Do you think Trump will be impeached or forced to resign?

[amvet]

11 minutes ago, Thakkar said:

The most consequential lies are often the lies we tell ourselves. 

“I have the best words.”

“I’m like a really smart person”

“I know more than the generals”

“I’m worth $10 billion”

“No puppet, you’re the puppet”

 

Trump is a penny ante liar. Habitual, pathological, yes, but Penny ante nonetheless. On the other hand, he rarely tells the truth either. Almost as if trying to make up in quantity what he lacks in quality. A quality lie is something like:

 

“Don’t want a smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud”

 

Which delivers a succinct lie by asserting something everyone can agree with. Don’t think we can expect that kind of finesse from Trump. Even if someone writes it for him, it will be botched in the delivery when he adds: “believe me”

So what has he done to warrant impeachment?  Is being a habitual liar an impeachable offense?  Maybe so.  When has he lied under oath?

[ilostmypassword]

2 minutes ago, amvet said:

Repeating her condemnation of Clinton for lying under oath in the Paula Corbin Jones sexual harassment lawsuit, U.S. District Judge Susan Webber Wright said that she was imposing the sanction to cover some of Jones’ legal expenses and “to deter others who might consider emulating the president’s misconduct.  In April 1999, U.S. District Judge Susan Webber Wright found Clinton in contempt of court for giving false testimony in the Paula Jones sexual harassment trial and fined him over $90,000.  Guilty not innocent.  

 

If Trump lies under oath and it is ruled a high crime or misdemeanor I'm sure someone will try to impeach him.  Until then it is only your opinion and he is nowhere near the top of the biggest Presidential liars.  

Only according to your ludicrously jury-rigged criteria.

[amvet]

15 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Only according to your ludicrously jury-rigged criteria.

Clinton lied under oath and was fined $90 thousand dollars (crime lying - punishment 90 grand fine).  Nixon had to resign or be impeached because he lied (crime lying - punishment resign or impeachment).  Trump has

done nothing that is an impeachable offense yet.  When he does I'm sure someone will let you know. 

Edited November 1, 2017 by amvet

[ilostmypassword]

16 minutes ago, amvet said:

Clinton lied under oath and was fined $90 thousand dollars (crime lying - punishment 90 grand fine).  Nixon had to resign or be impeached because he lied (crime lying - punishment resign or impeachment).  Trump has

done nothing that is an impeachable offense yet.  When he does I'm sure someone will let you know. 

And Trump pleaded no contest to fraud and had to pay 25,000,000 to 7000 people.

The point is, who made you the arbiter of what constitutes the biggest liar in the white house? Fundamentally it's a stupid argument and basically a piece of troll bait. There are no objective criteria. But it is undeniably true that no president has ever lied as much or as often as Donald Trump.

[MrPatrickThai]

20 minutes ago, amvet said:

Clinton lied under oath and was fined $90 thousand dollars (crime lying - punishment 90 grand fine).  Nixon had to resign or be impeached because he lied (crime lying - punishment resign or impeachment).  Trump has

done nothing that is an impeachable offense yet.  When he does I'm sure someone will let you know. 

These anti-trump intellectuals that arrogantly think they're more supreme to half the electorate, and forget that one is  innocent until proven guilty.

[MrPatrickThai]

1 minute ago, ilostmypassword said:

And Trump pleaded no contest to fraud and had to pay 25,000,000 to 7000 people.

The point is, who made you the arbiter of what constitutes the biggest liar in the white house? Fundamentally it's a stupid argument and basically a piece of troll bait. There are no objective criteria. But it is undeniably true that no president has ever lied as much or as often as Donald Trump.

You sound rather bitter, I guess you don't believe in the democratic process?

[MrPatrickThai]

1 hour ago, amvet said:

How long to you think it takes to impeach a fellow? Has he committed any high crimes or misdemeanors?  List em.  Is it a crime to ask a foreign government if they know anything bad about a rival?  Who paid the Russians for the Steele dossier? Trump?  

You're on the ball buddy, but you'll be ignored, or even worse.

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, MrPatrickThai said:

These anti-trump intellectuals that arrogantly think they're more supreme to half the electorate, and forget that one is  innocent until proven guilty.

Yes, I remember when those intellectuals were chanting "Lock her up. Lock her up." As I recall, someone who is currently President of the United States had something to do with that? No, I must be wrong. No person running for President could ever sink that low.

[Andaman Al]

20 minutes ago, MrPatrickThai said:

These anti-trump intellectuals that arrogantly think they're more supreme to half the electorate, and forget that one is  innocent until proven guilty.

