to and safety checks are lacking due to insufficient qualified personnel on the part of the Thai DCA?