Thailand has the second highest rate of road deaths in the world

[thaihome]

Really misleading old numbers from 2012. What's the kill-rate on 2-wheelers compared proportionately with other countries? Also the comment about the third world having far less "vehicles" shows that the figures are badly skewed. Commentary like "...although they have only half of the worlds vehicles, they have 90 percent of the worlds road deaths.... " does nothing to increase the accuracy of the perception.

Not to say that Thailand isn't very dangerous, but perhaps not much worse than other Asian or African countries.

Get into the details,,, http://www.who.int/violence_injury_prevention/road_safety_status/2015/en/

Page 11 of this will give some numbers http://www.news.mot.go.th/motc/portal/graph/transtat13.pdf

12million cars vs 19million "registered" motorcyles, but we all know that the real number is possibly double that.

Also interesting - - the WHO doubled the number of reported deaths for their survey. see page 14 here... http://www.who.int/violence_injury_prevention/road_safety_status/2015/Statistical_annex_GSRRS2015.pdf

It is interesting that the survey makes no attempt to separate the statistics for 2 wheel vehicles and 4. With 73% of the estimated total fatalities being 2 or 3 wheel vehicles it would seem to me that the issue is people can afford motorcycles but not cars much more then other developing countries, but due to lack of training and extremely lax enforcement lots of people get killed on motorcycles. This falls 100% in the lap of the traffic division of the RTP.

The car driving here is much better then many other Asian countries (china and india come to mind) but driving a motorcycle is very dangerous. But china and India do not have near the per capita motorcycle ownership that thailand has.

TH

[lvr181]

".....second highest rate of road deaths in the world."

Really? Who would have thought.

[farcanell]

Really misleading old numbers from 2012. What's the kill-rate on 2-wheelers compared proportionately with other countries? Also the comment about the third world having far less "vehicles" shows that the figures are badly skewed. Commentary like "...although they have only half of the worlds vehicles, they have 90 percent of the worlds road deaths.... " does nothing to increase the accuracy of the perception.

Not to say that Thailand isn't very dangerous, but perhaps not much worse than other Asian or African countries.

Get into the details,,, http://www.who.int/violence_injury_prevention/road_safety_status/2015/en/

Page 11 of this will give some numbers http://www.news.mot.go.th/motc/portal/graph/transtat13.pdf

12million cars vs 19million "registered" motorcyles, but we all know that the real number is possibly double that.

Also interesting - - the WHO doubled the number of reported deaths for their survey. see page 14 here... http://www.who.int/violence_injury_prevention/road_safety_status/2015/Statistical_annex_GSRRS2015.pdf

Interesting reading.... Doesn't inspire any confidence in Thai road use.

I found the "consensus" by user survey on road law enforcement, listing Thailand at 3 out of 10, to be a little high... Obviously not many expats were included in that survey.... In 9 years of driving over here, I have yet to see any law enforcement other than traps to pick up bike riders without helmets, so I would give that survey a 1.... At best.

[geronimo]

This is what happens when there is little money spent on roads and zero money spent on driver education.

You left out the #1 cause, zero law enforcement, which is also the root cause of 98% plus of Thailand's problems.

But it is the way it is! I stopped thinking about why? why? why? twenty years ago. It still continues but I don't get negged out contemplating the reasons. I guess I'm Thai now!

[mihalis]

Difficult to include Libya which is a country where there is a total war since many years .

Many of the road accidents are of mines , shelling, bombing, snipers ...drones ...

Not exactly what happens in Thailand .

How do you know ?

[mihalis]

This is what happens when there is little money spent on roads and zero money spent on driver education.

Roads, well my guess is the lack of driver training, lack of who gives a shit by many Thai drivers.. Not enforcing speed limits.. It's really frightening how many drivers just don't care !!

[farcanell]

U-turns, have a lot to answer for,too many of them

and I suspect why a lot of accidents happen,judging

by the painted outlines,just before and after.

regards Worgeordie

They installed concrete center road dividers on a long section of vichit road (rawai) last year, and from what I gathered from talking to people, was that most locals were upset and against the barriers, because it reduced the amount of places they could u turn.... Which , for a sane person, is excellent news, as it makes driving that much more safer, as you have one less hazard to negotiate

I'm all for engineering out the hazards.... It seems to be the only thing that works in Thailand.... Dictate how roads can be used, as education isn't working very well.

Lol... What a disgraceful post... Advocating reduction of free will... Sorry about that... But there you have it.