These Trump anti-intellectuals that arrogantly think they're more supreme to half the electorate, and forget that one is  innocent until proven guilty.......................Did you all forget that with Hillary Clinton? Even when she was investigated and judged innocent by a Republican run Congressional inquiry FOUR times! The Trumpsters still scream guilty.

[dundas]

If Putin could see this conversation, if I can call it that, he would be laughing. First, pay good Russian money (recent FB testimony) to Facebook, Google and Twitter to have a divisive president elected, and then immediately after the election pay good Russian money to Facebook et al to cast doubt on the legitimacy of the election win. Wars don't have to be won with guns, if you've got social media to fire your (metaphorical) bullets.  And this is still a hotly contested issue in the United States? 

Edited November 1, 2017 by dundas

[craigt3365]

9 hours ago, MrPatrickThai said:

Very true. Trump is doing a great job despite those out to bring him down. Nixon and Clinton had it easy. 

Please tell us what Trump has done that's great.  Just one thing would be OK.

[craigt3365]

9 hours ago, amvet said:

I didn't say he didn't lie.  My comment was to the poster who claimed he was the number one liar to have ever been President and that's not even close to being true.  Nixon and Clinton beat him hands down.  

Amazing you think this.  Based on the lies that have come from Trump.  I find it bizarre anybody could think Trump is not the #1 liar.  When that fact is well documented.

 

Nixon and Clinton did lie.  And they paid the price for it.  Trump has lied.  Hopefully he'll pay the same price.  Impeachment.

[craigt3365]

2 minutes ago, MrPatrickThai said:

Every time I reply to you, and you disagree, you run to your moderator pal and I get a suspension. Please don't write to me again.

Make a truthful post and be polite to others and you don't get into trouble.  Not hard to follow those rules.

 

So ya got nothing.  Again. 

 

Seriously.  I hear this all the time from Trump supporters, what great things he's done.  I'm desperately trying to find just one significant piece of legislation he's passed?  What has he done?  I'm all ears....or eyeballs in this case. LOL

[Srikcir]

26 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Please tell us what Trump has done that's great.

Trump has shown that his unconstitutional presidential orders will be foiled by the US judicial system.

And that has been Great for America.

[ilostmypassword]

17 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Make a truthful post and be polite to others and you don't get into trouble.  Not hard to follow those rules.

 

So ya got nothing.  Again. 

 

Seriously.  I hear this all the time from Trump supporters, what great things he's done.  I'm desperately trying to find just one significant piece of legislation he's passed?  What has he done?  I'm all ears....or eyeballs in this case. LOL

Well he appointed a supreme court justice who had previously decided that it was ok to fire a worker for taking action to avoid freezing to death.

[CaptHaddock]

8 hours ago, Thakkar said:

The most consequential lies are often the lies we tell ourselves. 

“I have the best words.”

“I’m like a really smart person”

“I know more than the generals”

“I’m worth $10 billion”

“No puppet, you’re the puppet”

 

Trump is a penny ante liar. Habitual, pathological, yes, but Penny ante nonetheless. On the other hand, he rarely tells the truth either.

 

Descriptions like this, while true as far as they go, fail to capture something essential about Trump's lying.  Because we all lie at one time or another, we assume that we understand what lying is and that other people lie in just the way that we ourselves sometimes lie.  But, in fact, for psychopaths like Trump, lying is an activity unlike anything the rest of us experience in our lives.  As I have said here before, Trump lives in a world composed exclusively of enemies and dupes.  According to Tony Schwartz, who spent every day with Trump for eighteen months writing his book, not only has Trump no friends at all, but Schwartz never heard mention of the name of any of Trump's kids from Trump during that time, much less did the Donald ever so much as have lunch with any of them.  This is an emotional landscape that, while bizarre beyond description to most of us, is where Trump has lived his entire life. 

 

For most of us when we lie, the crucial point is to gain some advantage by being believed of something which is not true.  When Trump brays some lie that everyone in the room knows to be patently false, such as having the biggest inauguration attendance in history, something very different it is taking place.  Trump, surrounded as he perceives himself to be only by enemies and dupes, is displaying his power in the most flagrant way with his bold-faced lie, which he well knows everyone recognizes as a lie.  Anyone can speak the truth; it takes no special power.  But to lie in the most flagrant way with impunity uniquely demonstrates true power.  In a world of enemies and dupes, why would truth matter anyway?

