Need help on wiring US bought Washer and Dryer

[pampal]

Hi All

I have a Frigidaire Laundry Center model  FLEB8200DS0 Electric 

 it's combo washer and dryer unit I bought in the US a long time ago

There are 2 models, one is Electric washer and gas dryer

and the other is Electric washer and Electric dryer which is the model I have

My model needs 240v and a 30 amp circuit breaker

As I understand in the US the 240v is 2x120v combined whereas in Thaiand it is not

Can anyone please expalin how to properly connect Thai mains power to this machine?

Any help is much appreciated

Frigidaire Laundry center installation.pdf

Edited September 10, 2016 by pampal
Add pics

[BKKdreaming]

First problem USA is 60 hz , Thailand is 50 hz , so the motor will not run the correct speed

 

not sure if the electronics care ,

[pampal]

Yes i dont believe that is a major issue, just slower drum rotation and maybe slower drying times.

The problem is how the 240v will be dellivered to the machine.

How to wire it properly?

[BKKdreaming]

on other machines , if a 60HZ motor is run at 50HZ it can overheat as the motor cooling fans are designed for the 60HZ   RPM , 

 

 

[Anythingleft?]

The voltage is automatically variable but the incorrect hertz will eventually destroy the unit, it may last 3 months or 3 years depending on your luck but it will probably fail sooner rather than later unfortunately

[bankruatsteve]

There will only be two wires to connect.  In the states, they would both be "live".  Here, one will be neutral.  They both will yield 220-240 volts.  As others have mentioned, it is all for naught.  Your machines will NOT work properly on 50 hz and only a matter of time before they fail completely.

[lopburi3]

As said just wire normally but you really need the export model motors that operate on 50HZ as it will both run slow and overheat using current motors and timing also appears to be mechanical so may also be based on 60HZ and will also be slow.  Perhaps might be better to just use as dryer and buy Japanese type washer (which clean softer and better IMHO) and are not that expensive.

[bankruatsteve]

Just to add if you persist in this...  if your machine already came with a connected 240v cable, then you just need to find a corresponding receptacle.  If you need to make your own cable, connect to the (guessing) black and red wires in the machine.  Do not connect anything to a white wire.  And connect ground of course.  You only need the "normal" 20 amp circuit (using 2.5mm2 wire).

 

Edit:  When I look at your labels again, it says "120/240" volt.  To me, that means BOTH - in which case it will definitely not be capable of hook-up here.  IE: that would use 120v for the washer and 240v for the dryer.  (?)  Check the manual to be sure.

 

Edited September 11, 2016 by bankruatsteve

[Crossy]

Yes, most of these machines need 120V (usually the motors and electronics) AND 240V (for the heaters).

 

Unless you know EXACTLY what you are doing there's potential for serious injury (both to the kit and you).

 

You'll need to use a 220 / 120V transformer to create the 120V for the electronics. There's also the issue that one leg of our 220V is near ground whereas in the US both legs of the 240V are 120V above ground, this may or may not upset the works.

 

Get the wiring diagrams for your kit off the net and post them here, we should be able to come up with a wiring scheme that will a. work and b. be safe.

[pampal]

49 minutes ago, Crossy said:

Yes, most of these machines need 120V (usually the motors and electronics) AND 240V (for the heaters).

 

Unless you know EXACTLY what you are doing there's potential for serious injury (both to the kit and you).

 

You'll need to use a 220 / 120V transformer to create the 120V for the electronics. There's also the issue that one leg of our 220V is near ground whereas in the US both legs of the 240V are 120V above ground, this may or may not upset the works.

 

Get the wiring diagrams for your kit off the net and post them here, we should be able to come up with a wiring scheme that will a. work and b. be safe.

 Hi thanks for ur reply

I added the installation manual as a pdf 

BTW i have 2 of these units and the first one has been working here for 10 years but that has diiferent electronics.

The washer is 120v which i use with step down converter and the 60hz vs 50hz is not an issue for a washer or dryer.

Actually the motor doesn't burn because its working slower and not faster.