[GinBoy2]

i love Thailand the way it is.

no enforcement of traffics law is one of the reasons I came here.

I hope the Thai people continue to resist these outside calls for change to the last breath.

take your nanny state radar guns, traffic cameras and police helicopters and SWAT teams and go back to the UK or USA or whatever total police state you come from.

I'm not quite sure where to start on the lunacy of this post.

In what seems to be your rather twisted logic somehow the total lack of any traffic law enforcement resulting in thousands of worthless deaths every year is a 'good' thing?

If you truly believe this you're sick, hopefully, I'm always an optimist, you made this post tongue in cheek

[Jonmarleesco]

'Surely coming as little surprise to anyone well acquainted with Thailand’s roads ...' Actually, it does come as a surprise. I would have expected first place. Seems some of the RTP's accident reduction tactics achieved some success; probably a surprise to them.

[Jonmarleesco]

i love Thailand the way it is.

no enforcement of traffics law is one of the reasons I came here.

I hope the Thai people continue to resist these outside calls for change to the last breath.

take your nanny state radar guns, traffic cameras and police helicopters and SWAT teams and go back to the UK or USA or whatever total police state you come from.

I'm not quite sure where to start on the lunacy of this post.

In what seems to be your rather twisted logic somehow the total lack of any traffic law enforcement resulting in thousands of worthless deaths every year is a 'good' thing?

If you truly believe this you're sick, hopefully, I'm always an optimist, you made this post tongue in cheek

'... hopefully ... you made this post tongue in cheek' He'd need a long tongue to reach that particular cheek.

[tomacht8]

Second. That is nothing new.
Drive as if everyone is your enemy and try to survive.
Everyone is responsible for themselves.

[jacky54]

All that's needed to start with is a genuine driving test, accident rates would plummet if they could ever be bothered to introduce one to replace the present farce.

[boomerangutang]

Most of those injuries and deaths are intrinsically wrapped around by Thailand's (and the world's) only legal recreational drug: alcohol

Meanwhile, illegal substances like pot and hemp don't cause any road deaths.

Hyper rich families like Charoen make millions of baht/day from alcohol.

While unimportant & poor Thais are rotting in jail (for decades) for unwittingly taking a package on an airplane to try and make some quick money.

[MJP]

Yet there are still people on this forum that claim Thailand is a perfectly safe place to ride a bike or drive a car, and no amount of factual evidence will convince them otherwise.

Possibly because they have done some hundreds of thousands kms without accident, because their driving style is pre-cautious and they calculate the opponents correctly? I prefer driving here to the way in Germany, just because Thai drivers are predictable, while in Germany the war is on.

I was about say this. It all depends where.

In Roi-Et and the sticks surrounding Roi-Et I have a much less stressful driving experience than say here, in East London, which I find so terrifying now I've got Asda delivering to site. Psychotic aggression here, it's bloody horrible.

[MJP]

i love Thailand the way it is.

no enforcement of traffics law is one of the reasons I came here.

I hope the Thai people continue to resist these outside calls for change to the last breath.

take your nanny state radar guns, traffic cameras and police helicopters and SWAT teams and go back to the UK or USA or whatever total police state you come from.

I'm not quite sure where to start on the lunacy of this post.

In what seems to be your rather twisted logic somehow the total lack of any traffic law enforcement resulting in thousands of worthless deaths every year is a 'good' thing?

If you truly believe this you're sick, hopefully, I'm always an optimist, you made this post tongue in cheek

There is traffic law enforcement in Thailand.

I got pulled over for having a black bonnet (fake carbon fibre stick on stuff, don't ask it's embarrassing) on a maroon pick-up and got fined 300 Baht. This was last month. So, I pulled the truck up to the pigsty and peeled the awful thing off in front of them. This was an absolute coup! I'd been wanting to do this for ages but the Big Angry wouldn't have it. She thought it looked "cool". It looked bloody dreadful.

They didn't mention the windscreen that was spidered with cracks mind, nor did they ask for proof of insurance or road worthiness.

[realenglish1]

This is a way to cut down on fatalities overnight in THailand but since its too easy Thais will not do it

Have an eye test when you get your drivers license I don't mean the color test or depth I mean a real test that will tell if you

need to wear glasses or not while driving I am certain there are 1000s of people that drive and cannot see properly

Then enforce it Too easy Right They will not do it

[canathai8]

Most of those injuries and deaths are intrinsically wrapped around by Thailand's (and the world's) only legal recreational drug: alcohol

Meanwhile, illegal substances like pot and hemp don't cause any road deaths.

