Brexit has created chaos in Britain – nobody voted for this

[nauseus]

7 hours ago, Grouse said:

Is it acceptable to have photoshopped insulting pictures of former prime ministers on TV? I bet if I posted a similar picture of Netanyahu I would be given a suspension. The man was wrong about weapons of mass destruction (though Saddam DID have Sarin). He was right about much else. Drop it. 

 

https://goo.gl/images/MnMaEB

Drop Blair, you mean?

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, CG1 Blue said:

Laws change

Not unless I say so!

 

We have an opt out of the Eurobut this will be lost if we are dragged out and then reapply

[aright]

32 minutes ago, Grouse said:

A while ago you told us you were a qualified social anthropologist? Historian? Please excuse me if I have misunderstood. Anyway, I would expect better from and educated man. To not specify a super majority was an appalling error by Cameron. He knows it, you know it really. Even 60/40 would have been just about adequate. I'll leave it to you to explain from a PPE point of view the underpinnings of representative parliamentary democracy 

No I said I was a qualified apologist...I think 

I would have expected an educated man not to use an expression like "from and educated man" which I don't understand. Its difficult to parley in a foreign tongue.

The only recent thing I remember about Representative Parliamentary Democracy is the Lower House voted by 498 votes to 114 to Trigger Article 50. True Parliamentary Democracy in action I would have thought...no doubt you approve. Mind you the split was only 81/19 so it would only just have got in had they adopted Simcards rule.

As an aside I was in Patts not so long ago and had a breakfast business meeting. The meeting lasted about an hour at which point we went our separate ways. On my way back to the hotel I passed a bar where they were showing the Eng/NZ Test match. Being a bit of a cricket fan I went in sat at the bar watching the cricket over a cup of tea(I never touch alcohol before 9:30am).  After a while bloke came in and sat next to me. After about 10 mins he turned to me and said "I'm bored". I explained cricket affected some people that way. he said "No I am bored"  I patiently explained if I explained the rules to him he might be less bored. No he said very excitedly "I am Bord From Sveden"  I spilt my tea and almost fell off the stool.

 

 

[aright]

18 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Worth repeating: The pedants revolt was led by Which Tyler ?

Bonnie?

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

The wrong question was asked, the margin is far too small for it to be a successful vote, what's inconsistent about that simple observation!

Nothing. Your simple observation is quite consistent with all of your others. 

[nong38]

19 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Wrong. The UK has an opt out. Not sure about Denmark; I'll check

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opt-outs_in_the_European_Union

 

Yes, totally incorrect.

According to documents from the Commission meeting in mid May 2017 all EU member states will be required to adopt the Euro as the currency, your opt outs was dated 2014, the date set for this is 2025, by which time we will be long gone, Denmark and Sweden will no doubt be watching our position.

[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, nong38 said:

According to documents from the Commission meeting in mid May 2017 all EU member states will be required to adopt the Euro as the currency, your opt outs was dated 2014, the date set for this is 2025, by which time we will be long gone, Denmark and Sweden will no doubt be watching our position.

hope dies last.

[aright]

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, Airbagwill said:

 I think this sums it up nicely......

Yes, quite a compressed pat of cow thingy.

[dunroaming]

5 minutes ago, nong38 said:

According to documents from the Commission meeting in mid May 2017 all EU member states will be required to adopt the Euro as the currency, your opt outs was dated 2014, the date set for this is 2025, by which time we will be long gone, Denmark and Sweden will no doubt be watching our position.

Denmark and Sweden are unlikely to accept it and if the UK were in the EU they certainly wouldn't accept it and it would be thrown out.  I still expect it to be rejected.  At the moment it is a proposal isn't it?

[CG1 Blue]

1 hour ago, tebee said:

2 hours ago, Grouse said:

..... Don't Brexiteers know anything?

On most of the existing evidence - probably not.... :)

I think you've lost the debate when you resort to saying those with the opposing view must lack knowledge.

[tebee]

4 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

I think you've lost the debate when you resort to saying those with the opposing view must lack knowledge.

Ad hominem attacks are on the same level as "you lost, get over it" so both sides have lost......

 

.... which, thinking about it, is probably very true, neither side is going to get what they wanted.

[CG1 Blue]

7 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Denmark and Sweden are unlikely to accept it and if the UK were in the EU they certainly wouldn't accept it and it would be thrown out.  I still expect it to be rejected.  At the moment it is a proposal isn't it?

Surely it's better to leave now with some dignity, rather than be kicked out for not adopting the Euro?

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, Grouse said:

Silly comment. Right now we NEVER need join the Euro. If we leave and rejoin, that opt out will be gone. Better remain until end 2020 and then decide. Don't Brexiteers know anything?

All EU members will eventually have to adopt the single currency. Past and present EU leaders have already declared this aim. If Brexit fails and if the UK stays a member of it, the EU will power on to full economic union and much more centralization of power. Brexit will probably be the last chance to retain the pound. 

[dunroaming]

41 minutes ago, nong38 said:

Yes whatever the deal is. If for some reason the deal was not acceptable and we then consider staying, Barnier says we can change our mind up to the end of the transition period, it would be a mistake, our influence would be less than now and its not much now, we would be treated like a naughty little boy who belongs in the corner, they would still want our money and our armed forces though. 

