Property rights. Phuket & Mauritius

[harleyclarkey]

Mauritius, an island not unlike Phuket but cleverly choose the five-star route, changed her property laws to make it easier to own, legally own, property in your own name with no fraud involved.

Why can Phuket not follow suit and give us a break? One property, minimum value and if they cannot stomach the thought of freehold then a 100-year lease?

Mauritius is also clever enough to allow full residency if you take in 100k dollars (can go towards property?). OK..not everyone has 100k under their pillow but they do allow residency and no <deleted> visa runs or 90 day reporting.

Whether you have a residence permit or not, there are no restrictions today for non-citizens who wish to acquire a residential unit as part of an IRS, RES or PDS. The same goes for a residential unit developed as part of a Smart City plan, or an apartment that is located in a building of at least two floors (excluding the ground floor)

It should be noted that concerning the purchase price of a property, the investment will have to be of at least 6 million rupees.

[Old Croc]

Mauritius is a country. Phuket is the smallest Province of Thailand and doesn't have foreign land ownership laws separate from the rest of the country.

It would be untenable for Phuket to have land ownership rules out of step with the rest of Thailand no matter how much one may wish for it. 

 

[Old Croc]

Mauritius sounds like a good place to retire if you can meet the need to transfer 40k US dollars every year.

 

http://www.expat.com/en/guide/africa/mauritius/5422-retire-in-mauritius.html

[KarenBravo]

4 hours ago, Old Croc said:

Mauritius is a country. Phuket is the smallest Province of Thailand and doesn't have foreign land ownership laws separate from the rest of the country.

It would be untenable for Phuket to have land ownership rules out of step with the rest of Thailand no matter how much one may wish for it. 

 

Nope. The smallest province in Thailand by land area is Samut Songkhram.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samut_Songkhram_Province

 

Phuket = 543 sq.km.

Samut Songkhram = 417 sq.km.

http://www.statoids.com/uth.html

Edited February 8, 2017 by KarenBravo

[Old Croc]

3 hours ago, KarenBravo said:

Nope. The smallest province in Thailand by land area is Samut Songkhram.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samut_Songkhram_Province

 

Phuket = 543 sq.km.

Samut Songkhram = 417 sq.km.

http://www.statoids.com/uth.html

You're right, I am wrong. Thanks for pointing that out.

I'm sure I read somewhere that Phuket was the smallest and have had the wrong impression since.

Always happy to be corrected on factual information.

[KarenBravo]

1 minute ago, Old Croc said:

You're right, I am wrong. Thanks for pointing that out.

I'm sure I read somewhere that Phuket was the smallest and have had the wrong impression since.

Always happy to be corrected on factual information.

My pleasure.

I, too, have heard many times over the years that Phuket was the smallest province.

[harleyclarkey]

On 08/02/2017 at 5:47 PM, Old Croc said:

Mauritius sounds like a good place to retire if you can meet the need to transfer 40k US dollars every year.

 

http://www.expat.com/en/guide/africa/mauritius/5422-retire-in-mauritius.html

 

No...it is not $40k every year.

You bring in either;

$100k which is meant to be spent in 3 years but in reality it can go towards a property. The residency process starts when you show the funds in the bank and not after three years.

Buy for $160k and in both cases get a legal residency.

 

Also....unlike this awful country and it's penal property laws you actually own full title to the property. 

The property law is more or less based on the English law. 

[harleyclarkey]

On 08/02/2017 at 5:41 PM, Old Croc said:

Mauritius is a country. Phuket is the smallest Province of Thailand and doesn't have foreign land ownership laws separate from the rest of the country.

It would be untenable for Phuket to have land ownership rules out of step with the rest of Thailand no matter how much one may wish for it. 

 

 

Indeed....it was just a comparison of two "paradise islands"

[harleyclarkey]

It is just that so, so many foreigners (all men?) have been cheated out of their properties due to an utterly vile corrupt system.

 

 Indeed may I say it is so designed so s to fleece these guys of their properties?

[NamKangMan]

You may wish to consider Malaysia.  Their "Malaysia My 2nd Home" program has some good incentives.

 

http://www.mm2h.gov.my/index.php/en/

 

Also, Vietnam now offering 50 year leases to foreigners. 

 

 

[stevenl]

No...it is not $40k every year.
You bring in either;
$100k which is meant to be spent in 3 years but in reality it can go towards a property. The residency process starts when you show the funds in the bank and not after three years.
Buy for $160k and in both cases get a legal residency.
 
Also....unlike this awful country and it's penal property laws you actually own full title to the property. 
The property law is more or less based on the English law. 

Are you living in this 'awful country'?

sent using Tapatalk

[simon43]

Interesting information about Mauritius.  I often thought about what will happen if I happen to have a small hotel (my 5th LoL) or whatever on rented land in Thailand, and I die.  The business is effectively lost.

 

If I own a condo in Pattaya or whatever, I doubt that my children in the UK will be interested in taking it on.