Hyper rich families like Charoen make millions of baht/day from alcohol.

While unimportant & poor Thais are rotting in jail (for decades) for unwittingly taking a package on an airplane to try and make some quick money.

"Meanwhile, illegal substances like pot and hemp don't cause any road deaths." And add kratom to the list - in moderation

[The manic]

I also live here because lawlessness equals a form of freedom Freedom from petty restrictions - it is noticeable after the theft of freedom in the UK as a result of the drink driving laws street violence especially with women victims soared because they were left vulnerable on the street with insufficient public transport - Basically we are told to stay at home and get ready for work- its s**t. We have been strangled in England due to petty laws on every aspect of our lives. Dreadful nasty minded bullies and jobsworth run my country. The younger people know no better so they do not know freedom despite living in a so called democracy.

[Beats56]

Having driven in Saudi (which does not report it's figures) Thailand is better to drive in.

I had a vehicle there for 11 years, the place is hopeless.

At least they don't have women drivers there

[kamahele]

I commute weekly between BKK and Korat and it is scary the number of accident sites I drive past and think I am lucky to have avoided. Almost every week I see overturned vehicles in ditches and gullies on the side of road. Saw an overturned bus last month and the following week another bus which had run off the road and through a grove of trees.

[Yunla]

The death rate in Australia in the 6o's was pretty close to Thailand - in 1975 26.6 per 1000 and now 1bout 6 per thousand. The difference is very strict driving rules enforced. But it has taken a wealthy country nearly thirty years to really start to get on top of things. Inbdia only has a lower death rate because traffic is slow most of the time.

I think this is the crux of the problem, there is no "quick-fix solution" and so the State will be implementing laws and advocating cultural changes that will not reap rewards for decades. In any nation where polls and populism are important, there is a tendency to aim for quick-fixes that show results, however temporary or fleeting those results may be.

There needs to be strict driver education, strict road-worthiness testing of vehicles, and strict enforcement of road laws. Those things can be implemented quickly, at a truly massive cost in both money and work. However this will only nudge a cultural change, which needs to be relentlessly nudged for decades - in this particular case I would say generations. Whoever implements the new training, testing and laws, will be incredibly unpopular nationwide, seen as slowing growth and wasting resources etc. They need to be a person who can face a lot of flames today, with only the promise of positive results eventually showing up many decades after they are gone.

[boomerangutang]

Here is a list of some of the many accident-causing habits Thai drivers have, from worst on down....

>>> cutting corners, particularly on blind corners

>>> extreme selfishness

>>> going through red lights

>>> not having the courtesy to yield to other drivers, motorcyclists, or pedestrians

>>> being isolated in their cars, all of which have tinted windows rolled up tight. It's not just a physical isolation, but also a psychic isolation, which contributes to their feelings of separateness from everyone outside their cocoon. Less awareness = less concern.

I reside in Chiang Rai, and consciously show courtesy to other drivers and pedestrians and motorcycle drivers. I don't know if it's infectious, but I notice a slight bit of added courtesy in other drivers around town. Some examples: Slowing/stopping for pedestrians, same for crossroads with no traffic lights. However, going through red lights is still very common in CR (probably all over Thailand). I estimate, just in my small city, over 10,000 red light runners per hour between 8 am and 10 pm. The high number reflects some drivers doing it multiple times/hr. Some of the red-light runners are several seconds after the light turns red!

[Ace of Pop]

So the Local Big School decreed that Pupils with no license or Helmet can't park within the School grounds. Now there are 150 Scooter things parked in front of the Post Office ,next to the Police Station.There is no end to stupidity here..

[chrissables]

Yet there are still people on this forum that claim Thailand is a perfectly safe place to ride a bike or drive a car, and no amount of factual evidence will convince them otherwise.

Possibly because they have done some hundreds of thousands kms without accident, because their driving style is pre-cautious and they calculate the opponents correctly? I prefer driving here to the way in Germany, just because Thai drivers are predictable, while in Germany the war is on.

Please don't try and defend the indefensible. Thailand is not a safe place to ride/drive no matter how careful you are. You can't predict what every crazy driver is going to do at any given time. Unless of course, like some falangs, you are possessed with supernatural powers of perception.

No, not safe. But if you have ridden or driven a lot here you become aware of many of the dangerous ways some Thai people drive. This insight helps a lot.

[off road pat]

I was just trying to use my imagination if Thailand would have Autobahn's without speed limits..........