We have decided to leave and we now have to make the best of it, I am optimistic that we can, although no one knows what tomorrow will bring.

 

Interesting little rider is that in 1975 I voted to join for he future of my children, in the recent referendum my children voted to leave. I don't know it was the Song Contest or the Champions League that swayed them!!

We have already agreed that we will continue to pay into the EU after we leave and we have also committed troops in return for the same commitment from the EU.

 

I do like your "little rider".  I think the Eurovision Song Contest is a strong argument for leaving  

[nauseus]

21 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Denmark and Sweden are unlikely to accept it and if the UK were in the EU they certainly wouldn't accept it and it would be thrown out.  I still expect it to be rejected.  At the moment it is a proposal isn't it?

Toofy Verhofstadt was talking about throwing out any members that don't accept the Euro. Good man is Guy. 

[nauseus]

23 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

I think you've lost the debate when you resort to saying those with the opposing view must lack knowledge.

Nothing new there CG.

[billd766]

1 hour ago, aright said:

Bonnie?

 

A good singer but the answer to Grouse's question is the guy was called Watt Tyler.

 

The question for Grouse is why, where and when and what happened to him.

 

Also it was NOT a pedants revolt but a peasants revolt..

 

Obviously Grouse's higher education levels are sadly lacking.

[billd766]

1 hour ago, aright said:

 

Is the one on the left in the red shirt Grouse or simoh1490 or perhaps Airbagwill?

[billd766]

52 minutes ago, nauseus said:

All EU members will eventually have to adopt the single currency. Past and present EU leaders have already declared this aim. If Brexit fails and if the UK stays a member of it, the EU will power on to full economic union and much more centralization of power. Brexit will probably be the last chance to retain the pound. 

 

If the UK stays a full member can they not veto this?

[tebee]

5 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

A good singer but the answer to Grouse's question is the guy was called Watt Tyler.

 

The question for Grouse is why, where and when and what happened to him.

 

......

Didn't end well for him - who is is current day equivalent ?

[nontabury]

5 hours ago, StreetCowboy said:

By leaving the EU we have lost our opt-out when we rejoin.

That must surely be irrelevant, as I cannot see us rejoining.

Once bitten, twice shy. And that’s taking into account,that the E.U will continue to exist.

 

 

 

Edited April 12, 2018 by nontabury

[oldlakey]

3 hours ago, soalbundy said:

sorry, I clicked send by mistake while doing an alteration, my keyboard is up the spout so I am using a screen keyboard, have to get used to it first, can't have an important sender like mine to be offline.

Oh dear never mind natural justice 5555555555555

[Grouse]

27 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

A good singer but the answer to Grouse's question is the guy was called Watt Tyler.

 

The question for Grouse is why, where and when and what happened to him.

 

Also it was NOT a pedants revolt but a peasants revolt..

 

Obviously Grouse's higher education levels are sadly lacking.

It's a bloody joke!!

 

Watt Tyler

 

Which Tyler? Pedants?

 

Jesus

 

Better stick to low level stuff that Brexiters might understand

 

 

[nontabury]

3 hours ago, soalbundy said:

That's the way Hitler eventually came to power, wasn't very practical in the long run but he got some good autobahns built and Mussolini made the trains run on time. Wasn't Mao popular? Sometimes the plebs need protection from themselves which is why we have a parliamentary democracy where the MP's have a host of experts and a civil servants to guide them, no need for mob rule, just vote them out by the next election if you want a drastic change.

 

Be very careful of what you put your faith in.

 

Do you not think that many of those so called experts and civil servants,are out to feather their own nests.

 

Allthough there’s a great deal of truth in what you say. And we did just that in the referendum, the vote out campaign was won by the largest ever democratic vote in the history of the U.K.

 

 

 

[oldlakey]

41 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

A good singer but the answer to Grouse's question is the guy was called Watt Tyler.

 

The question for Grouse is why, where and when and what happened to him.

 

Also it was NOT a pedants revolt but a peasants revolt..

 

Obviously Grouse's higher education levels are sadly lacking.

Not the first time the pedant has made a cow of it and himself

[oldlakey]

15 minutes ago, Grouse said:

It's a bloody joke!!

 

Watt Tyler

 

Which Tyler? Pedants?

 

Jesus

 

Better stick to low level stuff that Brexiters might understand

 

 

Thats what you say I am making the best of it 

[nontabury]

3 hours ago, soalbundy said:

I see May wants us to join the Americans in bombarding Syria, unfortunately the EU can't stop her.

And the same can be said of France. Germany and most of the other countries,Who sensible intend to keep out of this mess caused initially by Tony WMD Blair.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

All EU members will eventually have to adopt the single currency. Past and present EU leaders have already declared this aim. If Brexit fails and if the UK stays a member of it, the EU will power on to full economic union and much more centralization of power. Brexit will probably be the last chance to retain the pound. 

Wrong. There is no time limit on Denmark and U.K. Opting out. Certainly Brussels would like all EU countries to join the EU but this cannot be demanded.

[Orac]

 
If the UK stays a full member can they not veto this?

The UK opt out is in the Maastricht Treaty and not removed by the Lisbon Treaty which only stipulates that new members of the EU must join the Euro so a new law cannot change that treaty obligation - it would require a new treaty which would need ratification by UK parliament to become legally binding.


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