Frigidaire Laundry center installation.pdf

Frigidaire Laundry Center Owners Manual FLEB8200DS.pdf

[pampal]

More pics

 

Edited September 11, 2016 by pampal
add pics

[bankruatsteve]

From that you are simply not going to be able to connect to electrics here unless it is re-wired internally to provide distinctly separate 120v circuits from the 240v.  Just guessing, that may not be a simple endeavor.  Then you would need separate power cords: 1) from a step-down transformer 220 to 110v and 2) from "normal" 220v service.  Ground cannot be connected to the "neutral" as in diagram but to your house ground or it's own stake.

 

My experience with any appliance with electric motor that was designed for 60hz and then run at 50hz has been 100% failure after repeated use.  That includes hair dryer, electric shaver, power saw, and <something else>.  If a washing machine doesn't really care hz, I'm a bit surprised but gotta think a dryer would be much more sensitive.  Whatever.

 

Good luck.

[lopburi3]

 

Quote

The washer is 120v which i use with step down converter and the 60hz vs 50hz is not an issue for a washer or dryer.

Actually the motor doesn't burn because its working slower and not faster.

 

The problem is 60hz equipment can be made more cheaply and will be subject to overheating if run on 50hz power when this is done (and this is done for just about anything sold in USA as the few cents saved add up and are required in that competitive market).  For an easy to understand overview read section 4 of this link (only a few paragraphs).

 

 

[pampal]

7 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

From that you are simply not going to be able to connect to electrics here unless it is re-wired internally to provide distinctly separate 120v circuits from the 240v.  Just guessing, that may not be a simple endeavor.  Then you would need separate power cords: 1) from a step-down transformer 220 to 110v and 2) from "normal" 220v service.  Ground cannot be connected to the "neutral" as in diagram but to your house ground or it's own stake.

 

My experience with any appliance with electric motor that was designed for 60hz and then run at 50hz has been 100% failure after repeated use.  That includes hair dryer, electric shaver, power saw, and <something else>.  If a washing machine doesn't really care hz, I'm a bit surprised but gotta think a dryer would be much more sensitive.  Whatever.

 

Good luck.

 

Thx for ur input

I have brought many 120v 60hz appliances to countries using  220v 50hz countries

and never had any issues. Mostly fridges and clothes washers.

But i don't discount ur concerns and views.

[pampal]

8 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

 

The problem is 60hz equipment can be made more cheaply and will be subject to overheating if run on 50hz power when this is done (and this is done for just about anything sold in USA as the few cents saved add up and are required in that competitive market).  For an easy to understand overview read section 4 of this link (only a few paragraphs).

 

 

I agree that 50hz motors have heavier windings vis a vis 60hz motors. 

But i have never had problems in this regard.

[Crossy]

You need to do something like this, but truly, if you don't know what you're doing I'd leave well alone.

 

 

 

[bankruatsteve]

Crossy, is that something sold as a product or would it need to be Crossy'd?

 

Otherwise, if you can obtain the wiring schematic for your appliance and post that would help determine how easy or difficult it might be to re-wire.  And, seeing the washer and dryer are separate units with potential to run at the same time, you do need a 30 amp service.

[sandyf]

30 minutes ago, pampal said:

 

Thx for ur input

I have brought many 120v 60hz appliances to countries using  220v 50hz countries

and never had any issues. Mostly fridges and clothes washers.

But i don't discount ur concerns and views.

You are probably quite right in what you say. The problem here stems from having 2 appliances wired as one. The supply is based on 3 wires, L1,L2 and neutral. It would appear that there are 2 motors, one between L1 and neutral and the other L2 and neutral. The heaters are across L1 and L2. 

You cannot supply this from a 2 wire supply. Using a step down transformer could get the motors to run but there would be no supply to the heaters.

The only possibility would be to take the local 3 phase supply if available and step down 2 phases, a lot of hassle and a bit risky, safer to get a new machine.

[pampal]

21 minutes ago, Crossy said:

You need to do something like this, but truly, if you don't know what you're doing I'd leave well alone.

 

 

 

Thx all for ur replies

This machine does not allow simultaneous operation of the washer and drier unit.

Edited September 11, 2016 by pampal
mistake

[pampal]

12 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

Crossy, is that something sold as a product or would it need to be Crossy'd?