Well, They have them !!!.... that's the impression I have on the roads here .....

[boomerangutang]

I was just trying to use my imagination if Thailand would have Autobahn's without speed limits..........

Well, They have them !!!.... that's the impression I have on the roads here .....

....and they have roads where median divider stripes mean nothing, particularly on blind curves. Perhaps it's a geometry issue: If a truck or bus speeds around a blind corner, it gets to its destination 7/100's of a second sooner if it cuts the corner by a meter over the line. .....unless it crashes.

[CoreanoOzzie]

Things definitely need changing here with regards to road fatalities, starting from the grassroots level. Not helping the cause are you lot with your snide, cynical comments. Do you not realise that you might become a statistic by travelling on the roads here? I bet your family would not be laughing about it then.........

[CoreanoOzzie]

i love Thailand the way it is.

no enforcement of traffics law is one of the reasons I came here.

I hope the Thai people continue to resist these outside calls for change to the last breath.

take your nanny state radar guns, traffic cameras and police helicopters and SWAT teams and go back to the UK or USA or whatever total police state you come from.

The ridiculousness of your post lies in how profoundly "nanny state" Thailand has become with the government policing not only what people can do and say but also what they can think!

Thailand, much like North Korea, is the ULTIMATE nanny state!

LOL

What would you know about North Korea except for what the manipulative Western media throw at gullible fools like yourself?

[CoreanoOzzie]

i love Thailand the way it is.

no enforcement of traffics law is one of the reasons I came here.

I hope the Thai people continue to resist these outside calls for change to the last breath.

take your nanny state radar guns, traffic cameras and police helicopters and SWAT teams and go back to the UK or USA or whatever total police state you come from.

Agreed, there is something pleasing about the free-for-all "organised chaos" at Cross-Intersections for example. It actually works.

[robsamui]

A great many comments here. A great deal of sidetracking and going off at tangents also.

The crux of it all is:

1. The "statistics" re road deaths are unreliable. No matter what the source (ie - the WHO) the compiling organisation can only use the figures they are supplied with. In First World countries with accountability and transparency, there is a very good chance these are accurate. In Thailand, and other similar countries, the figures are exactly whatever the senior officials want them to be. Figures and stats like this are pulled out of thin air. There is no accountability.

(Koh Samui, for example, has had exactly the same 'official' road deaths since 2006 - 3 or 4 a month - even though the volume of traffic on the island has increased 300% in the same period. Prior to this time there was 8x (eight times) this amount. But 'dead-on-the-road' became the yardstick in 2005.)

2. Policing. Almost all comments to this topic assume that the police here function in the same way as in their own country. The police here have a totally different role, and are not trained to 'police the streets' . They act as on-the-spot judge and jury, deciding at the scene of an accident who is at fault and negotiating and enforcing fines as they see fit. They do not seek and discover as many instances of law-breaking as they can. They are directed each day by their station chief to target one specific thing, such as a drug/weapons check, a speeding check, or a vehicle documents inspection. All other infractions or irregularities will be ignored while they concentrate only on this.

(Imagine the police on the streets as being waiters in a restaurant. The restaurant manager directs them to this table or to that table, and tells them to go, fetch, carry and return. Waiters have no freedom of choice - if they see an unattended table at the back , they can't just wander across and sort it out. The role of the police here is exactly the same. They are denied initiative and trained to exclude this notion.)

2a. The police are corrupt and freely extract 'fines' on pretences as well as being open to being bribed. It's bedded into the social structure and runs throughout the whole nation at every level.

3. The supporting infrastructure isn't there. No government-approved driving instructors, no nationwide government-approved test centres which are all consistently coordinated together, no need for driving lessons or to pass a test or to hold a licence. A great many of the police themselves have no licence. Every individual driving on the roads has their own separate ideas about how to drive, and what they can and can't get away with. There is no uniformity or consistency - other than in the fact that a very high percentage of them keep having road accidents.

4. Karma etc - "My car has been blessed and can't have an accident." Alternating with "If I die, I die - it's out of my control to change things."

None of this is likely to change in the imaginable future. It's an established and consolidated social system, with its roots firmly in the top 2% of the social ladder. The upper-strata privileged few (the families that run the government, military and international corporate keystones) have no interest in educating their people in any way (except for their own children who they send away to universities abroad) and they have every incentive to manage and control the country to keep everything exactly the way it is.

All we can do as outsiders is to continue to broadcast as much information as we can to the world outside. Eventually international pressure might cause things to bend a bit - who knows!