 

But if I 100% owned a small property in Mauritius, I'm sure they wouldn't turn their noses up to it.

 

I've chatted many times with radio hams in Mauritius - perhaps I will pop over and check out the island.

[NamKangMan]

A little off topic, but, as a visa runner, I often meet expats that used to live in Thailand, and quite a few of them have their Thai missus with them.

 

I suppose, if the Thai missus refuses to relocate with you, especially if you are the sole provider, then that could say a lot about your relationship, but that's for another thread.

 

Point is, leaving Thailand, and all its problems for foreigners, doesn't mean you have to leave your Thai missus. 

[harleyclarkey]

2 hours ago, simon43 said:

Interesting information about Mauritius.  I often thought about what will happen if I happen to have a small hotel (my 5th LoL) or whatever on rented land in Thailand, and I die.  The business is effectively lost.

 

If I own a condo in Pattaya or whatever, I doubt that my children in the UK will be interested in taking it on.

 

But if I 100% owned a small property in Mauritius, I'm sure they wouldn't turn their noses up to it.

 

I've chatted many times with radio hams in Mauritius - perhaps I will pop over and check out the island.

 

I am with a great and fantastic Mauritian lady and so I will be buying something there....perhaps even a boutique hotel!

 

Rentals for the high season are off the scale and you will get nothing, and I do mean nothing, to rent unless you book 1-2 years ahead. 

Yes, there are what we call Indian apartments but these tend to be very basic and not up to rental to a westerner. The tourists to Mauritius tend to be very well heeled and money is no object for the right place in the right location.

 

I been a few times and while I would get cabin fever on a small island it is very well served by international flights....inc Bangkok to Port Louis the capital. 

 

Great thing here is you own the whole shebang....land and building.

 

[harleyclarkey]

2 hours ago, stevenl said:

Are you living in this 'awful country'?

sent using Tapatalk
 

 

I used to Steve...then I got sense.

 

First trip here was back in the late eighties.....wonderful, great place then.

And now? A truly awful place where everything is designed to work against you. 

I realised that we are not welcome in Thailand

[harleyclarkey]

2 hours ago, NamKangMan said:

You may wish to consider Malaysia.  Their "Malaysia My 2nd Home" program has some good incentives.

 

http://www.mm2h.gov.my/index.php/en/

 

Also, Vietnam now offering 50 year leases to foreigners. 

 

 

 

True NKM....a great option especially on the east coast with world class beaches.

As far as I know you can own land and property legally with rights....unlike Thailand

[stevenl]

I used to Steve...then I got sense.
 
First trip here was back in the late eighties.....wonderful, great place then.
And now? A truly awful place where everything is designed to work against you. 
I realised that we are not welcome in Thailand

Thanks, that explains it.

sent using Tapatalk

[madmax2]

I really do not believe expats are going to rush of to live there, not the ones i know anyway

Nigeria would probably suite some expats better, it is the land of conmen 

[DrDave]

15 hours ago, harleyclarkey said:

No...it is not $40k every year.

You bring in either;

$100k which is meant to be spent in 3 years but in reality it can go towards a property. The residency process starts when you show the funds in the bank and not after three years.

Buy for $160k and in both cases get a legal residency.

 

Also....unlike this awful country and it's penal property laws you actually own full title to the property. 

The property law is more or less based on the English law. 

I've always wondered about Mauritius, as I had a work colleague from there.

 

I just did a quick search for real estate in Mauritius, and didn't find any western-quality detached homes for under a half million USD that are approved for purchase by a foreigner. As I understand it, non-citizens can only purchase homes in developments that the government has designated as permissible for foreign ownership (designated as "IRS" or "RES"). Under the "IRS" scheme, the minimum land and home price is 500,000 USD. Most homes I saw were in the 700,000 to 1,000,000+ USD range with very little land, and seemed to be comparable to homes selling for about half that much in Phuket.

 

According to the following government website, as a retiree you must prove that you have brought the equivalent of 40,000 USD into Mauritius in each of the preceding 3 years at the time that you submit your application for a Permanent Residency Permit:  InvestMauritius.com/faqs/residence-permit

 

 

 

[harleyclarkey]

3 hours ago, DrDave said:

I've always wondered about Mauritius, as I had a work colleague from there.

 

I just did a quick search for real estate in Mauritius, and didn't find any western-quality detached homes for under a half million USD that are approved for purchase by a foreigner. As I understand it, non-citizens can only purchase homes in developments that the government has designated as permissible for foreign ownership (designated as "IRS" or "RES"). Under the "IRS" scheme, the minimum land and home price is 500,000 USD. Most homes I saw were in the 700,000 to 1,000,000+ USD range with very little land, and seemed to be comparable to homes selling for about half that much in Phuket.