 

Otherwise, if you can obtain the wiring schematic for your appliance and post that would help determine how easy or difficult it might be to re-wire.  And, seeing the washer and dryer are separate units with potential to run at the same time, you do need a 30 amp service.

Thanks u read my mind. A wiring schematic would be great.

Unfortunately both units cannot run at the same time.

[bankruatsteve]

Crossy, would two "standard" transformers joined at neutral out do the same thing?

 

Hmm, how does the L1 and L2 get 180 out of phase?

Edited September 11, 2016 by bankruatsteve

[Crossy]

20 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

Crossy, would two "standard" transformers joined at neutral out do the same thing?

 

Possibly, the issue with using two transformers would be guaranteeing correct phasing, I would file it in "too hard".

 

Also, one of our posters suggesting dropping down two phases of a 3-phase supply. Unfortunately this wouldn't work because the US split-phase supply puts L1 and L2 180^o out of phase, the phases of a 3-phase supply are 120^o apart.

 

If our OP could find the internal wiring of his beast (service manual), we could see how easy it would be to re-wire (it would still need a transformer).

 

You could make my circuit up using a regular 220-110 transformer (they are invariably auto-transformers) rated at 2kVA or so.

 

BUT, as I've noted before, it's not something that I would recommend to a DIYer with little electrical knowledge.

 

[pampal]

 

15 minutes ago, Crossy said:

 

Possibly, the issue with using two transformers would be guaranteeing correct phasing, I would file it in "too hard".

 

Also, one of our posters suggesting dropping down two phases of a 3-phase supply. Unfortunately this wouldn't work because the US split-phase supply puts L1 and L2 180^o out of phase, the phases of a 3-phase supply are 120^o apart.

 

If our OP could find the internal wiring of his beast (service manual), we could see how easy it would be to re-wire (it would still need a transformer).

 

You could make my circuit up using a regular 220-110 transformer (they are invariably auto-transformers) rated at 2kVA or so.

 

BUT, as I've noted before, it's not something that I would recommend to a DIYer with little electrical knowledge.

 

Hi Crossy thx for the info

I definitely lack in knowledge regarding electricity

Can u please explin ur diagram in Laymans terms.

My electrician will install it but neither of us understand ur diagram.

Thx

[Crossy]

Just now, pampal said:

My electrician will install it but neither of us understand ur diagram.

 

In which case neither of you are qualified to do the job I'm afraid.

 

I can't give you anything simpler.

[pampal]

Thx anyway to everyone who chimed in

I will install it and post the results.

 

[Crossy]

1 minute ago, pampal said:

Thx anyway to everyone who chimed in

I will install it and post the results.

 

How, if you have no-one who understands simple wiring diagrams (and there's no circuit protection included in my simplistic schematic)?

 

I fear that there could be smoke and tears in the offing

 

[bankruatsteve]

Crossy, to your diagram...  it seems L1 would always be at 220v potential and neutral and L2 always at 0v potential.  Or, how does it get 180 out?  If so, does that create issue?

 

Pampal, give your situation, if you can't obtain wiring schematic for the appliance, I totally agree with Crossy that you need to give up on this.

[Crossy]

N on the OUTPUT side is 110V above L2 @ 90^o relative to L2.

 

This is my main worry, we are putting output N, which the appliance expects to be near ground @ 110V, it will likely be fine, but it may not be

 

We are not being helped by one motor being fed L1-N and the other L2-N

 

The ideal solution would be an isolating transformer that gives us a real 110-0-110 output that can have the 0 (N) ground referenced, sadly you are unlikely to be able to buy something like this from any of the retail outlets and would have to have it made = $$$

 

 

 

 

 

[bankruatsteve]

Oh right, I see I left out a few words after "neutral".  My thought was that would leave N and L2 at unexpected potentials to what the design might require.  I think the best advice for those following this is to purchase electronics in the country they are intended to be used.

 

[bankruatsteve]

Crossy, this has me intrigued so hope I'm not beating the dead horse...

 

What if there was a 220v to 220v (or 240v) transformer with a connection to the mid-point.  Would that give the 180 offset between L1 and L2 leaving N with zero?  And, wouldn't that make it isolated?  Not sure what "wave" that would have but maybe not matter?