 

We can see this with the variety of executives and film producers who have recently been accused publicly for the first time of sexual harassment and then resigned.  They resigned, but only because they did not have enough power to resist the truth.  But Trump didn't resign the campaign, when sixteen women accused him of various sexual abuses including rape.  Because Trump has more power than has-beens like Cosby and Weinstein. 

 

This is why, when faced with Trump's incessant, transparent lying, those of us who recognize his lying for what it is, do not feel consoled that truth is on our side, but persistently disturbed that somehow truth doesn't seem to matter anymore.

 

That's why it is useless to point out Trump's lies to the Trumphead posters here.  They are eager to join the class of dupes, because they want to be with the winner.  Truth matters as little to them as to Trump, because they also live in a world where only power matters, but they don't have any.  So, they aspire to ally themselves with a powerful leader who might protect them somehow.  His very incorrigibility is their hope.  This is why the Trumpheads not only seem stupid to us, but even abject.

[Thakkar]

1 hour ago, craigt3365 said:

Please tell us what Trump has done that's great.  Just one thing would be OK.

He has brought white supremacy into the White House. To white supremacists, that’s a great achievement.

[Thakkar]

1 hour ago, CaptHaddock said:

Descriptions like this, while true as far as they go, fail to capture something essential about Trump's lying.  Because we all lie at one time or another, we assume that we understand what lying is and that other people lie in just the way that we ourselves sometimes lie.  But, in fact, for psychopaths like Trump, lying is an activity unlike anything the rest of us experience in our lives.  As I have said here before, Trump lives in a world composed exclusively of enemies and dupes.  According to Tony Schwartz, who spent every day with Trump for eighteen months writing his book, not only has Trump no friends at all, but Schwartz never heard mention of the name of any of Trump's kids from Trump during that time, much less did the Donald ever so much as have lunch with any of them.  This is an emotional landscape that, while bizarre beyond description to most of us, is where Trump has lived his entire life. 

 

For most of us when we lie, the crucial point is to gain some advantage by being believed of something which is not true.  When Trump brays some lie that everyone in the room knows to be patently false, such as having the biggest inauguration attendance in history, something very different it is taking place.  Trump, surrounded as he perceives himself to be only by enemies and dupes, is displaying his power in the most flagrant way with his bold-faced lie, which he well knows everyone recognizes as a lie.  Anyone can speak the truth; it takes no special power.  But to lie in the most flagrant way with impunity uniquely demonstrates true power.  In a world of enemies and dupes, why would truth matter anyway?

 

We can see this with the variety of executives and film producers who have recently been accused publicly for the first time of sexual harassment and then resigned.  They resigned, but only because they did not have enough power to resist the truth.  But Trump didn't resign the campaign, when sixteen women accused him of various sexual abuses including rape.  Because Trump has more power than has-beens like Cosby and Weinstein. 

 

This is why, when faced with Trump's incessant, transparent lying, those of us who recognize his lying for what it is, do not feel consoled that truth is on our side, but persistently disturbed that somehow truth doesn't seem to matter anymore.

 

That's why it is useless to point out Trump's lies to the Trumphead posters here.  They are eager to join the class of dupes, because they want to be with the winner.  Truth matters as little to them as to Trump, because they also live in a world where only power matters, but they don't have any.  So, they aspire to ally themselves with a powerful leader who might protect them somehow.  His very incorrigibility is their hope.  This is why the Trumpheads not only seem stupid to us, but even abject.

??

[Andaman Al]

1 hour ago, CaptHaddock said:

Descriptions like this, while true as far as they go, fail to capture something essential about Trump's lying.  Because we all lie at one time or another, we assume that we understand what lying is and that other people lie in just the way that we ourselves sometimes lie.  But, in fact, for psychopaths like Trump, lying is an activity unlike anything the rest of us experience in our lives.  As I have said here before, Trump lives in a world composed exclusively of enemies and dupes.  According to Tony Schwartz, who spent every day with Trump for eighteen months writing his book, not only has Trump no friends at all, but Schwartz never heard mention of the name of any of Trump's kids from Trump during that time, much less did the Donald ever so much as have lunch with any of them.  This is an emotional landscape that, while bizarre beyond description to most of us, is where Trump has lived his entire life. 

 

For most of us when we lie, the crucial point is to gain some advantage by being believed of something which is not true.  When Trump brays some lie that everyone in the room knows to be patently false, such as having the biggest inauguration attendance in history, something very different it is taking place.  Trump, surrounded as he perceives himself to be only by enemies and dupes, is displaying his power in the most flagrant way with his bold-faced lie, which he well knows everyone recognizes as a lie.  Anyone can speak the truth; it takes no special power.  But to lie in the most flagrant way with impunity uniquely demonstrates true power.  In a world of enemies and dupes, why would truth matter anyway?