 

According to the following government website, as a retiree you must prove that you have brought the equivalent of 40,000 USD into Mauritius in each of the preceding 3 years at the time that you submit your application for a Permanent Residency Permit:  InvestMauritius.com/faqs/residence-permit

 

 

 

 

Dave...no, this has changed end of last year. You can buy a property of at least 6 m rupees (150k euro) once it is in a complex of at least two stories. Maybe designed so you do not own the ground (literally) floor?) Clever that!

 

Those RES schemes are a ripoff and totally out of line with the cost of living in Mauritius. I guess now they will become redundant. Hope so.

 

I was in with the investment board and the residency section and the $100k is lodged in a Mauritian bank and supposed to be used for living over three years. I pointed out that you couldn't really spend $33k a year. I asked if the 100k could be used to buy a property....like who would check. A smile and a silent reply! They don't check.

 

But now you just buy a place for 150k euro....you actually own it....and residency.

[harleyclarkey]

8 hours ago, stevenl said:

Thanks, that explains it.

sent using Tapatalk
 

 

 

You wouldn't beleive how great a place Phuket was then. The people actually liked and helped you. The smiles were genuine. No rip offs, no issues, no mafia, very few cops. I could stay on Patong beach in a lovely hotel, right on the beach, for little or nothing. There were very few hotels then

Surin beach had two straw huts as bar/.restaurants and was as laid back a paradise as you could find.

 

It is very difficult to see how it has degenerated to what it is now. Paradise to hell for many in a mere 3 decades.

That is why my interest in Mauritius....I will for certain be heading there. Not to live but for my getaway with my Mauritian GF. 

Mauritian women are in a different league to the scheming Thai bar women. Never had time for them...the Thai bar girl that is!

Edited February 11, 2017 by harleyclarkey

[stevenl]

33 minutes ago, harleyclarkey said:

You wouldn't beleive how great a place Phuket was then. The people actually liked and helped you. The smiles were genuine. No rip offs, no issues, no mafia, very few cops. I could stay on Patong beach in a lovely hotel, right on the beach, for little or nothing. There were very few hotels then

Surin beach had two straw huts as bar/.restaurants and was as laid back a paradise as you could find.

 

It is very difficult to see how it has degenerated to what it is now. Paradise to hell for many in a mere 3 decades.

That is why my interest in Mauritius....I will for certain be heading there. Not to live but for my getaway with my Mauritian GF. 

Mauritian women are in a different league to the scheming Thai bar women. Never had time for them...the Thai bar girl that is!

I strongly disagree with your present assessment, and don't understand why people who find it an awful place and have moved away because of that are still hanging around on a forum like this, I can only think out of bitterness. But each to his own.

[harleyclarkey]

37 minutes ago, stevenl said:

I strongly disagree with your present assessment, and don't understand why people who find it an awful place and have moved away because of that are still hanging around on a forum like this, I can only think out of bitterness. But each to his own.

 

 

 

 

You have it so, so wrong. Bitter? No, I see the real Thailand and what it stands for. 

 

Thailand.

The cops are rotten, the courts are rotten, the lawyers are rotten,  corruption is rife, there is racist pricing, foreigners can own nothing, the local sport is stealing property from foreigners, driving is lethal and abysmal, there is no enforcement, certain areas are big into human trafficking. 

What have I missed? 

O, yes. It is a military dictatorship which oversees and utterly corrupt police force. And, of course, the restriction on freedom of speech and the new licence for journalists. Nice one that!

 

And you think nothing is wrong.

I cannot understand apologists for Thailand. 

 

Sorry....is the forum only for residents?

 

 

Edited February 11, 2017 by harleyclarkey

[stevenl]

21 minutes ago, harleyclarkey said:

 

You have it so, so wrong. Bitter? No, I see the real Thailand and what it stands for. 

 

Thailand.

The cops are rotten, the courts are rotten, the lawyers are rotten,  corruption is rife, there is racist pricing, foreigners can own nothing, the local sport is stealing property from foreigners, driving is lethal and abysmal, there is no enforcement, certain areas are big into human trafficking. 

What have I missed? 

O, yes. It is a military dictatorship which oversees and utterly corrupt police force. And, of course, the restriction on freedom of speech and the new licence for journalists. Nice one that!

 

And you think nothing is wrong.

I cannot understand apologists for Thailand. 

 

Sorry....is the forum only for residents?

 

 

Yes, as I said, bitter. I'm glad your perspective is different from mine.

[harleyclarkey]

7 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Yes, as I said, bitter. I'm glad your perspective is different from mine.

This is all off topic Steve.

 

Nothing to do with bitter. I merely have stated facts...nothing else.

Sorry to see that one of us has rose tinted glasses.

 

I hope you never have to endure the utterly rotten legal and governance system that two friends of mine are currently going through, and have been for over 5 years now.  Clear fraudulent conversion of their properties. There was actually a BBC programme about it, it is that bad. This is just one of the realities for me. 

 

By the way, I did live there and had a great time. Again, a long time ago.

 

Anyway, Steve, enjoy your time in Thailand....I did ....once a long time ago. But I have moved on.