 

We can see this with the variety of executives and film producers who have recently been accused publicly for the first time of sexual harassment and then resigned.  They resigned, but only because they did not have enough power to resist the truth.  But Trump didn't resign the campaign, when sixteen women accused him of various sexual abuses including rape.  Because Trump has more power than has-beens like Cosby and Weinstein. 

 

This is why, when faced with Trump's incessant, transparent lying, those of us who recognize his lying for what it is, do not feel consoled that truth is on our side, but persistently disturbed that somehow truth doesn't seem to matter anymore.

 

That's why it is useless to point out Trump's lies to the Trumphead posters here.  They are eager to join the class of dupes, because they want to be with the winner.  Truth matters as little to them as to Trump, because they also live in a world where only power matters, but they don't have any.  So, they aspire to ally themselves with a powerful leader who might protect them somehow.  His very incorrigibility is their hope.  This is why the Trumpheads not only seem stupid to us, but even abject.

Thank you for that analysis, it is about as good as it gets, it should be in the NYT or WP letters page.

[ilostmypassword]

3 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

Make a truthful post and be polite to others and you don't get into trouble.  Not hard to follow those rules.

 

So ya got nothing.  Again. 

 

Seriously.  I hear this all the time from Trump supporters, what great things he's done.  I'm desperately trying to find just one significant piece of legislation he's passed?  What has he done?  I'm all ears....or eyeballs in this case. LOL

 

3 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

Well he appointed a supreme court justice who had previously decided that it was ok to fire a worker for taking action to avoid freezing to death.

I should have added that there were 9 justices on the panel hearing the case and that Gorsuch was the only justice who voted against the worker.

[amvet]

4 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

Amazing you think this.  Based on the lies that have come from Trump.  I find it bizarre anybody could think Trump is not the #1 liar.  When that fact is well documented.

 

Nixon and Clinton did lie.  And they paid the price for it.  Trump has lied.  Hopefully he'll pay the same price.  Impeachment.

Nixon and Clinton both were guilty of impeachable offenses.  What Trump lie makes the grade of an impeachable offense?

[amvet]

3 hours ago, CaptHaddock said:

Descriptions like this, while true as far as they go, fail to capture something essential about Trump's lying.  Because we all lie at one time or another, we assume that we understand what lying is and that other people lie in just the way that we ourselves sometimes lie.  But, in fact, for psychopaths like Trump, lying is an activity unlike anything the rest of us experience in our lives.  As I have said here before, Trump lives in a world composed exclusively of enemies and dupes.  According to Tony Schwartz, who spent every day with Trump for eighteen months writing his book, not only has Trump no friends at all, but Schwartz never heard mention of the name of any of Trump's kids from Trump during that time, much less did the Donald ever so much as have lunch with any of them.  This is an emotional landscape that, while bizarre beyond description to most of us, is where Trump has lived his entire life. 

 

For most of us when we lie, the crucial point is to gain some advantage by being believed of something which is not true.  When Trump brays some lie that everyone in the room knows to be patently false, such as having the biggest inauguration attendance in history, something very different it is taking place.  Trump, surrounded as he perceives himself to be only by enemies and dupes, is displaying his power in the most flagrant way with his bold-faced lie, which he well knows everyone recognizes as a lie.  Anyone can speak the truth; it takes no special power.  But to lie in the most flagrant way with impunity uniquely demonstrates true power.  In a world of enemies and dupes, why would truth matter anyway?

 

We can see this with the variety of executives and film producers who have recently been accused publicly for the first time of sexual harassment and then resigned.  They resigned, but only because they did not have enough power to resist the truth.  But Trump didn't resign the campaign, when sixteen women accused him of various sexual abuses including rape.  Because Trump has more power than has-beens like Cosby and Weinstein. 

 

This is why, when faced with Trump's incessant, transparent lying, those of us who recognize his lying for what it is, do not feel consoled that truth is on our side, but persistently disturbed that somehow truth doesn't seem to matter anymore.

 

That's why it is useless to point out Trump's lies to the Trumphead posters here.  They are eager to join the class of dupes, because they want to be with the winner.  Truth matters as little to them as to Trump, because they also live in a world where only power matters, but they don't have any.  So, they aspire to ally themselves with a powerful leader who might protect them somehow.  His very incorrigibility is their hope.  This is why the Trumpheads not only seem stupid to us, but even abject.

What lies has Trump that make the grade of impeachable offense (the topic of this thread).

[craigt3365]

9 minutes ago, amvet said:

Nixon and Clinton both were guilty of impeachable offenses.  What Trump lie makes the grade of an impeachable offense?

Agreed.  What's that got to do with your statement they were bigger liars?  Just because it got them impeached?  Which happened a long time after the offenses took place.

 

Trump is hands down the bigger liar we've had as president.  Whether that gets him impeached is another issue.  But no denying, Trump's the Liar in Chief.

[amvet]

17 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Agreed.  What's that got to do with your statement they were bigger liars?  Just because it got them impeached?  Which happened a long time after the offenses took place.

 

Trump is hands down the bigger liar we've had as president.  Whether that gets him impeached is another issue.  But no denying, Trump's the Liar in Chief.

 On May 27,1997  the Supreme Court unanimously ruled against Clinton and Jones trial went ahead.  Clinton Impeachment Dec 19, 1998 – Feb 12, 1999.  Is a year a long time?  Clinton did not get Impeached for exposing himself to her.  He got impeached for lying under oath while he was President.  Nixon had to resign because he directed the coverup of a burglary when he was President.  Neither offense took place long before Clinton and Nixon were Presidents.  What has Trump done since he was President that is an impeachable offense?  Simple question and topic of this thread.

Edited November 2, 2017 by amvet

[craigt3365]

13 minutes ago, amvet said:

 On May 27,1997  the Supreme Court unanimously ruled against Clinton and Jones trial went ahead.  Clinton Impeachment Dec 19, 1998 – Feb 12, 1999.  Is a year a long time?  Clinton did not get Impeached for exposing himself to her.  He got impeached for lying under oath while he was President.  Nixon had to resign because he directed the coverup of a burglary when he was President.  Neither offense took place long before Clinton and Nixon were Presidents.  What has Trump done since he was President that is an impeachable offense?  Simple question and topic of this thread.

Him being a liar is what could get him impeached.  Comey, Flynn, Russian ambassador, etc.  All of which he lied about.  These things take time....

 

Anyway, amazing you support him so strongly.  You've still not told us what he's accomplished so far.

[Srikcir]

2 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

These things take time

And time does not favor Trump.

Mueller will interview White House communications director 28 y.o. Hope Hicks after Trump returns from his Asia trip. Mueller’s team is also expected to interview three or four other current White House officials.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/31/mueller-russia-investigation-hope-hicks-interview-244382

http://www.cosmopolitan.com/politics/news/a56404/who-is-hope-hicks-trump-press-secretary/

Looks like Mueller may be saving Trump as the last White House interview.

[Rimmer]

A couple of posts have been removed, please discuss the topic not other posters, thank you.

[craigt3365]

2 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

And time does not favor Trump.

Mueller will interview White House communications director 28 y.o. Hope Hicks after Trump returns from his Asia trip. Mueller’s team is also expected to interview three or four other current White House officials.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/31/mueller-russia-investigation-hope-hicks-interview-244382

http://www.cosmopolitan.com/politics/news/a56404/who-is-hope-hicks-trump-press-secretary/

Looks like Mueller may be saving Trump as the last White House interview.

I read a report that said they are holding the big fish for last.  Want to get their ducks all lined up.  Flynn, Trump Jr., Kushner, then Trump.  Grab the popcorn!!! LOL

[craigt3365]

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2017/11/01/trump-blames-son-in-law-jared-kushner-for-muellers-widening-russia-probe-report-says.html

Trump blames son-in-law Jared Kushner for Mueller’s widening Russia probe, report says

[heybruce]

15 hours ago, amvet said:

How long to you think it takes to impeach a fellow? Has he committed any high crimes or misdemeanors?  List em.  Is it a crime to ask a foreign government if they know anything bad about a rival?  Who paid the Russians for the Steele dossier? Trump?  

"Has he committed any high crimes or misdemeanors? "

 

As I explained in an earlier post, "high crimes and misdemeanors" are whatever Congress decides they are.  If Mueller gets into Trump's financial records, which seems likely, I'm sure he'll find things that make the millions of money laundering and tax evasion that Manafort is accused of look trivial.

 

"Is it a crime to ask a foreign government if they know anything bad about a rival?"

 

Yes.  Accepting any material assistance from a foreign government to further an election campaign is illegal.

 

"Who paid the Russians for the Steele dossier?"

 

Nobody.  First a Republican candidate, then the DNC, then the Justice Department paid GPS Fusion for research.